White Man: Why Are You Giving Away Your Country?

[ClydeYellow]

Simple. Our legal tradition is different from Europe, therefore our laws should reflect that. The EHRA represents European legal tradition, and their attitude to "human rights" and are not compatible with ours. If the UN adopted a Human Rights Bill and could force it on all members, do you think America would be happy to allow this new Bill to supercede their Bill of Rights? Similarly if American demographics changed significantly, the population may vote through ammendments more in line with their culture.

FTFY. Also, I'm not sure Amendments are voted by the population (but I don't know of a referendum ever happening in the US).

Turkey massacred Armenians a christian minority at the beginning of XX century and are still trying to deny it. They also were angry with Pope just because he said that.

Yeah, surely the genocide of the Armenians didn't have anything to do with the then-ongoing World War, the unfavorable results of the Balkan Wars for the Ottoman Empire, the revolution which had brought an end to religious rule in said Empire (and great turmoil), and the unsolved Armenian Question, amongst other things.

Nah, the Turks totes genocided the Armenians because they were Christians and didn't want to become Mosleems.

 

[Scaff]

Turkey massacred Armenians a christian minority at the beginning of XX century and are still trying to deny it. They also were angry with Pope just because he said that.

Do you think all Turks think like that?

Are you aware that the Ottoman Empire did actually apologize at the end of the war? It was only Nationalistic pride of the newly formed Turkey that changed that. Nationalism, cool huh?

I wonder what italian left is waiting, why they don't just give immigrants the chance to vote. Why waiting for citizenship?

That is no way addresses the question you were asked.

 

[HKS racer]

Do you think all Turks think like that?

That in no way address the fact Turkey massacred Armenians at the beginning of XX century.

 

[Joel]

Turkey massacred Armenians a christian minority at the beginning of XX century and are still trying to deny it. They also were angry with Pope just because he said that.

grasping at straws. Your claim was that a world of 70% muslims would lead to sharia law worldwide. I countered that with the fact that Turkey as well as a number of other countries with a majority muslim population over 70% don't have sharia law.

 

[Scaff]

That in no way address the fact Turkey massacred Armenians at the beginning of XX century.

I didn't say it did.

And what the is XX century? You seem to be remarkably ill informed about this entire event.

However by that token you must consider me to be no different, after all the British have never apologized for the genocide of Boer women and children less that 40 years before the Armenian genocide.

 

[Rich S]

I get frustrated when the discourse on white nationalism points to the supposed double standard as if that gives us a need for white nationalism. There's a reason why in America there aren't white nationalist movements which are taken seriously. We call white nationalists in the USA "Democrats" or "Republicans". White Entertainment networks "CNN" "Fox" or "NBC".

Then there's the idea that there's a "white" common cultural or racial identity. A hundred years ago we wouldn't call Italian or Irish Americans "white" but the piece in the OP posits that immigration is eroding white American culture which was heavily influenced by Italian and Irish immigrants who weren't even considered white when they immigrated. What is "white culture?" European whites can't even decide on which alphabet they use, or whether they're Catholic, Protestant, or Orthodox.

It's not political correctness. I just genuinely disagree with the idea that America is a "white country" for white people. I'm neither ashamed nor proud of being white.

Most here in USA are Germanic I guess. The border states are becoming mainly Mexican with Whites as a minority. So if Foxnews pushes the anti-illegal agenda its to pander to the border states which feel their being invaded and their correct I suppose as there is an awful lot of Mexican Olympians who've sprinted across the border... Here in the North, were still almost 90% Aryan with some racial mixing and African-Americans here and there. So the anti-immigration has not caught on here as we dont see a change yet. Although in Minneapolis if you go for a bike ride on the greenway, Somalian immigrants are everywhere and the muslim ISIS woman with the full cover and the creepy slits and all....... But Muslims are still a heavy minority so it shouldn't be too risky for them to be here.

Anyways German decent is pretty much wide spread, assuming these people consider themselves Aryan, then they would also consider the Irish to be related the them as the British and Italians. I dont believe in what the KKK thought, I think they were more of a silly cult. The NAZI idiology had some merit to it I guess based on some scientific theories (at the time highly respected), the KKK is basically a joke.

 

[Exorcet]

That's the problem, in 60 years, we came from World War II where everyone was trying to rule the world to the suicide of western civilization. Humans should try to achieve a balance instead of endlessly jumping from end to end.

I think the correct balance is recognizing that everyone has individual desires and they should be free to pursue those desires. We don't need to select one world culture to actively spread everywhere, and we also don't need to suppress the majority culture just because it's the majority.

