Fanatec Announcements: CSW V2 Reviews Out

[Mr Latte]

BTW.. I still have it in my garage as UPS are collecting on Monday

Exactly why I mentioned previously you didnt go out and test FM4 with the wheel. You made yet another excuse instead that the game wasnt released. Err you still had the wheel and sometime before your holidays. From a review perspective having the official FM4 wheel, one of the first in the UK might I add and not testing it on the actual FM4 game, man that was doh!

Again, others would of been so eager to try the game and the wheel together.
Oh but lets not criticise your lack of effort any further.

Back to the topic of products!

 

[amf7]

However as soon as I finished I was told.to box it and get ready to ship it back however for some reason their was a mistake with my labels as I didn't receive them until this morning

 

[thehawk05]

I read that replacement rims will likely also be offered for the CSR Elite wheel. Is there any news or rumors as to what these rims will be and if they will be available at release or not.

Thomas did an interview on ISR awhile back when the CSR E was introduced. The base is set up that swapping wheels will be an option but it will be limited compared to the CSW just because the CSR E is aimed at the console/PC market and consoles limit what they can do button wise. They could and likely will offer an F1 inspired wheel and perhaps a GT style but whether they will be available at launch is anyone's guess. The CSR E can't use any of the CSW wheels though as the mounting system is completely different (shaft with an index tab and set screws vs quick release hub) and the plug system is different as well (CSR E uses a wired plugs inside the shaft whereas the CSW has a built in hot plug design)

Belt might be also better with new wheels. And also the fact that you can tighten the belt if needed.

Belt is the same as the older Porsche wheels (I've had my CSR open) You can't tighten the belt on a CSR either......you're thinking of the CSR Elite.

 

[Mr Latte]

Amf, we have went far enough off course (again)....

 

[Richvw]

My quick comparison between CSR and PWTS.
Owned my PWTS for approx 18 months, running 660 firmware, no settings for dea, lin, spr or dpr. Reason I’m on 660 is that it came with that installed ( if it aint broke, don't fix it attitude )

First, the rim on the CSR was too thin for me, the grip area could have been a bit chunkier, good design though, the PWTS is a good bit thicker, which I prefer.

The CSR felt too soft on turning, even with spr and dpr on max, my PWTS feels like I am actually steering, with some resistance. The CSR felt too light for me.

I was running with 100% ffb on CSR with Forza 4, which is comparable with about 40-50% on my PWTS. I read that upgrading the firmware on the PWTS weakened ffb effects ( another reason for me not to upgrade firmware )

The abs rumble works on both wheels on all platforms using Clubsport pedals, the rumble effect felt the same on both.

One very strange thing on engine revs rumble with CSR, my friend ( using exactly the same wheel/game settings on Forza 4 ) gets no rumble effect, whereas I do ( another game glitch perhaps )

After trying many various settings, I decided to sell the CSR to my friend.
He was using the Microsoft wheel, so this was a major upgrade for him, and he loves it. When I visit him, he now drives with a permanent smile on his face, but I think that I get a better driving experience with my PWTS, so we are both happy.

I will be buying the CSR Elite, with 2 ffb motors, I am hoping for a better feel. I just hope it doesn't feel as soft as the CSR.

Anyway, each to their own, that’s just my opinion, happy driving.

 

[amf7]

Definitely light but I enjoyed that as I was quicker

 

[Richvw]

Definitely light but I enjoyed that as I was quicker

I felt that I was over compinsating steering input with the lighter feel, which given more time, I may have gotten used to.

 

[Symtex]

I got all my gear yesterday (CSR + Csr elite + CSR Shifter). It took some fiddling to get it fit on the Wheel Stand pro but it's secure now. I need more driving miles with the gear before even attempt to make comments on the gear. One thing is for sure. Braking is a total different experience and will take time to get acquainted to.

 

[Mr Latte]

I felt that I was over compinsating steering input with the lighter feel, which given more time, I may have gotten used to.

Rich thats a great ommission really. Rims will always be personal choice, I agree.

I really liked the PWTS, if anything the feel was real nice but a little hard. The weight gave it a sense of feeling substantial. The GT3/GT2 rim for me was super comfy but a little too thick or stumpy for its size.

Ive not really had a go with the CSR and its plastic top. The CSR Elite of course has the new grippy rubber.

Very much prefer the new shape though and the new button layout. For me the positioning of the start/select buttons rather than being down at the bottom of the wheel are better. Also wish they would of retained the nice lighting, well maybe on the Elite but still thats to be discussed later.

