Would people really prefer having to pay for Battle Passes or monthly DLC packs for cars and race tracks?

[Imari]

It makes companies money but I would never buy a game like that even if it was named Gran Turismo. It's grubby. I'm not opening my wallet for a few cars. I can't stand games that treat players like ATMs.

Roffle my copter and paint me turquoise, I've never seen such irony.

 

[NICKname]

It makes companies money but I would never buy a game like that even if it was named Gran Turismo. It's grubby. I'm not opening my wallet for a few cars. I can't stand games that treat players like ATMs.

 

[Scaff]

It makes companies money but I would never buy a game like that even if it was named Gran Turismo. It's grubby. I'm not opening my wallet for a few cars. I can't stand games that treat players like ATMs.

But you're fine with GT7s current model? Which actually does that, rather than paid DLC that doesn't?

Time to dig out the Cory quote again.

 

[NTGSruler]

How about we change the expectations here? What if, let's say, we pay 70-100euros for a game that IS COMPLETE. And maybe then we can think of paying for extra DLC along the way. We paid 70 or more euro for a game that now in April will implement new events, and maybe a "sell" feature, what should have been in the game since release. I did not buy the "DLC" in GTS, but the Hamilton DLC is something i would pay for. As for the rest MTX that is in the game, i can live with => see GTS. I thought that was the perfect way to do it. You earn ingame enough credits to buy every car that you wanted, if you did some grinding, or you could buy a car for a "small" fee. Not this 20 euro for 2million credits crap. That's just ripping people off. I also doubt this earning model is sustainable in the long run for a company.

 

[Dak0ta]

But you're fine with GT7s current model? Which actually does that, rather than paid DLC that doesn't?

Time to dig out the Cory quote again.

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while games take longer to make, every day new people get into gaming, i remember reading that it was on the ps3/360 gen that games where most expensive to make

 

[Scaff]

while games take longer to make, every day new people get into gaming, i remember reading that it was on the ps3/360 gen that games where most expensive to make

Indeed, but at the end of the day GT is a halo series and brings console sales and the associated attach rate to Sony, they would pretty much fund PD to make GT regardless, as long as it still shifts units (Forza is pretty much the same for MS).

That's what makes this all the more frustrating and annoying.

 

[NTGSruler]

Indeed, but at the end of the day GT is a halo series and brings console sales and the associated attach rate to Sony, they would pretty much fund PD to make GT regardless, as long as it still shifts units (Forza is pretty much the same for MS).

That's what makes this all the more frustrating and annoying.

Indeed. That's why they lower payouts to push people towards MTX. You would think that Sony/PD treated their fanbase differently.

 

[Magog]

But you're fine with GT7s current model? Which actually does that, rather than paid DLC that doesn't?

Time to dig out the Cory quote again.

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What are you talking about? All of the cars are free to earn in game and GT7 is far cheaper now than GT1 was in 1997.

 

[Snake55wildcat]

Hell no, keep battlepasses out of games PLEASE, I hated it when Hotwheels Unleashed did it, and I hate that more racing games are planning it. The only games that have done it right is ONRUSH and Deep Rock Galactic, both of which arent even a racing games.

 

[Scaff]

What are you talking about? All of the cars are free to earn in game and GT7 is far cheaper now than GT1 was in 1997.
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You need to take that up with the head of a Sony First Party studio, not me, but way to miss the point!

That logical error aside, you seem to have missed the GT7 economy being built around MTX's, and the balance of those posting in here seem to prefer the idea of paid DLC combined with a balanced in-game economy (i.e. not the one with the worst grind in GT history, combined with a paid shortcut).

 

[NICKname]

What are you talking about? All of the cars are free to earn in game and GT7 is far cheaper now than GT1 was in 1997.
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How much did the microtransactions cost in GT1, though? Could you also adjust those for inflation?

 

[Magog]

You need to take that up with the head of a Sony First Party studio, not me, but way to miss the point!

That logical error aside, you seem to have missed the GT7 economy being built around MTX's, and the balance of those posting in here seem to prefer the idea of paid DLC combined with a balanced in-game economy (i.e. not the one with the worst grind in GT history, combined with a paid shortcut).

The economy isn't built around MTX. You can earn a huge amount of credits very quickly and they are planning to double the credits you can earn which to me is overkill. You can win every race in the game without touching cars over 1 million dollars which there aren't even that many of.

 

[Scaff]

The economy isn't built around MTX.

It quite clearly is, the evidence to support that has been repeatedly demonstrated in numerous threads.

You can earn a huge amount of credits very quickly and they are planning to double the credits you can earn which to me is overkill.

