GT7 Daily Race Discussion

[hyperspeed980]

My hands are still shanking

Must be a citizen of the UK.

 

[rAtey]

Oof, this week is painful. I'm starting midpack at B mostly around 6-8 with a 1.25.5. I don't really like qualifying so when I set a relatively fast time for me I just stop. The sheer incompetence of the most low B drivers is infuriating. My racepace is usually slightly faster than place 6-8. Whenever I am behind someone in the slipstream I always brake a little bit early. However.... all other drivers seem to think thats unnecessary and use my car as a brake and spin me out. Last 5 races I have been spun out in the first lap, because people just dont know how to race. "Oh you cover the inside? I am still going to take it by punting you out!" is most common practice in low B/S. This is killing my mood to be honest. I wouldn't mind if someone apologised or give the place back, but they always continue as if they made a fair pass. In their minds they must be the greatest player of all times. I am having a hard time not returning the favor when I inevitably catch up with them (These people are always in the last few spots when I catch up).
I would really love a race D where you just get 10 minutes to qualify, so all the "I had a good 1 lap out of my 200 laps" people just start last.

Hopefully the kids are in bed when I will do some races late in the evening.

 

[Cerebral303]

I had a fun race last night at Road Atlanta Race B in a group of drivers ranked from DR A-E all in the same race, and with varying SR too. Ended up 6th which is higher than I should given that I'm a D level driver. Nice when things come together. This has been the race for me this week.

Race A is quite fun too though, just need a little restraint. As for Race C I have done the ring enough, it's an excellent circuit but at the moment the novelty of the new is really keeping the online races fresh for me, with Watkins Glen and Deep Forest in recent weeks (the reverse version is great!).

 

[KosmoKazi]

As some of you may know, I'm having a devil of a time understanding the Daily Race B track at Atlanta. My QT is behind a bunch of my friends who, no insult intended, I'm usually ahead of. I'm hoping some of you can look at my latest fastest QT and tell me what you think is going on.

Is it just a case of me needing to tighten up everything, or am I approaching the track wrong? Accelerating at the wrong places, that sort of thing?

I've tried just about every car, and the Alfa is the one I think suits me the best. So I'd rather not hear "just try car xyz", if you don't mind. I mean that's OK, but I'd rather focus on how I'm driving rather than what I'm driving.

I shared my QT in the game - search for "gtp4". Or, if you prefer:

Here's a video from bumper cam view:


And here's the same lap, from chase cam view:


Thanks to anyone who can help!

Not sure I'm any faster myself, but a few thoughts from a passenger seat perspective:

1) I think you can 'back up' T1 a bit to get more speed through the apex. Off the throttle a little earlier and back on it earlier too. That turn really re-pays the slow-in / fast out mantra with the uphill portion after it meaning apex speed differences are amplified. (it's SO HARD to get the speed down to the max min-speed there, without the feel of the car to know how much to brake. And if you extend it so that you can watch the speedo, you lose 3 tenths or so compared to when you just get it right. I sometimes double-up on the overlap with the brake, rather than coast-then-brake, applying brake against the throttle there. Important with a turbo car, too, to keep the boost up without that loss in power.

1b) Maybe a bit more speed if you devour the right side curb through the esses... I noticed you were off the throttle a little longer than I try to be... I only blip it to flip the rear end, but then I try to line the RF tire up on the outside of that first right side curb... every little bit of speed through there helps... about a 0.1 in there I bet.

2) Take a bunch more of that entry-side curb on the right, just before the tricky left hander at the end of the first sector. Your apex is good but you can carry a ton more apex speed if you start on the entry-side curb and then work that apex hard and early. I noticed you were feet off the right side of the track on entry, and I think you're giving up a lot of apex speed as a result. The track limits on that inside curb seem non-existent, by the way, so I keep reminding myself to take it as deep as I can, because the exit curb limits are... well, you know. We all know!

3) You can really work the power on early if you nail the last slow right hander before the long straight. It's almost a coin flip whether I can hit it right or not every lap... but when you do, it's like 3 or 4 tenths easy just because you stay ahead of the speed profile all the way up the back straight then. It's one of those where you hope you get it right when you're otherwise on a good flyer, and when you do... bonus. I think that lap you didn't get all of it, and bet there's some speed difference there when comparing top laps.

