PS3 General Discussion

Hmmm, I must say "The Darkness" looks significantly different on the 360's demo. The beginning scene had much more detail, and the movements of the cars seemed to be more realistic overall.

In gameplay there isn't much difference, but there's significant little parts that make a huge difference. For blood, for example, when you shoot a body and it splatters all over the floor, is a blur on the PS3, whereas on the 360 it's perfectly clear. I was so surprised I've don't recall seeing blood as realistic as that before. Other improvements was less aliasing, the motion-blur you get while moving around quickly (i prefer that), and effects like the lighting and shadows are better laid out, even if they're not "real" like the PS3s. They're not far off, or no difference at all if I wasn't paying huge attention.

I guess this is another example of a poor version of a multi-platform game...
 
Here's the final boxart for Heavenly Sword:

888284148_596e344051.jpg
 
G.T
Hmmm, I must say "The Darkness" looks significantly different on the 360's demo. The beginning scene had much more detail, and the movements of the cars seemed to be more realistic overall.

In gameplay there isn't much difference, but there's significant little parts that make a huge difference. For blood, for example, when you shoot a body and it splatters all over the floor, is a blur on the PS3, whereas on the 360 it's perfectly clear. I was so surprised I've don't recall seeing blood as realistic as that before. Other improvements was less aliasing, the motion-blur you get while moving around quickly (i prefer that), and effects like the lighting and shadows are better laid out, even if they're not "real" like the PS3s. They're not far off, or no difference at all if I wasn't paying huge attention.

I guess this is another example of a poor version of a multi-platform game...

I hate to disagree, but the textures are not very different in either version, I own them both. The opening scene, also, is not a polygon or physic's calc different. Both are *identicle* the only difference being motion blur. You're making detail where detail isn't there. Also, the textures are *clearer* on the PS3 version due to enhanced AF (at the expense of AA).

Just wanted to clear those up, but it's very much NOT a poor version of a multiplatform game.
 
OK rather bizarrely Microsoft it would seem are now prediction what future versions of the PS3 Sony will release....

Sony to release cut-price $399 40GB PS3

Or so claims Microsoft, which insists that failure this Q4 will be the end of PlayStation

Microsoft’s director of technical strategies Andre Vrignaud has predicted that Sony will launch a cut-price 40GB PS3 this Q4 in an effort to maintain competitiveness in the next-gen console war.

Speaking to N’Gai Croal at Level Up, Vrignaud stated: “A single, $599 SKU would be untenable – if they don't move significant hardware this holiday they'll basically be dead for this generation.

“My prediction is that you're going to see the creation of a new, low-end SKU this holiday. It'll likely remove integrated wi-fi, memory card reader, and most controversially, all backward compatibility.

“You'll see a new wi-fi dongle made available. And finally, this low-end SKU will likely come with a smaller 40 GB hard drive. The low-end price will be set at $399, with the higher-end 80 GB SKU dropping to $499.”

He concluded by predicting an October launch. We shall see.

Source - http://www.mcvuk.com/news/27878/Sony-to-release-cut-price-399-40GB-PS3
Source 2 - http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/leve...r-microserf-another-bet-on-sony-hardware.aspx

....quite strange.


Regards

Scaff
 
It's just abit of mind games. Simply, Sony are damned if they and damned if they don't now.

If they do, everyone will say how predictable they were and how right MS were. If they don't people will accuse them of cutting off their nose to spite their face by not doing exactly what MS predicted.
 
MS to consumers: hey guys, the PS3 is doing so bad they'll drop the price again so don't buy a PS3 now!

I'm really surprised N'Gai didn't call him out on the FUD bet. Maybe he wanted a free steak dinner. Who knows!
 
Duċk;2725046
MS to consumers: hey guys, the PS3 is doing so bad they'll drop the price again so don't buy a PS3 now!

I'm really surprised N'Gai didn't call him out on the FUD bet. Maybe he wanted a free steak dinner. Who knows!

Or translated another way


PPPPPPPPPPLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE don't buy a PS3, we need to shift lots more 360's to cover these warranty costs.

Does smack of a bit of nerves on MS's part on this one. I mean Sony were bitten once with the 20gig machine in Japan and the US, I find it unlikely that they would repeat that. I would also think that changing the production lines to run with two very different builds would be less than cost effective.

Given that the E3 announcements by Sony have apparently already seen a jump in sales might have a certain company a bit worried.

