2012 Grand Premio Petrobras do Brasil

[V v G T v V]

Argh! Cobras!

What?

 

[avens]

Well, they could pay a lot more attention to the feedback section, but Spa was very high on that list before being included (I think it was first). Plus, it is the only way we can hope to influence on future dlc and gt6... You dont need to be negative about it, it doesnt hurt to vote!

"More tracks with dynamic weather and/or time changes" is 7th on the feedback section.

The BMW E30 M3 is 7th on the GT6 car wishlist.

 

[Liquid]

Argh! Cobras!

What?

Famine is just having night terrors.

Don't worry.

 

[Ardius]

All I need to read now is that Michael Schumacher is indeed the Seventh Son of a Seventh Son and it will be complete.

 

[Liquid]

All I need to read now is that Michael Schumacher is indeed the Seventh Son of a Seventh Son and it will be complete.

No lie, I was listening to Iron Maiden when I read this.

 

[Ardius]

Well I'm wearing an Iron Maiden t-shirt.

And I have 7 holidays to use up at work. (seriously!)

 

[Liquid]

Formula 1 is in its seventh decade.

The mystery goes on...

 

[SilverArrow]

Guess who won the 7th race of his 7th full season and scored 10 points from 3rd on the grid...
In the 7th race of his comeback he scored 12 points from 5th on the grid.

 

[CarolinaBlue704]

Because starting 11th is the same as starting 6th, and being stuck behind Kimi Raikkonen for half the race does not matter?

No, it doesn't matter. For the reasons I already stated in my post. Massa would have made quick work of Kimi if he had the pace of the frontrunners who finished 45s ahead.

 

[Hun200kmh]

Suddenly Massa is brilliant and any help he may give Alonso is a disgrace to the sport ... evil EVIL Ferrari!

Anyways ... there's a huge debate on twitter around this video. Especially on what it shows if you skip it all and go directly to 10:00.

Regardless of Vettel ignoring yellow flags and the stewards ignoring him (probably without meaning to do it, with all that was going on) what I find hilarious is the STR guy slowing down. I think Ferrari, with all their money, should buy a second team and have THREE drivers working in Alonso's favour.

Oh wait, that would be really EVIL of them


The whole video may be interesting, but don't forget to check 10:00 and after

 

[Samus]

The thing with yellow flag overtakes is that they're actually logged automatically, as are the exact yellow flag zones. You sometimes see the display on the screen, a picture of the circuit with part of it yellow. They are the official yellow zones and they can detect/see any overtakes in those zones automatically, they do not need to be seeing images of it. So either they saw it and chose to ignore it (which would be very wrong) or they saw nothing because he didn't actually overtake in a true yellow zone.

Either way it's done, gone. Nothing is going to happen.

 

[Hun200kmh]

Either way it's done, gone. Nothing is going to happen.

No doubt. In a way it's good this wasn't Alonso, I can only imagine the outrage if it was.


Anyway, and although I know a thing or two about F1, I found this video very instructive. The guy talks a bit too much perhaps (at the beggining), but the sections of footage about the 3 overtakes he analized (from about 3:00 onwards) are fantastic and the detailed analysis made them really interesting. A bit nerdy, but interesting!

 

[Famine]

The stewards office - as reported by Brundle - said that solid yellow boards were the full course low grip warning (yellow/red flag) while flashing yellow boards were yellow flag conditions. All the drivers knew this - except Kimi who missed Thursday briefing - and all the teams knew this.

So it looks like there's not a case to answer.

 

[hornet_burnout]

Suddenly Massa is brilliant and any help he may give Alonso is a disgrace to the sport ... evil EVIL Ferrari!

Anyways ... there's a huge debate on twitter around this video. Especially on what it shows if you skip it all and go directly to 10:00.

Regardless of Vettel ignoring yellow flags and the stewards ignoring him (probably without meaning to do it, with all that was going on) what I find hilarious is the STR guy slowing down. I think Ferrari, with all their money, should buy a second team and have THREE drivers working in Alonso's favour.