The Swiss recently gave a close to their boundaries because they were afraid about loosing their cultural identity.
I'm not against immigration, immigration is ok as long as you integrate yourself in the country and you don't cause problems in the country you intend to go.

What problems do you have in mind? The only ones that I can think of don't have to do with immigration, things like crime. Preferring your native language, food, dress, behavior isn't a problem. You aren't forcing it on anyone else just by being there, and that works in all directions. Imagine if the currently native Swiss population became a small minority. Would their culture be lost? They could just form groups where the people who like that culture could come together and just behave as they like to naturally. I can see some people worrying about their traditions eroding over time as children just feel more comfortable with the majority culture perhaps, but why is that bad? If anything it might indicate that the majority culture is preferable to most people, so why not let them go. In the reverse of this example, you have immigrants mixing their native culture with that of their new country. If the host nation has such a great culture it probably shouldn't just disappear right? Rome fell how many centuries ago and we can still clearly see its influence almost everywhere in the western world.

But what we have here, is not immigriation, let's be fair, it's colonialism without weapons, it's colonialism based on the hypocrsy and moral contradictions of western countries.

I don't see a distinction between colonialism without weapons and immigration. If you're not forcing your way it, you're not doing anything wrong.

America is a country of immigrants, and should be proud of that. But it is also a country of predominantly white immigrants, and recognition of their achievements should not be forgotten in the rush to create a homogenous "utopia". Political correctness has made us remember the "bads" of white majority rule far more readily and has skewed the balance.

I honestly don't care who made the lightbulb, I care it that makes light. I wouldn't say that the history of a nation isn't worth remembering, but I don't see the importance of making a chart showing who did what separated by race. Goes double when some of the races were forced to do the really dirty work which directly prevented them from being in the position to invent lightbulbs.

I don't think PC has much to do with this. I don't consider whites bad people, they're just people that happen to be white. Like the people that happen to be non-white, they don't have inherent ownership of the US [or any nation] based on skin color.

OK, but what would you say about Scandinavian countries. Should they be criticised for protecting their heritage (White European)?

Protecting your heritage is fine, but people need to remember they can only control themselves and their own property. That's as far as your influence should extend.

On the long run a world with 70% muslims 30% other people will lead to sharia law worldwide.

Will it? Muslims form quite a large group as is and it is no where near homogenous. A 70% Muslim population does not mean a 70% Shariah population, it could even be below 50% Shariah.

I think it's very arrogant from our generation not considering the importance of keeping the peace and the balance in this world. The 70 years of peace we had after WWII has been gained through centuries of war.

Immigration was one of the things that was more open post WWII than before it.

 

[ClydeYellow]

I didn't say it did.

And what the is XX century? You seem to be remarkably ill informed about this entire event.

However by that token you must consider me to be no different, after all the British have never apologized for the genocide of Boer women and children less that 40 years before the Armenian genocide.

And Italy has never apologized for the concentration camps estabilished during WW2 in occupied Yugoslavia. Hell, it wasn't that much ago that Silvio Berlusconi (who else) said that Mussolini "used to send people on vacation" to Rab... And that was the first statement from a high-profile politician about it.

Immigration was one of the things that was more open post WWII than before it.

Immigration is a constant phenomenon in human history, that in the European continent stopped only because of the strengthening of nationalism, the nation-State and its borders (in the late 19th century), up until nationalism saw its support drop at the end of WWII. Gee, I wonder if the two things (nationalism and war) may be related...

 

[HKS racer]

grasping at straws. Your claim was that a world of 70% muslims would lead to sharia law worldwide. I countered that with the fact that Turkey as well as a number of other countries with a majority muslim population over 70% don't have sharia law.

What? Do we really need to speak about isis and boko haram even in this thread? Noob616 there is no need to be passive agressive, this thread is now an attempt to speak with people with completely different point of views the important thing here is to post something without the "I'm 100% right you are 100% wrong" attitude. I know it's a difficoult matter but we all have a brain and we at lest we can manage to speak about problems without derailing discussion as our politicians tends to do 99,99% of times.

@Exorcet I thank you for your post above that's the kind of post I was waiting for, a constructive debate.

And Italy has never apologized for the concentration camps estabilished during WW2 in occupied Yugoslavia. Hell, it wasn't that much ago that Silvio Berlusconi (who else) said that Mussolini "used to send people on vacation" to Rab... And that was the first statement from a high-profile politician about it.

Berlusconi is a worldwide joke and doesn't represent whole center-right people in Italy.

