Gran Turismo 7 Physics
- Thread starter Shingo_civic
- 6,193 comments
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- 4,716
- Indiana
- CWM_Spirit
Most of it has been a financial barrier. I started my sophomore year of high school and graduated from university last winter. I’ve recently landed a well paying position but I still have other large purchases I need to make & find a good place to keep a wheel setup. My current living space isn’t very accommodating.
- 1,925
- United States
The only thing he has said about the handling I have seen is in the GTplanet interview.
"In terms of physics, of course, it is something in the game that we have been evolving for the last 25 years. In GT7, I think you’ll find the precision has increased. I also think you’ll feel it to be more natural, even more-so than in GT Sport,” he explained.
Yamauchi also revealed that some of the best Gran Turismo players in the world have helped Polyphony Digital to help refine the physics engine in GT7. “Now we have new people like Igor Fraga and Mikail Hizal joining the family. We have feedback from them that has been very useful in tuning that.”
Silver Arrows
(Banned)
- 4,715
- Brandon, MB
- Silver-Arrows21
This thread, and some people trying to segregate and bash people who play sims with controllers, really just goes to show how utterly pointless it is on this forum, and really any other sim racing forum, to talk about pad controls in any regard.
- 735
- Maryland, USA
Hope this is true. Got on GT5 last night, and drove a stock BMW 2002 Turbo around the Nordschleife with Comfort Soft tires. Felt extremely direct, and the weight transfer physics were really predictable and believable. You could hold slides right where you wanted to, and correct the car exactly the way you wanted it. The car had very little grip, but it was predictable and had lots of feeling. Very natural. (even with the terrible DS3 controller). This is by far my favorite physics to be featured in a GT game, because cars are just so enjoyable and addictive to drive, because its believable. Maybe not necessarily realistic, but it just makes sense in the way it feels, looks, and responds to inputs.
I then hopped on GT Sport later in the night with a PS5 controller in a BMW E30, with the same tires to compare. The best way I can describe GT Sports handling, is that it feels like an Elephant is sitting on the hood of the car at all times to give your front tires way more control than they would irl. The steering is just way too touchy, doesn't feel like you are even controlling a 2500lb car. It's like you are driving on a planet with very little gravity. If you steer a direction on GT Sport, the car will start steering instantly and the weight will start transferring with barely any resistance after you do the inputs. Before even the steering animation gets shown, it looks and feels so odd. Doesn't help the weight transfer is extremely unrealistic in GT Sport to boot.
This clip of a Camaro weaving at around 20MPH is the best way I can show what I'm talking about. I'm happy Kazunori describes GT7's new physics as 'more natural', because that's not in anyway how I would describe the physics in its current state on GT Sport. It's a step forwards, and two steps back from what we had in GT5.
- 963
- United Kingdom
- 5,300
- Tijuana, B.C.
- MRT_Cinnamon
Nothing bad with wanting GT getting the behavior of its cars more in line to what we see in real life, it should be possible without getting to the depths of simulation like iRacing or ACC
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- 5,645
- Edison NJ
- jdmking13
- Lucid killer 58
I mean for a game being on a console and having to appease a wide audience I think the GT series is doing a good job. Anytime I go from playing Ac, Acc back to GTS I am please where GT is. Beside the feedback I think GTS is not crazy far off from both games. The feedback is the most lacking but I’m actually cool with GTS feedback. If the feedback registered the bumps on the track especially on the straights it would be much better. AC and ACC are also a lot less forgiving.. when you make a mistake you will pay the price a lot more in those games compare to GTS.
- 1,279
- Melbourne
- Nicky-Boy_7
Yeah, the main improvement for me would be transfer of road detail to the controller wheel.
Bung in a whole lot of that bumpiness and it'll feel like we're most of the way there to ACC... for most peeps, I reckon.
Bung in a whole lot of that bumpiness and it'll feel like we're most of the way there to ACC... for most peeps, I reckon.