Regards

Scaff
 
I don't believe the MS statement at all.
I agree that this is probably a move to gain sales through mis-information.
While I don't necessarily think it is impossible to see a $499 80gb down the road, I do feel it is very unlikely we will see any sort of cheap version for the PS3.

My guess, MS is doing exactly what Scaff has mentioned. They are probably more worried than ever before.
Frankly, I can smell the fear coming off of both MS execs and fanboys alike. It seems '08 is going to be the year where Sony kills MS and drives the 3 billion dollar lossers of the Home Entertainment division of MS out of the market.

Only Halo 3 can save MS at this point.
I have a feeling that an Xbox720 is much less likely than a PS4. Of course, only time will tell.

Again though, my guess is that '08 will really mess up MS's plans to dominate the console market. GT5, MGS4, and nearly every good game going on the X360 other than Halo will be great games for PS3 (it's hard to deny the fact that most of the games shown as hits for the 360 at E3 were multi-platform games like COD).

Oh, and that's all without mention of the fact that developers such as EA are now begining to focus on development for the PS3 rather than primarily developing for the 360.

Btw, using my logic (which isn't to say it is right)...
I don't see how the MS statement makes sense.
What company would plan their biggest year of releases for the year after they would go under? No company would do that.
 
Oh, and that's all without mention of the fact that developers such as EA are now begining to focus on development for the PS3 rather than primarily developing for the 360.

Not to burst your bubble, but all that really means is that the games will be equal on both platforms so that you don't have NCAA '08 and Madden '08 being 60fps on 360 and 30fps on PS3, etc. You're not going to see stadium editors and such only on the PS3 versions.

And with Peter Moore now heading up EA Sports, I doubt they're going to throw the PS3 versions some bones.

And :lol: at you thinking the 360 is getting Dreamcasted in 2008. You're lying to yourself if you seriously believe that.
 
Duċk;2725102
Not to burst your bubble, but all that really means is that the games will be equal on both platforms so that you don't have NCAA '08 and Madden '08 being 60fps on 360 and 30fps on PS3, etc. You're not going to see stadium editors and such only on the PS3 versions.

And with Peter Moore now heading up EA Sports, I doubt they're going to throw the PS3 versions some bones.

And :lol: at you thinking the 360 is getting Dreamcasted in 2008. You're lying to yourself if you seriously believe that.

I'm not saying it will be dreamcasted (I assume you were reffering to my comments that MS would be driven out of the console buisness due to possible '08 losses). The reason I say it will not be dreamcasted (as you put it) is because the situations are very different between Sega and MS.
What I'm saying is that MS is on the down-slope and Halo 3 is their best bet of keeping sales up.

As for what EA will do, not entirely sure, I'm just going on what EA's head said at E3. :indiff:

In any case, I do believe MS is looking at trouble if they are going to the extreme of mis-information (assuming the info is not true).
Furthermore, there is no denying the fact that MS has lost 3 billion in their Home Entertainment division over the last 3 fiscal years.

I don't have a MBA so I can't be sure, but in my opinion, 3 billion in losses over 3 years isn't something that most companies consider acceptable. Beyond that, I have to ask myself, how long will the executives at MS support a program that creates losses of that size?

With that in mind, I do believe that continued losses at this rate will lead to the death of MS consoles. :ouch:
Of course, that is dependant on big of a loss MS is willing to take just to take part in the console wars.
 
Microsoft is making some hefty statements there, but even if they were true they would have a hard time convincing me that a failed PS3 would mean the end of Playstation. Sony has enough money to go for another system. That would be like saying after the Gamecube had problems Nintendo would go the way of Sega. You would have to have a couple of failures and large losses that can't be recouped to have that happen.

Duċk;2725102
And :lol: at you thinking the 360 is getting Dreamcasted in 2008. You're lying to yourself if you seriously believe that.
There is a slim (very slim) chance that if they can't start creating positive revenue growth the investors may call a stop to the gaming stuff. I don't see it happening this generation, but if they don't recoup their losses before the next generation they may have to call a halt to the entire entertainment division. That entire division looks like a case of "we can do that too" and then spending too much money trying to prove it.

But I think that with Halo 3 coming out they will see their sales begin to increase again and as the system becomes profitable to sell they will sell many more 360s.

Of course, with GT5 and others coming out next year we could very well see huge upswing in PS3 sales as they begin to turn profitable.



I highly doubt that we will see any gaming company go under this generation, but if we do I think that it will be the XBox just because they are already so far in the hole and they are being drug down with other products as well.
 
