Wii U Project Cars Discussion

[DrJustice]

I've seen a lot of people go on about the potential the wii tablet controller offers to project cars, but the fact is, the ps4 also offers full support to use tablets as second screens in game, and sms didn't bother taking advantage of that in any way, despite the obvious benefits to the players, so why would you expect them to go to so much trouble on the wiiu version?

It's not a case of "didn't bother", but rather the 1st party approval and then the capacity/finances to do it. You can't just willy nilly code up any network functionality you fancy on a console - these things are strictly controlled by the manufacturers. Some of the examples of second screen apps on the consoles are either the 1st parties' own software, and even fully bounded by their closed ecosystem like PS4 and Vita. Some does not communicate with the running game, but rather with the servers of the game developers. Some seem to provide some real time communication with the console (War Thunder Tactical Map) - they may have the approvals needed (I don't know the policies governing that).

Read a response from the horse's mouth here (Health and safety warning: Ian Bell answers in that thread, so if you want to take offense from him typing, do not read! ).

 

[Mike_grpA]

Finances obviously weren't allocated to it, but I doubt it would be that hard to implement, as quite a few games use the second screen app, and not just for vita either, I have the app on my tablet, and while it's pretty much just a gimmick for most games that use it, I can see how it could be a huge asset to a racing sim. I don't care that they didn't want to go to the effort to try it, and from what Ian says in that thread, they didn't really look into it because they had way higher priorities. I understand the resources were allocated to what they thought most important first, but would be nice if they could look into it for pcars 2, which should be much better optimised for consoles.

Either way my point remains: If they didn't take advantage of the second screen on ps4, it's unlikely the Wii U version would've been very complex regarding use of the second screen. But some people were expecting the Wii U to not only handle the full game, but to have a lot more functionality than the other consoles, which is just unrealistic.

 

[Benny44]

Finances obviously weren't allocated to it, but I doubt it would be that hard to implement, as quite a few games use the second screen app, and not just for vita either, I have the app on my tablet, and while it's pretty much just a gimmick for most games that use it, I can see how it could be a huge asset to a racing sim. I don't care that they didn't want to go to the effort to try it, and from what Ian says in that thread, they didn't really look into it because they had way higher priorities. I understand the resources were allocated to what they thought most important first, but would be nice if they could look into it for pcars 2, which should be much better optimised for consoles.

Either way my point remains: If they didn't take advantage of the second screen on ps4, it's unlikely the Wii U version would've been very complex regarding use of the second screen. But some people were expecting the Wii U to not only handle the full game, but to have a lot more functionality than the other consoles, which is just unrealistic.

I don't think most Wii U owners expected it to have everything the full game had. I figured possibly fewer tracks, not quite as good looking and without weather. Everyone seems to feel the Wii U is underpowered, but the fact is that they announced this game alongside PS3/360 which are not as powerful as Wii U. Wii U version was announced as being in development BEFORE the XBox One and PS4 versions, so it's not like they should have been in any way porting those two versions to Nintendo's console.
As far as the second screen support, not everyone who owns a PS4 has a Vita or a compatible tablet. Secondly, the Wii U's tablet controller is better than either of those two things (refresh rate, picture quality) While Sony has done a good job with supporting it, you simply can't beat a unit that was designed around second screen. That's my two cents anyway ​

 

[Mike_grpA]

I don't think most Wii U owners expected it to have everything the full game had. I figured possibly fewer tracks, not quite as good looking and without weather. Everyone seems to feel the Wii U is underpowered, but the fact is that they announced this game alongside PS3/360 which are not as powerful as Wii U. Wii U version was announced as being in development BEFORE the XBox One and PS4 versions, so it's not like they should have been in any way porting those two versions to Nintendo's console.
As far as the second screen support, not everyone who owns a PS4 has a Vita or a compatible tablet. Secondly, the Wii U's tablet controller is better than either of those two things (refresh rate, picture quality) While Sony has done a good job with supporting it, you simply can't beat a unit that was designed around second screen. That's my two cents anyway ​

Fewer tracks would do nothing to free up memory, and taking weather away would no doubt cause an uproar among wii fans that they were getting an inferior product. Not to mention, Ian said the SETA tyre model almost maxed out the wii u by itself, let alone the rest of the game.

Secondly, the game was changed dramatically when WMD voted to drop ps3/360 in favour of current gen hardware. This included going all out on building the best and most realistic tyre model they possibly could, the SETA model. The older builds without this tyre model and with far less going on in the simulation department would have run on ps3, 360 and wii u, but that would essentially be viewed as shift 3, it was certainly nothing compared to the game pcars is now.

Thirdly, the screen in the wii u controller is not better than tablets, it may have a better screen than the vita, but there are a lot of good tablets compatible with the ps4 that are much much better than the wii u controller.

I agree that there aren't many people on ps4 taking advantage of the second screen app, but that's largely due to a large portion of ps4 owners viewing such things as gimmicks. No doubt they'd buy a wii u if they wanted that functionality, because, as you say, the wii u is designed completely around that.

