Bugatti thread.

[Terronium-12]

Like i said, the speed is impressive, the overall car isnt (for me that is), because i find everything else except the top-speed ugly, boring and unimpressive. I think its overhyped, i think there are too many people who find it "kewl" and i think it could be more impressive if they wouldve focused less on top speed and more on other things.

I wont take that as a fact but an opinion, because if you like the design and if you like the sound (which i find also boring compared to most sportscars) etc. the car is impressive. I dont like either, so...

I had to jump in on this conversation...

The Veyron isn't the best-looking car known to man, hell, I still consider the Enzo to be ugly at times but it's grown on me, overall. That's beside the point, the Veyron isn't about compromise or even the hype itself - that's the end product of countless magazines, reviewers and even news editor's going on and on about it's 254 mph top speed. I've learned or rather I've noticed that it isn't the speed itself most, if any of them at all are genuinely impressed with, it's the astounding comfort, the structural rigidity and as one or two have even proposed the lack of excessive cabin noises at that speed. I might be wrong as I haven't seen the episode in quite some time but wasn't James unaware at how fast he was going until he actually looked at the speedometer?

Let's look at this from another opinionated matter, the interior is one of the most luxurious, sexiest display of craftsmanship I've laid my eyes on in recent time. Only two cars I can think that have as good of an interior to me are the Zonda F, well, any Zonda for that matter and the One-77. From everything I've read, all of the road tests, speed tests and the likes thereof that I've seen or read, it seems to be more about the car itself and not the car you see.

 

[dancardesigner]

Veyron isn't that impressive, it's just an overengineered mess and an excuse to claim crazy numbers, i mean 4 turbos, WTH the Zenvo ST1 will be capable of similar power output naturally asspirated.
And +1000:tup: for the Zonda , thats a work of art, epecially in naked carbon.

 

[GT5_Racer]

I really dont get how anyone can call the Veyron ugly, its the most beautiful car in the world. Its the fastest car in the world but still manages to look refined unlike lamborghinis and zonda which have fins and spoilers sticking out of every oriphis.

 

[Terronium-12]

Veyron isn't that impressive, it's just an overengineered mess and an excuse to claim crazy numbers, i mean 4 turbos, WTH the Zenvo ST1 will be capable of similar power output naturally asspirated.
And +1000:tup: for the Zonda , thats a work of art, epecially in naked carbon.

You have to keep in mind the reason the Veyron even has four turbos and not one, or even none at all is because the Veyron is quite heavy and it has to overcome aero drag while remaining stable at all times at the speed it's traveling, that excessive drag will slow the car down even moreso if the car is heavier than say, a Lotus Elise which would for the sake of this argument "look" faster because it's smaller and lighter. I believe the turbochargers are there for no other reason than to feed the engine that additional power when it's in top speed mode - and also remember it's everyday top speed is 220mph without any of the turbos "chirping".

Ugh. I haven't talked like this in a while, if I missed anything or totally messed that up, correct me.

 

[Pierced Lead]

400kph = 250mph

400 km/h = 248.548477 mph to be exact , but I stand corrected.

Veyron isn't that impressive, it's just an overengineered mess and an excuse to claim crazy numbers

You really haven't read the rest of this thread have you?

 

[Terronium-12]

I really dont get how anyone can call the Veyron ugly, its the most beautiful car in the world. Its the fastest car in the world but still manages to look refined unlike lamborghinis and zonda which have fins and spoilers sticking out of every orifice.

The Bleu Centenaire, which I think that is is a little more "refined" than the original Veyron.

Most beautiful in the World? Subjective, but not to me.

The One-77 is better-looking in my opinion, but boy, do I love the Veyron Grand Sport

 

[Bram Turismo]

I find it irritating how another "Bugatti thread" in the GT5 forums turns out to be a discussion between the Veyron and the F1. There recently was a discussion like this in the Movies&TV section in the Top Gear thread, https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=82030&page=183. This is what Fred had to say about the matter, and I believe his post is the best way to put how things are between the Mclaren and the Bugatti: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3448311&postcount=3648. I cannot understand how we are comparing two cars that come from 2 very different eras, and with different technology to each other. For a long time since the F1 came into production, it was the greatest, and I still view upon it as one of the greatest peices of automotive engineering ever, seeing how it still is able to hold on, if not, beat cars that are 10-15 years newer. And that with out-dated technology, and not to forget, out-dated tyres.

