ABS 0 community where are you???

If any European drivers (just to minimise lag) are looking for an ABS 0 league thats been running well over a year then i run a league www.TheAutomotiveMayhem.com ( known as TAM ), were pretty much full but there are 2 spaces free in league 2 atm if anyone is interested.

Or we have an open room going once or twice a week for casual racing
 
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Hey guys I believe I have said I have been doing a lot of testing with the new physics after the last update.

I have been for the last couple days testing brake balances and tires to match the fastest track times (for example Top Gear the UK version not that American bull crap haha) with cars in the game.

Found some interesting things with the tires and brake balances. Easiest cars to show is Ferrari at Top Gear. Because as many may know the stigma never runs one of those without the race setting on (which turns off all assists including abs). On the Enzo for example the most realistic way the car handles (yes i have never driven one but I have studied the video of its lap to see how it handles if you catch my drift). For this car the most realistic for driving it stock seems to be the most realistic to match or get close to the time.
Tires
Front- sports hard
Rear- sports medium

ABS- 0 of course

Brake balance-
Front 2-3
Rear 0-1

I pretty much only race bone stock cars now with no tuning. Oil change car wash and on Lancer EVOs with AYC i will adjust that to be more accurate but besides that nothing. I find races to be really close with just driver skill involved.

If you guys want i can post a little brake balance and tires that would be the most realistic for the cars being stock when i am done noting everything down. I know not everyone likes racing stock cars but some do so i thought this information might be helpful.
 
ORPHANTHIRTY7-I'd love to see your findings. I've gone the same route lately:bone stock, no aids, cockpit view no hud. After 2 years of GT5, I'm enjoying the cars more than ever.

I've put in a lot of seat time offline these past couple weeks driving w/o ABS. Jumping in cars I've rarely used. Ran the Hommel Berlinetta for an hour in the French seasonal. Such a tricky car with no tuning and default tires!

Ran a one make w/ the 86 RUF on Deep Forest 15 laps. Started last and making my way through traffic was great fun. Better have been some Arcades with pro level AI. Just spent a couple hours running a great custom track from a course maker on GTP. Used a Ammemiya GT300 RX7. If you start in last and don't pass anyone on the first lap, it's pretty fun to make clean passes through the mixed field.
 
ncrthree
ORPHANTHIRTY7-I'd love to see your findings. I've gone the same route lately:bone stock, no aids, cockpit view no hud. After 2 years of GT5, I'm enjoying the cars more than ever.

I've put in a lot of seat time offline these past couple weeks driving w/o ABS. Jumping in cars I've rarely used. Ran the Hommel Berlinetta for an hour in the French seasonal. Such a tricky car with no tuning and default tires!

Ran a one make w/ the 86 RUF on Deep Forest 15 laps. Started last and making my way through traffic was great fun. Better have been some Arcades with pro level AI. Just spent a couple hours running a great custom track from a course maker on GTP. Used a Ammemiya GT300 RX7. If you start in last and don't pass anyone on the first lap, it's pretty fun to make clean passes through the mixed field.
Click to expand...

I have a hard time using the cockpit view. I just can't get over seeing 2 steering wheels. I do ignore it while cruising. But i like to look at the dials inside the car instead of the hud dials. But i use the hood camera because when I look over my wheel i am looking over it and onto the hood and that other steering wheel in the cockpit is a nooseence.

I love that car. I used to drift that thing. I used to be know for that car. All my friends called it the pig. I just like the sound and body kits.


I will let you know when i get it done
 
I never liked cockpit view either. Always considered it a gimmick! Bumper cam was all I'd use from years of ps2 GT's. Still prefer it for online pack racing. Watched a bunch of PCars videos and got jealous of their graphics. Gave it another chance and was surprised at how impressive some Premium interiors are. Even the standards aren't too bad with limited hud on. Right after that was when I decided to commit to ABS 0 too. I don't "see" 2 wheels when I play, I guess because my sight line is pretty high over my wheel. I'm only focused on the track and the cars direction. A quick glance at the screen wheel sometimes helps to see where the front wheels are aimed in a spin.
 
ncrthree
I never liked cockpit view either. Always considered it a gimmick! Bumper cam was all I'd use from years of ps2 GT's. Still prefer it for online pack racing. Watched a bunch of PCars videos and got jealous of their graphics. Gave it another chance and was surprised at how impressive some Premium interiors are. Even the standards aren't too bad with limited hud on. Right after that was when I decided to commit to ABS 0 too. I don't "see" 2 wheels when I play, I guess because my sight line is pretty high over my wheel. I'm only focused on the track and the cars direction. A quick glance at the screen wheel sometimes helps to see where the front wheels are aimed in a spin.
Click to expand...