I also had ps move for the ps3, because it was genuinely better than the wii remote. The same problem existed on that though. People weren't too interested in it, so Sony didn't show it much love.

I get that some Nintendo fans might be upset that they won't be getting a realistic sim racer afterall, but considering there's never been a racing sim on a nintendo console, I would imagine most sim racing fans who own a wii u would also own a platform they can play sims on anyway, so I doubt SMS is missing out on many sales.

 

[Benny44]

Ok, I know what you're saying about screens. And, don't get me wrong, I love Playstation. But implying that Nintendo has sold its last two consoles based on gimmicks is a bit harsh. If you haven't used a Wii U for an extended period of time, then you haven't gotten to enjoy the gamepad. It's actually quite comfortable. There is simply no way a tablet on a PS4 can compete. There are no physical buttons other than power, volume, home, etc. You'd have to take your hand off your controller to do anything on your tablet.

As for comparing move to wii's motion controls, Sony's effort was good but expensive. How could they take advantage of something when only a small percentage of PS3 users had the move? It would cost in the range of $100-$200 to get your console decked out with it. And then wii motion plus came along and was actually slightly better than the move for tracking motion(according to critics). As for the tire model, etc, I know WHY they didn't ultimately put it on Wii U, they just did made a lot of empty promises. And that is why I am so frustrated with it not being on the system.

 

[Mike_grpA]

Ok, I know what you're saying about screens. And, don't get me wrong, I love Playstation. But implying that Nintendo has sold its last two consoles based on gimmicks is a bit harsh. If you haven't used a Wii U for an extended period of time, then you haven't gotten to enjoy the gamepad. It's actually quite comfortable. There is simply no way a tablet on a PS4 can compete. There are no physical buttons other than power, volume, home, etc. You'd have to take your hand off your controller to do anything on your tablet.

As for comparing move to wii's motion controls, Sony's effort was good but expensive. How could they take advantage of something when only a small percentage of PS3 users had the move? It would cost in the range of $100-$200 to get your console decked out with it. And then wii motion plus came along and was actually slightly better than the move for tracking motion(according to critics). As for the tire model, etc, I know WHY they didn't ultimately put it on Wii U, they just did made a lot of empty promises. And that is why I am so frustrated with it not being on the system.

Nintendo absolutely did sell their last two systems based on gimmicks, and it was a brilliant move for Wii, because they tapped into a market full of non-gamers and casuals, and sold a ton of the things because of it. Of course the problem with that strategy is when you try to repeat it (Wii U), the people you've marketed to aren't interested in buying up more hardware, because they aren't serious gamers. This much is obvious when you look at Wii's comparatively poor software sales (when considering the massive install base). This was due to people buying the thing for Wii Fit or Wii Sports, and then not being gamers, not buying the other games. Wii U has sold so much worse because it's targeting an Audience who aren't interested in upgrading a system they bought for a little bit of fun.

The Wii U tablet having buttons has nothing at all to do with my point that the screen itself is not better than every tablet pc available, as the comment I replied to stated. Also, holding the Wii U controller/tablet, if you want to tap the screen, you have to let go of one of your hands off the buttons anyway don't you, so what's the difference? Especially since the best use of a second screen for pcars would be telemetry, so you don't need to touch the screen anyway.

As far as Wii motion + being more accurate than the PS move controller, you must have gotten those facts from a Nintendo fan site, as I've used both and the Move was almost perfect 1:1, and the Wii was simple at best. Motion + improved the Wii a lot (originally it was laughably inaccurate), but Sony just went all out on Move to make a point of having the thing work as advertised. The reason the Move was so accurate was due to having a series of six axis sensors located in the handle for the console to use bluetooth to know it's orientation at all times, and coupling that with that stupid looking ball on top that the camera tracked to know your location. I bought the move set up for my ps3 for $25 second hand, because as I said, it was just a gimmick, so I wouldn't have paid full price for it.

Now lastly the tyre model. It was announced they'd make it for Wii U when the game had the old tyre model, and was built to work on ps3/360, which being a full gen older than Wii U, were slower, so had those plans gone ahead, you'd have a Wii U version right now, and it'd be second only to the PC version. The problems started when WMD voted to drop last gen, as it meant the PC would get a proper up to date simulation, instead of the strongest version of a sim made for last gen. The resulting simulation was so complex that PS4 and X1 are struggling with it. Despite this, SMS kept working hard to optimise everything they could on Wii U hoping to get it to at least work at a reduced level to the other systems, but even at 720p, and heavily optimised, it was only achieving 23fps. Throw in a full grid + weather and I could easily see that drop to single digits. I've seen X1 frame rate drop into low 30s in videos with a lot on screen, and that runs as high as 60 in ideal situations.

 

[Com Fox]

Fewer tracks would do nothing to free up memory

Actually it would. Also every Wii U owner expected that it would be inferior, kinda like how the Handheld versions of Console Games are usually downgrades (3DS Sonic Generations and Lost World for example).