DWA
EA is EA... they will always put out garbage. :rolleyes:

Aren't a bunch of the Forza guys former EA guys. ;) :lol: (just kidding) :D

On the subject though...
I do think it will be difficult for the 360 in '08.
As of now it looks to be such a big year for PS3 releases that I have a hard time seeing MS match that success anywhere other than Halo 3. Even then, I get the feeling that Halo 3 will be a great seller but I don't see it being a system mover since I suspect most people looking to pick up Halo 3 already have a 360.

On the other hand, I see GT5 and MGS 4 as major system movers. Combine those with a supporting cast of great multi-platform games and even a few good exclusives and you've got a forecast of trouble for MS.

In my opinion, time is working against MS.
As time goes on we (the gaming public) see more and more publicity regarding the red ring of death. Multi-platform games are looking great on both systems (which will be more and more evident over time), and exclusives to the PS3 are going to continue growing in quality and quantity.

Just the other day I had a friend tell me how bad Resistance looked and when I reminded him of the difference between PS2 launch titles vs games like God Of War he quickly reeled back.

It's just my biased opinion, but I get the impression '08 will be Sony's year.
 
I don't have a MBA so I can't be sure, but in my opinion, 3 billion in losses over 3 years isn't something that most companies consider acceptable. Beyond that, I have to ask myself, how long will the executives at MS support a program that creates losses of that size?

Its not the company itself or the executives that MS's gaming division need to worry about, its the shareholders. The profits they make are being reduced by this part of MS and its inability to make money, given enough time and they could deal the final card, and that would almost be regardless of what MS as a company want.

Sony's 'trump' card in this area is the PS2, it continues to sell, worldwide, at a very healthy rate; and everyone sold makes SCEJ money. Money that can help to subsidise and mitigate losses from the PS3 in its early years and help calm shareholder nerves.

MS are not gone in this market yet, far from it, but they need to turn things around and quickly. Certainly having to publicly state that the warranty programme was going to cost them in the region of 1 to 1.5 billion will not have helped at all in this regard.

Regards

Scaff
 
If everything goes well for Sony it will definitely be them rising and M$ falling. I've heard more positive things about Sony lately. Still, it remains the 360 right now and the PS3 for later. Games coming out like CoD4 you will be able to get on both systems but I'd prefer the 360 since I have a library of games for it and then there's the 360's controller which imo is better than the PS3s right now.
 
Heavenly Sword demo is up guys.

And it convinced me to fork out $60. :guilty:

EDIT: And the demo is from an older build, the latest build doesn't have all the screen tearing or nearly as "bad" a framerate.

Also, for the record I'll give my end all be all personal opinion about everything in a few moments. In-'n-Out Burger has higher priorities. :dopey:
 
Heavenly Sword convinces eh? :)
I liked it myself (thinking of the bigger picture here) - if this is just a demo, a short demo I may add, what would the whole game be like? It looks great, the camera doesn't frustrate (and you have some control over it), the animations are top-notch, the voice acting (what little you hear) is good, and the gameplay is as good as I'd hoped. Controls are fluid and easy and you can pull off some monstrous combos by switching between stances etc. Counters are generally easy to do and when one connects it's fun to see the different moves Nariko does. And I like Nariko (she reminds me of my Japanese ex-girlfriend...well, if only because their names are similar :dopey: ).

Surprised to find (on the UK/EU) demo that there are 11 languages to choose from. That'll help fill up space on the BD Rom disc!

Wish it had been a bit longer but hey, just 2 months until release!
 
OK, now for my opinion after playing the demo several times, without the shock and giddiness that can make me biased for one thing or another.

The Good
  • I'm not a big fan of action games like this, but it actually made me interested. Not completely hardcore like Ninja Gaiden, but it has some depth. Overall, I like it. Not as much as other genres and such, but it's good enough to warrant keeping the demo on my HDD.
  • Graphics look good. Not completely spectacular, but not too shabby either. The cutscenes look great like expected, the hair doesn't completely look like red Play-doh, animations are cool and transition well, etc. Of course, the technical stuff like charging into an army without a hitch is what really impressed me, and not average gameplay, so I wasn't disappointed.
The Bad
  • The variety of gameplay doesn't seem to be all that great. With the exception of the final battle against King Bohan's army and Kai's "unique" (for a lack of a better word) missions, it just seems to go from QTE to Arena-like battle, then transitioning to the next Arena-like battle via a QTE. I'd love to be proven wrong and be thrown some puzzles and the like to spice it up, but it seems like they're focusing on the battling aspect of the game.
The Ugly
  • And this is my second largest concern, following gameplay (which was resolved): what happens after I finish the reported 10-12 hour long story? What's the incentive to make me play the game again? There's no multiplayer, so that's out. What about Home trophies or unlockables? Those are always viable things... but I really haven't seen anything about HS unlockables or Ninja Theory putting some effort into Home trophies to give the game some life after the single player is done. Something like this may or may not be done, but if this is a game where I can complete it in a few days as a Gamefly rental, I really don't have much of a reason to buy it. It's not like I'm really fond of the core game to begin with.
 