Yeah i just hope they will make a option to remove the steering wheel in cockpit view or at least remove the hands. I know a pc game that has that like that too
 
ABS 0 here with ds3.. tend to mess up somethimes but Ive raced with abs 0 for a while now and I wont go back to abs 1 :) Desent and clean driver btw :)))
 
I actually use ABS on certain vehicles only.

When I'm driving all the Hondas, TVRs, and Lotuses (excepting the JGTC cars), I try not to use ABS. The Nissans... Yeah. I use it, because they won't work well without them.

It does take practice, getting used to using no ABS. The Brera works well without it.
 
My thoughts on driving without ABS:

I think it is less stable and easier to lock up than real life would be and technique required is a bit different due to it, in a way similar but you have to do less work in real life than you would in GT5 I predict. ABS on 1 or without ABS is probably as realistic as each other, maybe ABS 1 is more realistic in general for how a car will behave in regards to performance driving.
 
Saidur_Ali
My thoughts on driving without ABS:

I think it is less stable and easier to lock up than real life would be and technique required is a bit different due to it, in a way similar but you have to do less work in real life than you would in GT5 I predict. ABS on 1 or without ABS is probably as realistic as each other, maybe ABS 1 is more realistic in general for how a car will behave in regards to performance driving.
Click to expand...

Looks like we have different findings when driving without ABS, I find that with no ABS in GT5, the brakes lock up just fine, not too easy or too hard - this is with a pad. Rarely I have a lock up in GT5, and it's quite easy to trail brake - due to muscle memory I guess. I am more on the edge with no ABS, that is normal as I don't get assurance of no lock up from the game assisting me.

I drove pretty fast at times in real life, not going into detail, but I did have a lock up on my old AE92 Corolla years ago, I stab the brake suddenly - only halfway and the front locked up and skid for a second or two, before I regain control ( I was doing a "bit" more than 80km/h :sly: ), the cheap skinny tire did not help either.

If you say that ABS 1 is more realistic in general for how a car behave in regards to performance driving ... mmm that is the opposite of my experience. Every car I have driven without ABS behave much better than with ABS , with ABS 1, the car felt too stable under heavy braking, seems like that they have a perfect anti lock braking system that would never exist in real life.

Anyway, maybe all these are cause by my way of playing since release day.
My play time with ABS can be counted in minutes :lol:, I felt weird with it on, like the car didn't talk to me no more when slowing down:dunce:
 
Ridox2JZGTE
Looks like we have different findings when driving without ABS, I find that with no ABS in GT5, the brakes lock up just fine, not too easy or too hard - this is with a pad. Rarely I have a lock up in GT5, and it's quite easy to trail brake - due to muscle memory I guess. I am more on the edge with no ABS, that is normal as I don't get assurance of no lock up from the game assisting me.

I drove pretty fast at times in real life, not going into detail, but I did have a lock up on my old AE92 Corolla years ago, I stab the brake suddenly - only halfway and the front locked up and skid for a second or two, before I regain control ( I was doing a "bit" more than 80km/h :sly: ), the cheap skinny tire did not help either.

If you say that ABS 1 is more realistic in general for how a car behave in regards to performance driving ... mmm that is the opposite of my experience. Every car I have driven without ABS behave much better than with ABS , with ABS 1, the car felt too stable under heavy braking, seems like that they have a perfect anti lock braking system that would never exist in real life.

Anyway, maybe all these are cause by my way of playing since release day.
My play time with ABS can be counted in minutes :lol:, I felt weird with it on, like the car didn't talk to me no more when slowing down:dunce:
Click to expand...