As for the bad news, while I was disappointed at first, I saw a few glimpse of things wrong with the game on the PS4 and Xbox ONE, I doubt I would even enjoy myself if this came to the Wii U. I'd rather have a bland racer over an unpolished racer with Sonic 06 like glitches when it is first released, and those "nice" comments Ian Bell made on Nintendo users made me want to stick a special finger at the franchise. (though while it maybe Sarcasm, the comment was completely uncalled for and if it was sarcasm, very immature).

 

[Mike_grpA]

Actually it would. Also every Wii U owner expected that it would be inferior, kinda like how the Handheld versions of Console Games are usually downgrades (3DS Sonic Generations and Lost World for example).


As for the bad news, while I was disappointed at first, I saw a few glimpse of things wrong with the game on the PS4 and Xbox ONE, I doubt I would even enjoy myself if this came to the Wii U. I'd rather have a bland racer over an unpolished racer with Sonic 06 like glitches when it is first released, and those "nice" comments Ian Bell made on Nintendo users made me want to stick a massive middle finger at the franchise. (though while it maybe Sarcasm, the comment was completely uncalled for and if it was sarcasm, very immature).

The number of tracks doesn't affect memory, it's just content taking up disc space...

The problem is most Wii users are expecting the company to bend over backwards to basically give them a completely different game (which it would be to work on Wii U), when it'll sell poorly on that platform anyway. SMS have stated they didn't want to water down the physics, and they've done all they can do to optimise it. Then you get Nintendo fan boys bombarding the official forums with crazy accusations and vile insults, and you can't blame Ian for being a smart arse after he tried repeatedly to calmly explain things to them, and got nothing but ignorance and hate in return.

Good on him for persisting as long as he did I reckon, I would've told them flat out to just **** off if they said stuff like that to me (one user said he wished Ian got cancer and died...ffs). He's even stated since all the carry on that they still haven't given up hope of getting the product to a nintendo system, and that's why it hasn't been officially cancelled, just put on hold.

I like Nintendo for their own first party stuff, but some of the fans are millitant fanboys that just won't accept reality.

 

[Com Fox]

The number of tracks doesn't affect memory, it's just content taking up disc space...

The problem is most Wii users are expecting the company to bend over backwards to basically give them a completely different game (which it would be to work on Wii U), when it'll sell poorly on that platform anyway. SMS have stated they didn't want to water down the physics, and they've done all they can do to optimise it. Then you get Nintendo fan boys bombarding the official forums with crazy accusations and vile insults, and you can't blame Ian for being a smart arse after he tried repeatedly to calmly explain things to them, and got nothing but ignorance and hate in return.

Good on him for persisting as long as he did I reckon, I would've told them flat out to just **** off if they said stuff like that to me (one user said he wished Ian got cancer and died...ffs). He's even stated since all the carry on that they still haven't given up hope of getting the product to a nintendo system, and that's why it hasn't been officially cancelled, just put on hold.

I like Nintendo for their own first party stuff, but some of the fans are millitant fanboys that just won't accept reality.

I guess that's what I actually meant then

While I do admire his dedication, I find what he is doing with it rather stubborn, I don't think people are asking for a different game, just decrease it so it can be played on the Wii U. Also according to an old Pcars poll, the Wii U is the most wanted version, which actually isn't much of a surprise. A game like Pcars is almost totally new to the Nintendo audience, since the other platforms also have GT, Forza and other 3rd parties to compete with. So it seems like a missed opportunity.

Sorry but I still see myself "blaming Ian". You're sounding like Ian and SMS is the only one in the industry who has been attacked by Millitant Fanbases, which obviously isn't true and those others who have are capable of handling it a mature way unlike Ian.

 

[Mike_grpA]

I guess that's what I actually meant then

While I do admire his dedication, I find what he is doing with it rather stubborn, I don't think people are asking for a different game, just decrease it so it can be played on the Wii U. Also according to an old Pcars poll, the Wii U is the most wanted version, which actually isn't much of a surprise. A game like Pcars is almost totally new to the Nintendo audience, since the other platforms also have GT, Forza and other 3rd parties to compete with. So it seems like a missed opportunity.

Sorry but I still see myself "blaming Ian". You're sounding like Ian and SMS is the only one in the industry who has been attacked by Millitant Fanbases, which obviously isn't true and those others who have are capable of handling it a mature way unlike Ian.

I think what you're failing to understand here is that they have tried to decrease it to make it work on Wii U, and the fact is simply it's far too advanced for the system to handle. Like I said before, Ian said the Wii U struggles to handle the tyre model alone, let alone the rest of the game.

That poll is no surprise, as people probably figured voting for the Wii version would help get it over the line, and PC/PS4/X1 users just expect the game on the system regardless. The only version which was a maybe was the Wii U version. They never said it would definitely be on the system.

I don't believe I am sounding like Ian and SMS are the only ones being attacked by fan boys. I simply said I don't blame him for being a smart arse when they literally ignored everything he said and kept going mental. I like how he's not a PR robot, and has a typically British sense of humour. It also beats the hell out of what we get from Kaz/PD (total ignorance and silence).

