Track Limit Abuse by most Top 10 Drivers

[Spurgy 777]

Condemning this is like a blind rusher (excuse the jargon) saying camping ruins FPS games. If you can't beat them, join them; if your ego stops you from doing that, then deal with it. Complain to PD by all means, but to have a go at the player for exploiting a fault in a game is nothing more than...jealousy, maybe?

Off topic but there's good reason to be annoyed about campers as joining them isn't an option as it makes the game mindnumbingly boring but most importantly it's a game breaking play style. If everyone camped nothing would happen as no one is moving to see each other. Anyway, I digress.

 

[Woodybobs]

Interesting logic. But I disagree. Most drivers, including myself don't think about how much can I get away with? We see the line and stay within the limits. So, those who look for how much they can get away with have an unfair advantage. If you continue to use that advantage, I say that's unfair and cheating.
If my employer has pads of paper and pens in a cabinet and I take them because they don't know, there's no penalty for me doing so, according to your logic, that's totally fine and my employers fault. Lol

There'd likely be a penalty if you got caught. That's the difference. Without penalties, corner cutting would be the norm in all racing, even though it's against the rules. It's up to the relevent bodies to ensure the rules are enforced.

 

[Sven Jurgens]

And I feel bad when I touch the curbs in a corner :/ Nailing the corner without touching any curb stones feels much better.
But I do also cut some of the corners as otherwise I get hit from behind or overtaken on the inside in those corners during a race. In qualifying it feels more satisfying not the hear the rumble strip.

 

[Famine]

Let's see: Let me hit XXXsquareXXcircle, options. Oh look! It automatically gives my car a 20% boost in speed and I win now every time. The game lets me do it, so it's OK! It's totally fine. Game let's me do it.

I've just tried this and it took me to GT Sport's main menu. Do I need to start at a different screen to get this 20% speed boost?

 

[VFOURMAX1]

Wall riding is different as it is actually against the rules in the game, there are just ways of doing it that avoid detection by the game which is an exploit and illegal

Here we go again, How can on the inside radius of a corner all 4 wheels being off the actual normal asphalt track racing surface not be considered an "illegal" exploit that is plainly shortening the length of a laps full distance while rubbing the outside track barrier while remaining fully on the tracks allowable asphalt surface is considered 'illegal'?

Certain corners the limits do not allow such generous allowances and you will be penalized for the much less of same amount of the car leaving the defined racing surface inside the outer white lines of the track.

The same as some walls will give you a penalty for contact some will not.

Both situations are dependent on location and proper implementation of correctly pushing the limits without the game issuing a penalty.

Again both are actually just pushing the actual limits of the rules and limitations of what the game will allow before it recognizes the action as illegal and an act that calls for the racer to be penalized for the action.

Both actions are available to be "exploited by all racers" during the entire distance of the contest or race.

Unlike the pit glitch which can only be exploited by one driver at the beginning of a race and therefore is plainly a cheat as they are gaining an advantage over the other racers that they do not have the opportunity to gain that same advantage within the contest.

Corner cutting is just as much against the rules of the game as wall riding and there are just corners that the limits allow that to be exploited just like there are walls that allow contact without penalty.

Your saying one is cheating and one is not is just you being okay with one exploit that you may feel like it is okay and may even exploit yourself and saying the one you do not like as cheating.

Take off the blinders and admit that both situations are location and game allowance dependent, can be used by all racers throughout the contest and other than what your preferences may be personally for the rules these are the same and you cannot be cheating just exploiting one or the other either they are both cheats or neither are cheats, you cannot have it both ways.

Personally I do not agree with either being allowed in the game, inside radius corner cutting should pull a penalty if any part of the car actually exceeds the outside edge of the actual curbing and contact with the wall should at minimum cause a slowdown of a cars pace which would negate any brushing against or trying to use the wall as a corner guide.

 

[demeaning pie]

And I feel bad when I touch the curbs in a corner :/ Nailing the corner without touching any curb stones feels much better.
But I do also cut some of the corners as otherwise I get hit from behind or overtaken on the inside in those corners during a race. In qualifying it feels more satisfying not the hear the rumble strip.

