Concours Club [Single Make Same Tune Racing]

  • Thread starter Captain Roh
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Hooray, at least 2 of 3 tracks are real ones June 26th:tup:

Are those 3 all premium cars? I haven't checked the dealership yet :)
 
In future I think the cars need to have similar cornering speed as well as different straight line speed, as the ZR1s were often holding the M3s up in the corners to the point they should have almost been letting us by :lol:. Ultimately that was my problem, I knew if I let a ZR1 pass by getting out the gas I would then be slowed down for the following corners quite alot, I'm thinking same compound tyres in future will resolve this, meaning that a faster class car won't be held up in turns by slower ones and slower ones won't be held up either when letting a faster car go.

There's also a slight bit of unclearness as regarding 'in a battle' though again I don't feel I was right in my case, it is difficult to measure that a perhaps a more clear cut method such as within X of other class driver.

Ultimately both incidents were really only warning worthy anyway, as the receiving end of Douqas Indy incident, I only ended up in the grass as the little punt sent me slightly quicker then I anticipated (no more then slipstream though) it was just a case of impatience which put me under a bit of pressure and I borked it :lol:, I wouldn't have given any penalties for it 👍.

I know incidents aren't supposed to be discussed here, but in this case with the new format there are lessons to be learnt and so I feel discussion here is worthwhile, to turn awesome racing into multi-class perfection 👍.


I sort of agree with all of that. I also asked for suggetion in my report post, so the contribution is appreciated 👍

However I eluded to the problem I have in that if the cornering performance in each class is the same, why would anyone choose to race GT2? Everyone likes to go fast right!? :dopey: I go back to my initial dilemma before this combo was posted.. Do I force people into driving a particular class or give them the choice. I'm inclined to go with the latter. This isnt a serious, albeit respectable, racing championship. People race for fun and a gimmiky podium spot in the first page ;) Its all about bragging rights and giggles in here. I always want my members to have 'the choice'!

In my opinion, GT1 should be wild. Challenging your abilities in car control. It should also be faster by some margin. GT2 by comparison, should emphasise skill in race craft more than anything else.

I realise now after our pretty successful maiden multi class, that improvements can still be made. GT1 should out perform GT2 by an even greater differential. 3-4 seconds, as big as it sounds, just isnt enough. However the balance between drivability and performace will be the crucial factor. Next time we do a multi class event much more testing would be prudent!




I do apologise for my incident in the final race, though in my defence the problem was that there was never a chance to let you guys by without jeopardising my position for class lead. Given that those ZR1s were looking at lower class standings and the speed differential it was nigh on impossible bar the main straight for a ZR1 to pass me clearly without me having to throw away my position (by allowing other M3 into my slipstream zone). Though I was still wrong and when I did try to let cars pass I totally screwed it up and misjudging the ZR1s lack of braking and cornering performance, I was braking far earlier then I needed to in order to turn in ok, and the ZR1 had managed to go from slightly ahead to slightly behind :lol:.


With respect mate, its not up to you to decide how you race infront of a GT1. If you lose time by yielding, thats for you to make up again. Everyone else behind let us through! All you needed to do is leave a car width at the apex, job done. I was stuck behind you from the end of the pit straight to the second tunnel because you were defending. The slipstream effect made my tyres less effective in the corners and I lost even more time being dragged wide. I even flashed my lights coming up behind you on the pit straight.

As you said discussions about incidents aren't resloved in here. You brought it up however and I felt it needed a response. The only reason it is being responded to is because it isnt an incident even worthy of a warning.

I also acknowledge the difficlutly you had understanding the multi class rules I had outlined. In future, a 'battle' constitutes being immediatly within a passing opertunity of a same class competitor.



Hooray, at least 2 of 3 tracks are real ones June 26th:tup:

Are those 3 all premium cars? I haven't checked the dealership yet :)


You should know me better by now Jack ;) Of course they're premium! Infact let it go on record that Concours will race exclusively premium cars. Mostly because I only drive cockpit cam :sly: but seriously because I cant guarantee everyone can find the same standard car for each event. Its a bit of a lottery that dearlership 👍
 
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I sort of agree with all of that. I also asked for suggetion in my report post, so the contribution is appreciated 👍
I always want my members to have 'the choice'!

In my opinion, GT1 should be wild. Challenging your abilities in car control. It should also be faster by some margin. GT2 by comparison, should emphasise skill in race craft more than anything else.

I would still have chosen GT2 for the reasons you discuss regarding race craft and such, it's not as if the Zr1 becomes a puppy on sport soft and I dare say we seemed to have better racing as regards our own class which is why I would choose it again it the same choices were offered on 1 compound I imagine I wouldn't have been alone.