 

[Com Fox]

That poll is no surprise, as people probably figured voting for the Wii version would help get it over the line, and PC/PS4/X1 users just expect the game on the system regardless. The only version which was a maybe was the Wii U version. They never said it would definitely be on the system.

I don't believe I am sounding like Ian and SMS are the only ones being attacked by fan boys. I simply said I don't blame him for being a smart arse when they literally ignored everything he said and kept going mental. I like how he's not a PR robot, and has a typically British sense of humour. It also beats the hell out of what we get from Kaz/PD (total ignorance and silence).

I personally doubt it but even if it is true, it would prove how strong the following for a Nintendo Pcars is.

I think it would be better for Ian to keep his mouth shut like Kaz instead of making an uncalled for sarcastic remark and not even add something like a "jk" so people can easily know it was a joke (because sarcasm is hard to tell for some on the web). The most upsetting thing is that, Ian should've saw this backlash and response coming from his message and why posting the exact message on the forum is bad. It's like if Kaz wrote "You can say, we hate our fans", a lot of GT fans would be 🤬, and with Ian, Nintendo fans are 🤬.

He just came across as an unprofessional man, now only if Pcars 2 is cancelled then we have Phil Fish all over again (I know I've beaten a dead horse with this )

 

[Mike_grpA]

I personally doubt it but even if it is true, it would prove how strong the following for a Nintendo Pcars is.

I think it would be better for Ian to keep his mouth shut like Kaz instead of making an uncalled for sarcastic remark and not even add something like a "jk" so people can easily know it was a joke (because sarcasm is hard to tell for some on the web). The most upsetting thing is that, Ian should've saw this backlash and response coming from his message and why posting the exact message on the forum is bad. It's like if Kaz wrote "You can say, we hate our fans", a lot of GT fans would be 🤬, and with Ian, Nintendo fans are 🤬.

He just came across as an unprofessional man, now only if Pcars 2 is cancelled then we have Phil Fish all over again (I know I've beaten a dead horse with this )

It was called for lol. You are of course right about sarcasm, his post would only have been obvious to those with intelligence...

The fact is, the only people who even care about his comments or took them seriously, or are getting their nickers in a twist over them, are die hard big N fan boys. So I seriously doubt Ian, or anyone at SMS for that matter, cares at all.

He is hugely professional. If you actually read the proper forum threads, and not just the fan boy SMS bashing threads, you'll see just how involved with the community he is.

 

[Wolfe]

It was the Wii U Daily article and the Reddit/NeoGAF threads that took Ian's remark out of context. No context = very limited indication of sarcasm, fanboys or not. And like RESHIRAM5 said, it was a bit foolish of Ian if he had not expected that to happen. However, I think it's just as likely that he did expect it to make headlines and doesn't mind the free advertising.

On the subject of abuse at the official forum, Nintendo fans are mocked indiscriminately even when a discussion is civilized. The Wii U is bait for pot shots and trolls, and when agitated fanboys brought flames, many of the replies poured gasoline on the fire.

 

[McKiernan]

It was the Wii U Daily article and the Reddit/NeoGAF threads that took Ian's remark out of context. No context = very limited indication of sarcasm, fanboys or not. And like RESHIRAM5 said, it was a bit foolish of Ian if he had not expected that to happen. However, I think it's just as likely that he did expect it to make headlines and doesn't mind the free advertising.

On the subject of abuse at the official forum, Nintendo fans are mocked indiscriminately even when a discussion is civilized. The Wii U is bait for pot shots and trolls, and when agitated fanboys brought flames, many of the replies poured gasoline on the fire.

Sad but true, I read that thread out of curiosity mainly, one poster mentioned that the attitudes expressed by all sides of the fence, covered no one in glory.

 

[Benny44]

I know for me personally it is very hard to stay civilised in these conversations. You try and bring up valid points but so many people mock Nintendo. My favorite game system of all is probably still the PS2, so I'm not exactly a 'Nintendo fanboy'. Backhanded comments really bug me. Especially when they are condescending. 'You can have your little gimmicky system, I'll just keep my real video games'.. @McKiernan I read most of that thread as well, and the commenter you quoted is not wrong.I started this thread because I wanted to talk about the upcoming Project Cars game. When it didn't get released, we have every right to be upset.

 

[Mike_grpA]

I know for me personally it is very hard to stay civilised in these conversations. You try and bring up valid points but so many people mock Nintendo. My favorite game system of all is probably still the PS2, so I'm not exactly a 'Nintendo fanboy'. Backhanded comments really bug me. Especially when they are condescending. 'You can have your little gimmicky system, I'll just keep my real video games'.. @McKiernan I read most of that thread as well, and the commenter you quoted is not wrong.I started this thread because I wanted to talk about the upcoming Project Cars game. When it didn't get released, we have every right to be upset.

So when a developer says they might release a game for a system you own, and they will try as hard as they can to make it work properly, despite the system being far weaker than it's rivals, and then after the developer spends a lot of their time and money trying to optimise the code for the system, and no matter what they do, they can't get it to work, so they put it on hold. You have a RIGHT to get upset about it do you?

