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No, the High Court's ultimatum.
2015 F1 Mechanics/Aero; Design predictions to win the WCC/WDC. READ FIRST POST
- Thread starter LMSCorvetteGT2
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Meanwhile, Christian Horner believes that it's situation critical at Red Bull:
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...tion-for-2016-critical-warns-christian-horner
Elsewhere, Niki Lauda reckons Dietrich Mateschitz has lost interest in Formula 1, possibly explaining why he never got back to Mercedes:
http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121055/lauda-mateschitz-has-lost-f1-interest
If true, I can't imagine that Mateschitz would just pull the pin - he'd sell the team on. But to whom?
http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12...tion-for-2016-critical-warns-christian-horner
Elsewhere, Niki Lauda reckons Dietrich Mateschitz has lost interest in Formula 1, possibly explaining why he never got back to Mercedes:
http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121055/lauda-mateschitz-has-lost-f1-interest
If true, I can't imagine that Mateschitz would just pull the pin - he'd sell the team on. But to whom?
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The High court case has been adjourned for 70 days after the letter of intent was submitted today. http://www.crash.net/f1/news/223613/1/lotus-avoids-administration-as-renault-steps-in.html
Steve Matchett on NBC said during one of this past weekends broadcasts that Lotus employees werent paid recently so hopefully somebody steps up here and makes a deposit.
Steve Matchett on NBC said during one of this past weekends broadcasts that Lotus employees werent paid recently so hopefully somebody steps up here and makes a deposit.
- 9,554
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- catamount39
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And on this, Red Bull signed the Concorde Agreement until 2020 - and if they don't honour it, they get slugged with a fine. I've heard $100 million per season.
I think they're really making a mountain out of a molehill - they could be competitive with a 2015 Ferrari engine.
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- FMecha_EXE
But they insisted on technical parity. After all, all the other Ferrari-powered engines received up-to-date engines.
Tired Tyres
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- Tired Tyres
But they insisted on technical parity. After all, all the other Ferrari-powered engines received up-to-date engines.
None of those teams are likely to take points, wins and championships away from Ferrari. Red Bull will. It's completely stupid of Ferrari to even entertain the idea of replacing themselves as primary challenger to Mercedes by making a rival like Red Bull more competitive.
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- HamiltonMP427
But they insisted on technical parity. After all, all the other Ferrari-powered engines received up-to-date engines.
As @Tired Tyres said, this is Ferrari and just like Merc (as I and other predicted) don't want to give them the same advantage they enjoy. If RBR wants to have such ability to compete with them, it sure as hell wont be because of their allowing, instead they will help (or not in Mercedes case) but not to the same extent as they do for others.
RBR has the ability to spend as much as a manufacture and thus will always be a massive threat, so if they want to have parity with others...they better hope VW shows up like rumored. And more so hope they can build a comparable engine.
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And Toro Rosso won't. That's the hang-up for me: Toro Rosso could do a deal with Ferrari for 2015 engines tomorrow, and it wouldn't be an issue.
I can't imagine that Mateschitz is going to completely walk away from Formula 1. For one, he stands to be slugged with a huge fine. But it's also going to mean a huge hit to Red Bull's international reputation because it means completely shutting down two teams. Nearly a thousand people (if not more) will be out of work.
I suspect that if he does walk, a more realistic outcome is a management buy-out. Given the rules aimed at maintaining continuity in constructors, the team would likely continue to compete as Red Bull, running off the prize money from this year. So Red Bull would get maximum exposure without costing them so much as a dollar. Then, it doesn't matter if they have 2015 or 2016 engines.
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I'm curious why Cosworth hasn't been called up 
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- TenEightyOne
- TenEightyOne
The "VW plan" involved Red Bull heavily sponsoring a VW team, perhaps that option's still on the table even after all the out-of-F1 VW shenanigans. In the short term, if Red Bull really are to stay, maybe they'll draw up a new contract with Renault. Amongst other things they're running out of time to complete a chassis design that mates to an engine. That loses them some advantage (possibly) but gives them time to tread water.
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Which might also explain why Mercedes were reluctant to supply Red Bull - they didn't want to share their engines to a team that could pass information on to VAG.
![[Nor]MclarenF1](/forum/data/avatars/m/169/169289.jpg?1413287138){kind=avatar}
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- Moss
- hoydeskrekk
I think any notion of VW entering F1 can be thrown out the window. The sheer scale of their diesel mess will surely demand vast amounts of money to be spent rectifying the problem. Not to mention potential fines and costs of potential buy backs and lawsuits. We're talking billions upon billions of dollars.
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- HamiltonMP427
We've been over this though, F1 could restore some of what has been lost by VW and secondly running a team in F1 while expensive compared to other series is a drop in the bucket compared to any amount they pay to any national environmental agency. So no the notion of VW entering isn't beyond the realm of possibility at all. It's in the same realm it was before this mess they created, does F1 seem viable enough for them to waste time in it and get something out of it technology and monetary wise that they aren't in any other series.
