Zeta News: Holden Pres Says Camaro Prototypes Due By X-Mas

[Jim Prower]

Naw, 7.0 COPO/Yenko.

Because the GT500 shouldn't have all the fun.

 

[YSSMAN]

I think Onikase had the right idea. The use of the 5.3L V8 has been up in the air because of the L76 V8 available in AUS, as it has more power and theoretically better fuel economy. Shes a 6.0L unit making about 350HP, had DOD technology, and as proven by Holden, can be matched to either a 6-speed manual or 4-speed automatic (probably will be a 6-speed back home).

Most of the theories point to there being three inital trim levels, the base V6 package, the Z/28 package, and then the SS package. Then there is talk of a later introduction of a RS/SS or COPO LS7-powered model, but no one is sure yet...

Ohhh, and someone got to drive the Camaro Concept Today...

Earlier today, we highlighted a first-drive by the Mercury News of the Chrysler Imperial Concept. Well, it turns out Chrysler isn’t the only automaker letting journalists try out its hot concept cars. Detroit Free Press columnist Mark Phelan got a chance to drive the popular Chevrolet Camaro Concept today. “It sounds even better than it looks and it looks exactly like a 21st century Camaro should,” he said. “The 400 horsepower V8 has the bubbling note of authority a muscle car needs and the interior was an ingenious combination of comfortable modern materials and design touches, like the round aluminum shift knob and big circular speedometer and tachometer, that harken back to the classic 69 Camaro.” A full review will follow tomorrow, the newspaper said. See the full photo gallery here. The Leftlane Perspective: Hey Dodge, can we take the Challenger Concept for a spin?

 

[Jay]

Those classic style belt buckles

Brings back memorys, I really like them. 👍

 

[GT4_Rule]

Awesome.....now we know for sure that its going to come around 2007!

 

[Wolfe]

It looks awesome, and I'm glad to see that the interior turned out like those drawings, but...what's up with the SUV-like ride height (or is it just me?), and how the heck do those gauges even work??

 

[Jim Prower]

Okay, perhaps it's not as flat as I once thought. The taillights need to be merged, though. one, single bar, seperated into three parts like the original.

 

[YSSMAN]

The guages should have a small LED needle inside of them that rotate just like any other set of guages. It is amazing looking at the inside and seeing how much the design is like that of a real '67-'69 Camaro. My Dad has a '68 Coupe, and although it was a bit of a low-level model (327, 2-speed auto), the interior is one of the best of the 1960s. Nothing outrageous, some fake wood-trim, etc. It all looked good.

Here is the full story from the Detroit Free Press:

Build it.

That's all I can say after 40 minutes driving the ravishing Chevrolet Camaro concept car around General Motors Proving Grounds in Milford.

The head-turning new sport coupe can't hit the road soon enough. GM has not officially decided it will build the Camaro, but the legendary car's powerful appeal, the adrenaline shot it will give Chevrolet and conversations with a number of GM executives are enough to convince me only a catastrophe will keep this car off the road.

You don't spend this much time nailing every detail -- from the growling rumble of the exhaust to the light and easy feel of the clutch pedal -- if you're not serious about a car.

And the Camaro is serious fun. Its unique design may set the tone for other Chevrolet cars, boost sales and add excitement to GM's most important brand.

The sensuous and threatening-looking coupe will be a welcome addition to Chevrolet showrooms. That was apparent even in the handle-with-care driving mandated by the fact that this is a show car, built for looks not speed.

Despite that, the Camaro felt very polished. The power steering is direct and responsive; the brakes are firm with good pedal feel, and the six-speed manual transmission was more precise than some production cars.

"We spent a lot of time on the sound of the exhaust," GM concept car engineer Kris Hess said as the Camaro's 400-horsepower V8 burbled to life on the test track in Oakland County for my drive. "We have a lot of performance fans on the team that did this car."

The concept's classic wasp-waisted shape, flared fenders and eager forward-leaning grille made the Camaro a hit when it debuted at the North American International Auto Show in Detroit in January.