Personally, I can't see why the Bugatti Veyron is so astonishing. I do have respect for it, but if I pay a million pounds, all I get is a car that'll bring me up to speeds of 400 km/h. I'm not buying it for the comfort, because I can buy more luxurious cars and more comfortable cars for a lot less than the pricetag of a Veyron. I'm not doing it for the handling abilities either, because f I really want a car that handles stupidly good, I can buy a Caterham R500. Am I buying it for sheer beauty? Hell no, Ferrari's where you want to be at! No, I believe the only thing the Veyron really is good at is achieving a topspeed of 400 km/h with silence and comfort. Impressive it is indeed, but in my opinion it doesn't make it one of the greatest cars ever. And if I'm really crazy and I want to modify a car that'll all together cost me less than a Veyron, I can buy a Supra and modify it to go from 0-246 mph in just 22 seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xr58Fq9fwo

Now, to get on-topic then... I'm not just exited to see the Veyron in GT5, but I'm even more exited to see the EB110 car in action. It was one of the first supercars I saw when I was younger, and I've always thought it's looks where staggering, although I sometimes have to come back to that today.

 

[dancardesigner]

I accept the veyron is a well built, and very quality looking car, and it does have some nice curves to it, but at the end of the day beauty is in the eye of the beholder, it's just oppinion. I can appreciate the looks of the veyron as i can an enzo but not in the same way as something like an Aston martin or even the new 458. I have a preference for low long bonneted, wedgey looking cars,the veyron is very short nosed and round and dare i say it looks a bit fat, but hey i still appreciate someone elses oppinion as it being best looking in the world, it's not like it looks like a tortoise or something.

 

[dancardesigner]

I find it irritating how another "Bugatti thread" in the GT5 forums turns out to be a discussion between the Veyron and the F1. There recently was a discussion like this in the Movies&TV section in the Top Gear thread, https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showthread.php?t=82030&page=183. This is what Fred had to say about the matter, and I believe his post is the best way to put how things are between the Mclaren and the Bugatti: https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/showpost.php?p=3448311&postcount=3648. I cannot understand how we are comparing two cars that come from 2 very different eras, and with different technology to each other. For a long time since the F1 came into production, it was the greatest, and I still view upon it as one of the greatest peices of automotive engineering ever, seeing how it still is able to hold on, if not, beat cars that are 10-15 years newer. And that with out-dated technology, and not to forget, out-dated tyres.

Personally, I can't see why the Bugatti Veyron is so astonishing. I do have respect for it, but if I pay a million pounds, all I get is a car that'll bring me up to speeds of 400 km/h. I'm not buying it for the comfort, because I can buy more luxurious cars and more comfortable cars for a lot less than the pricetag of a Veyron. I'm not doing it for the handling abilities either, because f I really want a car that handles stupidly good, I can buy a Caterham R500. Am I buying it for sheer beauty? Hell no, Ferrari's where you want to be at! No, I believe the only thing the Veyron really is good at is achieving a topspeed of 400 km/h with silence and comfort. Impressive it is indeed, but in my opinion it doesn't make it one of the greatest cars ever. And if I'm really crazy and I want to modify a car that'll all together cost me less than a Veyron, I can buy a Supra and modify it to go from 0-246 mph in just 22 seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xr58Fq9fwo

Now, to get on-topic then... I'm not just exited to see the Veyron in GT5, but I'm even more exited to see the EB110 car in action. It was one of the first supercars I saw when I was younger, and I've always thought it's looks where staggering, although I sometimes have to come back to that today.

Yes but what makes an overall good car is a good general compromise, what good is a king sized bed attached to a lawnmower.

 

[RACECAR]

How about we stop with the oh so tiring "Veyron vs. F1" comparison already? I thought this was about Bugatti being in GT5, not about the same comparison people keep talking about.

 

[Bram Turismo]

How about we stop with the oh so tiring "Veyron vs. F1" comparison already? I thought this was about Bugatti being in GT5, not about the same comparison people keep talking about.

Very true 👍

 

[dancardesigner]

Hope to see this but mirrored surface probably be too complex for PS3 to render.

 

[Famine]

Personally, I can't see why the Bugatti Veyron is so astonishing. I do have respect for it, but if I pay a million pounds, all I get is a car that'll bring me up to speeds of 400 km/h. I'm not buying it for the comfort, because I can buy more luxurious cars and more comfortable cars for a lot less than the pricetag of a Veyron. I'm not doing it for the handling abilities either, because f I really want a car that handles stupidly good, I can buy a Caterham R500. Am I buying it for sheer beauty? Hell no, Ferrari's where you want to be at! No, I believe the only thing the Veyron really is good at is achieving a topspeed of 400 km/h with silence and comfort. Impressive it is indeed, but in my opinion it doesn't make it one of the greatest cars ever. And if I'm really crazy and I want to modify a car that'll all together cost me less than a Veyron, I can buy a Supra and modify it to go from 0-246 mph in just 22 seconds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8xr58Fq9fwo

But is anything more luxurious than the Veyron better handling? Is anything better handling also faster? Is anything that's faster also as luxurious? And will your Supra have a warranty?