 

[Scaff]

What? Do we really need to speak about isis and boko haram even in this thread? Noob616 there is no need to be passive agressive, this thread is now an attempt to speak with people with completely different point of views the important thing here is to post something without the "I'm 100% right you are 100% wrong" attitude. I know it's a difficoult matter but we all have a brain and we at lest we can manage to speak about problems without derailing discussion as our politicians tends to do 99,99% of times.

Rather ironic given that you were the one who derailed it with tales of how Islam is going to take over and we have to do something less they kill all the kids!

You want to keep it on topic? Stop answering questions with right wing rhetoric that has nothing to do with the question being asked.

 

[niky]

You're misunderstanding. America celebrates these achievements, but if you point out that they are White European achievements everyone gets a bit squemish

My laziness for not saying "White European"

Don't forget the part where I said: "Not all of them are actually white."

Italian immigrants, on the other hand...

Italians were once viewed as a distinctly non-white ethnicity.

And Jews, as well. Though they are still mostly viewed that way.

-

To put it into better perspective, white supremacists will have you believe the American empire was built on nothing more than the blood, sweat and tears of Anglo-Saxon workers and no one else. Which is, again, a dangerous misconception.

Even the most cursory examination of American culture is enough to dismiss the idea that immigrants were assimilated into it without bringing in their own culture and language.

Hell, American English is a bastardized hodge-podge that includes words brought in by immigrants and inherited from Spanish-speaking Mexicans and from Native Americans.

http://ojs.academypublisher.com/index.php/tpls/article/viewFile/tpls041124102414/10422

 

[Beeblebrox237]

Let's see if Gtplanet is mature enough to handle an argument like this without name calling.

Noob616 there is no need to be passive agressive

Oh, the irony.

 

[ClydeYellow]

Berlusconi is a worldwide joke and doesn't represent whole center-right people in Italy.

What? Do we really need to speak about isis and boko haram even in this thread?

Oh, yeah, let's talk about ISIL and how much Mosleems love them, shall we?

 

[HKS racer]

Rather ironic given that you were the one who derailed it with tales of how Islam is going to take over and we have to do something less they kill all the kids!

You want to keep it on topic? Stop answering questions with right wing rhetoric that has nothing to do with the question being asked.

So now you tell me what I have to say and in which way? Are you sure you are not abusing your moderating power? You want to close the thread? Do it.

But if you don't and my posts respect the AUP please let me reply the way I want, how I want and when I want. Thank you.

Oh, the irony.

Said by the oner who the first post was:

What a racist idiot.

Protecting your heritage is fine, but people need to remember they can only control themselves and their own property. That's as far as your influence should extend.

There is huge room for discussion here. Humans invented things like religion in order to easily bypass what you said in that sentence.

 

[niky]

So now you tell me what I have to say and in which way? Are you sure you are not abusing your moderating power? You want to close the thread? Do it.

But if you don't and my posts respect the AUP please let me reply the way I want, how I want and when I want. Thank you.

Nowhere did he say you were not allowed to post what you posted.

He simply pointed out that if you wish for people not to post off-topic, stop steering the discussion off-topic.

 

[Scaff]

So now you tell me what I have to say and in which way? Are you sure you are not abusing your moderating power? You want to close the thread? Do it.

If and when you break the AUP you will be aware of it, until then if you feel I have broken the AUP use the report button.

However that is not even close to what happened.

You complained that the thread was being derailed by talk of Islamic fundamentalism, I pointed out that was ironic given that you introduced talk of Islamic Fundamentalism to the thread.

You complained that people were answering off-topic, I pointed out that if you want that to stop you might want to stop replying with off topic right wing rhetoric and actually answer the questions you have been asked.


Reading and comprehension, they are fun!

But if you don't and my posts respect the AUP please let me reply the way I want, how I want and when I want. Thank you.

If you continue to post off-topic noise in place of answering the questions asked it is a violation of the AUP.

• You will, if asked by a representative of the forums, cease posting any content.

Answer the questions asked, do not use GTP as a platform to simply spout far right rhetoric in place of those answers.

Said by the oner who the first post was

Please point out in what way his statement is inaccurate or even ironic?

Or do you believe in White Supremacy and the threat of White Genocide?

 

[TenEightyOne]

OK, but what would you say about Scandinavian countries. Should they be criticised for protecting their heritage (White European)?

I would say "I wonder if there's already one or more threads covering this"?