Oh wait, that would be really EVIL of them


The whole video may be interesting, but don't forget to check 10:00 and after

I just found that too 👍

It shows how hard a drivers life is! And even if technically he did pass before green, it's too late now.

And you still can't be sure he couldn't get back into a position to win the WDC, nor would a 20s penalty take it away from him.

It does feed the conspiracy theory though...

 

[Hun200kmh]

The stewards office - as reported by Brundle - said that solid yellow boards were the full course low grip warning (yellow/red flag) while flashing yellow boards were yellow flag conditions. All the drivers knew this - except Kimi who missed Thursday briefing - and all the teams knew this.

So it looks like there's not a case to answer.

If you watch the video that is abundantly clear (section about the Kobayashi overtake, from about 6:00 on))

Besides, they are warned through their wheel too, something I kind of knew but never actually noticed how.

 

[PeterJB]

You could argue that because the STR slowed down (albeit deliberately) Vettel and the stewards could have assumed he was passing a broken down car, whereas if the STR was still at speed and defending against him then it would look a bit more suggestive.

 

[G.T.Ace]

I only saw one pass under caution in that video and that was a couple of meters before he passed the green board. Pretty much didn't matter in the end.

People are overanalyzing the whole thing anyway.
Makes me sick considering how everyone's celebrating guys like Senna, as they were gods, who did much worse stuff.

 

[Ardius]

End of story.

 

[Peasantslayer]

People are overanalyzing the whole thing anyway.
Makes me sick considering how everyone's celebrating guys like Senna, as they were gods, who did much worse stuff.

It's weird how people get so nostalgic about the past, I bet at least half of the people who watched the Senna movie believe he would be at least half a second a lap faster than today's top drivers.

 

[That90sGuy]

Never mind.

 

[Wardez]

*image*

End of story.

[/debate]

 

[nealcropper]

I only saw one pass under caution in that video and that was a couple of meters before he passed the green board. Pretty much didn't matter in the end.

People are overanalyzing the whole thing anyway.
Makes me sick considering how everyone's celebrating guys like Senna, as they were gods, who did much worse stuff.

It's weird how people get so nostalgic about the past, I bet at least half of the people who watched the Senna movie believe he would be at least half a second a lap faster than today's top drivers.

I have said it before, and I will say it again. Senna is only regarded the way he is because he died racing.

Now I know this sounds harsh, and it probably is a bit, and what happened to him was horrible, and I hope I never happens again.

But, Prost was just as good, if not better than Senna because Ayrton was reckless. He took risks, sometimes they payed off (Monaco 1984) and sometimes they didn't (his numerous collisions with numerous drivers in numerous years). There was a great feeling in the pit lane that he was dangerous.

Yes he was a very fast driver in the wet, what he could do in them conditions beggars belief, but lets not forget Alain Prost. If all people see is the Senna documentary, then Prost may leave a bad taste in the mouth. Which he shouldn't, he was a very fast driver with as much skill as Ayrton, in my option.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I agree with you peasentslayer. The film is very one sided, I seen an interview with Prost at the Goodwood Festival of Speed this year, and even he said that he wasn't very happy with the way he was portrayed in that film. He was a good friend of Senna's, and somehow the film skates over that fact.

Also the cars were faster then, and nowhere near as safe. So without doubt if Senna was alive and young today, and driving the old Lotus, he would undoubtedly be much faster than Vettel. Cue trolls.

 

[PeterJB]

Also the cars were faster then, and nowhere near as safe. So without doubt if Senna was alive and young today, and driving the old Lotus, he would undoubtedly be much faster than Vettel. Cue trolls.

Actually, this year's cars were on average 6-10 seconds faster per lap than those of Senna and Prost's day, though they'd still give the HRTs a run for their money!

 

[ghskilla]

I have said it before, and I will say it again. Senna is only regarded the way he is because he died racing.

Now I know this sounds harsh, and it probably is a bit, and what happened to him was horrible, and I hope I never happens again.