With respect mate, its not up to you to decide how you race infront of a GT1. If you lose time by yielding, thats for you to make up again. Everyone else behind let us through! All you needed to do is leave a car width at the apex, job done. I was stuck behind you from the end of the pit straight to the second tunnel because you were defending. The slipstream effect made my tyres less effective in the corners and I lost even more time being dragged wide. I even flashed my lights coming up behind you on the pit straight.

As you said discussions about incidents aren't resloved in here. You brought it up however and I felt it needed a response. The only reason it is being responded to is because it isnt an incident even worthy of a warning.

I also acknowledge the difficlutly you had understanding the multi class rules I had outlined. In future, a 'battle' constitutes being immediatly within a passing opertunity of a same class competitor.

I did try leaving gaps on the apex for other cars but it wasn't enough without almost stopping unnaturally it seems wrong that the slower class can be held up by the quicker one, it was difficult to judge just how much I needed to slow down as the ZR1s were quite considerably slower on alot of the turns and then couldn't get on the gas earlier so you'd almost run into the back of them on exit. As I say I know I was wrong to hold you up and I was taking risks to defend my own position thanks to GTs over the top slipstreaming, what I'm getting at more is that if the ZR1s had been a little bit faster than they were I wouldn't have had this dilemma at all as I'd not be worrying about being held up myself.

I can't think of any real life multi class racing where the top class is inferior to the others in anyway, equal to perhaps but not worse in speed terms, I think there's a reason for that. You can induce more wild handling through other means to cancel out a compound upgrade. In other words, the GT2 races should be interrupted by allowing the GT1 to pass (which I know I failed to do quickly enough) but GT2 shouldn't be interrupted by GT1 after the pass is complete. In future I will yield further in advance, even if it means hitting the brakes on a straight, if a similar situation occurs and I want everyone to be aware I know what I did was wrong and I apologise for that.

Suggestion:
You could allow a fixed number of entrants per class, allowing reserves who wish to upgrade in to GT1 if they so wish and if GT1 entrants do not all show. Hopefully if the events are popular enough this would work out with 2 classes of 8 drivers (or perhaps 10 and 6 would be ok also if one class is much more popular). It's not necessarily a perfect system, but it's just something you can look in to. See how it plays out anyway before assuming everyone would want the quicker class if tyres were the same, if others are like me nothing would have changed selection wise.
 
I can't think of any real life multi class racing where the top class is inferior to the others in anyway, equal to perhaps but not worse in speed terms, I think there's a reason for that. You can induce more wild handling through other means to cancel out a compound upgrade. In other words, the GT2 races should be interrupted by allowing the GT1 to pass (which I know I failed to do quickly enough) but GT2 shouldn't be interrupted by GT1 after the pass is complete. In future I will yield further in advance, even if it means hitting the brakes on a straight, if a similar situation occurs and I want everyone to be aware I know what I did was wrong and I apologise for that.

Suggestion:
You could allow a fixed number of entrants per class, allowing reserves who wish to upgrade in to GT1 if they so wish and if GT1 entrants do not all show. Hopefully if the events are popular enough this would work out with 2 classes of 8 drivers (or perhaps 10 and 6 would be ok also if one class is much more popular). It's not necessarily a perfect system, but it's just something you can look in to. See how it plays out anyway before assuming everyone would want the quicker class if tyres were the same, if others are like me nothing would have changed selection wise.



First of all, I respect you for your continuing apologies, but it really isnt neccesary any more ;)👍 I can appreciate now that you were at least trying to respect the rules of engagement last night. From my perspective in that particular incident it didnt appear that way. However you've offered your apologies and they are accepted. Everyone here is very obliging provided you arent blatently disrespectful. On track and in the forum too :)


In response to the rest of your message I'll just repeat what I said previously


I realise now after our pretty successful maiden multi class, that improvements can still be made. GT1 should out perform GT2 by an even greater differential. 3-4 seconds, as big as it sounds, just isnt enough. However the balance between drivability and performace will be the crucial factor. Next time we do a multi class event much more testing would be prudent!


I fully agree that there needs to be an even bigger margin. However, and I can only speak for myself, but I didnt hold up anybody last night. Certainly not an M3 in any case. If I remember correctly, I even over took you in a corner ;)

I think last night was great in terms of testing anyhow. I certainly had loads of fun as well, but the experience has helped me to learn a lot about this format. Last night needed to happen. As now I will know what to do about it.

Also with regards to last night, there were a few other factors thrown into the mix. Namely track selection. You may not of noticed but we raced both cars individualy the previous two weeks, and I wanted to pick a track from each of those weeks with a new third track. Trial Mountain wasnt suited to multi class with these cars that much is certain. But again,. lesson learned ;)

As for having a certain amount of spots for each class I have to say I'm not immediatly keen on the idea. If anything, giving people the choice was the most successful part of the race meet last night, as we ended up with equal amounts in each class. The idea of taking away competitors freedom, even if very marginaly is still something I want to avoid, diligently!