You make some interesting points about gameplay and unlockables. Even Lair has an online component involving stats plus planned downloadable content including Home.

I like the combat system, testing out combos with different stances is entertaining. I beat the demo in about 4 min once but i can't repeat that time. I'm sure it will sell well like Motorstorm's 75% released game.
 
Or translated another way

PPPPPPPPPPLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAASSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE don't buy a PS3, we need to shift lots more 360's to cover these warranty costs.

Does smack of a bit of nerves on MS's part on this one. I mean Sony were bitten once with the 20gig machine in Japan and the US, I find it unlikely that they would repeat that. I would also think that changing the production lines to run with two very different builds would be less than cost effective.

Given that the E3 announcements by Sony have apparently already seen a jump in sales might have a certain company a bit worried.
Excellent points. The facts just don't add up, especially Vrignaud's claim that Sony would release a PS3 without backward compatibility. As you pointed out, PS3 sales are up, and Sony already found that the 20GB PS3 just didn't sell well.

In addition, Sony is enjoying some good buzz from E3 with several exiting titles on their way so this not only doesn't make much sense, and if anything makes it really look like a desperate attempt on MS part to take attention away from their own woes and possibly encourage those who ay have been planning to get a PS3 to wait for a version that might never show up.





My guess, MS is doing exactly what Scaff has mentioned. They are probably more worried than ever before.
Frankly, I can smell the fear coming off of both MS execs and fanboys alike. It seems '08 is going to be the year where Sony kills MS and drives the 3 billion dollar lossers of the Home Entertainment division of MS out of the market.
$5.9 billion in losses since the original Xbox, and MS Xbox losses are expected to exceed well past $7 billion by the end of the year.

Only Halo 3 can save MS at this point.
Microsoft would need close to 50 first party X360 games as successful as Halo 3 is expected to be in order to come close to breaking even by the end of the year. Considering only one game for the X360, Gears of War, has sold more than 2 million copies, it is very unlikely Microsoft's investment in their Xbox division will ever return enough profit to break even.

Again though, my guess is that '08 will really mess up MS's plans to dominate the console market. GT5, MGS4, and nearly every good game going on the X360 other than Halo will be great games for PS3 (it's hard to deny the fact that most of the games shown as hits for the 360 at E3 were multi-platform games like COD).

Oh, and that's all without mention of the fact that developers such as EA are now begining to focus on development for the PS3 rather than primarily developing for the 360.

Btw, using my logic (which isn't to say it is right)...
I don't see how the MS statement makes sense.
What company would plan their biggest year of releases for the year after they would go under? No company would do that.
Good points as well.





There is a slim (very slim) chance that if they [Microsoft] can't start creating positive revenue growth the investors may call a stop to the gaming stuff. I don't see it happening this generation, but if they don't recoup their losses before the next generation they may have to call a halt to the entire entertainment division. That entire division looks like a case of "we can do that too" and then spending too much money trying to prove it.
I agree, but I seriously do not believe MS would ever call a halt to the entire entertainment division. What I can see happen is that they pull out of hardware development and sales, and focus on their core business, software, which is highy profitable... although it would be very interesting to see MS release games for a Sony console... but stranger things have happened... including the improved relationship between Apple and Microsoft.





Its not the company itself or the executives that MS's gaming division need to worry about, its the shareholders. The profits they make are being reduced by this part of MS and its inability to make money, given enough time and they could deal the final card, and that would almost be regardless of what MS as a company want.
Precisely... and with the recent news of several MS executives dumping huge chunks of their company stock from their own personal portfolios suggests that the writing is on the wall regarding angry shareholders demanding changes.

Sony's 'trump' card in this area is the PS2, it continues to sell, worldwide, at a very healthy rate; and everyone sold makes SCEJ money. Money that can help to subsidise and mitigate losses from the PS3 in its early years and help calm shareholder nerves.
I think the decision to continue to support the PS2 was a very wise one on the part of Sony. While it is likely true they would have had better PS3 sales had they cut support for the PS2, but considering how much they lose on PS3 hardware, and how they didn't have enough software titles to help minimize those losses, they could easily have found themselves in a similar situation that MS is in.