And yet every professional race car driver/motorcycle racer in every racing series uses the curbing. I think they get more pleasure out of a lower lap time than not hearing and feeling the rumble.

 

[thestig911]

Half of the corners should incur a penalty. Aren’t the FIA rules that you should have 2 wheels on the tarmac side of the white line or something similar? If so, and GT take themselves seriously as an FIA sanctioned race sim, then they should apply those rules. It is unfair, as most of us do not have the time or inclination to work out all the corners that it is allowable to bend the rules on. I’m not criticising ZZZ, but it looks like he has the time to exploit this, whereas most of us do not, we just assume that you shouldn’t cut corners as it is against the rules and going to incur a penalty. It’s therefore not a level playing field.

 

[Scaff]

I must confess I find it odd that people keep saying that this doesn't occur in the real world, and that real world drivers would never do it and that it makes sim racing look bad.

Have any of those saying this actually got a real interest in motorsport?

I have to ask as track limits and pushing them has to be one of the single most regular and repeated topics in just about every series, every year, forever.

Why on earth do people think sausage curbs came into being? What about corner posts? Why have all he circuits on the BTCC calendar had run-off sensors fitted?

This kind of thing would be why:

(I have a LOT more).

Half of the corners should incur a penalty. Aren’t the FIA rules that you should have 2 wheels on the tarmac side of the white line or something similar? If so, and GT take themselves seriously as an FIA sanctioned race sim, then they should apply those rules. It is unfair, as most of us do not have the time or inclination to work out all the corners that it is allowable to bend the rules on. I’m not criticising ZZZ, but it looks like he has the time to exploit this, whereas most of us do not, we just assume that you shouldn’t cut corners as it is chating and going to incur a penalty. It’s therefore not a level playing field.

Not if a curb is present, curbs under FIA and BRDC regs count as part of the track.

Two wheels on the white line or on the curb and your inside the track limits.

As I said before half of the issue here is that the fantasy tracks in GTS have stupidly wide curbs (Cooper Straight right hand run off at Brands is however wrong, you can't use the run off in reality without penalty).

 

[demeaning pie]

Personally I do not agree with either being allowed in the game, inside radius corner cutting should pull a penalty if any part of the car actually exceeds the outside edge of the actual curbing and contact with the wall should at minimum cause a slowdown of a cars pace which would negate any brushing against or trying to use the wall as a corner guide.

There isn't anyone in here who disagrees with you, including the racer in the OP's video.

 

[baldgye]

I must confess I find it odd that people keep saying that this doesn't occur in the real world, and that real world drivers would never do it and that it makes sim racing look bad.

Have any of those saying this actually got a real interest in motorsport?

I have to ask as track limits and pushing them has to be one of the single most regular and repeated topics in just about every series, every year, forever.

Why on earth do people think sausage curbs came into being? What about corner posts? Why have all he circuits on the BTCC calendar had run-off sensors fitted?

This kind of thing would be why:

(I have a LOT more).


Not if a curb is present, curbs under FIA and BRDC regs count as part of the track.

I do wonder what people who start DR/SR complain threads would make of the BTCC

 

[Foofer37]

Stop triple posting and stop being abusive. The AUP is quite clear on this.

Whatever. So you cheat as well I guess?

 

[Scaff]

I do wonder what people who start DR/SR complain threads would make of the BTCC

While the BTCC is a hotbed of crappy driving standards at times (and it arguably part of the draw for many), I actually agree that SR is broken in GTS.

 

[MatskiMonk]

And I feel bad when I touch the curbs in a corner :/ Nailing the corner without touching any curb stones feels much better.

I like it when you chip a curb and get some two-wheel hangtime...

..and then I got tree'd by Scaff's Knockers shots...

But I'm going to post one anyway!

 

[Scaff]

Whatever. So you cheat as well I guess?

I actually very rarely bother with GTS, a couple of races a week. I mainly race on titles that have far stricter track limits.

However nice try at a straw-man argument, now let me make this clear. Sort out your posting and sort out your attitude or you will be gone.