I don't think Ian cared much about what the "backlash" would be from fanboys by the time he made the comment that was jumped on. If you read how much time he spent trying to explain to people what was going on with their Wii U development before that comment, you'll see barely any of the Wii U fans would pay attention, and were just asking the same things over and over, and some were being very rude, which led to him saying what he thought they were all wanting to hear, basically what the fan boys were already saying about SMS in Nintendo forums, that they just hate Nintendo users.

You can get as upset as you like, but the fact of the matter is they actually tried very hard to make it work, and never promised it would definitely come out for Wii U, which is a hell of a lot more than most other third party devs do for Wii. Most of them just flat out ignore Nintendo.

Btw: My favourite console of all time was the N64, back when Nintendo still produced the strongest hardware and had the most advanced games, but that all ended with the first Wii. Since then Nintendo games have been nothing compared to the giant killers they were when I was younger.

 

[Wolfe]

So when a developer says they might release a game for a system you own, and they will try as hard as they can to make it work properly, despite the system being far weaker than it's rivals, and then after the developer spends a lot of their time and money trying to optimise the code for the system, and no matter what they do, they can't get it to work, so they put it on hold. You have a RIGHT to get upset about it do you?

"It's not our job to disappoint [Nintendo fans]. So when we say the Wii U version is delayed in 2015 because we need a little more time, that's all it is. We just want to make sure it's of the same standard of all the other games." -- Andy Tudor

This is the way SMS talked about it prior to the wave of delays. Andy also said the Wii U version was "extremely promising" in development. Nothing about the language they were using suggested it was a "maybe" -- sorry, but that's a retcon on Ian's part.

I'm not saying Nintendo fans have a right to demand the game, but it was not unreasonable to expect the game, because SMS repeatedly said it was going to happen. It was also not unreasonable to believe it was working fine in spite of the Wii U's limited processing power, because Andy said it was working. Griping about all this and insulting SMS on the official forum is not helpful, but it's fair enough for Nintendo fans to be upset by the Wii U version's pseudo-cancellation.

Personally, given the game's teething problems, I can wait for PCARS2 on the NX. And if that doesn't happen, maybe I'll have a fast enough PC by then.

 

[Mike_grpA]

"It's not our job to disappoint [Nintendo fans]. So when we say the Wii U version is delayed in 2015 because we need a little more time, that's all it is. We just want to make sure it's of the same standard of all the other games." -- Andy Tudor

This is the way SMS talked about it prior to the wave of delays. Andy also said the Wii U version was "extremely promising" in development. Nothing about the language they were using suggested it was a "maybe" -- sorry, but that's a retcon on Ian's part.

I'm not saying Nintendo fans have a right to demand the game, but it was not unreasonable to expect the game, because SMS repeatedly said it was going to happen. It was also not unreasonable to believe it was working fine in spite of the Wii U's limited processing power, because Andy said it was working. Griping about all this and insulting SMS on the official forum is not helpful, but it's fair enough for Nintendo fans to be upset by the Wii U version's pseudo-cancellation.

Personally, given the game's teething problems, I can wait for PCARS2 on the NX. And if that doesn't happen, maybe I'll have a fast enough PC by then.

But you've quoted him saying it's promising at the start of 2014. They were saying all kinds of good stuff about the game before they switched focus to new hardware, and once they re-did things to suit more modern hardware, the cracks started to show for Wii U. It has been explained a million times to Nintendo fans, and yet all they do is keep saying the same stuff over and over, and don't listen to any explanations they're given, which is why Ian gave up trying to explain things and just gave them the answer they were looking for.

Now on all the Nintendo fan sites, everyone is saying Wii U pcars is cancelled, and pcars 2 will be on the NX... FFS the NX is only a name. Nintendo haven't even said it will be their next home console, let alone give an idea of the specs of the thing. Nintendo needs to build a machine that matches the generation it's released in, not the previous gen, and their troubled with third party devs wouldn't be so bad.

I can't explain it any better than this comment, from the pcars forums, responding to a Nintendo fan who keeps trolling the forum and posting baiting threads constantly:

"Because above all else some Nintendo Wii U fans cannot and will not accept that their machine is severely lacking in terms of hardware specs, capability, support from Nintendo, sales on a local and International level. Also some will take the news of the PCars Wii U version as a personal slight against themselves and Nintendo, so outraged they will be that even in the face of tech specs, sales figures, accounts from developers who have struggled with the Wi U system, retailer de-listings and a total lack of 3rd party interest, they will still stick their fingers in their ears and scream.

When a developer says it 'intends' to release a game on a particular platform but later cannot because the considerations required do not match up, that is not a 'promise' That is just how life is sometimes and not really worth getting so worked up about.

Forget Mr Bell, I would have thought there are far more questions to generally ask Nintendo themselves..."

 

[Benny44]

@Mike_grpA - So it's fine to get public money to fund a game that is primarily Wii U/PC, ANNOUNCE that it is going to be on the Wii U then decide you're going to make it for the two newest consoles, continue to tell fans it is still coming to Wii U, then release on the two newer consoles and try and sweep the Wii U version under the rug? The only reason Ian Bell said anything was because of the backlash of fans.

