Dear PD, please bring GT7 back to DAY 1 physics and ffb

[Pigems]

Whats is wierd, the ps4 version of gt7 had a better response in terms of tire feedback and stronger rumble then the ps5 version.

yes up to patch 1.13 was all more or less good but since then they messed it up.
Hopefully the new patch brings back the goods for FFB and haptik feedback on dualsense 🙏

Pads don’t have FFB dude, only a wheel does. The joystick doesn’t push back against your thumb, so no FFB on a Pad, at all.

 

[RacinLei]

I know thx. Is corrected. Im not so selffish and exclude the wheel user 😉

 

[Magog]

They are changing the physics yet again so I'm sure it will be 50% praise and 50% complaints as usual.

 

[Pigems]

I know thx. Is corrected. Im not so selffish and exclude the wheel user 😉

It’s not about excluding anyone, Pad just don’t have FFB at all. Sure, they rumble, but that’s likely just the same signal that the bass shaker in a TGT gets, not the FFB signal. If the joysticks pushed back under cornering load, that would be FFB, but the run I long isn’t.

 

[RacinLei]

It’s not about excluding anyone, Pad just don’t have FFB at all. Sure, they rumble, but that’s likely just the same signal that the bass shaker in a TGT gets, not the FFB signal. If the joysticks pushed back under cornering load, that would be FFB, but the run I long isn’t.

I know, i corrected it 😉

 

[MidnightRun85]

They are changing the physics yet again so I'm sure it will be 50% praise and 50% complaints as usual.

And by the sounds of things they're making it easier. "Increased stability" reads to me as "making things easier" for everyone. I actually enjoy having to drive as if hitting a curb has a noticeable effect and aquaplaning were a real hazard. From the leaked patch notes it sounds more like they're rolling back to GT6-style physics. But hopefully not!

 

[Pigems]

I wonder how much faster the new demo/reference laps will be, compared to the original ones? Has anyone screen shotted, or written down the original CE lap times from the demo laps?

 

[AutumnalGlow]

Pads don’t have FFB dude, only a wheel does. The joystick doesn’t push back against your thumb, so no FFB on a Pad, at all.

The stick may not, but what about the PS5's triggers?

 

[Pigems]

The stick may not, but what about the PS5's triggers?

How is that force feedback? It’s just rumbling and such. It’s not the buttons forcing themselves to do anything, or pushing back against your finger on their own.

 

[Theufcveteran]

How is that force feedback? It’s just rumbling and such. It’s not the buttons forcing themselves to do anything, or pushing back against your finger on their own.

Actually, they do push back. They will bounce back and forth when the brakes are locked, or when there’s a loss of traction.

 

[ShiftingGears]

There's even less FFB through the wheel now, how do PD keep making this game worse lmao

 

[Boxster]

I wonder how much faster the new demo/reference laps will be, compared to the original ones? Has anyone screen shotted, or written down the original CE lap times from the demo laps?

Nurburgring is 1 sec faster for gold now.

 

[Goldin]

There's even less FFB through the wheel now, how do PD keep making this game worse lmao

Not sure what are you talking about, on T300 is noticeable stronger on 4-1 setting.

 

[ShiftingGears]

Not sure what are you talking about, on T300 is noticeable stronger on 4-1 setting.

On DD pro there's no feel until the wheels are scrubbing

 

[Ryan Dungey]

On DD pro there's no feel until the wheels are scrubbing

Must be to do with what settings your using? Watching stream of someone using the DD pro they were saying there is significantly more detail and weight

 

[Pigems]

Actually, they do push back. They will bounce back and forth when the brakes are locked, or when there’s a loss of traction.

Except pedals don’t give FFB, so whatever the triggers are doing, isn’t FFB. The wheel(or joystick) moving itself left/right on its own, is the only FFB the game give you. Anything else is just feedback, or something else, and is completely unrelated to, and isn’t, Force FeedBack.

Must be to do with what settings your using? Watching stream of someone using the DD pro they were saying there is significantly more detail and weight

iRacing has noticeably better FFB right now, and it’s not known for having “good” FFB.

Nurburgring is 1 sec faster for gold now.

