You learn something new... - Cars you didn't know existed, until now!

[Niku Driver HC]

Apologies for the double post, but after the discussion I had with @Michelin over the existence of a younger Volkswagen Gol GTI in the 90's, something steemed from my little research about it, two somethings in fact;

The Quantum Sport; a "perua" (the affectionate name given by Brazillians to station wagon-type cars) based off the ancient VW Santana, which aimed at a market where people wanted both comfy and sporty in their station wagons, although such a market is rather uncommon in Brazil, but VW was not scared of trying out new things. Do not expect a super secret V6 engine or something, however; despite having to contend its market share with Brazil's half-Opel/half-Impala muscle car, the 6-cylinder Chevrolet Opala 4.1, this had to do with a 2.0 engine instead. Nothing mind-blowing, but I just love how honest this car looks. It's a wagon with a youthful (about as youthful as a Santana derivative can be, at least) spring to its step.

But wait, there's more! Of course, I have now seen pictures of the last generation of the Gol GTI, finding out that it had an even rarer brother, or should I say, sister, during its lifeline. Here's the previously mentioned 1990's Gol, complete with that Mitsubishi Eclipse-esque hood buldge;

Very neat, and not half-slow either; thanks to a 2.0 litre 16V engine, the Gol was more than capable of hitting over 125 mph if given the beans. Not bad for a poverty-spec Golf sibling, I'd reckon. But before being demoted to a mere equipment package for lesser Gols near the 2000 production year and then being discontinued altogether, the GTI gave its heart and buldge to a rather curious sister;

That is right, not only did the Gol have a "perua" sister as well, she gained some muscles in form of a GTI version! She is the Parati GTI, a girl that is apparently quite rare even in her home country, from what I just read about her. Same engine and hood buldge as her brother, and ironically enough she also lost her sporty status after the year 2000, so they share quite the history. Still, just for being a cheap alternative to a Golf GTI and having a boot as a bonus, I sure wouldn't mind owning one myself...

 

[Michelin]

I've never liked the Quantum or the squared Santana.. the second generation of the Santana, more rouded, is more fond on my heart. haha

Every visual bit (exterior and interior) were so popular back in the end of the 90s that Volkswagen decided to create a kit that anyone could buy and add to the more common versions of the Gol, so that quickly killed the GTI, since you didn't need to have the GTI to have GTI looks. The Gol GTI 2nd gen (common knew as the Bolinha, or little ball, because of it's rounded shape) had a German 2.0 16V engine that rocketed 145bhp, a lot of power for the 90s.

Now, the Parati never received a GTI version as far as I know and remember, so either I don't know about Brazil's domestic cars as I thought I knew or someone got the GTI kit for a Golf and fitted it on the Parati...

@Niku Driver HC

 

[Niku Driver HC]

I've never liked the Quantum or the squared Santana.. the second generation of the Santana, more rouded, is more fond on my heart. haha

Haha, fair enough, I have yet to see actual pictures of that generation... Or maybe I have done such a thing, but I can't recall that right now.

Every visual bit (exterior and interior) were so popular back in the end of the 90s that Volkswagen decided to create a kit that anyone could buy and add to the more common versions of the Gol, so that quickly killed the GTI, since you didn't need to have the GTI to have GTI looks. The Gol GTI 2nd gen (common knew as the Bolinha, or little ball, because of it's rounded shape) had a German 2.0 16V engine that rocketed 145bhp, a lot of power for the 90s.

Now, the Parati never received a GTI version as far as I know and remember, so either I don't know about Brazil's domestic cars as I thought I knew or someone got the GTI kit for a Golf and fitted it on the Parati...

@Niku Driver HC

Of course, and then the imported 4th gen Golf killed the remaining chances of the Gol's GTI version being viable in the Brazillian car market, that didn't help matters either. It's a shame, although there does seem to be a new chapter about to be opened; rumors state that the GTI will return as a proper Gol version in 2016, complete with an optional 7-speed automatic transmission (!!!), so it does seem that the myth is not dead yet.

As for the Parati, it does seem to be quite legit; I've even seen an official VW advertisment featuring the car itself;

http://vwlvideos.blogspot.pt/2012/03/propaganda-da-parati-gti-datada-de-1998.html

I don't think it's a mere bodykit, it may just be a super rare Brazillian domestic car. Or in fact, a true Brazillian sleeper considering what's under the hood...

 

[VXR]

The second-gen Gol appears to be closely related to the body shell of the second-gen Seat Ibiza. The front bumper looks like a straight swap with that car's GTI.