Camaro was introduced in 1966 as the answer to the Ford Mustang and went through several generations before production ended in 2002.

"We set out to capture the essence of the Camaro," said Tom Peters, who led the design team that created the concept in Studio X, a secret den below the design building at GM's technical center in Warren. The concept's styling borrows elements from the classic 1969 Camaro, the 2005 Corvette and the YF22 jet fighter's rounded cockpit.

Crowds packed Chevrolet's stand to admire the Camaro at the show, but almost nobody got close enough to see that the concept's interior is equally appealing and well executed.

The big, chrome-rimmed speedometer and tachometer perfectly complement round brushed-metal dials for climate and audio controls. Door and dash insets the color of burnished copper match the faces of four small rectangular gauges -- fuel, battery, oil and water -- set in the center console just ahead of a round aluminum shifter knob.

Even if everything goes flawlessly, the Camaro isn't likely to hit the streets before 2009, and the production model will not be identical to the concept.

There's no magic or sleight of hand involved in making the case for the Camaro.

The concept uses GM's new Zeta global architecture for rear-wheel-drive cars, which goes into production in Australia this summer and should form the basis for several big, powerful sedans and coupes in North America.

The Camaro's engine, transmission, brakes and most other major components are off-the-shelf technology, ready to run today, but ready to mate high-horsepower performance with 30 miles per gallon or more on the highway, GM said.

GM executives have told workers in at least two North American assembly plants -- Oshawa, Ontario, and Wilmington, Del. -- that they're in the running to build the Camaro.

So the decision to build it comes down to a few questions: Will people buy it? How can GM build it profitably? What will it cost?

GM Vice Chairman Bob Lutz told Automotive News that GM won't build the Camaro unless it can sell 100,000 a year.

To reach that goal, Chevy will have to offer a less-expensive V6 model in addition to the V8, said Jim Hall, vice president for industry analysis at the Southfield office of consultant AutoPacific.

Even then, it's unlikely Camaro could beat the popular Ford Mustang's $19,115 base price, he said.

The Zeta family of cars features an independent rear suspension, a more-expensive layout than the Mustang's trusty old live axle.

Nobody at GM will touch the price question, but it's clear Chevrolet doesn't need -- and probably couldn't sell -- another high-priced, low-volume image car. The Corvette fills that role beautifully.

Chevrolet accounts for around 60% of GM's annual sales in North America. Adding a couple of exciting and profitable cars to Chevy's lineup would go a long way toward curing what ails GM.

The stylish 2008 Malibu sedan -- unrecognizably different from today's mundane model -- set to debut next year may be the first of those cars. The Camaro could be the second.

Build it.

Ohhh, and there is a video to go with the story too!

EDIT: Just over the wire... Topgear.com is seeming to call the Camaro a done deal...

Muscle car fans and rednecks around the world will rejoice at the news that the Chevrolet Camaro looks like it's on its way back.

The concept car shown at the Detroit Auto Show in January is undergoing feverish development to bring it to a production-ready stage.

Chevrolet bosses have studied research and reckon they will be able to sell more than 100,000 Camaros every year, which is the figure required to justify production.

The new Camaro will be based on a platform from Holden, the Australian cousin of Chevy in the General Motors family.

The Camaro could be on sale in the US by late 2008, but UK buyers are likely to have to follow the same route as with the Ford Mustang and import one themselves.

...Hmmm, interesting to see how the Brits see the situation...

 

[Onikaze]

Just please, please put a DOD V-8 with the E/CVT Hybrid.

I'd love to see it pip 30 mpg city, not just highway. THAT is the kind of Muscle car that I think would put Chevy back on the lips of people everywhere.

 

[YSSMAN]

Don't be surprised to see the ECVT automatic eventually make it into the Camaro, but I would be willing to bet that all of the automatics across the board are going to be variations of the 6T70E automatic from the Yukon and Escalade, as well as the new Aura and Outlook as well.