By continuing their support of the PS2 they have been able to enjoy those profits while also ramping up PS3 hardware production and software support.





Heavenly Sword convinces eh? :)
I liked it myself (thinking of the bigger picture here) - if this is just a demo, a short demo I may add, what would the whole game be like?
Short, yet in terms of disc space already larger than some X360 games, and its just a short demo. This should once and for all end all speculation that quality next-gen HD games are going to need more than 7GB of disc space, and in some cases, have already exceeded twice that much disc space. 👍
 
I agree, but I seriously do not believe MS would ever call a halt to the entire entertainment division. What I can see happen is that they pull out of hardware development and sales, and focus on their core business, software, which is highy profitable... although it would be very interesting to see MS release games for a Sony console... but stranger things have happened... including the improved relationship between Apple and Microsoft.

Indeed stranger things have happend. Heck who would have thought 15 years ago that Sonic would show up on a Nintendo! :sly:
In any case, glad you enjoyed my comments.

Also, thanks for the general stats... I had no clue MS was looking at as much as 7 billion by the end of the year (in losses).

Oh btw, my buddy who owns the 360, spoke poorly of Resistance, and didn't know the 60gb had a wireless net connection... Tonight I saw him at the bar and guess what he told me- his 360 got the red death lights. :ouch:
He was bummed and by the end of the night he brought up (without my suggestion) trading-in the console he gets after warranty repairs. :indiff:

I just don't see MS holding the market in '08 or any year after as they had in '06 and '07.
 
Speaking of no 360 gaming... I think I got a little in over my head because I'm gold til 09 and 4000 pts. I hope it makes it that far. :grumpy:
 
Duċk;2725588
The Ugly
  • And this is my second largest concern, following gameplay (which was resolved): what happens after I finish the reported 10-12 hour long story? What's the incentive to make me play the game again? There's no multiplayer, so that's out. What about Home trophies or unlockables? Those are always viable things... but I really haven't seen anything about HS unlockables or Ninja Theory putting some effort into Home trophies to give the game some life after the single player is done. Something like this may or may not be done, but if this is a game where I can complete it in a few days as a Gamefly rental, I really don't have much of a reason to buy it. It's not like I'm really fond of the core game to begin with.

I just wanted to point out, in case you didn't know, there will be a free multiplater patch available for this game from the Playstation Store before the year is out. It will feature online 1vs1 and 8 player deathmatch.

Personally I agree with the rest of your review. This game seems like one of those 'ultimate rental' games. Something I'll pick up when it gets to greatest hits
 
I agree, but I seriously do not believe MS would ever call a halt to the entire entertainment division. What I can see happen is that they pull out of hardware development and sales, and focus on their core business, software, which is highy profitable... although it would be very interesting to see MS release games for a Sony console... but stranger things have happened... including the improved relationship between Apple and Microsoft.

They would just migrate their games to PC.

I just wanted to point out, in case you didn't know, there will be a free multiplater patch available for this game from the Playstation Store before the year is out. It will feature online 1vs1 and 8 player deathmatch.

That was debunked.
 
Duċk;2726050
They would just migrate their games to PC.
Microsoft has already been doing that to some degree so that's a given. The interesting possibility though is for them to also release them on Sony and Nintendo consoles. Without a seriously vested interest in their own console, the lure of greater profits from selling their games to PS2, PS3, Wii and even PSP and DS owners is probably more than enough for them to not let foolish pride get in the way of a good solid business decision.... Of course, all of this is predicated on whether or not Microsoft pulls the plug on their Xbox hardware.

As long as they are trying to sell X360's there is no chance they will ever release their own software titles for any other console. That is pretty much a given as well.





DWA
Speaking of no 360 gaming... I think I got a little in over my head because I'm gold til 09 and 4000 pts. I hope it makes it that far. :grumpy:
Don't worry, there is no chance MS will pull the plug on XBL any time soon, even if they stop selling hardware. They are making way too much revenue from paid subscriptions and advertising to end XBL. Just imagine how much worse MS's financials would be had XBL been a free service and it had to use it's own servers to host online games!

Besides, XBL is there to support their software, so as long as XBL continues to make money for MS and as long as the service helps sell their software despite the possibility that MS might stop selling X360's, then there is no chance XBL will be making a hasty departure. 👍
 
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