But, Prost was just as good, if not better than Senna because Ayrton was reckless. He took risks, sometimes they payed off (Monaco 1984) and sometimes they didn't (his numerous collisions with numerous drivers in numerous years). There was a great feeling in the pit lane that he was dangerous.

Yes he was a very fast driver in the wet, what he could do in them conditions beggars belief, but lets not forget Alain Prost. If all people see is the Senna documentary, then Prost may leave a bad taste in the mouth. Which he shouldn't, he was a very fast driver with as much skill as Ayrton, in my option.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that I agree with you peasentslayer. The film is very one sided, I seen an interview with Prost at the Goodwood Festival of Speed this year, and even he said that he wasn't very happy with the way he was portrayed in that film. He was a good friend of Senna's, and somehow the film skates over that fact.

Also the cars were faster then, and nowhere near as safe. So without doubt if Senna was alive and young today, and driving the old Lotus, he would undoubtedly be much faster than Vettel. Cue trolls.

Hello. I like that someone else feels the same way. 👍
Edit - I know PeterJB tree'd me on this, but the cars back then were slower than they are today around a lap.

Any major rule changes for 2013?

 

[Wardez]

Actually, this year's cars were on average 6-10 seconds faster per lap than those of Senna and Prost's day, though they'd still give the HRTs a run for their money!

Yeah, I think he was trying to say they were just more powerful, and more dangerous as a result.

 

[nealcropper]

Yeah, I think he was trying to say they were just more powerful, and more dangerous as a result.

Yep. I meant more in terms of raw power, but I didn't know that today's cars were so much faster than yesteryears. Thanks for that guys.

 

[Wardez]

omg check this out! DELICIOUS STAT'S

http://f1pressarea.pirelli.com/wp-content/files/pdf/14311.pdf

Really interesting ****! It's like the stat's you can look up during Grand Theft Auto play throughs xD

Here's all of it pasted for those who can't otherwise open the .pdf:

2012 PIRELLI FORMULA ONE STATISTICS

Tyres
Total number of tyres provided for the season:
Race tyres: 31,800 of which 22,500 dry tyres and
9,300 wet tyres plus an additional 6,600 for the tests (not including development tyres)
Of which (for race tyres only):
supersoft: 6 % / soft: 25 % /
medium: 21 % / hard: 17 % /
intermediate: 18 % /
wet: 11 % / 2 % development tyres

Total numbers of tyres used: Dry tyres: 21,400; wet tyres: 2,100

Number of tyres recycled during 2012: All, i.e. 31,800 race tyres plus 6,600 test tyres

Average life span of a dry compound this season: 180 km

Average life span of a wet compound this season: 140 km
Tracks, Races and Tests

Longest continuous energy input into a tyre: India (turn 10-11)

Longest race of the year: Malaysia in 2hrs 44min 51.812s

Shortest race of the year: Great Britain in 1 hr 25min 11.288s

Most laps run on Pirelli tyres:
Hard – Kobayashi (798); Medium – Senna (869); Soft – Ricciardo (1,012); Supersoft – Raikkonen (237); Intermediate – Alonso (145); Wet – Kobayashi (104)

Highest top speed reached by a P Zero F1 tyre: 248.241 kph (Hamilton / Italy Qualifying)

Slowest top speed reached by a P Zero F1 tyre: 161.828 kph (Schumacher / Monaco Qualifying)

Most fastest laps in 2011: Sebastian Vettel (5 in race / 6 in qualifying)

Distance covered by Pirelli’s Renault R30 test car in 2012: 7,012 kms

Number of different test tracks visited by Pirelli staff this year (incl. private tests):
9 Pit stops

Total number of pit stops for the year: 957 (of which 14 were a Drive Through and 2 a stop&go
penalty)

Total average number of stops per race: 47.9, i.e. 1.9 per driver

Most pit stops in a race: 76 (Malaysia)

Least pit stops in a race: 24 (United States)

Fastest pit stop time: 2.31s (McLaren / Jenson Button at the German Grand Prix)