No, you can't, it's been proven that the current economy is one of, if not the slowest to earn of any GT title, @Famine even published an article about it. What the economy will look like after the promised changes we will have to see, but right now we can only talk about the products we have, not the one we 'may' have.

You can win every race in the game without touching cars over 1 million dollars which there aren't even that many of.

Because the game released massively light on events, this is not quite the flex you think it is!

 

[Imari]

You can win every race in the game without touching cars over 1 million dollars which there aren't even that many of.

If they had put no events in the game you could have won all the races without even buying a car! Silly Polyphony, putting races in their game. What amateurs.

 

[EES]

Hell no, that will split the sportmode online community, which is where I spend most of my time.

I believe they've already promised extra tracks will be free so they can't back out from that. No more mess ups, they need to fix the reputation of the whole francise first after the mess they created last week.

 

[Veinz]

Neither of these, they don’t work well for GT.

 

[dacc10]

How about we change the expectations here? What if, let's say, we pay 70-100euros for a game that IS COMPLETE. And maybe then we can think of paying for extra DLC along the way. We paid 70 or more euro for a game that now in April will implement new events, and maybe a "sell" feature, what should have been in the game since release. I did not buy the "DLC" in GTS, but the Hamilton DLC is something i would pay for. As for the rest MTX that is in the game, i can live with => see GTS. I thought that was the perfect way to do it. You earn ingame enough credits to buy every car that you wanted, if you did some grinding, or you could buy a car for a "small" fee. Not this 20 euro for 2million credits crap. That's just ripping people off. I also doubt this earning model is sustainable in the long run for a company.

I think the GTS model was fine too. It had MTX, but nothing absurd. The grind was much more doable than GT7, only if people were somehow in a hurry, they would pay real money for a specific car. In that case, the existance of MTX was balanced by free content via updates (with exception of the LH paid DLC).

If they want to make a Season Pass of sorts in the future, they better make it with an acceptable price, and tell us what it contains.

Though, let's keep in mind that, the car and track list has disappointed many people. Yet, many of them bought the game, expecting that in the future, it would get more content for free (based on GTS). I assume many people will be disappointed if they have to pay for more content.

 

[Famine]

You can earn a huge amount of credits very quickly

they are planning to double the credits you can earn which to me is overkill.

No, they aren't.

They are planning to "re-establish the reward system with greater balance throughout the game" (which may mean some rewards go down) while increasing the rewards in "the latter half of the World Circuits events by approximately 100% on average" (which may mean some rewards more than double).


I don't know where people are pulling this insane "they're doubling prizes" - and the equally insane "they're doubling prizes they've already halved" - rubbish from, but it's not what Yamauchi said at all.

You can expect longer and notionally more difficult (more chillis) events which already pay out 50,000cr to 75,000cr to increase more - and more so the longer and more difficult they are - while shorter and easier events may increase or decrease slightly.

 

[Magog]

No, they aren't.

They are planning to "re-establish the reward system with greater balance throughout the game" (which may mean some rewards go down) while increasing the rewards in "the latter half of the World Circuits events by approximately 100% on average" (which may mean some rewards more than double).


I don't know where people are pulling this insane "they're doubling prizes" - and the equally insane "they're doubling prizes they've already halved" - rubbish from, but it's not what Yamauchi said at all.

You can expect longer and notionally more difficult (more chillis) events which already pay out 50,000cr to 75,000cr to increase more - and more so the longer and more difficult they are - while shorter and easier events may increase or decrease slightly.

That would be a good balance. Kaz is right that if you earn things too quickly the feeling of reward is diminished. You can earn almost a million credits in an hour already which is enough to buy the fastest cars in the game.

 

[Scaff]

That would be a good balance. Kaz is right that if you earn things too quickly the feeling of reward is diminished. You can earn almost a million credits in an hour already which is enough to buy the fastest cars in the game.

How much the fastest cars in the game cost is irrelevant to the economy, how much the most expensive ones cost is. And that takes far more than an hour, far, far more!

 

[Famine]

Kaz is right that if you earn things too quickly the feeling of reward is diminished.

Are we going two for two of quoting Yamauchi incorrectly to serve some weird alternate purpose? Looks like we are.

Incidentally, a maximum of 900,000cr per hour on a non-stop grind is still the second-lowest for any active game in the entire series, behind only a game whose entire collection of cars would cost less than half of a SINGLE vehicle from GT7's Legends Cars.

"You can earn a huge amount of credits very quickly" my fat hairy arse.

 

[Johnnn]

Paid content is normal way and I like it. But what to expect from company who blocks already paid content?