- 2,323
- United States
I've been lurking on this thread for a while now and, quite frankly, the level of arguments and fanboyism is totally off the charts. These kinds of "discussions" don't do anyone any favors.
For the record, I am pushing 50, have had the luxury of track days and driving high performance cars, and have been gaming since 1979. I have played most car games released in the last four decades, be it "arcade", "simcade" or "sim". I am not an expert on vehicle dynamics nor do I consider myself an authority on judging how authentic this or that car game is. I do, however, know what a car feels like to drive on and near the limit both on track and on gravel. My all-time favorite sim is Assetto Corsa Competizione. It's an incredible game in my opinion. No, I haven't driven GT3 or GT4 cars. It just feels "right". Setup changes have expected effects over all climate possibilities. The ABS and TC seem to be well implemented. Real racers have said this. That's fine. I don't have to believe them. But I personally feel the same. IMO <--- very important!
I have been with Gran Turismo since 1997 when I picked up a copy during a visit to Japan. I loved it, and I have always loved the GTs over the past nearly 25 years. The first GTs were ahead of their time in the physics department. But in the last few years PD falling behind so much in the physics department is inexcusable. @Scaff and many others have pointed out the many flaws that Gran Turismo still drags onto the screen today after so many years.
That said, I love GT Sport despite it being below my standards for a "sim". Why? Because it is still intuitive enough to enjoy. The physics are basic yet somewhat realistic. The FFB is lacking but enough to keep me there. It's no ACC but you see, I love racing online, and I am NOT a fan of iRacing. At all. And I have learned over the years that participating in professional leagues on the "real" simulators becomes a part-time job. And I don't have time for that. GT Sport and its online matchmaking and FIA championships are the best online racing I have ever experienced. I hope they keep it up.
Everyone needs to understand that PD will not (or doesn't even have the capacity to) model aerodynamics, traction control, ABS, dampers, suspensions, tire contact patches, tire pressures, etc... for 500 cars. I really don't think any developer could ever do that. Hence the varying quality of mods in the more popular PC sims. But what I will say is that PD's modeling of ABS, braking in general and traction control are horrendous (beyond the hideous FWD and MR handling). I can deal with the simplified physics and dynamic model. And I enjoy the driving because for the most part the cars behave intuitively enough that I can apply my skills in the same way I do in ACC. But what absolutely has to be improved is braking and TC. The fact that 0 TC on GT3 cars is a masochistic exercise in throttle modulation, TC 1 does nothing, and TC2 just bogs the car down, is at this point in time inexcusable. Ditto the laughable simulation of braking.
I am sure I will enjoy GT7 for what it is. And I am not bashing the game for what it is. But those are the things that need desperate tweaking, and they are issues that won't even make the game "harder" for "casual" racers. GT3 cars should not be easier to drive in ACC than they are in GTS. And that's where my main gripe comes from. I don't need GT to be "The Real Driving Simulator". I have ACC for that. However, PD would do a great service to themselves and the racing community if they could at least improve the ABS and TC system.
For the record, I am pushing 50, have had the luxury of track days and driving high performance cars, and have been gaming since 1979. I have played most car games released in the last four decades, be it "arcade", "simcade" or "sim". I am not an expert on vehicle dynamics nor do I consider myself an authority on judging how authentic this or that car game is. I do, however, know what a car feels like to drive on and near the limit both on track and on gravel. My all-time favorite sim is Assetto Corsa Competizione. It's an incredible game in my opinion. No, I haven't driven GT3 or GT4 cars. It just feels "right". Setup changes have expected effects over all climate possibilities. The ABS and TC seem to be well implemented. Real racers have said this. That's fine. I don't have to believe them. But I personally feel the same. IMO <--- very important!