There are cars which can beat it on each point, but the Veyron will beat them on all the others...


Though as I said, I don't care for the car myself.

 

[sumbrownkid]

That chrome finish looks tacky on that Veyron.

 

[alonsof1fan91]

Ok, thats my last post in this thread.

In my opinion, neither the Veyron nor the Mclaren F1 is the best piece of automobil technology up to date. Nothing comes close to this three cars: W125, W196 and FW14.
These cars, changed the automobil industry more then the Veyron/F1...

 

[Famine]

Ok, thats my last post in this thread.

In my opinion, neither the Veyron nor the Mclaren F1 is the best piece of automobil technology up to date. Nothing comes close to this three cars: W125, W196 and FW14.
These cars, changed the automobil industry more then the Veyron/F1...

So did the Citroen 2CV and BL Mini. But that's absolutely irrelevant to the thread, every bit as much as two Mercedes and an F1 car.

Seriously? An F1 car?

 

[psn-marc15]

Bugatti Veyron and the Mclaren F1 are very fast and amazing looking cars.
Happy that Bugatti is in Gran Turismo, and i hope the Mclaren F1 is aswell.
I have no preference of either car.

 

[Terronium-12]

Ok, thats my last post in this thread.

In my opinion, neither the Veyron nor the Mclaren F1 is the best piece of automobil technology up to date. Nothing comes close to this three cars: W125, W196 and FW14.
These cars, changed the automobil industry more then the Veyron/F1...

Did you really, just now compare two road-legal supercars to one GP racer, and two F1 racers?

I know the technology inherits itself onto newer vehicles, but that's just...out of place. Just using the Veyron, no, let's use both of them...show me another road car or even a racer (I've never seen one) that uses gold to cool off the engine. Or, doing the same thing show me any race car that uses a W16 engine. If those aren't advancements in the slightest I just don't know what is.

 

[Dave A]

So what? The F1 doesn't have it to begin with & it put a lot of length on the Veyron shortly; I highly doubt launch control would have made that much of an impact on the distance. Besides, the AWD system already gave the Veyron a slight advantage from a dig.

As for the Veyron walking the F1, notice it couldn't do that until it really got moving. Even then, it wasn't exactly leaving the McLaren standing still.

Terronium is right. That race, as seen from the start, did come down to the weight vs. torque. The McLaren wouldn't have jumped out & put such a length on the Veyron if it wasn't.

Regarding the TopGear test, there is a reason the Veyron didn't fly past the F1 fom the get go and that's because it bogged down off the line. In usualTopGear fashion the race was dramatised to make it closer than it would have otherwise been. Independant tests all show that the Veyron is a faster accelerating can across the range. If both the F1 and Veyron have a good start then there would be no points in the race from 30mph onwards where the F1 is even a whisker ahead.

 

[McLaren]

And from you as you can see in the video the turbos came on boost the veyron hauled it in in no time at all and walked away from it but then you wouldn't be biased to the mclaren would you?

Nothing to do with bias, more that you barely know anything about the McLaren. You've showed this before when you argued with Fred over it.

Other than that, I see no reason to keep going. We can talk again when you've got an actual debate instead of attempting to sound witty with dried up comebacks.

Regarding the TopGear test, there is a reason the Veyron didn't fly past the F1 fom the get go and that's because it bogged down off the line. In usualTopGear fashion the race was dramatised to make it closer than it would have otherwise been. Independant tests all show that the Veyron is a faster accelerating can across the range. If both the F1 and Veyron have a good start then there would be no points in the race from 30mph onwards where the F1 is even a whisker ahead.

Of course we all know it was dramatised; the Veyron would have also been in its Top Speed mode.

However, even though the McLaren was given a good start, the Veyron didn't blow by it. The 2 did stay side-by-side for a quick couple seconds as seen from the McLaren's cockpit, which is what my point that isn't being left standing still when it comes back by.

 

[Famine]

Of course we all know it was dramatised; the Veyron would have also been in its Top Speed mode.

If launch control was disabled, it won't have been. It would also have been ahead throughout (though the McLaren F1 is apparently faster from 60-150mph that the Veyron anyway).