I’m very surprised it’s only 1s, I took a screen shot of every full lap gold time last night, to compare today after work.



To the FFB guy.

So basically, if your on a pad, you don’t get FFB, at all, and really have no business in an FFB convo, unless your are, or have, used a wheel under the current update that we are talking about.

 

[Abu_Azrael613]

Not sure what are you talking about, on T300 is noticeable stronger on 4-1 setting.

How much of an increase would you say you're noticing?

 

[Pigems]

Actually, they do push back. They will bounce back and forth when the brakes are locked, or when there’s a loss of traction.

Force FeedBack comes from the steering wheel(or if the joystick pushed back) only, not from any other control input, period. So if the joystick doesn’t push back, there is no FFB, period. Pedals don’t push back, in a real car, so any feedback added to the triggers just just there to help pad players, but it’s not Force Feed Back, at all. It’s just some other type of feedback. You can debate it until the end of time, and you will still be wrong.

 

[Goldin]

How much of an increase would you say you're noticing?

I would say that is now on 4-1 is slightly stronger than on 5-1 yesterday.
You can even run on 3-1 with race cars (GR2,GR3) and get enough feedback.

I was running last month with 5-1, and would sometimes switch to 4-1 when grinding with high downforce cars.

 

[Abu_Azrael613]

I would say that is now on 4-1 is slightly stronger than on 5-1 yesterday.
You can even run on 3-1 with race cars (GR2,GR3) and get enough feedback.

I was running last month with 5-1, and would sometimes switch to 4-1 when grinding with high downforce cars.

Ok good news, i usually run between 5-2 or 4-2 with my T300. Do you have an upgraded fan also? How is the quality of the feedback, do you feel any more details/vibration?

 

[aguia]

Were you the ones who ordered a Cappuccino? So, send it back and order an Expresso.

 

[Artremis]

Force FeedBack comes from the steering wheel(or if the joystick pushed back) only, not from any other control input, period. So if the joystick doesn’t push back, there is no FFB period. Pedals don’t push back, in a real car, so any feedback added to the triggers just just there to help pad players, but it’s not Force Feed Back, at all. It’s just some other type of feedback. You can debate it until the end of time, and you will still be wrong.

Force Feedback is not limited to steering wheels or racing games at all. Force Feedback is any form of feedback that offers physical resistance to the input method a player might be using, which accurately describes the DualSense's triggers.

Also, if we're talking about "fake" FFB adding details that wouldn't exist in real life, the same is true for wheels which compensate the lack of feedback you would feel by sitting in a car by offering "fake" feedback that you wouldn't feel in real life. The entire idea of being able to modify FFB is "fake" on itself.

 

[Theufcveteran]

Force FeedBack comes from the steering wheel(or if the joystick pushed back) only, not from any other control input, period. So if the joystick doesn’t push back, there is no FFB, period. Pedals don’t push back, in a real car, so any feedback added to the triggers just just there to help pad players, but it’s not Force Feed Back, at all. It’s just some other type of feedback. You can debate it until the end of time, and you will still be wrong.

Okay, maybe it’s not force feedback, but regarding your previous post, the triggers are pushing back. They’re resisting, bouncing back and forth in little amounts, up and down. Maybe it’s not FFB, but it’s more than standard vibration.

 

[Pigems]

Okay, maybe it’s not force feedback, but regarding your previous post, the triggers are pushing back. They’re resisting, bouncing back and forth in little amounts, up and down. Maybe it’s not FFB, but it’s more than standard vibration.

My pedals push back too, because they are spring loaded, just like a trigger. Basically, the wheel is reacting to digital signals from the console/game, and giving feedback based on that data, forcing itself into the position that the game thinks it should be in at any time. No other feedback works like that, you may get a rumble, or some haptics, but they are output only, unlike a wheel where you can actually give back inputs, based on the FFB output the whee is giving you. Triggers aren’t reacting to game signals, and pushing back on your finger beaded on those signals, they may stiffen up, or rumble, but that’s not FFB, it’s just vibrations, like a bass shaker, in the base of a TGT, not the wheel itself.