Hopefully I've covered all bases there. The one resounding factor is the cars relative performance. As I say, much more testing will be needed in preperation for the next event, but I think thats a very simple solution to a problem that was very minor. Everyone still had fun on track last night, despite the problems. Thats a win in my book :D

I'll be sure to make the next multi class double win!! :lol:
 
Fun racing last night, if a little lonely. Things should be a bit closer next week. I had fun just trying to keep it in a straight line.

Dragonistic, I've checked my replay and would like to apologize to you for my driving and my comments afterwards. You were right, none of you guys could have really moved anywhere and the gap I went for obviously wasn't big enough. I didnt know last night that the contact contributed to you leaving the track so I'm sorry.
 
Unfortunately I was the cause of Crispy's demise in that race, I spun, he came around the corner and had nowhere to go apart from at me :ill: Apologies once more mate. :dunce:

No problem at all Captain, just one of those things. Although it was a race ender for me, I still laughed when it happened, because as competitive as we all are, when it all comes down to it...it is just a game :lol:

But nevertheless, I really enjoyed the combo and the split class system, although as has already been stated the two classes were very close...especially around Trial Mountain. But had some great battles with Kamy, Pag and Dragonistic, and fortunately no real issues with the Vettes coming through 👍

Really looking forward to this weeks races though, the Lexus is a fab race car. Also curious to know why Pag seems to hate me and not want to be teamed up :lol:
 
Dragonistic... etc.

Accepted 👍 you can see why I got a little defensive when you seemed to be blaming us for it, no harm done it was still mostly my own mistake. Moving on.

Soooo when can we expect teams and race length to be announced, more the length is my potential issue if they'll all be the same as last time I will be having no issue so long as I'm home in time!
 
With regards to letting everyone know their position and car in the meet this weekend, I still have 11 unconfirmed messages pending.

I had hoped everyone would see them by now. I did the best I could, posting a message in here, PMing everyones inbox at GTP and PSN. If they havent seen them by now I guess they may miss the deadline. Which, I have just decided, will be 5pm (BST) tomorrow., Wednesday 22nd.

After that time I will post up teams along with your designated car, and any left over participants will race by themselves.


And just so you know Dragon, I aim to keep race meets to between 2 and 2 ½ hours every week. Each race length is determined by how many tracks we race in a particular combo 👍
 
I really like next weekend's schedule. But, since my schedule for every weekend is unpredictable, I cannot promise to participate until Saturday. So, I think I gave you an answer Shin. I may be there though even outside of any team.
 
I am enjoying the Super GT (using the Denso right now; can change if needed team wise); I should (hope) be more competitive this Sunday using this car and at least 2 of the 3 circuits :)

I am just gonna buy all three :D
 
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All three eh! :lol: Funny you should say that because I've been testing with all four! I fully believe I can bring the ENEOS into line with the other three now. Crispy, Kamy and I had some great battles last night. Each car has its individual characteristics, but the pace of all of them is relatively similar over a lap. With a little bit of fine tuning after the last part of testing I'll be able to bring them all into line perfectly. Each will still havent certain characteristics, but with each team member having a different car it should be balanced out perfectly.


Speaking of team members I still plan to let you all know later this afternoon. As I said, fine tuning will be going on behind the scenes right up to the weekend, but at least you will all have a car designated to you to practice with. You can always set it up like I ask you later ;)


Anyway, apologies for any spelling errors or anything, I was called out to work at midnight last night. Got home at four, had to be back at six, told everyone they'd have to manage without me because I was going home at 8! :lol: Plenty of coffee for Gary today!!! :scared:


:lol:
 
:drool:

GT5 needs this car!! Just add it to the SLS RM option PD.. You listenin'??! It needs to happen!!

F1 should be in town as well Kamy! Make sure you DO take that DSLR!! I want piccies :D
 
:drool:

GT5 needs this car!! Just add it to the SLS RM option PD.. You listenin'??! It needs to happen!!

F1 should be in town as well Kamy! Make sure you DO take that DSLR!! I want piccies :D

Yep. They should have like Spec RM. Like Ferrari 458, Vette Zr1 to GT1. A 320si and a Chevy Cruze to Super 2000 Specs, and so on. It would be amazing.
What you mean by the part I highlited??
 