I have been with Gran Turismo since 1997 when I picked up a copy during a visit to Japan. I loved it, and I have always loved the GTs over the past nearly 25 years. The first GTs were ahead of their time in the physics department. But in the last few years PD falling behind so much in the physics department is inexcusable. @Scaff and many others have pointed out the many flaws that Gran Turismo still drags onto the screen today after so many years.
That said, I love GT Sport despite it being below my standards for a "sim". Why? Because it is still intuitive enough to enjoy. The physics are basic yet somewhat realistic. The FFB is lacking but enough to keep me there. It's no ACC but you see, I love racing online, and I am NOT a fan of iRacing. At all. And I have learned over the years that participating in professional leagues on the "real" simulators becomes a part-time job. And I don't have time for that. GT Sport and its online matchmaking and FIA championships are the best online racing I have ever experienced. I hope they keep it up.
Everyone needs to understand that PD will not (or doesn't even have the capacity to) model aerodynamics, traction control, ABS, dampers, suspensions, tire contact patches, tire pressures, etc... for 500 cars. I really don't think any developer could ever do that. Hence the varying quality of mods in the more popular PC sims. But what I will say is that PD's modeling of ABS, braking in general and traction control are horrendous (beyond the hideous FWD and MR handling). I can deal with the simplified physics and dynamic model. And I enjoy the driving because for the most part the cars behave intuitively enough that I can apply my skills in the same way I do in ACC. But what absolutely has to be improved is braking and TC. The fact that 0 TC on GT3 cars is a masochistic exercise in throttle modulation, TC 1 does nothing, and TC2 just bogs the car down, is at this point in time inexcusable. Ditto the laughable simulation of braking.
I am sure I will enjoy GT7 for what it is. And I am not bashing the game for what it is. But those are the things that need desperate tweaking, and they are issues that won't even make the game "harder" for "casual" racers. GT3 cars should not be easier to drive in ACC than they are in GTS. And that's where my main gripe comes from. I don't need GT to be "The Real Driving Simulator". I have ACC for that. However, PD would do a great service to themselves and the racing community if they could at least improve the ABS and TC system.
- 1,279
- Melbourne
- Nicky-Boy_7
Well-said mate, and I tend to agree.
However, the first thing I notice (it hits me in the face), when I switch from ACC to GT6 (skipped PS4 'cause it didn't have a full GT title), is the lack of road detail.
This is why I said what I said earlier. The initial impression is like being on a rally stage when the road switches from roughish dirt to ice. As a long-time, die-hard GT fan, this is embarrassing to me.
However, the first thing I notice (it hits me in the face), when I switch from ACC to GT6 (skipped PS4 'cause it didn't have a full GT title), is the lack of road detail.
This is why I said what I said earlier. The initial impression is like being on a rally stage when the road switches from roughish dirt to ice. As a long-time, die-hard GT fan, this is embarrassing to me.
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- 1,925
- United States
Pretty odd to be embarrassed by the state of GT when you haven't even played the latest game and are playing on 15 year old hardware.
- 1,279
- Melbourne
- Nicky-Boy_7
I'm only 1 game behind mate and have played it for 9 years so know it intimately.
If GTS had taken the leap necessary from GT6 in order for that smooth-road contrast to not be so glaringly-obvious that a severe case of peripheral neuropathy couldn't miss it in its sleep, I'm sure I would've heard about it 'cause I've followed GTS' progress from day dot here.
Not complaining. Just saying I'm hoping for a vast improvement in road detail. I'm guessing that data's already there from the scans but hasn't been allowed to make it to the controller in all its glory. Far from it.
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- 444
- Sweden
Once again, what's the point of feeling "road detail"? Is it to enhance "realism" and make the experience more immersive, or is it needed to improve performance? Through my wheel in GTS, I get all the road detail I need to know how to manipulate my steering, throttle and brake. If the FFB feels smooth and heavy through a corner, I know that there's 100% grip since there's no bumps. When there's bumps, the wheel flickers with lightness and I need to anticipate and be more careful. I'm not sure I'd appreciate constant buzz, rumble or whatever. Especially if I had to play on a gamepad, I would only like rumble when I need to back off from throttle/brake or counter-steer - otherwise those signals would drown in "pointless" buzz.