 

[baldgye]

While the BTCC is a hotbed of crappy driving standards at times (and it arguably part of the draw for many), I actually agree that SR is broken in GTS.

Oh I'm not saying SR/DR is perfect, but at the end of the day, it's a game with no real repercussions... the stuff that happens in BTCC isn't the same in that regard, especially for the smaller teams...

I remember watching a race last year from Brands, not sure which race it was and I think Plato was leading and was taken out at the last corner on the last lap from the chap behind and they both got stuck in the gravel. After the race he patted him on the head gave him a hug and then said to the media (with his arm still around him) saying what a prat he was! I'm sure I've seen SR/DR threads with similar things

 

[VFOURMAX1]

Have any of those saying this actually got a real interest in motorsport?

Love real world motorsports and I have never said that course cutting does not happen in the real world.

Both pictures you posted though would not be either of those drivers intentional way of running those corners as in the first picture the probability of suspension or tire damage, front splitter ect would be too much of a risk for that to be an every lap time gaining tactic.

The second picture the angle the driver is at cutting the inside and the way of the tracks turning radius upon corner exit again clearly a mistake as there is no way that angle will be the fastest way to attack the corner.

In real motorsports most corners that the cars actually exceed past the outer limits of a curbing without really risking penalty with most organizations are on the outside of the corner not the inside.

 

[cleanLX]

Sebastian Vettle was asked in an interview post race how F1 should enforce track limits...
His answer was brilliant...
Design tracks so that exceeding track limits does not allow a benefit...
aka grass, gravel/sand... walls... ... which also implies, keep making hardened runoff areas and racers will continue to "use" them.

 

[Scaff]

Love real world motorsports and I have never said that course cutting does not happen in the real world.

Both pictures you posted though would not be either of those drivers intentional way of running those corners as in the first picture the probability of suspension or tire damage, front splitter ect would be too much of a risk for that to be an every lap time gaining tactic.

The second picture the angle the driver is at cutting the inside and the way of the tracks turning radius upon corner exit again clearly a mistake as there is no way that angle will be the fastest way to attack the corner.

In real motorsports most corners that the cars actually exceed past the outer limits of a curbing without really risking penalty with most organizations are on the outside of the corner not the inside.

Hate to break it too you, but that's exactly how driver try and run that corner. Its the chicane at Knockhill and its known for it.

If you have PC2 try it.

 

[baldgye]

Sebastian Vettle was asked in an interview post race how F1 should enforce track limits...
His answer was brilliant...
Design tracks so that exceeding track limits does not allow a benefit...
aka grass, gravel/sand... walls... ... which also implies, keep making hardened runoff areas and racers will continue to "use" them.

He also track extended in the final sector at COTA and almost gained the lead from doing so

 

[GTWelsh]

4 wheel corner cutting is no better than wall riding imo. It's an interesting one but they're just taking advantage of the game's lax "cheat" detection. PD's fault, but I'll happily finish behind someone I would say is "cheating" (even though the game allows it) until PD fixes it (they won't).

 

[Spurgy 777]

@VFOURMAX1 As I said, the major difference is in what the game intends for you to be able to do. The game actively tries to stop you wall riding and it can't be done unless you exploit the detection system and ride the wall in a specific way (with minimal impact on the wall). The game doesn't try and stop you cutting the corners that you can and intends for you to be able to take those lines, there's no specific trick to taking those lines to avoid getting a penalty, it just lets you do it regardless of what your approach is.

Now I agree that limits should be stricter, but completely disagree that exploiting the games penalty detection system to wall ride is comparable to just doing what the game intends you to do.

 

[Toblakai99]

I hope P.D fix this problem because people will exploit the system and defend there behaviour.

 

[Scaff]

Sebastian Vettle was asked in an interview post race how F1 should enforce track limits...
His answer was brilliant...
Design tracks so that exceeding track limits does not allow a benefit...
aka grass, gravel/sand... walls... ... which also implies, keep making hardened runoff areas and racers will continue to "use" them.

Fixing track limits....................................................by bringing back more driver injuries.