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- hoydeskrekk
I agree it may to some extent provide a pr boost. However, it's hard to imagine a company that is going through a drastic reshuffling of it's board of directors, and facing massive fines and probably a fair amount of lawsuits from American customers should choose to go into the most expensive motorsport of them all. If we are to see VW in F1, I think we'll need a big dose of patience.
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The idea was that VAG would buy into team, but wouldn't openly run as a works team until 2018.
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An interesting article at the BBC on the history of Renault/Red Bull and the current bargaining tools that Red Bull and Ferrari have at their disposable. Not much new news but still a good breakfast read.
Also more on Michelin with it being reported that teams and drivers are pushing for them to become the tyre supplier. I think Pirelli are between a rock and a hard place on this one, they've supplied what's been asked for. Still, one supposed driver-quote that's been doing the rounds is;
Also more on Michelin with it being reported that teams and drivers are pushing for them to become the tyre supplier. I think Pirelli are between a rock and a hard place on this one, they've supplied what's been asked for. Still, one supposed driver-quote that's been doing the rounds is;
Un-named 'top' driver
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I don't, one it's VW that everyone is looking at. Two not everyone is like the collective you find on GTPlanet of race fans and car nuts, and thus most people don't realize that Bentaly is basically a modern iteration of VW or that Bugatti is one or Porsche and so on.
And so just like many didn't realize the connection between Infinit and Renault, why would they with those brands. The fact is those brands make money and with some assistance from the Mother company they can sponsor a team like @prisonermonkeys has been saying and others and then in 2018 have that group with VAG help be a works team. People will see it as a sports/luxury brand in F1 like most other manufactures in F1.
I mean I don't get why people think after these issues arise that a group is going close up show...Toyota didn't when it had his colossal problem and neither did GM and both groups were running and still run many motorsport efforts with nice sums of money in them.
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In the short-term, Formula 1 isn't really an option for VAG - but give it enough time, and the company will regain traction. They already have a very healthy presence in motorsport; in addition to the WEC and WRC, they authorise the use of the Passat in the BTCC, as well as the Polo in the WRX, and provide engines for junior open-wheel formulae. About the only things they don't do are WTCC and IndyCar.
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- hoydeskrekk
I guess we're just going to agree that we see this matter from different angles. It's all guesswork and assumptions at the moment since there is no official statement saying the one or the other. Of course, I'm not saying VW will NEVER get into F1, but this time around it looks like their attempt has pretty much been shot down by their own mess.
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*double post please remove*
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No one is saying you are...the problem is you don't seem to be understanding what we're getting at. Which is VW could join RBR as a sponsor at a much cheaper premium then a full on factory team
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Indeed. In order to keep the prize money, the team would need to compete as Red Bull for a season, so VAG can't buy the team directly.
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- hoydeskrekk
No no... I get that. I'm just pointing out the very high possibility that their entire F1 venture has been put on hold/cancelled.
Christian Horner has also said that the deal with VW went "up in smoke".
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/horner-potential-vw-f1-deal-seemed-to-go-up-in-smoke/
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Horner says there are no sour grapes but then goes on to say;
Christian Horner
Perhaps he's having trouble subtracting the engine cost from the sponsorship? The engine was effectively free, albeit with Infiniti on the cover.
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More good news for Manor, Williams have agreed to a technical partnership along with their supply of Mercedes engines.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121111
With Haas using Ferrari power and technical expertise, I just hope that Honda have some big plans for the winter development period... I couldn't stand watching McLaren being THE backmarker team, with a livery reminiscent of the HRT's and potentially 2 world champions driving...
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121111
With Haas using Ferrari power and technical expertise, I just hope that Honda have some big plans for the winter development period... I couldn't stand watching McLaren being THE backmarker team, with a livery reminiscent of the HRT's and potentially 2 world champions driving...
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- hoydeskrekk
Going by this quote it seems like it's the entire deal that's disintegrated.
Looks like there is no longer an engine on offer from VW, making the deal redundant.
http://motorsports.nbcsports.com/2015/09/25/horner-red-bull-volkswagen-deal-up-in-smoke/
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- HamiltonMP427
Yeah I saw this too it figures that Manor would become rear gunner when Haas got on board as I and others talked about a few pages ago. It just good to see it porven with the link.
Second link is just a rehash of the first. They've also said in another article that it seems unlikely but people shouldn't fear because the new boss is a Motorsports fan as well and worked with current VAG Motorsport big wigs.
For now I'm sure they wont join but to pass up F1 all together I doubt very much since it's been shown here and other threads that the publicity and brand awareness revenue is larger in F1 than any other Motorsport. When they decided to join will depend on who stays in charger and how fast this mess can be cleared up, since they're clearly taking it slow.
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- hoydeskrekk
Then I guess we do agree on something.
The seed of F1 has been sown within VW, let's see how it grows over time.
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- catamount39
So it's Ferrari or the parking lot now for Red Bull?
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