Edit: I've double-checked. It's not in Top Speed mode. The spoiler was retracted at the start and extended during the race. With Top Speed mode enabled it extends to 2 degrees and stays there throughout.

 

[Holdenhsvgtsr]

Nothing to do with bias, more that you barely know anything about the McLaren.

So about the same as you then unless you work for mclaren and are/was involved with it at some point?

 

[Peter]

The bugatti is one of a kind. It's in its own neighbourhood. It's the fastest, luxury, good handling supercar ever and will stay like that for a long time. The comparisons stop here.

 

[McLaren]

So about the same as you then unless you work for mclaren and are/was involved with it at some point?

Go back, read my whole post.

Other than that, I see no reason to keep going. We can talk again when you've got an actual debate instead of attempting to sound witty with dried up comebacks.

 

[Zmann42087]

The news of Lambo and Bugatti has pretty much made my day, though Porsche would have been the icing on the cake...

I would give up Lamborghini and Bugatti if we could just have Porsche.

 

[Terronium-12]

I would give up Lamborghini and Bugatti if we could just have Porsche.

You say that now.

 

[PAPPACLART]

The question is... if 400km/h isn't impressive, why is only one production road car capable of it?

The Veyron is a very impressive piece of engineering, made to fulfil 5 criteria which, at the start, were said to be "impossible" individually. I don't particularly care for the car, but I can recognise what an achievement it is.

I think the Bugatti is impressive in the context of performance and not simply because it is pretty much the only car to achieve 253mph. 8000cc with 4 turbo's producing 1000bhp is not hugely impressive in my book nor are the claims that it has closer to 1500bhp but looses this from the heat? My father in-law's early nineties 1100cc motorcycle has 300bhp from a small turbo and has 70000 almost trouble free miles under its belt. Of course a bigger engine requires more cooling where there are also other practical/technical problems to overcome. I believe any other big manufacturer with the resources and desire to produce a Veyron could have.

What is impressive is that a Veron has 1000bhp that does not need a rebuild every time you floor it, though this has been achieved like I said, from 8000cc and 4 turbo's which makes life all the more easy where for example a 1000bhp Pimped Supra has less than half the engine size and turbo's and does often explode when driven with any kind of passion.

The ‘It was not possible' claims were always just marketing Blub as well as the over inflated acceleration times that were also quoted prior to launch which had many forums buzzing with the idea that a Veyron could smoke an Formula 1 car through gears!! lol

Bugatti set out from the start with the intention to dominate and what they have achieved is impressive, but for me the real accomplishment is they have made a 1000bhp 253 mph car almost practical in terms of ease of use, comfort and reliability.

I would have liked to have seen a normally aspirated purpose built W16 8000cc engine with a 125bhp per litre specific output producing 1000bhp @ aprrox 9000rpm would be more of an achievement if compared to the lazy option of 4 turbos and a low reving motor. Each piston would be 500cc and with a slightly over square design would have no problems running at 9000rpm reliably. Yes it would 'only' have approx 640 ft/lb but a likely lighter engine and lower gear ratios due to the motor reving higher would certainly not have impacted on the the 253mph top speed.

Anyway despite what I say the Veyron how ever you look at it is a fantastic achievement.

 

[sejtur]

I really hope that the EB110 is in GT5, it was one of my favourite cars when I was a kid. The Veyron is nice, but I'd rather drive an Enzo.

 

[psn-marc15]

I would give up Lamborghini and Bugatti if we could just have Porsche.

I wouldnt, i dont even like Porshe, i think their ugly however their a great piece of machinery. I would pic Lambo over Porshe anyday IMO.

 

[GT5_Racer]

Regarding the TopGear test, there is a reason the Veyron didn't fly past the F1 fom the get go and that's because it bogged down off the line. In usualTopGear fashion the race was dramatised to make it closer than it would have otherwise been. Independant tests all show that the Veyron is a faster accelerating can across the range. If both the F1 and Veyron have a good start then there would be no points in the race from 30mph onwards where the F1 is even a whisker ahead.

You are wrong actually. The reason the Bugatti didnt get off the line that well, was because of the heat. It was 50 degrees on the road. The heat effected the veyron because the veyron relys quite a bit on its turbochargers and turbochargers need to be cooled to reach their optimum power, so the turbochargers wernt working properly because of the heat, so that is why it bogged on the line. As the Veyron started to gain speed the turbochargers where being cooled thus the veyrons power kicked in and it passed the f1. If the test was done in cooler conditions then the veyron would have beat the f1 off the line and carried on till it wasnt visible. All of this is backed up because it says it in Topgears own magazine.