 

[Rinsky]

Also, during the races I can hardly do that and risk a spin or penalty. Especially on turn 4.

So this is what I find odd about the whole thing. Seems anyone can obviously get away with it in the qualifying laps but not so much in the actual race. So you have to ask yourself is it really allowed or just exploit in qualifying.
Because I'm taking that post as it won't penalize you and qualifying but it will in the actual race.
Doesn't concern me either way as to what others do. I will always race with two tires on the track and two on the curb. If that makes me slower than so be it.

 

[Scaff]

I hope P.D fix this problem because people will exploit the system and defend there behaviour.

Given that PD have been fine with it for a decade and are part of the problem for designing circuits with curbs wider than cars I seriously doubt it.

 

[Spurgy 777]

So this is what I find odd about the whole thing. Seems anyone can obviously get away with it in the qualifying laps but not so much in the actual race. So you have to ask yourself is it really allowed or just exploit in qualifying.
Because I'm taking that post as it won't penalize you and qualifying but it will in the actual race.
Doesn't concern me either way as to what others do. I will always race with two tires on the track and two on the curb. If that makes me slower than so be it.

He means it's hard to do consistently, in qualifying you only need to get it right once in a 100 laps, in the race you need to get it right every lap. So taking high risk lines that you could get wrong is not as doable in the race, in this case if you get it wrong you could cut the corner too much (more than in the video) and get a penalty, or unsettle the car too much and spin.

 

[kilesa4568]

As I read these post I almost have to laugh as the other day in the thread about wall riding at tokyo people were saying the same about racers "cheating". Even though I do not race on that circuit at all I was saying that pushing the limits the game allowed was not cheating as everyone had the option to do it and was being crucified from multiple directions for my incorrect opinion on the matter.

Wish you guys had of been there for that one for support. Exact same thing only one is allowable excessive course cutting and one is riding the wall.

The game allows it by all players so maybe an exploit of the limits but definitely not cheating. Same opinion I had in the other thread .

In all fairness, I didn't come close to crucifying your opinion. I simply didn't agree with you and debated why.

Sincerely sorry if I can came across the way you think I did. No hard feelings mate.

As for the game's track limits, you've got to test them until you're punished.

I'm usually a stickler for rules but if extreme track limits are legal in the game, I haven't got a leg to stand on trying to argue against it.

I'll be honest and say I don't like seeing it though.

 

[Rinsky]

He means it's hard to do consistently, in qualifying you only need to get it right once in a 100 laps, in the race you need to get it right every lap. So taking high risk lines that you could get wrong is not as doable in the race, in this case if you get it wrong you could cut the corner too much (more than in the video) and get a penalty, or unsettle the car too much and spin.

Ok got you. That clears things up a little better.

 

[Woodybobs]

Please quote where I said anyone is a cheater or withdraw this post. I won't ask again and I will report you for posting false or misleading information if you don't delete this post. You completely missed the point of my post obviously. I've already said numerous times it's not about the drivers it's about the game. Please read more carefully before you respond next time.

He may have jumped to conclusions, but they were reasonable assumptions. You categorised pit-lane glitch exploiters, wall riders, and track limit exploiters in one group. It's likely that PD intended to set track limits to their current level, but unlikely that either of the other two are intentionally in the game. That's why many think the latter two are cheating and the former is acceptable. While you may not have meant it, your post was ambiguous, and it could easily be construed that you were calling all of them cheaters.

Edit. Swap former and latter.

 

[baldgye]

So this is what I find odd about the whole thing. Seems anyone can obviously get away with it in the qualifying laps but not so much in the actual race. So you have to ask yourself is it really allowed or just exploit in qualifying.
Because I'm taking that post as it won't penalize you and qualifying but it will in the actual race.
Doesn't concern me either way as to what others do. I will always race with two tires on the track and two on the curb. If that makes me slower than so be it.

If your best quali time is something you can easily replicate in a race, then your quali time isn’t very good.
A one lap quali run is (ideally) totally on the limit of what you and the car, can do... if it’s not, your not going fast enough