But, be careful what you wish for with those transmissions. They are going to be expensive, and to keep the Camaro within the shake of a stick of the Mustang, they may have to keep the good ol' 4L80E around for just a bit longer...

 

[Onikaze]

Oh I know it will be expensive, but I'd love the idea of a 30+ mpg in the City Camaro.

Between DOD, proper driving habits, and that ECVT, it should happen.

That makes me smile.

 

[YSSMAN]

Most certainly yes, it should happen. I think the old Camaro was rated at 19/26 for city/hwy mileage in Z/28 and SS forms when equipped with the Tremec T-56. I've herd plenty of stories of both Camaro/Firebird owners, as well as Corvette owners that easily surpass 30MPG on the highway with the cars, but city mileage I'm not so certain on. I think if they can keep it around 20 or so MPG in the city, it will match most full-size sedans equipped with V6 engines, and shouldnt hurt sales too much.

 

[Onikaze]

Think about what that DOD V-8 and ECVT can do though.

Hybrids love City traffic, the DOD functions well under low load, so if you aren't shoving your foot up it's ass, it will often be in 4 banger mode.

I'd bet at least 25 City, but I'm sure they'd love to say 30 Miles Per Gallon...


In the City.

 

[YSSMAN]

Certainly they would. It would then become a question of "do I want a Scion tC for $25K fully-loaded that maybe gets 25MPG, or do I want that Camaro that gets the same mileage with double the horsepower?"

 

[Onikaze]

^ FTW

That is my biggest concern, I want a fun car (I'm 25) but it has to be fairly affordable, and it has to get pretty good mileage.

 

[YSSMAN]

I'm in the same boat. Thats why I have been looking so closely at Volkswagens and considering BMWs, but if Chevrolet can offer an "economical" Z/28 for around $28K with decent options, that would be a far-better buy than a 325ci or Jetta GLI.

 

[Onikaze]

Hell, I'm leaning towards an older Miata right now (first gen, 91-94 preferably) but if I get on at a Dealership soon, maybe even a Chevy one, I'd be hard pressed to not get into a Camaro if the mileage/fun factor was right.

The Mustang is awesome and all, but the V-6 version only gets 1 more mpg in city/hwy driving than the V-8 does, and I'd rather wait til the GT-350 comes out anyways.

 

[YSSMAN]

It sounds as though Pontiac may end up doing more with Zeta than what we once thought...

General Motors is considering reviving Pontiac’s role as GM’s performance leader with a lineup of exclusively rear-wheel-drive cars, according to trade publication Automotive News. In recent years, Pontiac has been criticized for building understeering, generic-looking, front-drive blandmobiles. That is, until the automaker unveiled the slick new RWD Pontiac Solstice. Response to the Solstice has been overwhelming positive, and momentum is building for the company to build more cars with similar characteristics. According to the Auto News report, sources say the transition to rear-drive would take about five years to complete. Currently under consideration is the future of the Grand Prix sedan and the possibility of a Camaro-based GTO or Firebird muscle car, the report said. This year, GM’s Bob Lutz said the Camaro platform would be used for a Chevrolet Impala, Camaro, Monte Carlo, Buick Statesman, and Pontiac GTO. Pictured right is an artist’s rendering of how a Camaro-based Pontiac could look. However, a re-badged Camaro is not likely, says Pontiac spokesman Jim Hopson. “We want a truly differentiated product,” he said.

(BTW: This is the crappy Firebird photoshop:

)

 

[GT4_Rule]

That's nice, but won't that mean that there will be some product overlap, something GM is trying to eliminate?

 

[Jay]

From the rumour that GM scrapped the Zeta platform development to this.. GM is really going to town with Zeta now.

 

[YSSMAN]

Well, I could easily see Pontiac "cutting the fat" and getting rid of most of their badge-engineered models and instead return to making fun and exciting cars. My guess is that of all the current models, we could probably expect ONLY the G6 to remain a front-driver, but even then, that could see replacement as well.