 

[MadJackMcMad]

I personally have no issue with the legendary cars costing as much as they do, or with the premise that it would take much longer to earn them than the 'fastest cars' in the game. However, I should have the capacity to earn the credits needed to purchase them in a reasonable timeframe, playing the game however I choose.

When your options are (a) play the game for fun (however you prefer, engaging with various different in-game experiences/races), but make the prospect of affording the legendary cars in a reasonable timeframe much more remote; (b) race one of the 'optimal' credit earning races over and over again for tens of hours (to the point of absolute tedium), or; (c) purchase MTX as means of relieving the need to grind, allowing you to play the game for 'fun' (at a much greater cost than the initial purchase of the game), then something is very wrong.

 

[m76]

I certainly would not pay a subscription fee for a game, that's out of the question. DLC cars, maybe if the price is right. I don't think I'd pay for any individual car, but I'd buy an expansion pack containing several cars and tracks. Like the Test Drive Unlimited car expansion pack that contained 45 new cars.

 

[Johnnn]

It makes companies money but I would never buy a game like that even if it was named Gran Turismo. It's grubby. I'm not opening my wallet for a few cars. I can't stand games that treat players like ATMs.

That's the difference between us. You rather grind dumb game than earn money. I can buy content but I can't buy time or fun.

 

[Magog]

How much the fastest cars in the game cost is irrelevant to the economy, how much the most expensive ones cost is. And that takes far more than an hour, far, far more!

Not to me. Those cars are museum pieces. Fun to look at and boring to drive. I'll only buy them when I run out of better options and need somewhere to throw around my credits.

 

[NotThePrez]

I have no problem paying for new content if said content is actually new, made after the game was finished, and represents good value.

This. Plus, paid DLC typically means that the developers are committed to put out X-amount of content in a certain amount of time. In my personal experiences with the GAAS model, that commitment isn't there, there's less information for the players about the kinds of content that they'll be getting, and there's be typically less new content put out for free compared to paid DLC packs.

Personally, I very much prefer to know exactly what I'm getting for a set price. And it's not like GT hasn't done it before.

It makes companies money but I would never buy a game like that even if it was named Gran Turismo. It's grubby. I'm not opening my wallet for a few cars. I can't stand games that treat players like ATMs.

This has already been brought up, but GT7 does exactly that. The credit MTXs are a top-up for a renewable resource in the game, and the game is very clearly built around the player using up said resource and spending more money to top it up. That's PD and Sony treating players like ATMs.

 

[Magog]

I personally have no issue with the legendary cars costing as much as they do, or with the premise that it would take much longer to earn them than the 'fastest cars' in the game. However, I should have the capacity to earn the credits needed to purchase them in a reasonable timeframe, playing the game however I choose.

When your options are (a) play the game for fun (however you prefer, engaging with various different in-game experiences/races), but make the prospect of affording the legendary cars in a reasonable timeframe much more remote; (b) race one of the 'optimal' credit earning races over and over again for tens of hours (to the point of absolute tedium), or; (c) purchase MTX as means of relieving the need to grind, allowing you to play the game for 'fun' (at a much greater cost than the initial purchase of the game), then something is very wrong.

I totally agree that payouts for custom races and online races should be increased so you are constantly earning while enjoying the game the way you want. Ironically that was what Kaz said his intention was in adjusting the payouts previously. So that you didn't feel forced to play a certain race over and over again in order to "maximize" your time. It was clear to me that their intent was always to then add more races with bigger payouts in the next update but they didn't count on or expect gamers to have zero patience for the process.

AFK script kiddy gamers have already ruined the economy for themselves and if they want to buy every car in the game without earning any of them they can already do so.

 

[Johnnn]

AFK script kiddy gamers have already ruined the economy for themselves and if they want to buy every car in the game without earning any of them they can already do so.

ruining = you can actually buy at least something, other stuff is hidden somewhere, probably not in the game

 

[Scaff]

Not to me. Those cars are museum pieces. Fun to look at and boring to drive. I'll only buy them when I run out of better options and need somewhere to throw around my credits.

Which ones you prefer has absolutely zero to do with an objective analysis of the game's economy.

It was clear to me that their intent was always to then add more races with bigger payouts in the next update but they didn't count on or expect gamers to have zero patience for the process.

No, it wasn't clear at all, as that letter and the update that came with it did the exact opposite, it nerfed payouts. You are once again reading what you want into statements that don't actually say it and ignoring what factually occurred.

AFK script kiddy gamers have already ruined the economy for themselves and if they want to buy every car in the game without earning any of them they can already do so.

Stop insulting people you don't agree with, the AUP isn't optional.