I can see the realism of ABS off, but it is overdone I feel, in terms of instability and locking that ABS 1 starts to feel more realistic. I don't have a problem driving with no ABS in GT5, the amount I've driven without ABS is probably similar to you driving with ABS. Just feel I should be able to brake harder (More travel (Might be pressure problem)) like people might do in real life and also other sims. GT5 is probably the hardest sim game I've tried to drive with no ABS and it is because I feel it is harder than it should be. Hopefully PD sort it out to be more realistic in future GT games.
 
I just did the first race ever with abs off!

Car: Scion FR-S

Specs:
  • 219BHP
  • 1230KG
  • 22.6 KGFM
  • 419PP
  • CH Tires
  • Fully Custom Trans
  • Fully Custom Suspension
  • Fully Custom LSD

BB: 4/7

It felt great, I have no fear anymore. :P
Now only need to "upgrade" to the big guns. ;)
 
tronrider345
I just did the first race ever with abs off!

Car: Scion FR-S

Specs:
  • 219BHP
  • 1230KG
  • 22.6 KGFM
  • 419PP
  • CH Tires
  • Fully Custom Trans
  • Fully Custom Suspension
  • Fully Custom LSD

BB: 4/7

It felt great, I have no fear anymore. :P
Now only need to "upgrade" to the big guns. ;)
Click to expand...

:tup:Keep practicing and enjoy the thrill, also welcome to GTP:gtpflag::cheers::gtpflag:
 
I'm wondering, is it ok that the tires smoke? Yeah, n00b question, but it doesn't stop me from asking. :D
I want to discover the "marvellous" world of ABS 0.
 
Yauma9
I'm wondering, is it ok that the tires smoke? Yeah, n00b question, but it doesn't stop me from asking. :D
I want to discover the "marvellous" world of ABS 0.
Click to expand...

Well, it means that you are locking up and reducing braking efficiency. Also locking fronts means you won't be able to steer, and rears is a bit like applying the handbrake.

You will get it with no ABS and it adds to the fun and drama of racing, but you should try minimise lock-ups by modulating your brakes and reducing steering input under heavy braking. Unlike ABS you need to reduce brake pressure as you turn into the corner and/or slow down (trail and threshold braking).

I don't normally play with tyre wear but I assume lock ups will wear your tyres more quickly.
 
Yauma9
I'm wondering, is it ok that the tires smoke? Yeah, n00b question, but it doesn't stop me from asking. :D
I want to discover the "marvellous" world of ABS 0.
Click to expand...

If you're on an all out hotlap and the car isn't set up well then, yes smoking the inside front is ok (although, not ideal). In a race where tyre wear is a factor, you need to tune it out. 👍
 
I'm starting to see a lot of people posting all types of BB settings on here which can be kind of confusing for newcomers that are just starting to pick up ABS OFF. They won't know which is right or wrong and don't know who to believe anymore. Maybe some of us can get together to write an instructional guide on how to find the correct BB setting for each car and get it stickied/wikied on here so newcomers can easily follow. For example we can describe the process we go through and the steps we usually take when we get into a new unfamiliar car and need to find the right optimal BB setting. What do you guys think?
 
Something like this?:

Beginner's guide to no ABS brake balance settings:

What you have to realise when beginning driving with no ABS is that no car has the same braking characteristic. Some will be supremely stable (generally speaking FFs), some will react violently to trail braking (generally 4WDs and MRs) and some will have very little threshold before the tyres lock (Camaro SS '10 etc.).

Because of this, you have to adjust the brake balance to suit each vehicle's individual characteristics, both through the overall braking power (how high your values are) and the ratio of front to rear bias. Generally speaking a bias at which the front locks before the rear is desirable, as in the case of lock up, you'll plow into the corner, rather than going in taillights first.

Here's my method for getting a reasonable setting:

Road Cars:

Starting balance: 4:2

From there, if you find you are locking up the front too easily, move each value down 1, to 3:1. If you still find you're locking the front too easily, try 2:1 or 2:0. Beyond that you are losing too much braking force at high speed. It's also good to note that a brake value of 0, does not mean no braking on those wheels, it is just the minimum value.