I could see the lineup eventually looking like this:
- Solstice
- Solstice Coupe
- Kappa-based (or maybe "Sigma-lite"?) sedan, G6 replacement
- Zeta-Based Grand Prix
- Zeta-based GTO

 

[YSSMAN]

Hey there kids, new photos just came up on some of the new VE (Zeta) Holden Products:

Several new images have emerged online of the new Holden Commodore VE, from GM’s Australian subsidiary. What’s so interesting about this vehicle is it’s supposedly based on GM’s new Zeta platform, which is expected to underpin a slew of new cars, including the Chevrolet Camaro, Impala, Monte Carlo, Pontiac GTO, and a Buick sedan. In addition to the regular Commodore VE, photos have also been snapped of a long wheelbase version. There has been no word if this specific model will be re-badged for U.S. sale, but a Chevrolet-badged version was spotted. It’s possible, however, that the Chevy badge was either camouflage, or it is a model meant for non-U.S. markets

Wow, they all look pretty good if you ask me. I'd be willing to bet that the big checker car with the Chevy badge is indeed the new Impala, based on photots allready seen of the new Malibu. I'm thinking that GM decided to ditch the retro-styling on the Impala...

So kids, youre looking at the car that is going to be causing a stir in the US just a few months from now...

EDIT: Just thought of something...

Chevrolet could be moving the Impala uplevel where it should be, hence the long-wheelbase car being tested in Australia (not the LHD configuration as well). That would mean that the pictures posted earlier this week of a strangely large Malibu could be taking over the slot once held by the Impala, but the Monte Carlo would stay the same size (about the same as the new Commodore/Monaro).

 

[Onikaze]

Well, interestingly, the Chevy badged one has the dual circle taillights like the Impala, suggesting that's what it is.

This is a totally different car though, the brake venting/tail light shape are new to me, perhaps an AU car buff would be able to identify it easier. Edit, This looks like the same model as the non-sunroof camo car.

Either way, it is very nice...very very nice.

 

[Jay]

What do ya know, looks almost exactly as I was expecting.



The front of the car in this picture reminds me of a E36 M3 with its small over hang, flared wheel arches and the fender vent. The rear door shape reminds me of the rear doors from a current (new) Lexus IS (the Red Commodore pictures show it better).

Looks like they have gone for a wide track, short over hang design with Zeta, which should be good.

 

[GT4_Rule]

Isn't that the current Commodore SS?

Anyway, I like the styling of that car. Sharp.

 

[Cap'n Jack]

Isn't that the current Commodore SS?

Anyway, I like the styling of that car. Sharp.

Nope, looks completley different.
I really like it, it looks very European-like.

 

[Jay]

Isn't that the current Commodore SS?

Anyway, I like the styling of that car. Sharp.

Like Radicool said no thats the upcoming VE Commodore SS.

it looks very European-like.

I agree it does look Europeon-like.

 

[wasace96]

i dont like it (ford fan here) liked the old one but

 

[Jay]

i dont like it (ford fan here) liked the old one but

I think they made the headlights and fender combo very Falcon-like.

Check these pics to compare

Especialy the way the headlight cuts into the flatish type mud gaurd (fender/wing).

 

[YSSMAN]

When I first saw the pictures, my first thoughts were "That looks like the Falcon XR8..." but I really didn't worry about it too much. The Holden looks more agressive, despite the fact that the lines look much clearer on the car than what they do on the Ford. The spoiler needs to come down from eleven to about eight or nine, but I suppose it doesn't look THAT bad...

I dunno, I quite like it to tell you the truth. It looks as though the only models that we (Americans and Australians) are going to directly share stylistic wise appears to be the Impala (checkered car) and the Statesman (the big gold one). The GTO (Monaro) should end up looking like the old '65-'67 models, and it really is anyone's guess as to what happens with the Monte Carlo.

 

[GT4_Rule]

The front sort of reminded me of a Altima SE-R. And I like the lines on that car. So I'm hoping that I'll see this car at my Chevrolet dealership sometime.