Formula one this weekend! Go travel 700miles and climb a tree or something! :lol: Would be great to see a photo someone I know has taken of an F1 car!! :P



Just started work on this team selection by the way chaps. A lot more difficult than I'd imagined :scared:

At the moment it looks like 3 teams of 3, with one reserve team and one solitary driver. Or 5 teams of 2 with 3 reserve drivers. :( Was hoping for a big turnout for this one. Too many people on the fence though, I cant set this up with a solid line up either way. I expected Burr and Akmuq to respond to me by now as well. Anyone know if they're away or something? I could pretty much guarentee they would be definates. Maybe I'll do a line up with them in mind as well. Could be a long day figuring this out! :lol:


Also, he hasnt registered yet because he is unsure where to come etc, but my best mate irl finally bought a DFGT and GT5 about a week ago. I'll get him involved to bulk up the grid. Play nice though, he's a total noob! Haha! He's never done any online racing of any kind, however he races model cars every week and is aware of track etiquette. GT5 is a whole new ball game though, so it may take him a few weeks to get up to speed 👍 I'mm make sure he knows not to slow any of you down ;)
 
Formula one this weekend! Go travel 700miles and climb a tree or something! :lol: Would be great to see a photo someone I know has taken of an F1 car!! :P

Lol. No thank you.
I've only got the camera 2 months ago and had my first experience shooting race cars in movement :scared:, so until I'm better at that I won't go that far for photo shooting. :)
 
With regards to letting everyone know their position and car in the meet this weekend, I still have 11 unconfirmed messages pending.


Sorry, I thought you said in your message to ignore it if I didn't want to attend? Anyway, just to let you know that I really don't like the race cars in GT5 or the original tracks, so I'm not up for it.
 
:lol:

Just sent you a PM as well! :P No worries then mate. All I meant by unconfirmed messages is that the people I'm waiting on havent even read the message yet. Most I know probably wont come, but I did think Burr and Akmuq would be up for this.


Hey ho 👍
 
This sunday!!!? Ohhhh Noooooooes!!!! I didnt even realise! :(


Dammit. Concours traditionally runs an hour later for top gear when its on, but I didnt realise it was back.

Should probably leave the schedule as it is this week though, iPlayer wont go anywhere ;) Infact it may even be up by the time we finish racing :D


From next weekend onwards however, Concours will be held at 9pm (BST).
 
: IMPORTANT INFORMATION :​


Random cars have been selected for all participants. Please see the list below to find out which car you have been given. Please also note new setup criteria for individual cars further down in this post. Thank you.


BlaqueJacques: Lexus BANDAI DIREZZA
Cpt Disaster: Lexus PETRONAS TOM’S
Crispy74: Lexus PETRONAS TOM’S
DOUQA: Lexus BANDAI DIREZZA
KamyKaze1098: Lexus DENSO DUNLOP SARD
paginas: Lexus DENSO DUNLOP SARD
RalliArt/////: Lexus PETRONAS TOM’S
Shin_Roh: Lexus BANDAI DIREZZA
weescotman: Lexus ENEOS



Reserves

Dragonistic: Lexus ENEOS
Talon: Lexus ENEOS
Rotorist: Lexus DENSO DUNLOP SARD





sc430current.png





Scheduled Event: Sunday 26th 8pm (BST)
Track: Suzuka Cicuit [-] Tokyo R246 / Reverse [-] Fuji Speedway F [-]

Car: Lexus BANDAI DIREZZA SC430 (SUPER GT) ‘06
Tyres: Racing Hard
Aero Parts: Downforce 35/60
Tuning Parts: Not Allowed
Settings: Power Restrictor @ 98.6%
Traction Control: Optional
Brake Bias: Optional
ABS: Optional
Pit Stop: Mandatory

Car: Lexus DENSO DUNLOP SARD SC430 (SUPER GT) ‘08
Tyres: Racing Hard
Aero Parts: Downforce 35/60
Tuning Parts: Not Allowed
Settings: Power Restrictor @ 98%
Traction Control: Optional
Brake Bias: Optional
ABS: Optional
Pit Stop: Mandatory

Car: Lexus PETRONAS TOM’S SC430 (SUPER GT) ‘08
Tyres: Racing Hard
Aero Parts: Downforce 35/60
Tuning Parts: Not Allowed
Settings: Power Restrictor @ 98%
Traction Control: Optional
Brake Bias: Optional
ABS: Optional
Pit Stop: Mandatory

Car: Lexus ENEOS SC430 (SUPER GT) ‘08
Tyres: Racing Hard
Aero Parts: Downforce 40/65
Tuning Parts: Not Allowed
Settings: Power Restrictor @ 100%
Traction Control: Optional
Brake Bias: Optional
ABS: Optional
Pit Stop: Mandatory
 
SWEET! i think im going to be using the DENSO DUNLOP in the WSGTC series so it should be 2nd nature for me to drive it hehe :D

Plus it must be fate as i was thinking of using the Supra but now its calling for me hahaha

So the teams are same car i guess yea?
 
So the teams are same car i guess yea?


No mate. The teams will remain secret until saturday or even sunday.

There are a few iterations as I still dont know for sure if certain people are going to commit or show up on the night. I'll have to do a quick shuffle once I'm 100%. Most outcomes are planned for though. Even if its in the lobby, will only take me a second to look at my spreadsheet 👍
 
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