- 1,279
- Melbourne
- Nicky-Boy_7
You said it mate - realism, more-immersive.
It can of course affect performance too. If you have to feather it over tiny bumps that weren't perceptible previously, this would make for a more-interesting driving experience, surely.
If said bumps were rendered and transferred to the wheel as per GT6 (all I have to go on), track performance would be more-unrealistic, the driving experience more-boring and any dosh you spent on a DD wheel or another substantial investment more-pointless.
It can of course affect performance too. If you have to feather it over tiny bumps that weren't perceptible previously, this would make for a more-interesting driving experience, surely.
If said bumps were rendered and transferred to the wheel as per GT6 (all I have to go on), track performance would be more-unrealistic, the driving experience more-boring and any dosh you spent on a DD wheel or another substantial investment more-pointless.
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- 5,645
- Edison NJ
- jdmking13
- Lucid killer 58
Not for nothing bro but the driving in GTS is way better IMO than GT6 it’s a shame you haven’t given it a try I think you would like it.
- 3,359
- California
- PumpinNumbies
To be fair, if my memory serves, PD or Kaz went out of their way to create that stigma. They were asked point blank why they named it GTSport instead of GT7 and they said it was a different game or something. They started backpedaling shortly after because of how negative the reaction was, and as we can see in GT7 they're clearly going back to the collector, tuner, style game.
In fact, that the decision to name the new one GT7 not GT8, really drives home the point that GTSport was never a part of the Legacy Series in their eyes.
Don't get me wrong, I was a big fan of GTSport, I actually think 6 sucked, and 5 was my favorite. I don't care about offline racing, individual part tuning seems futile, and collecting garbage cars from a used car dealer that is time gated annoys me. Sport was significantly more up my alley, but that's kind of the overall point. Sport was a step in a new direction and was not a continuation of the original GT series.
That's why the stigma exists. Personally I don't care whether people call it real or not, the playing experience was 100% a Gran Turismo game, and people's offline comments have no effect on the in game play.
The entire world knows that gaming has evolved to online or die. PD tried to follow that trend and it seemed to have disrupted their playerbase. They're blatantly trying to turn back the clock, but without abandoning the future of gaming, so instead of splitting their fan base, they will cater to both this time around.
Just my .02
- 1,925
- United States
Online is where a lot of companies went chasing profits but most of Playstation Studios best selling and most successful PS4 games were primarily single player.
- 1,279
- Melbourne
- Nicky-Boy_7
- 963
- United Kingdom
The moment that GT goes full hardcore sim is the moment it burns off the majority potential users/players.
The "entry-level" physics are part of the ease of accessibility which one of the main reasons why the series has been successful. You really think all 9.5million users (estimate from Feb 2021) are all hardcore sim racing enthusiasts? Don't let the echo-chambers fool you into thinking it's a majority.
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- 5,645
- Edison NJ
- jdmking13
- Lucid killer 58
The funny thing is you feel just as much surface with the controller compared to the wheel. I like GTS on the controller, prob one of the best in all the games. I really was competitive online in sports mode with a controller. The PS5 controller feels even better IMO with the inputs smoothness and vibration you get. I said it before I think GT7 with the PS5 controller is going to great for pad users I can’t wait to try it!
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- 16,062
- Melbourne
- ScottPuss20
- CheetahsMeow
Oh boy. This is soo wrong on soo many levels and I simply cannot understand how you've come to these conclusions. Not all controller users are erratic and not all of them cause crashes. Do you honestly believe that all wheel users are clean drivers? I've raced against some pretty bad wheel users in my time and beaten them! I've been praised for my abilities on a controller despite the fact that I'm disabled, so what you're saying is totally false and laughable.
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