You come onto a thread discussing Wii U, bash the console, put down all the fans of it, and act as if you are the final say on everything. It was actually an interesting discussion before you came along and started an argument. You would be doing everybody on here a favor if you just went away and let people who have a Wii U (or at least tried one) talk about a game they were looking forward to.

 

[Mike_grpA]

@Mike_grpA - So it's fine to get public money to fund a game that is primarily Wii U/PC, ANNOUNCE that it is going to be on the Wii U then decide you're going to make it for the two newest consoles, continue to tell fans it is still coming to Wii U, then release on the two newer consoles and try and sweep the Wii U version under the rug? The only reason Ian Bell said anything was because of the backlash of fans.

You come onto a thread discussing Wii U, bash the console, put down all the fans of it, and act as if you are the final say on everything. It was actually an interesting discussion before you came along and started an argument. You would be doing everybody on here a favor if you just went away and let people who have a Wii U (or at least tried one) talk about a game they were looking forward to.

I didn't say a single thing to "bash" the console, you can interpret that the wii u is inferior in whatever way you want mate, and I never once put down all of the fans of it. I put down the ridiculous fan boys on the official forum claiming the bollocks that people here are quoting as fact. A good example of that is what you're saying, that the game was primarily a wii u and pc game. It was NEVER primarily a console game at all. It was primarily a f2p pc game with micro transactions, and was 95% funded by pc users only, then by decision of wmd users, it was decided to be a console release too, with ps3/360/wii u being added to the development. Then wmd voted to move development to next gen, and drop ps3/360, and only SMS wanted to keep developing for Wii U. Then after the game had evolved into what we see now, the development on Wii U was stalling due to difficulties finding new ways to optimise it to actually work properly. They suspended development to focus on the 3 similar platforms (pc/ps4/x1) to release them, at which point they would look into what they could do to get the Wii U version done. They then stated that they would wait on news of Nintendos new hardware, as Nintendo released a vague statement about a new product name (nx), and SMS didn't know what this would be, when it would release, and whether it would negatively affect their efforts to put out a game on Wii U. They have said now that they are looking into what will be the best course of action for the Wii U version.

If you knew anything at all about how the game was funded, you'd know that all backers get a return on their investment of more than they put in, they were all given the option of a refund if they didn't want a pc version on release, and none of them are even discussing any of this. It is all just BS from Nintendo fan boy websites that have made up one bs article after another about the project being a kickstarter or about it being a wii u exclusive before other platforms were added, or that wii u users were the biggest contributors, and many many many more lies they've made up as click bait to get the hardcore fan boys riled up, because it's good for the traffic on their websites.

They announced it was in development for the Wii U, not that it would definitely be released for the Wii U. Besides that, it was never cancelled, and Ian recently said himself they were still hoping to release it.

I never started any argument in this thread, if you look back you actually quoted me and started arguing with what I said. All I did was try to explain things that people obviously weren't understanding. On the contrary, your replies to my posts seem to have ignored all of the facts, stated mis information from nintendo sites as fact instead of looking at the pcars site for your answers, and then told me to go away so that Wii U owners can talk about it (read:bash sms).

Try to actually read into what's really going on, instead of getting your info from the same places as those fan boys on the pcars forums who are constantly trolling SMS and ignoring everything they're told...

Here are two threads I think everyone here should read:
http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?27717-Information-on-Nintendo-versions-of-pCARS-(some-wailing)&highlight=Information+Nintendo+versions+pCARS+(some+wailing)

http://forum.projectcarsgame.com/showthread.php?27584-Can-the-Wii-U-run-PCARS&highlight=wiiu

 

[Com Fox]

I didn't say a single thing to "bash" the console

Btw: My favourite console of all time was the N64, back when Nintendo still produced the strongest hardware and had the most advanced games, but that all ended with the first Wii. Since then Nintendo games have been nothing compared to the giant killers they were when I was younger.

Also, might I add, Bell made the ridiculous sarcastic comment on all Nintendo Users, he didn't specify which ones, just any Nintendo user.

His dumb idea of a "joke" (if it is a joke (though likely is)) wouldn't need any issues if, 1) He did a specification instead of Nintendo Users in general 2) He added a "jk" or something so people can get it because Sarcasm can be hard to understand.

Or 3) Act like a responsible adult and don't try to add fuel to an already raging fire.

 

[Mike_grpA]

If you read on after the comment (I'm assuming you're referring to his "we hate nintendo users" comment) he actually did address the comment saying he didn't think people would actually believe it.

As far as your quotes go, how is me saying I think the Nintendo games post gamecube aren't anywhere near as good as pre Wii considered "bashing" the Wii U? It is a perfectly valid opinion and I base it on the games I've played on those systems. GCN and all Nintendo systems before it were powerhouses of their day (GCN was twice what the PS2 was, N64 was Twice what the PS1 was), and since the first Wii, the hardware has been well below their competition. Hence they are no longer "giant killing" games. By that I mean, ps1 and 2 were giants, due to their massive sales, but the best games of those gens were on N64 and GCN. The sheer quality, graphics, and size of some games on those systems, compared to their more popular competitors, were "giant killers" IMO.