 

[Niku Driver HC]

The second-gen Gol appears to be closely related to the body shell of the second-gen Seat Ibiza. The front bumper looks like a straight swap with that car's GTI.

It does look similar, but it does not share the same platform, it seems; that generation of the Gol ran on the BX platform, which was unique to the Gol and its variations. I wouldn't put the idea of swapping parts with an Ibiza aside however, but it would not be an easy swap...

 

[Michelin]

Of course, and then the imported 4th gen Golf killed the remaining chances of the Gol's GTI version being viable in the Brazillian car market, that didn't help matters either. It's a shame, although there does seem to be a new chapter about to be opened; rumors state that the GTI will return as a proper Gol version in 2016, complete with an optional 7-speed automatic transmission (!!!), so it does seem that the myth is not dead yet.

As for the Parati, it does seem to be quite legit; I've even seen an official VW advertisment featuring the car itself;

http://vwlvideos.blogspot.pt/2012/03/propaganda-da-parati-gti-datada-de-1998.html

I don't think it's a mere bodykit, it may just be a super rare Brazillian domestic car. Or in fact, a true Brazillian sleeper considering what's under the hood...

So, wait: They gonna fit the normal Golf 1.4 engine on the Gol and call it GTI? It's a great idea actually!

Maybe it was a prototype that never went to production? Hmm might have to dig it when I have time for it.

The second-gen Gol appears to be closely related to the body shell of the second-gen Seat Ibiza. The front bumper looks like a straight swap with that car's GTI.

I think the 3rd generation of the Gol could be closely related to the Ibiza, not the second. The third is from the early 2000s, while the second is early, mid 90s..

 

[Niku Driver HC]

So, wait: They gonna fit the normal Golf 1.4 engine on the Gol and call it GTI? It's a great idea actually!

Well, isn't Brazil the country that slapped some Boss 302-esque decals on a Ford Ka with an 1.2 litre engine and called it the "big-block" Sport version? If anything, a 1.4 engine is already far more performing than the ghastly weak 1.0 engines that you usually see in Gol across the country...

Maybe it was a prototype that never went to production? Hmm might have to dig it when I have time for it.

Again, I don't think it's a prototype, otherwise the Brazillian websites where I read about the car would state that. In my opinion, the Parati GTI was just one of those cars where it was very hard to find a specific market for such a model, so most people flatout ignored it in favor of options which were either more pedestrian (the more civilized versions of the Parati) or sportier (like hot hatches such as the Gol GTI). Therefore, it does exist as a production car, but it's impossibly rare to find one in good condition. I've read that from a Gol GTI article by flatout.com.br, where they said that "we will only speak about the Parati GTI when you find and send us an example in good condition to our email box"...

 

[Michelin]

Well, isn't Brazil the country that slapped some Boss 302-esque decals on a Ford Ka with an 1.2 litre engine and called it the "big-block" Sport version? If anything, a 1.4 engine is already far more performing than the ghastly weak 1.0 engines that you usually see in Gol across the country...

No, the Sport Ka used the 1.6 RoCam engine. That engine on such small car as the Ka made it a little pocket rocket, it had great agility with that engine, and having low weight, it was a great car. Now, the Boss 302-esque decals are true.

Again, I don't think it's a prototype, otherwise the Brazillian websites where I read about the car would state that. In my opinion, the Parati GTI was just one of those cars where it was very hard to find a specific market for such a model, so most people flatout ignored it in favor of options which were either more pedestrian (the more civilized versions of the Parati) or sportier (like hot hatches such as the Gol GTI). Therefore, it does exist as a production car, but it's impossibly rare to find one in good condition. I've read that from a Gol GTI article by flatout.com.br, where they said that "we will only speak about the Parati GTI when you find and send us an example in good condition to our email box"...

Wow... that's really unexpected. I love a wagon, I might have to shift my interest from the Gol to the Parati GTI it seems... hahaha

 

[Niku Driver HC]

No, the Sport Ka used the 1.6 RoCam engine. That engine on such small car as the Ka made it a little pocket rocket, it had great agility with that engine, and having low weight, it was a great car. Now, the Boss 302-esque decals are true.

Ah right, I dun derp'd again, typical me trying to grab old facts from my "automotive mental library" without proper verification.
But yes, while I bet that the 1.6 engine gave the Ka enough grunt to offer some interesting performance figures, calling it a "big block" (as the Brazillian magazine QuatroRodas once did in their short news article about the Sport) is a tad bit far fetched even for marketing's sake... And then you have decals that are trying to evoke powerful Mustangs, which would be fine if we weren't talking about a run-of-the-mill, small city ecobox car.