 

[snc]

Watched Kie stream testing new update, quite possitive, ff is little stronger, physics according to Kie more realistic now.

 

[Artremis]

My pedals push back too, because they are spring loaded, just like a trigger. Basically, the wheel is reacting to digital signals from the console/game, and giving feedback based on that data, forcing itself into the position that the game thinks it should be in at any time. No other feedback works like that, you may get a rumble, or some haptics, but they are output only, unlike a wheel where you can actually give back inputs, based on the FFB output the whee is giving you. Triggers aren’t reacting to game signals, and pushing back on your finger beaded on those signals, they may stiffen up, or rumble, but that’s not FFB, it’s just vibrations, like a bass shaker, in the base of a TGT, not the wheel itself.

That is quite literally what the gear-driven system in the DualSense triggers does. They have no rumble or haptics motor (unlike an Xbox controller, for example), it's all done through the force feedback dynamically adjusting the resistance of the trigger to achieve the effect. It's how you can have it simulate a gun trigger, it will offer no resistance until you reach a middle point where the resistance increases sharply, and once you push it past the resistance point it can even go back to offering no resistance to give a punchier feeling.

For the sake of the argument, it's true that the DualSense's FFB is unidirectional, as it can't push itself down, only upwards. This doesn't mean it's not force feedback, and especially not in a racing game where there would be no reason for the pedals to go down on their own.

 

[Pigems]

That is quite literally what the gear-driven system in the DualSense triggers does. They have no rumble or haptics motor (unlike an Xbox controller, for example), it's all done through the force feedback dynamically adjusting the resistance of the trigger to achieve the effect. It's how you can have it simulate a gun trigger, it will offer no resistance until you reach a middle point where the resistance increases sharply, and once you push it past the resistance point it can even go back to offering no resistance to give a punchier feeling.

For the sake of the argument, it's true that the DualSense's FFB is unidirectional, as it can't push itself down, only upwards. This doesn't mean it's not force feedback, and especially not in a racing game where there would be no reason for the pedals to go down on their own.

Think about it this way, if a wheel doesn’t come with an electric motor, to power the wheel and give it FFB, it’s said the wheel “Does Not” have FFB( like a TM T80, spring loaded only). So if the trigger can’t fully move on its own, based on what the cars is doing on screen, it’s can’t really be FFB, because it can’t move fully on its own.

 

[Artremis]

Think about it this way, if a wheel doesn’t come with an electric motor, to power the wheel and give it FFB, it’s said the wheel “Does Not” have FFB( like a TM T80, spring loaded only). So if the trigger can’t fully move on its own, based on what the cars is doing on screen, it’s can’t really be FFB, because it can’t move fully on its own.

The trigger dynamically adjusts its force to deliver feedback in the game. The reason why wheels are able to move on their own is because they have enough force to do so, but the principle behind itis the same. If it's not force feedback, what would you call it? There is no haptic vibrations going on, there is not a rumble motor, there is a gear and a spring that can dynamically apply different levels of force to the player to offer feedback for a game they're playing.

Hell, if we go to the Wikipedia page of the Dualsense:

The analog triggers now have a force feedback mechanism, allowing the controller to provide varying levels of resistance to the user depending on in-game actions. An example provided by Sony is being able to feel the tension of a bow string as the user pulls the trigger

 

[Pigems]

The trigger dynamically adjusts its force to deliver feedback in the game. The reason why wheels are able to move on their own is because they have enough force to do so, but the principle behind itis the same. If it's not force feedback, what would you call it? There is no haptic vibrations going on, there is not a rumble motor, there is a gear and a spring that can dynamically apply different levels of force to the player to offer feedback for a game they're playing.

Hell, if we go to the Wikipedia page of the Dualsense:

I’d call it a sales pitch, and not something useful to going fast. As far as I know, the faster guys turn it off anyways. So it can’t be that great, or useful.

 

[ShiftingGears]

Must be to do with what settings your using? Watching stream of someone using the DD pro they were saying there is significantly more detail and weight

I will have to tweak the settings but three other people I've personally spoken to have had similar feedback and in fact there are people in the top 10 in the new Alphard time trial that used a DualSense controller because the wheel is slower.