Overtaking
Number of overtaking manoeuvres in 2012: 994 (not including Brazil)

Most overtaking manoeuvres in a dry race: 90 at the 2012 Chinese Grand Prix

Most overtaking manoeuvres in a wet race: 76 at the 2012 Malaysian Grand Prix

Least overtaking manouevres in a dry race: 12 at the Monaco Grand Prix

Other interesting numbers
Total kilometres driven by all the P Zero compounds in 2012 (races and tests):
Hard – 101,692;
Medium – 121,840; Soft – 123,270; Supersoft – 21,993; Intermediate – 13,770;
Wet – 7,930

Coldest track/ground temperatures Pirelli P Zero tyres have run: United States Grand Prix at 11
degrees Celsius (17.11.); coldest overall: Jerez winter testing at 0 degrees Celsius (10.02.)

Hottest track/ground temperatures Pirelli P Zero tyres have run: Brazilian Grand Prix at 55 degrees
Celsius (23.11.)

Coldest air/ambient temperatures Pirelli P Zero tyres have run: United States Grand Prix at 4 degrees
Celsius (17.11); coldest overall: Jerez winter testing at -2 degrees Celsius (10.02.)

Hottest air/ambient temperatures Pirelli P Zero tyres have run: Grand Prix of Europe at 37 degrees
Celsius (21.06.)

Amount of time spent downloading all tyre data on the RTS system this year (incl. tests): 92 hrs

Number of track/air temperature taken by tyre fitter per race weekend: 124

Total distance travelled by all F1 tyres in 2012 (off-track): 216,967 kms

Total number of tweets from Pirelli Media: 5,400

Words written on Pirelli press releases in 2012: 79,744

Total number of Pirelli recipe books produced (incl. translations): 10,000

Pirelli F1 and its people
Total number of Pirelli people travelling to each race: 52

Total number of nationalities within the Pirelli F1 team: 10

Average amount of hours spent by each Pirelli staff member on a plane this year: 192 hrs (or 8 days!)

Number of Pirelli wristbands given out during the season in the paddock: 4,450

Total number of hotel nights booked for the Pirelli team: 1,498

Pirelli’s F1 Trucks & Hospitality
Total amount of trucks at European races: 13
Total average kilometres travelled by each Pirelli truck in 2012: 31,125 kms
Numbers of meals served at the Pirelli F1 hospitality (incl. tests): 24,132
Number of coffees served by Pirelli hospitality during the season: 28,350
Number of different pasta recipes cooked by Pirelli’s chef this year: 314
Amount of mascarpone used for tiramisu and other dolci: 205 kgs
Pirelli in Formula One overall (since 1950)
Races started: 242
Wins: 83
Pole positions: 86
Podium places: 256
Fastest laps: 90

 

[Samus]

I just glanced through and one stood out as wrong, shortest GP being British. The Italian is always usually the shortest because of it's high speed nature and sure enough that one was 1:19:41.221, six minutes less.

Oops Pirelli!

They also have Brazil wrong, that one lasted about 20 minutes. Or at least it seemed to go that quickly there was so much action, didn't feel anything like 1:45hr.

 

[niky]

Another good impartial article analysing things from Gary Anderson - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20501817

I wish he wrote all of the BBC articles, not that muppet Andrew Benson writing biased guff like this - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20490565

Interesting analysis. Just goes to show what drivers like Alonso, Hamilton and Vettel have over their teammates... that ability to adapt perfectly to the car they're driving. And the problems this raises for the teams in terms of development!

Still, of the three... Most impressed with Alonso. He's had to adapt to how many different cars and varying sets of driving characteristics now?

 

[RodrigoDLL]

End of story.

Not quite: this picture is from a lap earlier than the video, isnt it? He seems to be behind an HRT at the back of the image.

But anyway, on the video the STR clearly slows down a lot to let Vettel through, so its same as passing a car with problems which is ok under yellows.

On the pirelli stats: highest top speed, from Hamilton at Monza, is also clearly wrong: 248km/h? It must be 348...