Wow... that's really unexpected. I love a wagon, I might have to shift my interest from the Gol to the Parati GTI it seems... hahaha

Haha, see? It's not that far-fetched, the existence of a Parati GTI... Although you may have to look far and wide just to spot an used one for sale, I bet. Great car for what it is, but the rarity is shockingly strong for a Parati.

And, to finally kill the doubts for good, here's the ultimate proof of the Parati GTI's existence;



At point, still doubting such a thing is just nitpicking to the max.

 

[SVX]

I actually prefer the Quantum to the Golf that was around at the time.

Would love to see it properly done up...

 

[el fayce]

I have recently seen an eleventh gen F-150 step side, while I'm aware of GM's step sides of the same era, I had no clue that ford had the same idea as well!

 

[RandomCarGuy17]

Lamborghini Miura Jota
http://www.lambocars.com/miura/miura_jota.html

 

[Dennisch]

1934 Texaco Diamond T Doodlebug tanker truck.

 

[ScottPuss20]

1934 Texaco Diamond T Doodlebug tanker truck.

That's just cool

 

[homeforsummer]

I discovered a new one today - the Toyota Sprinter Marino / Toyota Corolla Ceres.

And just four months later, what do I see in the car park of the local supermarket? (Apologies for potato quality - was quite dark at that end of the car park)

 

[Tornado]

That looks spectacularly like a car they would give you at the beginning of an early Ridge Racer game.

 

[Wiegert]

Some Montego estates wore the MG badge for the New Zealand market as part of the MG 2.0 range from 1989.

 

[SVX]

Can't say I've ever seen one.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Some Montego estates wore the MG badge for the New Zealand market as part of the MG 2.0 range from 1989.

The Maestro and Montego were both sold in an MG-badged package in the UK, they were pretty fast while they lasted... which wasn't long. Is that just one of those?

 

[Wiegert]

The Maestro and Montego were both sold in an MG-badged package in the UK, they were pretty fast while they lasted... which wasn't long. Is that just one of those?

Estates never officially came in MG form here. Just Austin or simply 'Montego' later in life. But there are a few MG turbo conversions knocking about with rebadged exteriors.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Estates never officially came in MG form here. Just Austin or simply 'Montego' later in life. But there are a few MG turbo conversions knocking about with rebadged exteriors.

It did, it was launched in 1988 and called the "Montego Countryman", a version that was estate-only

 

[RACECAR]

Thanks to a recommended YouTube video, I found 3 F1 cars I was not aware of.

2003 McLaren MP4-18:

1962 Honda RA270:

1981 Williams FW07D:

 

[homeforsummer]

I discovered this concept car recently:

Toyota AXV-IV. Designed as an "environmentally friendly personal commuter" car. Which is a class of vehicles I'm quite partial to - my Honda Insight was basically designed along these lines, as is the Smart Fortwo, as is one of my favourite-ever concept cars, the Volkswagen Nils.

Unfortunately, like virtually all those vehicles bar the Insight, it never even got close to production. But it's quite remarkable - 804cc, supercharged two-stroke (environmental credentials are dubious there, but people still thought two-strokes had potential in 1991), only 450kg (990lb), and rear-wheel drive.

I think what I like most about these kind of cars is the feeling you're not dragging around a load of unnecesssary stuff just to go from one place to another. It's a car pared down to its bare essentials. And because they're lightweight and small, they always look like they'd be great fun to drive.

 

[Niku Driver HC]

It does have that eeriely similar feel to the Daihatsu Copen, to be honest; a small kei-car class two seater, betting on lightweight feel and sharp styling to be attractive to customers. And I can defintely respect as well as appreciate cars like these, it is a shame that it would take Toyota quite a while to create something like the AXV-IV again, which is of course the Toyota S-FR...

 

[Nessy]

Speaking of Daihatsu, it made me remember this:

1991 concept car. Daihatsu X-021

 

[homeforsummer]

It does have that eeriely similar feel to the Daihatsu Copen, to be honest; a small kei-car class two seater, betting on lightweight feel and sharp styling to be attractive to customers. And I can defintely respect as well as appreciate cars like these, it is a shame that it would take Toyota quite a while to create something like the AXV-IV again, which is of course the Toyota S-FR...

Strictly speaking, neither the AXV-IV nor the S-FR are kei cars - but I get what you're getting at. You could throw the Copen, the Mazda AZ-1, Suzuki Cappuccino, Honda Beat and probably a number of others into the same basket. But some are expressly designed to be economical, low-impact commuting vehicles, which is where this concept (and my Insight) come in.