The lighter rim is noticable and I agree it takes time to adjust. With it being lighter I found with some testing it required altering your timing ever so slightly upon turn in for corners. I remember the same thing when comparing the PWTS to the G25. The extra weight of the PWTS perhaps needed an earlier or slightly quicker turning action for corners, old test on "Eiger Nordwand".

Your right it takes a length of time to re-adjust and even then you may be used or prefer what well really you feel more comfortable with.

 

[amf7]

The first time I drove with that wheel... Shown in the video I was shiz. At least 2 seconds a lap.down but towards the end of my.time I was similar on 1 lap runs but a good few seconds quicker over several laps. This was on GT5 btw

 

[Spagetti69]

When is Thomas going to add a load cell to the clutch for a super duper set of pedals?

 

[Symtex]

When is Thomas going to add a load cell to the clutch for a super duper set of pedals?

Is there a way to add a load cell for the throttle pedal?

 

[Spagetti69]

Is there a way to add a load cell for the throttle pedal?

Not sure if your asking if it can be modded? I would suppose so.

The default spring arrangement feels fine for me as a throttle though.
Throttle is operated by distance of travel anyhow not so much as pressure related.

 

[mikemav]

Is there a way to add a load cell for the throttle pedal?

Not sure that would be of any benefit, except maybe longevity-wise? I think even in real cars which operate via "drive by wire" throttle, these pedals also use potentiometers. Brake (and perhaps clutch) simulation would seem a good for some pressure/load based readings that a load cell gives but I think throttle is always based on amount of travel and not pressure on pedal as far as I know. Maybe contactless "hall" type sensors might be a better fit than load cell for throttle?

 

[jimbobclay]

I have just ordered a CSR and was wondering if anyone in the Toronto area took delivery of these and had to pay duty or any other fee when they arrive. I had them sent to my work so as not to freak out my wife with the purchase and I may not be here when they are delivered. I need to leave some money with our receptionist and was wondering how much.

Thanks in advance guys.

 

[Symtex]

I have just ordered a CSR and was wondering if anyone in the Toronto area took delivery of these and had to pay duty or any other fee when they arrive. I had them sent to my work so as not to freak out my wife with the purchase and I may not be here when they are delivered. I need to leave some money with our receptionist and was wondering how much.

Thanks in advance guys.

Yeah. I had to pay something around 28$ for duty.

 

[paskowitz]

Is there an embargo date for CSRE tester impressions? I am interested to see what people say.

 

[thehawk05]

The CSR felt too soft on turning, even with spr and dpr on max, my PWTS feels like I am actually steering, with some resistance. The CSR felt too light for me.

I was running with 100% ffb on CSR with Forza 4, which is comparable with about 40-50% on my PWTS. I read that upgrading the firmware on the PWTS weakened ffb effects ( another reason for me not to upgrade firmware )

Interesting that was your experience with it. I too own a PWTS currently running firmware 681 and I found no difference whatsoever in terms of the FFB strength between the two wheels when equal settings were used. Weird there was such a difference in your experience.

As for the firmware changing the FFB strength. Well I owned my PWTS from early on and there was no decrease in FFB strength throughout the several firmware updates. I'm curious if the people who percieved this difference accidently engaged some DR in the settings on the latter firmwares. Adding DR drops the FFB strength to make the wheel quicker to turn.

BTW.....none of my musings here are in some way trying to imply you made a mistake dumping the CSR. Comfort is a huge factor to enjoying SIMs and if the PWTS feels better for you all is good......it's not like the CSR has relegated the Porsche line to outdated junk status....they're all still very good relevant wheels.

I have just ordered a CSR and was wondering if anyone in the Toronto area took delivery of these and had to pay duty or any other fee when they arrive. I had them sent to my work so as not to freak out my wife with the purchase and I may not be here when they are delivered. I need to leave some money with our receptionist and was wondering how much.

Thanks in advance guys.

Give me a couple hours...I'll tell you exactly how much when I get home from work. It was around $40 though

 

[Symtex]

I connect the CSR wheel to my pc and used the driver test program and I find the vibration to be weak as hell. The FF is very strong. So I am wondering the following : Is my wheel stand pro dampening too much the vibration, is my wheel defective or the vibration/shock is just weak on the wheel ?

 

[Richvw]

Very much prefer the new shape though and the new button layout. For me the positioning of the start/select buttons rather than being down at the bottom of the wheel are better. Also wish they would of retained the nice lighting, well maybe on the Elite but still thats to be discussed later.