In some cars, for example a lot of 4WD cars, you'll find that the rear slides out under trailbraking. This is why I always use a starting value of 5:2 for 4WDs. If you find you're locking too easily, try 4:1.

For MR cars, they are always a bit unstable and even with a good BB setting they'll generally still get loose when trailbraking. However start from 4:2 and tailor from there. With MRs, I generally find 4:2 or 4:1 to be best.

Racing Cars

Starting Balance: 6:3

Because racing cars have higher grip tyres and downforce, they can withstand more braking force. That's not to say, however, that some racing cars won't lock easily. For example, the Autobacs Garaiya lock it's front tyres rather easily, so for that car I use a balance of 4:2.

Apply the same rules as for road cars to tailor your BB. Locking the rear? Try 6:2 or 5:2. Locking the front too easily? Try 4:2 or 5:2.

Important notes:

  • These are just my tips, some people like to use higher balances, some people like lower ones. Find what suits you.
  • Each track may require a different balance. A track with lots of high speed braking zones (La Sarthe, Monza etc.) might be better if you raise your BB a bit. A track like Laguna Seca where trailbraking is very important and the heavy braking zones are bumpy (T2 & Corkscrew), might be better suited with a slightly lower bias.
  • Locking the inside wheel isn't necessarily a BB issue. It can also be down to a bad diff setting. The Deceleration value can be tailored to lock the inside or outside wheel first, try to get a happy medium.
  • When using no ABS you need to be aware of the track surface, if there's a bump in the braking zone (Corkscrew, Tokyo Reverse T1) you need to modulate the brake pedal to avoid lock up (ease up).
  • Some cars just don't work well without ABS, some do. Car choice is a key part of enjoying no ABS driving.
  • Adjust your BB to suit the situation you're using it in. For example, in a one off hot lap, running higher brake balances is preferable to gain that higher braking force (especially at high speed). However in a race where tyre wear is a factor, you may want to lower your BB slightly to minimise lock up.
  • You'll also want to change you BB to suit the state of both the weather and the state of your tyres. If it's wet, you'll lock up a lot faster (I mean a lot, it's very easy to underestimate) so keep the same ration of F:R, but lower the values (using 6:3? Go to 4:2 or even 2:1 etc.). If your front tyres are getting worn too fast, flick the rear value up slightly, or take 1 click off your front one. If your rears are wearing, put a bit more front on. You'll also want to change your bias even if they're wearing evenly, however, keep the same ratio.

I may have forgotten a few things. :ill: Tell me any suggestions or maybe share your own and we can compare the differences in tactics. :)
 
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Well said Ford:tup:, sounds like a good place to start. Personally I tend to favour the lower end of the scale but I'm usually driving street cars on CM-SS tires. I'd say 3/0 and 4/0 covers the majority of the cars I have run without ABS.

Another factor for me is also where I'm running the car. For a TT or Q run for example, I'll tend to run higher balances to get that little extra bit of braking because making an error causes me to lose a bit of time or a timed lap. In a race situation, I tend to favour lower figures to avoid mistakes under pressure and for consistency and tire wear.
 
Johnnypenso
Well said Ford:tup:, sounds like a good place to start. Personally I tend to favour the lower end of the scale but I'm usually driving street cars on CM-SS tires. I'd say 3/0 and 4/0 covers the majority of the cars I have run without ABS.

Another factor for me is also where I'm running the car. For a TT or Q run for example, I'll tend to run higher balances to get that little extra bit of braking because making an error causes me to lose a bit of time or a timed lap. In a race situation, I tend to favour lower figures to avoid mistakes under pressure and for consistency and tire wear.
Click to expand...

Thanks, that's a good point actually, I'll add that in. 👍

EDIT: Also added a point about changing BB to suit the weather and tyre wear. :)
 
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FordMKIVJ5
Something like this?:

Beginner's guide to no ABS brake balance settings:
:)
Click to expand...

Well done, thank you. One advice I would add for beginners is that 0 brake pressure in GT5 is misleading as zero is minimum brake pressure, not no pressure at all. count Zero as one.
 

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