I think unfortunately the market just isn't there for cars like that. But it's a type of car I really appreciate. My Honda is 100kg lighter than my MX-5 - that's instantly 100kg of stuff that hasn't needed to be extracted from the earth, be that in the form of metals or petroleum products like plastic, less than an already-light car. This Toyota concept is almost half the weight; half the materials before it's even burned a drop of fuel.

I really enjoy driving cars that don't feel like they're carrying around a bunch of stuff you don't need. I virtually never carry more than one passenger (and rarely that), so rear seats are completely superfluous to me. My commute is about 7-8 miles, so I don't need massive comfy leather-bound heated seats. The weather is crap quite frequently, so I do need a roof and doors, which rules out really basic stuff like a Renault Twizy. And it takes in some 60-70mph zones, so I do need a reasonable turn of performance - the Insight is fine, with its ~11sec to 60mph.

Unfortunately, most cars have too many seats, weigh too much, are loaded with too much equipment etc. And the cheap ones are usually a bit boring - pretty much any city car besides the Fortwo bores the crap out of me...

Speaking of Daihatsu, it made me remember this:

1991 concept car. Daihatsu X-021

Daihatsu has had some really neat concepts. There was the HVS that predated the Copen, the OFC-1 that pre-dated the second-gen Copen, the UFE concepts...

 

[R5]

Speaking of Daihatsu, it made me remember this:

1991 concept car. Daihatsu X-021

A baby TVR!

 

[TexRex]

This Toyota concept is almost half the weight; half the materials before it's even burned a drop of fuel.

Loving this view. You can even consider that fewer/lighter materials means the parts for those cars can be brought together with less effort, saving on energy during manufacturing.

A baby TVR!

That was my reaction.

 

[Niku Driver HC]

A baby TVR!

My thoughts exactly, haha! Why did Daihatsu shrink a Cerbera down to Copen size?

It's things like this that really get me interested in whatever will Daihatsu come up with for the Vision GT project. They know how to make a small concept car look good...

Strictly speaking, neither the AXV-IV nor the S-FR are kei cars - but I get what you're getting at. You could throw the Copen, the Mazda AZ-1, Suzuki Cappuccino, Honda Beat and probably a number of others into the same basket. But some are expressly designed to be economical, low-impact commuting vehicles, which is where this concept (and my Insight) come in.

I think unfortunately the market just isn't there for cars like that. But it's a type of car I really appreciate. My Honda is 100kg lighter than my MX-5 - that's instantly 100kg of stuff that hasn't needed to be extracted from the earth, be that in the form of metals or petroleum products like plastic, less than an already-light car. This Toyota concept is almost half the weight; half the materials before it's even burned a drop of fuel.

I really enjoy driving cars that don't feel like they're carrying around a bunch of stuff you don't need. I virtually never carry more than one passenger (and rarely that), so rear seats are completely superfluous to me. My commute is about 7-8 miles, so I don't need massive comfy leather-bound heated seats. The weather is crap quite frequently, so I do need a roof and doors, which rules out really basic stuff like a Renault Twizy. And it takes in some 60-70mph zones, so I do need a reasonable turn of performance - the Insight is fine, with its ~11sec to 60mph.

Unfortunately, most cars have too many seats, weigh too much, are loaded with too much equipment etc. And the cheap ones are usually a bit boring - pretty much any city car besides the Fortwo bores the crap out of me...

Well, the engine in the AXV does suit kei-car regulations somewhat, while the S-FR clearly cannot do such a thing. But in essence, the concept is there for both cars, the only real difference is age.

But as the poor sales of the Copen in Europe prove, even if you do follow European regulations (which were the ones to force Daihatsu's hand in changing the Copen's engine to a 1.3-litre engine) there seems to be a rather empty market for such a car. While the efficiency is hard to argue with, it won't matter if there is no profit to be gained from selling these cars. That was why Daihatsu left all non-Japanese markets, after their vast range of small but efficient cars failed to gain leverage in a competitive world.

But I do agree with one thing; if you can significantly reduce a car's weight without reducing everything else but emissions produced, you are creating a very good car. Over-engineered cars suffer from this problem, as they add a gazillion different things for comfort's sake, but fail to take into account the effects those same gizmos will have in both driving and efficiency. I can tell that you love the Insight because it does all the things required out of a mundane family car, but without forcing you to take frequent trips to petrol stations due to too much baggage...

 

[Nessy]

It does have a bit of TVR to it.

@homeforsummer Totally agree, Daihatsu have had some great concepts.

Another concept that didn't make it.. Absolutely love this tiny thing.

Suzuki C2: