PS3 General Discussion
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Joey D
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The 360 is out selling the PS3 currently:
http://www.vgchartz.com/
The 360 has 23.37 million units sold worldwide while the PS3 has 19.46 million units sold worldwide.
That statement sounds fanboy-ish. My PS3 died for no reason and I don't think it's a bad product. There are so many factors into why 360's fail out of the box it's hard to just pin it on MS. If you don't think stores don't try and resell returned broken 360's you are crazy.
My 360 has been extremely reliable with only having to be replaced because I broke it. And yes I got what I paid for. The PS3 has more features, therefore I paid more and got more stuff. The 360 has less features, so I paid less.
The Sony cheerleaders on this site are a bit ridiculous, yes I fully agree the PS3 is the better system in many ways but to completely dismiss anything 360 is just, well, lame. This is sad too, because many of the people that do this I once respected, now they just enter the ignore list.
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Robin
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Wasn't actually a question (though it looks like it), it was meant to be a reply to that topic. I 'spose I failed on that one.
Not completely dismissing the 360, it's a decent machine, but they work in different ways. Both are sold in different ways too. Sony had to remove some features to cut costs, MS sell machines with and without some of the features. The 360 is good, but I know what I would/did spend my money on. Things like PSN being free, people say XBL is better, I can't say, never used it, but would I want to keep spending £40 a year for on-line gaming? No, I wouldn't. It's not a huge part of my gaming experience. I use PSN infrequently for online gaming. Mainly for having my tag for the WRS and occasionally for playing GTA IV, so for me PSN being free is an advantage, as I wouldn't use a paid service. The wi-fi bit of the PS3 is another great addition too. So simple to set-up, practically noob proof.
I think it's a shame that because you disagree with someone's opinion you put them on the ignore list. For me, I'm as much interest, if not more so, with the people whose opinion differs from mine.
Yup, and the Marketing unit on my BTEC. \o/
Not completely dismissing the 360, it's a decent machine, but they work in different ways. Both are sold in different ways too. Sony had to remove some features to cut costs, MS sell machines with and without some of the features. The 360 is good, but I know what I would/did spend my money on. Things like PSN being free, people say XBL is better, I can't say, never used it, but would I want to keep spending £40 a year for on-line gaming? No, I wouldn't. It's not a huge part of my gaming experience. I use PSN infrequently for online gaming. Mainly for having my tag for the WRS and occasionally for playing GTA IV, so for me PSN being free is an advantage, as I wouldn't use a paid service. The wi-fi bit of the PS3 is another great addition too. So simple to set-up, practically noob proof.
I think it's a shame that because you disagree with someone's opinion you put them on the ignore list. For me, I'm as much interest, if not more so, with the people whose opinion differs from mine.
Robin
Yup, and the Marketing unit on my BTEC. \o/
Joey D
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The irrelevant though, the fact is the 360 is still outselling the PS3 currently. Although the Wii has them both licked and that came out within a few days of the PS3.
Now that post was not fanboy-ish and I can completely respect that. Although just because you had a bad experience does not mean that's the case for everything. Like I said, my 360 experience has been fine. My PS3 experience has been less enjoyable but that is only because the customer service was awful when it broke.
As for XBL, I believe it is better but like you posted, you get what you pay for. I don't expect leaps and bounds from the PSN, but I do expect quite a bit from XBL. Needless to say both have met my expectations.
I think it's a shame to constantly belittle people because they don't prefer the PS3. I almost feel like I can't post anything concerning the 360 in the console debate without either being called a fanboy or told how much the 360 sucks or even worse having numerous people blow it so far out of proportion that it becomes laughable (look at the last page or two).
Yes I like my 360, yes I like my PS3, yes I even like my Wii, but the only thing I'm a fan of is the PC since it offers a gaming experience that is unlike any console on the market.
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Joey D
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No it's not you, it's other members, you for the most part add decently to the discussion. I was more surprised at your post more than anything. Sorry I didn't mean to direct that comment at you, more so of just a general observation anytime something like this comes up. And not that it really needs to be said since I am posting to you, but you didn't make it to the ignore list.
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But they are profoundly different, and that doing a proper apples to apples comparison even in the UK, an equally equipped 360 is more expensive and is still missing many features on an equally equipped PS3.
As I said before, take the same chart as posted earlier, and fill in the UK prices, and the PS3 is still cheaper.
Not at all. In fact, using your own logic - thus ignoring the differences between the systems and only focusing on price, then the PS2 is hands down the most economical system... which may also be why the PS2 has outsold the Xbox 360 since the 360 launched over three years ago (35 million PS2s vs 27 million 360s). In fact, it was only less than a year ago that the 360 finally started to outsell the PS2 on a regular basis.