 

[Com Fox]

If you read on after the comment (I'm assuming you're referring to his "we hate nintendo users" comment) he actually did address the comment saying he didn't think people would actually believe it.

As far as your quotes go, how is me saying I think the Nintendo games post gamecube aren't anywhere near as good as pre Wii considered "bashing" the Wii U? It is a perfectly valid opinion and I base it on the games I've played on those systems. GCN and all Nintendo systems before it were powerhouses of their day (GCN was twice what the PS2 was, N64 was Twice what the PS1 was), and since the first Wii, the hardware has been well below their competition. Hence they are no longer "giant killing" games. By that I mean, ps1 and 2 were giants, due to their massive sales, but the best games of those gens were on N64 and GCN. The sheer quality, graphics, and size of some games on those systems, compared to their more popular competitors, were "giant killers" IMO.

Like I said before, I Ian should have should have seen that coming, it's the internet and people have trouble reading sarcasm.

 

[Mike_grpA]

Yeah I understand your point on that one, and I agree. I just don't think he cared to be honest. At that stage it was pretty obvious that anyone who genuinely wanted to listen to him and understand the situation, would do, and all the trolls would do is troll away and ignore everything. I don't think he'd regret it either, as it's caused quite a lot of conversation about the game and SMS.

Edit: The important thing to do in all of this is listen to the devs and WMD members, and not the trolls and piss weak "journalists" at certain fan sites.

 

[Wolfe]

But you've quoted him saying it's promising at the start of 2014. They were saying all kinds of good stuff about the game before they switched focus to new hardware, and once they re-did things to suit more modern hardware, the cracks started to show for Wii U.

After it was delayed to 2015, SMS didn't say a single word about it until May, when Ian confessed the difficulties they're having. The silence was worrying enough for anyone paying attention, but right up to the game's initial launch, Bandai Namco kept repeating that the Wii U version would be released in "2015".

My point is that there was no tangible reason for people to see this coming. If SMS had concerns early on, they never disclosed them until now. The Wii U is always getting lambasted for being "underpowered", and SMS specifically declared their intention to counter that sentiment. There was nothing else but these old quotes, but who are fans going to trust, the haters or the developers themselves?

People have reason to be upset. It's just not an excuse to go mouth off on the official forum, and I'm aware there's misinformation flying around.

 

[Mike_grpA]

After it was delayed to 2015, SMS didn't say a single word about it until May, when Ian confessed the difficulties they're having. The silence was worrying enough for anyone paying attention, but right up to the game's initial launch, Bandai Namco kept repeating that the Wii U version would be released in "2015".

My point is that there was no tangible reason for people to see this coming. If SMS had concerns early on, they never disclosed them until now. The Wii U is always getting lambasted for being "underpowered", and SMS specifically declared their intention to counter that sentiment. There was nothing else but these old quotes, but who are fans going to trust, the haters or the developers themselves?

People have reason to be upset. It's just not an excuse to go mouth off on the official forum, and I'm aware there's misinformation flying around.

Yeah I understand that, and completely agree with your last paragraph there. You and Robbo are the two Wii U posters on the official forums that everyone else should be more like, it's just unfortunate that the misinformation most of the other Wii U fans over there are raging about, gets passed from one to the next, and seemingly none of them have noticed how many times so many people have set them straight and explained in great detail what's gone/going on.

I understand people that haven't been following closely enough may not have noticed the lack of positive statements about it for a while, and as far as Namco repeating the release in 2015, I hadn't noticed that, though I never specifically followed the Wii U specific news for the game, more just how the game was coming along for PC, so I would probably be pissed at Namco for that if I were a Wii U owner. I don't think that would have anything to do with SMS though. More likely Namco spruiking what they think is a future product, to generate as much hype, and therefore sales, as possible. Likely without even speaking to SMS about the likelihood of that release being on schedule.

I don't think all hope is lost on a Wii U release at all. But it will likely be nothing like the full cream version if and when it does land. Ian spoke about needing reduced visuals, cutting dynamic weather, and switching back to the old tyre model as being what it'd likely take to achieve 30fps at 720p. As far as I understand it, the old tyre model was an advancement of the shift 2 model (I could be wrong, but that's what I've read), so that would mean the game would be basically shift 3. They might be able to throw in some pre-baked weather, maybe a specific series of wet races? Dunno. But all of this would require quite a bit of money and reworking, for an install base of 10 mill, on a system people didn't buy for a game like this. They have to weigh up the investment vs likely return. Also it'll probably be buggy as hell, with no WMD support to iron out the bugs from all the reworking.