Not so keen on the shape ( GT rim + CSR Elite next for me will hopefully be the one )
Totally agree with you about the buttons, big improvement.

Interesting that was your experience with it. I too own a PWTS currently running firmware 681 and I found no difference whatsoever in terms of the FFB strength between the two wheels when equal settings were used. Weird there was such a difference in your experience.

As for the firmware changing the FFB strength. Well I owned my PWTS from early on and there was no decrease in FFB strength throughout the several firmware updates. I'm curious if the people who percieved this difference accidently engaged some DR in the settings on the latter firmwares. Adding DR drops the FFB strength to make the wheel quicker to turn.

I remember reading that after some people upgraded their firmware, they felt that they were getting less FFB strength. I've never used any other firmware version ( horror stories of things going wrong put me off ) so can't compare. But as for FFB strength, my PWTS is way stronger than the CSR was. I just hope that the CSR Elite gives me a good workout.

 

[LogiForce]

My curious mind has started wondering about the F1 rim Thomas was talking about.
Since Fanatec is now in a partnership deal with BMW I was thinking this. Would the F1 rim for the CSW be an exact replica of the upcoming Formula1 2012 car from BMW, since the wheel won't be released anyway until the new season?

 

[Dijital Majik]

Would the F1 rim for the CSW be an exact replica of the upcoming Formula1 2012 car from BMW, since the wheel won't be released anyway until the new season?

2012 BMW F1 car? There's no such thing.

It would be nice to see a Mercedes, or even better a McLaren wheel. Heck, even a fully functional generic HRT or Virgin-alike would be great, manufactuer branding isn't the end-all as long as it looks realistic.

 

[LogiForce]

2012 BMW F1 car? There's no such thing.

It would be nice to see a Mercedes, or even better a McLaren wheel. Heck, even a fully functional generic HRT or Virgin-alike would be great, manufactuer branding isn't the end-all as long as it looks realistic.

If it has to look realistic first the real thing (or the original) has to be present in order to make a copy.

But yeah, since Fanatec is German... maybe a Mercedes-Benz or a McLaren then.
I forgot BMW withdrew Although they might come back... who knows...

 

[Mr Latte]

Its going to take some time I believe to see new rims coming for the CSRE. Fanatec will be busier at present than they ever have been before with so many new products just launching.

Fanatec will Im sure want to see how well the CSRE sells and that could determine how quick or how many types of rims appear. If anything they might be best to arrange a poll for people to vote on what rim style/type should come first/next but some form of feedback from owners would likely be in their best interest?

The CSRE rim to me feels superb. I dont know how interested Id be in a F1 rim tbh. Besides it looks much nicer in person so to speak particulary the new rubber finish and black rather than silver seen at E3.

The shifter must come first though in their priorities...

 

[thehawk05]

But as for FFB strength, my PWTS is way stronger than the CSR was.

Maybe you ended up with a PWTS with a freak 550 motor! ( or perhaps a weak one in the CSR )

I went back and retested by PWTS to compare it back to back with the CSR on the Sunset track in Forza 4. I've done a lot of laps on that one and it's got some good sections that transmit varying changes in FFB depending on what the car is doing. I matched the settings between both wheels and proceeded to do 15 laps with each wheel. After the session there was some interesting things of note:

Outright strength of feedback is pretty much equal between the two when max FFB is outputted by the game. The difference is how the CSR handles FFB effects vs the PWTS. The easiest way for me to describe it is the CSR feels more refined and has more "layers" or degrees of FFB if you will. For example, no matter the situation be it heavy understeer, full throttle down a straightaway, or countersteering the PWTS always exhibits a fair amount of FFB when you try to turn the wheel. When severe understeer is encountered the PWTS still has a fair amount of FFB and when the grip comes back it immediately goes full FFB again. The CSR on the other hand will go very light when severe understeer is incountered and the FFB increase is more gradual as the car regains grip in the turn....sometimes the grip will even "snap" back into place and the FFB of the CSR transmits that. The CSR also transmits momentary losses of front grip in a turn that the PWTS just misses altogether. Having driven high performance cars on racetracks this is very much what steering actually feels like most of the time when these situations are incurred.

Another difference is countersteering. With equal settings on the wheels the PWTS feels slow to countersteer compared to the CSR and almost fights you to a degree when quick countersteering inputs are required. The CSR feels more natural and light when these situations are incurred. I didn't bother changing the tuning on the PWTS to see if that could be improved via the drift or spring settings. But given the equal settings the CSR has a clear advantage in quickness.