They have to. Since the PS3 launched in Europe it has sold 7.8 million units. Over the same period of time the 360 has only sold 5.7 million units... and this despite the higher up front cost of the PS3... as apparently many Europeans do recognize the value and features the PS3 has over the 360.
It's also safe to say, many 360s and PS3s are sold not because of their price or even their features, but because they have some great exclusive games. Also many PS3 were originally bought as just Blu-ray players.
Beyond that, many people do not pay attention to over all costs, which is why selling a la carte systems like the 360 makes it appear cheap. Many people undoubtedly do not do any due diligence, and only they can be blamed for that, not Microsoft.
In fact, it's Microsoft's duty to make money for its shareholders, and if people are willing to pay more for features lacking in the standard 360 and pay more for XBL, then it's Microsoft's right and duty to charge for it. As a stockholder, I'd be furious if they did not. This is in fact where I believe Sony has screwed up because they have essentially given away so much for free that they could have easily charged for had they packaged it differently. However, that's beside the point.
Still??? Read the above response... your facts are wrong.
Yes, thanks to a significant price drop, the 360 has enjoyed a nice sales jump over the last three months that has helped it beat out current weekly PS3 sales, but the 360 is STILL behind in terms of sales rates, but that's hardly anything to freak out over.
Oh, and before you start tossing out total units, you seem to conveniently forget that the 360 came out a full year ahead of the PS3. By that logic the PS2 is KILLING the 360 based on it's 125 million units sold.
In fact, I wonder how shocked you would be to discover that the majority of multi-platform games over a year ago sold more PS2 versions than 360 versions? Or how shocked you would be to discover that Take-Two (publishers of games like GTAIV, BioShock, Midnight Club:LA, 2K Sports games, etc) announced that 35% of the quarterly take was for their PS3 games while Xbox 360 accounted for 28%.
(source)
Of course we know that total units only tells one small part of the story, which is why sales rates since launch and day-to-date comps are what is more relevant in terms of adopting rates.
Let's start with the UK:
How about Europe you might ask?
How about Japan?
How about countries other than America, Japan, and in Europe?
In fact the only region where the 360 has a faster sales rate is in the US:
However, when combined, including the US, world wide, the PS3 continues to have the fastest sales rate:
What you and perhaps a small handful of others would apparently have us believe is that because the total worldwide units is more and because the last few weeks the 360 has outsold the PS3, that it's doom and gloom for the PS3... yet that only tells one small fraction of the story... not to mention the simple fact that the 360 had a nearly 10 million unit head start... of which it has lost quite a bit of ground because despite the recent sales jump in 360s, it's still well below the PS3's over all sales rate.
Except in past posts the only PS3 hype you have mentioned has either not come from Sony and or has already come true. Based on all the things the PS3 can do that no other console can, and based on the nearly 300 games already out for the system, of which the vast majority have received above average ratings, many of which received some of the highest ratings among published professional critics, including more higher rated exclusive games for the PS3 than the 360. It seems quite obvious that as far as a system goes the PS3 is delivering the goods and then some, and frankly they are giving away too much for free at the cost of their bottom line.
Not only does the PS3 have far more features and multi-media support, but the system software is regularly updated, continually adding to and improving the system. Granted, you currently can't have an audio chat with your friends while you are playing in different games (not that it was promised, nor that it might be added soon), but if that's the only advantage the 360 has over the PS3 then MS is truly screwed... and those whining about it need a serious reality check! If it's that important to you, call them on the phone, or use PSN text chat system.
I also don't get all the complaining about Home... show me anything like it at all on any other console... and it's bloody free. Seriously, I swear some people just get off complaining, regardless of how ridiculous they are being.
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- 5,051
- Labounti
That margin is less than what the 360 sold its first year. In that light as far as year to year wouldn't the PS3 have a slight edge out side of the total replaced.. ..er i mean sold systems? They sold more because of the one year lead.
Microsoft only charges for Xbl to make a profit not to cover server cost. I dont think it costs more than $100mil a year to maintain the servers. they already pull millions in revenue from downloadable content, accessories and game sales. difference in silver and gold memberships reveal that ugly truth. The feature differences are not the result paying for it. Sony just hasn't been able to keep up with xbl. If one believes they are getting great service because they are paying for it they are wrong. Gold members don't get golden service, silver does which is free, not free if u have to buy a HDD cuz you got sucked into the Arcade money trap. Paying $50+ a year just to play online when you want is not worth it to me. And Silver is not better than PSN.