AFAIK it's either something like that, or they simply wait it out 'till Nintendo releases some info on when their next system will launch. Nintendo isn't exactly helping the situation by being so vague about their plans. They aren't supporting Wii U very well atm, and being so vague about this NX, whatever it's meant to be, and obviously not telling anything to third party devs either, wouldn't be helping SMS with what must be a pretty hard decision. I don't envy SMS' position in this. They're stuck between a rock and a hard place, being bombarded on their own forums by trolls whilst trying to do their jobs.

 

[Wolfe]

...as far as Namco repeating the release in 2015, I hadn't noticed that, though I never specifically followed the Wii U specific news for the game, more just how the game was coming along for PC, so I would probably be pissed at Namco for that if I were a Wii U owner.

I suppose you could say Bandai Namco wasn't lying when they promised information would be "coming soon," about a week before Ian spoke up.

I don't think all hope is lost on a Wii U release at all. But it will likely be nothing like the full cream version if and when it does land. Ian spoke about needing reduced visuals, cutting dynamic weather, and switching back to the old tyre model as being what it'd likely take to achieve 30fps at 720p...

Honestly, I didn't expect them to overstep the bounds of the hardware in the first place, considering the age of the project (since before the launch of the Wii U) and its roots in the prior iteration of the Madness engine. I know they didn't start development on Wii U until autumn 2013, but I didn't think they'd try so hard to squeeze the full cream experience onto the Wii U's hardware, because I never expected that to work. I guess SMS thought it would.

I really couldn't care less about reduced visuals, and I'd be happy enough with the Brush Tire Model if it meant I could play the game on my preferred system. After tweaking the controls, I thought Shift 2 Unleashed was pretty close to enjoyable, just not close enough. If SMS polished up the BTM, it might not be the simulator it is on other platforms, but it could still be fun to drive.

Nintendo isn't exactly helping the situation by being so vague about their plans. They aren't supporting Wii U very well atm, and being so vague about this NX, whatever it's meant to be, and obviously not telling anything to third party devs either, wouldn't be helping SMS with what must be a pretty hard decision. I don't envy SMS' position in this. They're stuck between a rock and a hard place, being bombarded on their own forums by trolls whilst trying to do their jobs.

Nintendo is being vague because they mentioned the NX for only one reason -- to preempt speculation that they would be exiting the hardware business upon announcing their partnership with the mobile company DeNA. Satoru Iwata has been crystal clear about that.

I agree with you on the situation SMS has found themselves in, although I feel part of the trouble comes down to mishandling things on multiple occasions, including Ian's sarcastic joking remark.

 

[Mike_grpA]

I think most Wii U owners would agree with you that they wouldn't care about having a reduced experience, I think that it's SMS that don't want such an inferior version of their game out there. I can imagine the Nintendo reviewers tearing them apart from dumbing down the version for the Wii U. Though Ian did say that they would do that if it became clear that there would be no chance of a new system for a couple of years. The hope was that they could drop Wii U for the next system, like they did to Sony and Microsoft's systems, to get the same experience as the PC version out.

I think the whole idea of pcars on console was to bring a proper racing sim to consoles, that would only differ to the pc version in visuals. The PS4 version (which I have) has graphics that are barely any better than GT6, such is the massive drain on the system of the physics.

I believe you'll get what you're hoping for (brush model, reduced visuals and effects), because it's become clear that Nintendo won't have a new system out in time. They could have been more clear with the third party devs about this long ago, to help devs decide if they'll make games for the Wii U or not. But Nintendo haven't exactly got the best track record with third parties, so it doesn't really surprise me. I reckon give it 6 months for them to rework it (remember lots of bug fixing currently going on for other platforms) and they'll release it, maybe with a different name like Project CARS U or lite or something.

 

[Com Fox]

I think most Wii U owners would agree with you that they wouldn't care about having a reduced experience, I think that it's SMS that don't want such an inferior version of their game out there. I can imagine the Nintendo reviewers tearing them apart from dumbing down the version for the Wii U. Though Ian did say that they would do that if it became clear that there would be no chance of a new system for a couple of years. The hope was that they could drop Wii U for the next system, like they did to Sony and Microsoft's systems, to get the same experience as the PC version out.

I think the whole idea of pcars on console was to bring a proper racing sim to consoles, that would only differ to the pc version in visuals. The PS4 version (which I have) has graphics that are barely any better than GT6, such is the massive drain on the system of the physics.

I believe you'll get what you're hoping for (brush model, reduced visuals and effects), because it's become clear that Nintendo won't have a new system out in time. They could have been more clear with the third party devs about this long ago, to help devs decide if they'll make games for the Wii U or not. But Nintendo haven't exactly got the best track record with third parties, so it doesn't really surprise me. I reckon give it 6 months for them to rework it (remember lots of bug fixing currently going on for other platforms) and they'll release it, maybe with a different name like Project CARS U or lite or something.

I kinda doubt the tearing apart. Usually the inferior ports are usually reviewed more nicely than the superior versions because it's usually the consoles fault.

 

[Mike_grpA]

I kinda doubt the tearing apart. Usually the inferior ports are usually reviewed more nicely than the superior versions because it's usually the consoles fault.

I don't doubt it, I've seen what passes for journalism on a lot of those sites, but that wasn't really the point of my post.