I think a valid question is would the Bill of Rights' importance get lost should there be a large enough cultural shift. A good analogy would be Britain and the EU Human Rights Act, and our proposed British "Bill of Rights"
(As you can imagine, it's an exciting time to be British )

We already have a Bill of Rights (1689) that sits on top of the Magna Carta (albeit, as @Scaff alluded to, mostly uncodified as is the British way). The new BoR is a sop to make people think that withdrawing from our global human rights duty is somehow okay. You also seem to be confusing the European Human Rights Charter and the UN's UDHR, they're distinct and separable.

 

[Carbonox]

That was a hypothetical, although expect a nationalist surge in Sweden sometime soon.

Don't. Nationalism is all but dead in Sweden. It's arguably the last country in Europe, maybe even the whole world, that would ever elect a nationalist government.

You can look at SD's growing success and think differently, but trust me, their battle is doomed to be a failure due to the stern opposition they face from every other parliament party out there. In what other country would people all over the social media celebrate the fact that 87% of the voters didn't vote for SD - cough, excuse me, I meant, 87% voted against them.

 

[HKS racer]

Nowhere did he say you were not allowed to post what you posted.

He simply pointed out that if you wish for people not to post off-topic, stop steering the discussion off-topic.

Ok fair enough. But my complaint wasn't really about being or not off-topic it was more toward the difference in behaviour people having here. Some people like Exorcet have an oppisite point of view but I'm actually having an interesting discussion, others are just trying to create a situation that lead this thread to be locked.

Immigration was one of the things that was more open post WWII than before it.

What I wanted to say is: can the western world assure equal rights, work and welfare for all the people actually living here and all the people coming here without issues? Can western countries keep up with the rates, the numbers of new people each day arrive?

What happen when you add to much water to a glass? Some water get lost out of it.

 

[Scaff]

Ok fair enough.
What I wanted to say is: can the western world assure equal rights, work and welfare for all the people actually living here and all the people coming here without issues?

That assumes that people arriving in the Western are entailed to the same rights in the first place, certainly in the UK that isn't true and asylum seekers and refugees have no right to welfare or work on the same level as a UK citizen. They get a payment that is well below even the lowest level of welfare available to a national. Illegal immigrants? They are entitled to nothing and have zero right to work in the UK, but that's to be expected, the clues in the name.

Can western countries keep up with the rates, the numbers of new people each day arrive?

That is a valid question, one that personally I would be happy to pay more to help it happen (and I already pay more in tax and NI a year that the UK living wage), but then again I personally believe that we should help those who have nothing.

What happen when you add to much water to a glass? Some water get lost out of it.

Assumes that the glass is already full.

 

[HKS racer]

That assumes that people arriving in the Western are entailed to the same rights in the first place, certainly in the UK that isn't true and asylum seekers and refugees have no right to welfare or work on the same level as a UK citizen. They get a payment that is well below even the lowest level of welfare available to a national. Illegal immigrants? They are entitled to nothing and have zero right to work in the UK, but that's to be expected, the clues in the name.



That is a valid question, one that personally I would be happy to pay more to help it happen (and I already pay more in tax and NI a year that the UK living wage), but then again I personally believe that we should help those who have nothing.



Assumes that the glass is already full.

Well that's actually a good answer thank you. From your post I can hear how the situation in a country I'm not living in really is. It can also be a chance to letting you know the situation here is drastically different. Illegal immigration no longer exist in Italy everyone can jump in a boat and reach my country. Then the people arriving here should be splitted to different regions of Italy. They get benefits like communal houses without paying and they get per diem payment.

 

[Scaff]

Illegal immigration no longer exist in Italy everyone can jump in a boat and reach my country.

That would still make them either a refugee, asylum seeker or an illegal immigrant.

Then the people arriving here should be splitted to different regions of Italy.

Well those with a real need should, those without should be re-repatriated.

They get benefits like communal houses without paying and they get per diem payment.

How does that breakdown between Illegal Immigrants and Asylum Seekrs/Refugees?

On a basic level I have no issue with people being provided housing and food, its better than them being forced onto the streets and having to beg or steal for food.

 

[Pseudopod]

OK, but what would you say about Scandinavian countries. Should they be criticised for protecting their heritage (White European)?

White scandinavian here. I don't give a **** about what the people immigrating here looks like.

 

[zzz_pt]

Can we get a source for this outside of a far right / white supremacist site at all?

I only ask as Christopher De La Viña doesn't appear to have existed on the internet prior to that article, in fact the only place he seems to exist is that article?

This was exactly my thought.

The entire article looks fake. It starts by claiming it's written by an hispanic guy and then just goes on a racist rant until the end.