Oh yeah I could not simply revert to silver with a push of a button and my card had expired, all i wanted was to go back to silver but they wanted a new card. I got fed up and sold the system, a 1 year old premium with 3 games for $150 and he rest went to gamestop. It was a gift anyway
magburner
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I agree! I though I was a fanboy, but compared to some here, I feel like a casual gamer! Even though I've owned every Playsation from day one, and probably spent upwards of £10K on Sony products over the years!
I know I have bashed M$, but to tell you the truth, my orginal Xbox gets more play than my PS3. I like a few things that M$ have done with the 360, but fear of the RRoD has put me off that system. All these Sony delays are making me serioulsy re-consider that descision though.
Like I have said previously, I have faith in Sony's vision, but waiting for that vision to become reality is getting on my nerves. I might as well get a 360 and Forza 2, because it seems now that GT5 (the reason I brought my PS3 in the first place), has been delayed yet again!
Joey D
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Since I guess you are grouping me in that other handful of people let me be a bit clearer. It is a fact shown through charts that the 360 is outselling the PS3 and the Wii is outselling both by a huge margin. However, I never said the PS3 isn't selling at a faster rate, it is and will probably pass the 360. But for the time being the 360 has sold more units then the PS3. How fast it is selling is irrelevant in a discussion about total sales.
My PS3 and 360 probably get equal amounts of play now, the 360 used to get more but as games I actually wanted to play came out on the PS3 I began playing it more and more. Although both get hugely overshadowed by my PC which is light years ahead of either console since I can not only play games but do everything else under the sun (expect what HD movies from a disc since I am not spending that kind of money yet).
Sony and their game companies do tend to delay things, but every company does that now. And if they don't delay it, it comes out half-assed...just look at every EA game made in the past few years. All rushed and for the most part all worse then what they should have been.
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In the EU the PS3 came out march 2007 so thats 1 year and 4 months after the 360 and 4 months after the wii. The PS3 is 1.5 million behind the 360 and as soon as a price drop comes it will catch up.
The 360 is not reliable, im on my 6th and this one is really slow and loud. I bet theres loads of people who have bought more than one 360 because theres broke.
The 360 is not reliable, im on my 6th and this one is really slow and loud. I bet theres loads of people who have bought more than one 360 because theres broke.
- 6,009
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The only thing ridiculous is your gross exaggerations - enough already!
Who here has ever completely dismissed the 360? Be specific, other wise your either lying or grossly exaggerating!
Heck, I have on countless times come to its defense when people have posted false facts about the 360.
Who is being belittled and how? If they say things that are untrue or exaggerated, and someone posts facts that show that to be true... if they feel belittled for that so be it, but that's on them to change not those that correct their misleading or false info.
The problem Joey is some people post things that are either misleading, exaggerated or simply not true, and when actual facts are then brought up they react negatively, accused of being attacked.
What's laughable, nay tragic, is to dismiss facts, or ignore those that do not support your personal opinion/preference based on a personal bias... doing so is how I would define a fanboy.
I must say, while it was true that I looked forward to your posts and reading your opinions, if your last few posts are an example of what I have to look forward to in the future, then perhaps I'll have to reconsider.
I sincerely hope this is not the case, and all of this can be chalked up to an over heightened heated discussion that can bring out the worst in people.
If so, I hope things cool off and we can enjoy a virtual toast and enjoy quality discussions and games with each other. 👍
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Joey D
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I'm not giving name, the last time I did that I got a PM from a long term mod telling me to stop. If the mods want to know the name of the mod who did that I will PM them. But I'm not risking that again, even if it was in an automotive discussion last time.
If you think I'm lying then fine, but if you can't see people who have dismissed the 360 as junk you aren't looking very hard and yes some are long term members here. This is not even to mention those who are fly by night trolls, of whom I will mention even if I do get nicked for it...shaka.
What have I posted that is untrue or misleading? It is a fact that the 360 has sold more unit worldwide, which I even posted a link to a source for. It is a fact that the PS3 does not come with any means to have it do High Def out of the box. It is a fact the PS3 does not come with a headset. These are all of the claims I have made, which none of are untrue, misleading, or false.
Frankly I feel belittled when you or any other member tells me I'm posting things that are untrue when they are not. I admitted I misread FoolKillers first post and I will admit when I am wrong most of the time. However misreading that post still doesn't change the fact that the PS3 can't do HD out of the box, that if you are buying a PS3 at a retail store you are going to pay a hefty premium on a HDMI cable, and that it does not include a headset.