And not that it's the golden benchmark to judge by but after I did my 15 laps with the 911 and swapped over to the CSR I was faster by 2 seconds by my 3rd lap with the CSR and eventually topped my best time with the 911 by 2.6 seconds after all was said and done.

Also of note....the PWTS had a fair amount more of that cogging feel compared to the CSR as well. My CSR is butter smooth compared to my PWTS.

I've loved my PWTS since the day I've owned it but now that I have the CSR I'll take it over the PWTS all day, everyday. I like the refinement of the FFB a lot more and the looks and feel suit me better. It's a great wheel and IMO a step up in many facets over the Porsche designs.

Firmware notables:

PWTS - 681
CSR - 704 (beta)

 

[Richvw]

The CSRE rim to me feels superb.

So, beta testing has started then ?

 

[amf7]

I know what you mean about the loss of grip when your pushing around a track. Very satisfying though

And yes beta testing started q while ago

 

[Jump_Ace]

My firmware on the CSR is like 701 I think. Where can I get this newer 704 Firmware hawk? And does it stop that annoying high pitched sound on the 360 and save my wheel settings?

Jerome

 

[thehawk05]

My firmware on the CSR is like 701 I think. Where can I get this newer 704 Firmware hawk? And does it stop that annoying high pitched sound on the 360 and save my wheel settings?

Jerome

It's a beta firmware I've been testing for Thomas. The official firmware should be released shortly. And yes....it rids the CSR of the high pitched noise in Xbox mode.👍

I can't speak on the settings save issue as it never affected my wheel but my understanding is the firmware will fix that as well.

 

[HoiHman]

Maybe you ended up with a PWTS with a freak 550 motor! ( or perhaps a weak one in the CSR )

I went back and retested by PWTS to compare it back to back with the CSR on the Sunset track in Forza 4. I've done a lot of laps on that one and it's got some good sections that transmit varying changes in FFB depending on what the car is doing. I matched the settings between both wheels and proceeded to do 15 laps with each wheel. After the session there was some interesting things of note:

Outright strength of feedback is pretty much equal between the two when max FFB is outputted by the game. The difference is how the CSR handles FFB effects vs the PWTS. The easiest way for me to describe it is the CSR feels more refined and has more "layers" or degrees of FFB if you will. For example, no matter the situation be it heavy understeer, full throttle down a straightaway, or countersteering the PWTS always exhibits a fair amount of FFB when you try to turn the wheel. When severe understeer is encountered the PWTS still has a fair amount of FFB and when the grip comes back it immediately goes full FFB again. The CSR on the other hand will go very light when severe understeer is incountered and the FFB increase is more gradual as the car regains grip in the turn....sometimes the grip will even "snap" back into place and the FFB of the CSR transmits that. The CSR also transmits momentary losses of front grip in a turn that the PWTS just misses altogether. Having driven high performance cars on racetracks this is very much what steering actually feels like most of the time when these situations are incurred.

Another difference is countersteering. With equal settings on the wheels the PWTS feels slow to countersteer compared to the CSR and almost fights you to a degree when quick countersteering inputs are required. The CSR feels more natural and light when these situations are incurred. I didn't bother changing the tuning on the PWTS to see if that could be improved via the drift or spring settings. But given the equal settings the CSR has a clear advantage in quickness.

And not that it's the golden benchmark to judge by but after I did my 15 laps with the 911 and swapped over to the CSR I was faster by 2 seconds by my 3rd lap with the CSR and eventually topped my best time with the 911 by 2.6 seconds after all was said and done.

Also of note....the PWTS had a fair amount more of that cogging feel compared to the CSR as well. My CSR is butter smooth compared to my PWTS.

I've loved my PWTS since the day I've owned it but now that I have the CSR I'll take it over the PWTS all day, everyday. I like the refinement of the FFB a lot more and the looks and feel suit me better. It's a great wheel and IMO a step up in many facets over the Porsche designs.

Firmware notables:

PWTS - 681
CSR - 704 (beta)

Yesterday i hooked up my (old) PWTS to see how is, compared with the CSR.

I could not agree with you more.

Since i'm planning to sell my CSR as soon as the CSR Elite comes available, i thought maybe i sell it now and use the PWTS untill i have the CSR Elite.

But the difference in the two wheels is so big, that i'm not thinking about selling my CSR untill i have a confermed pre-order of the CSR Elite.

@Thomas : The waiting for the firmware is killing me !!!