I don't buy it.

 

[Pseudopod]

So now you tell me what I have to say and in which way? Are you sure you are not abusing your moderating power? You want to close the thread? Do it.

But if you don't and my posts respect the AUP please let me reply the way I want, how I want and when I want. Thank you.

Sounds like you're actually hoping on becoming an internet martyr. Please close the thread so that everyone can see how being right leads to closed threads in today's PC society.

 

[HKS racer]

That would still make them either a refugee, asylum seeker or an illegal immigrant.


Well those with a real need should, those without should be re-repatriated.

No one gets re-patrieated.

How does that breakdown between Illegal Immigrants and Asylum Seekrs/Refugees?

On a basic level I have no issue with people being provided housing and food, its better than them being forced onto the streets and having to beg or steal for food.

Ok but no one gets re-repatriated. And we do have people stealing beggin for food and committing crimes on daily basis.

Sounds like you're actually hoping on becoming an internet martyr. Please close the thread so that everyone can see how being right leads to closed threads in today's PC society.

Internet martyr. I've never heard of it.
It's great to learn new things every day.

 

[Pseudopod]

We repatriate lots of people here. Also let a lot stay though.

 

[HKS racer]

We repatriate lots of people here. Also let a lot stay though.

Where do you live? I saw people with the "foglio di via" (expulsion) in their pockets staying here doing undeclared work and paying undeclared sub-rents to their countrymen.

 

[Scaff]

No one gets re-patrieated.

Ok but no one gets re-repatriated.

Well that's odd because before the fall of Libya, Italy had an agreement in place doing just that.

And we do have people stealing beggin for food and committing crimes on daily basis.

You always will do, I'm quite sure that its not just poor migrants that do so however.

Where do you live? I saw people with the "foglio di via" (expulsion) in their pockets staying here doing undeclared work and paying undeclared sub-rents to their countrymen.

Are you saying that yo actually saw it in the pocket of these people and you then followed them to work and then home, then investigated it all to ensure that it was indeed illegal activity?

Or are you just making assumptions?

 

[HKS racer]

Well that's odd because before the fall of Libya, Italy had an agreement in place doing just that.



You always will do, I'm quite sure that its not just poor migrants that do so however.

Actually most of the theft in the houses are done by orginazed criminals from east europe.

About the re-patriated thing I found this article.

Immigrants from the UK to Italy and back to avoid deportation

A BBC report documenting the journey of illegal immigrants who pay smugglers to take him from Dover to Calais up in Italy, where asylum seekers. Once back in the UK, if intercepted by the authorities, are returned in Italy and not in their land of origin: Afghanistan, India or Pakistan

March 21, 2015
BRUSSELS - There comes an explanation from the UK to record growth recorded by Eurostat of asylum seekers in Italy, in a year increased by 143 percent. A report released by the BBC video, shot by an undercover Afghan journalist, explains how illegal migrants arrived in the UK are able to stay long on European soil. When illegal immigrants are likely to be repatriated, paying 300 pounds to human traffickers to help them get out from England imbarcandoli onto trucks at the Port of Dover. After crossing the English Channel, arrived in France to Calais, coming up in Italy, where asylum seekers and are fingerprinted. From there they are free to return to Calais and embark again to return to the UK. This time traffickers ask him 1,200 pounds for the trip in reverse. Thanks to this trip, when they are intercepted by the British authorities will be sent back to Italy and not in their lands of origin, in Afghanistan, India or Pakistan, thus prolonging their stay on European soil.
The journalist gave 300 pounds to a trafficker with whom he had a meeting at a restaurant in Walthamstow, a town east of London, from where it is transported before the party on a minivan, then onto a truck. Other migrants were recovered before boarding to Dover.
The journey undertaken, the journalist-infiltrated, who shot the video with a hidden camera, was in the truck with a score of illegal migrants, of which the majority has confessed intention to return to the UK. Migrants also told him that they entered for the first time in Britain with student visas or irregularly.
The trip by truck ended in Veurne, Belgium, along the border with France and then migrants were driven in different locations. Journalist-infiltrator was shown how to reach the nearest station. The same smugglers invited him to call them on the phone to prepare the return and set foot in the UK. (Giovanni de Paola)

I google translated it so it may contain grammar errors.
http://www.redattoresociale.it/Noti...all-Italia-e-ritorno-per-evitare-il-rimpatrio

No don't know who the owner of that site is, but doesn't look like to be a white supremacy site. It's just an article that involves UK and explain a way to by-pass re-patriation so at least can be worth reading for some of you.