Maybe they feel they are? And that is against the AUP, there was just a length discussion in the Opinion forum on this very topic. Even if one person is offended by something it is grounds for an AUP violation and that can range from anything to a picture poking fun at 9/11 to disagreeing with someone in a less than respectful way.
I don't dismiss facts, trust me I read all of your posts and have learned quite a bit from them. What I dismiss is the way facts are presented. That Sony press release was extremely biased however it was factual. I could compare a base Saturn Aura to a full loaded BMW 3 series and go "look the 3 series is a vastly superior car in every way". Not only would I be comparing things which go after two different market segments I wouldn't even be comparing like trim levels.
Like I said numerous times, I don't for a minute believe the PS3 is junk and I do think you get quite a few great features on it. I really enjoy my PS3 even if I don't play to many games on it. I find many other great uses for it and I don't regret buying it now that I have an HDTV and can utilise everything. I do have complaints about it, mainly the reliability since one has died on me and I experience quite a bit of freezing in all sorts of games. I still think it's superior to the 360 in many ways though.
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Just the ones they make. Dead Space is a pretty good game. I do agree, though. I've retired from pc gaming even though i have a gaming laptop. I'd rather spend my cash buying games and not worrying about upgrading my system. Plus consoles offer more good games IMO. My PC DX9, is used heavily for emulation and classics. My Laptop DX10, for everything else +emus.
I wouldn't call D-N a cheerleader, hes more like its agent. You know, the one who only gives you the facts, dismissing false claims or subjects taken out of context or ignoring more meaningful facts. A cheerleader just chants/rants about being "number one" regardless of the score.
Joey D
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A fair number of games come out the PC and consoles. This is also not to mention the huge number of RPG's and MMORPG's that are only one the PC. I don't know I would much rather play certain games on the PC over a console due to the better graphic processing (at least of my machine) and greater control with the mouse and keyboard. However there are games I will only play on the console, like Grand Theft Auto for instance. It might run better on my PC but I find it easier to use a game pad.
Perhaps that wasn't the right word, but it's not a case of fanboy-ism so I didn't really know what to call it. And just so I'm not acting like I'm attempting to talk "behind your back" so to speak I will address D-N with this as well.
I appreciate the information you give us 99.9% of the time but I think there are a few times were you go a bit overboard with it all. My previous statement with the regards to the HDMI cable and the headset was solely directed at the PS3. I admit there are times when I could be clearer or make more sense. Although we are all guilty of this and I freely admit I am not immune to it.
- 6,009
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Are you really sure you want me to go back and quote every post you made that was untrue or misleading in this thread and in the 360 threads? Seriously, is that really what you want me to do, or shall we let sleeping dogs rest?
First of all it most certainly is misleading when you fail to mention the same is true for all but the Elite model 360, and that there is no HDMI cable or headset that comes with the other 360s, and fail to mention the fact that the majority of 360s sold do not even have an HDMi output, let alone a cable for one.
It is also VERY misleading to suggest that just because someone buys a console at a retail store they will buy an HDMI cable there. It is also VERY misleadiing to suggest that the cable will cost $100. I know Best Buy sells them for as little as $50 and Fry's sells them as low as $25. But that's all besides the point. Many people buy consoles at Amazon, and they sell HDMI cable for just $1.78 - so yes it was terribly misleading on your part.
It was also misleading to suggest there are no bundles from retailers for PS3s that include HDMI. One Google search proves that is not the case... although agin, I don't recommedn it as you can get the excat length and type of HDMI cable you want for less.
But that's what we were correcting you on, and looking back, all that has been said in response are facts... much of which you have been very quick to dismiss. So what's that all about then?
Again, this is more of the same misleading posts from you. There are bundles at retail stores that include HDMI cable, there are retail stores that do not charge as hefty of a premium as you have suggested earlier, and besides all that you say quite clearly "you are going to pay a hefty premium on a HDMI cable"... when in fact any wise consumer knows to shop around for the best price. If not, that's their problem, and has nothing to do with the PS3.
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Can we please leave this argument now, for the benefit of the whole site. I use to like seeing this thread pop up in my GTPlanet subscriptions, it usually meant that someone had found good news about the Playstation or related products. But this row has gone on way too long, I think I'm speaking on behalf of the majority of people when I say can we please just leave it now, no one needs to have the final post on the matter.
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Being bloody free or open beta does not make a product exempt from criticism. Free is a very good bonus. Open beta suggests there is room for improvement. Sony is trying hard to push Home as a feature of the PlayStation 3. It's not difficult to understand if people are complaining about Home's shortcomings when it fails to meet their expectations.
My friends with PS3s have opted to skip PlayStation Home altogether as everything it provides in NA Home can be accomplished with freebie multiplayer flash games, Windows Live Messenger, and social networking sites. They don't see a point to it in its current state. I'm not sure what it's like in other Home regions, but the grass is looking much greener on the other side of the fence.
Is it really possible to invite people between different Home regions? I'd love to have a look, but I'm not interested in making yet another account.
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Joey D
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I am talking about here and now as I thought we have left that in the past. I really don't want to get into a well you said this a year ago argument, and I won't, but if you feel you must do it.
Wait not mentioning something is misleading? That's not misleading that's just not stating it. I agree that the 360 doesn't come with a HDMI port or cable save for the Elite, the 360 will however do HD out of the box if you don't buy the arcade one. I never had to buy any special cable with mine to make it go HD.
I was initially responding to FoolKiller's post which stated:
I believe he was implying that one was buying it at a retail store. Also the only reason I brought up the HDMI cable and the headset is because it is not exactly true that if someone looked at a PS3 after having a 360 rung up and said "how much are the add ons for that" the answer would be "you wouldn't need anything". You would at the very least need and HDMI cable, which will run at a high premium at an electronic store.
I also said up to a $100 at some store since a store was never specified, but it is a fair guess that it would be a retail store in which you can go and talk to someone and have them ring it up. Most online retailers don't do that.
I didn't mention bundles, why bring it up?
And yet you are posting in a manner I find abusive since you are claiming I am lying when I am not. Frankly I find that offensive when I have posted nothing but true thing thus far.
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Sony did drop the ball big time when they not only didn't include an HDMI cable (my Series 3 TiVo came with one, so it's not unheard of) but they didn't even provide a component cable. Fortunately I had one for my PS2 and they tided me over until I could order the HDMI. Regardless, you don't have to have either of the premium cables to play the PS3, but that kind of defeats the purpose, doesn't it?
As for the price difference, for me personally it was never an issue as I have never considered an Xbox of any kind. I have nothing against MS and I'm certainly not a Sony fanboy, but there was significantly more draw to the PS3 and its capabilities.
As for the price difference, for me personally it was never an issue as I have never considered an Xbox of any kind. I have nothing against MS and I'm certainly not a Sony fanboy, but there was significantly more draw to the PS3 and its capabilities.
- 12,872
- Cambridge
- Moglet85
- Moglet
The 360 Pro comes with a headset too 👍
The prices in the US seem a bit more balanced than in the UK having read this thread, in the UK a 360 Pro is much cheaper than the basic PS3 to get HD online gaming. But then the 360 doesn't come with a Blu Ray player.
I did a price comparison to get HD online gaming in the 360 forum if anyone wants to see the difference (I used in store prices, not online, as there are so many online bundles a comparison would be impossible)
- 6,009
- Austin, Texas
- D-Nitrate / GTP_DNitrate
I don't own a PSP, but I believe the developer of the game has to include Remote Play as an option, and seeing as there are fundamentally different things about the way a game is programmed for each system I suspect most games probably don't have it, but that's just a guess.
BTW: I just checked, and Wiki has a listing on Remote Play as well as a list of games. 👍
- 6,009
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That's good to know. That must have changed recently, but unfortunately it's still only the wired headset. I believe the wireless set still lists for $60.
- Or the ability to have larger drives from anyone other than MS
- Or the ability to play games on Blu-ray
- Or 1Gb/s Ethernet
- Or Web Browser
- Or Flash Support
- Or HDMI 1.3 Output
- Or Wireless Headsets other than from MS
- Or Bluetooth Headset Support
- Or Bluetooth 2.0
- Or Controllers w/motion control
- Or USB Camera w/microphone
- Or Audio/Video Mix Software
- Or Driving Wheels or any specialized controllers other than from MS
- Or DLNA Media Streaming other than through Windows Media Player or Windows Home Server
- Or AVI playback
- Or DivX playback
- Or M2TS playback
- Or VOB payback
- Or XviD playback
- Or MP4 AAC 5.1 playback
- Or WAV playback
- Or Dolby TrueHD
- Or DTS-HD Master Audio
- Or Linux OS Support
Most importantly though, if they are playing online, don't forget to add $50 a year or more if you are in the UK for each account every year you are signed up for it... that in itself will wipe out any cost differences, which even today, many people seem to overlook.
Look, the 360 is a great gaming console with great games, but if you are doing a comparison, be accurate.
I'll have to check it out... did you make sure to list all the games for the PS3 that are rendered in 1080p? Are there still no games available on the 360 that are rendered in 1080p? Keep in mind, rendered means the graphics were created in 1080p, not simply scaled up to 1080p and outputted, there's a huge difference between the two.
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