Like I said, not sure I'm faster, but those are the things that jump out at me when I watch your replay.

(Side note: it is cool how we can rely on our friends list speeds to assess where we are most times. First thing I do, now that Kudosprime and GTBlade aren't available, is look to see who I know I can usually best, and work until then. Then I look at the top times, and measure what % off of those I am, based on the data I had in GTS, by Gr3 / Gr4 / category, etc. and try to gage whether I should have more speed in me or not before I hit the grid.)

 

[rAtey]

Snip

3) You can really work the power on early if you nail the last slow right hander before the long straight. It's almost a coin flip whether I can hit it right or not every lap... but when you do, it's like 3 or 4 tenths easy just because you stay ahead of the speed profile all the way up the back straight then. It's one of those where you hope you get it right when you're otherwise on a good flyer, and when you do... bonus. I think that lap you didn't get all of it, and bet there's some speed difference there when comparing top laps.

Like I said, not sure I'm faster, but those are the things that jump out at me when I watch you replay.

To add to this (warning: I dont use the Alfa) try shifting up to third before going on the gas in the right hander before the long straight.

 

[NevilleNobody]

(Side note: it is cool how we can rely on our friends list speeds to assess where we are most times. First thing I do, now that Kudosprime and GTBlade aren't available, is look to see who I know I can usually best, and work until then. Then I look at the top times, and measure what % off of those I am, based on the data I had in GTS, by Gr3 / Gr4 / category, etc. and try to gage whether I should have more speed in me or not before I hit the grid.)

Yep. If I am more than 3% off the top time I know I am gonna struggle in the race. Friends wise, Revengel is my litmus test, we are basically identical on pace so he's my yardstick. I sorta know you're gonna gap me by a half second so if it's less than that i know i am going ok, NGP a strong track for me and I think i am slightly up on you and at close to 2% but this is an outlier track.

My big issue is tyre wear, by the end of lap 7 my left front has let go at times, i chew them that badly.

 

[benjoi84]

Does it matter though? Like where you end up? So long as it is good racing, who cares where the DR is? If you want to be closer to the front, hit a few barriers and drop your SR to A.

I agree that fun should be number 1 priority. When I was working my way up from lowest ranking at the beginning of GT Sport, I used to believe higher lobbies would guarantee clean racing.

Now that I've been there for a while, I understand that dirty drivers come at all different levels, but you do reduce the element of mistakes from other drivers and the risk of succumbing to collateral damage.

 

[KosmoKazi]

To add to this (warning: I dont use the Alfa) try shifting up to third before going on the gas in the right hander before the long straight.

Good point.

Brings up a beef about the current PD GT7 physics model and how it's playing out on track (and the reason why the GTR and Alfa are META every. single. week.)

The rotation of the cars is so impossibly binary: the transition from 0% to 5% throttle and the dynamics of the model, including both available traction and side force loading, is wrought with unreal step functions.

So the fastest way around is to time your rotation, then mash the gas at the earliest possible moment, and let the front end pull the car around while the rear is at it's limit for combined slide/drive traction.

There's less reward for managing the throttle through the turn, and on acceleration off it, because the damage was done when you had to fake the car's rotation in the front end, and you may have missed the window to get to 100% throttle as early as the dumb model allows in the former scenario I mention.

This means ragging the hell out of the AWD cars will be faster all the time. And why I suspect the BoP is not working right, because I'll bet Sophy is trying to drive 'correctly' while the reality is all us humans figure out how to drive the 'game' model.

Further evidence of this dynamic is the stupid way the game is rewarding you for the throttle-on downshifts mid-turn and on entry... that should NOT be how you point the front end. Balancing the car on the front axle as you approach a turn should be done with throttle lifts and braking... but the way the model plays out now, downshifting the car under deceleration rotates it much more effectively, and that's quite simply: stupid. Bad physics model. And I'm sure someone who knows what they're doing at PD knows it.

That's why the META in dailies is stuck on GTR/Subaru/Alfas in Gr4 and why the game is frustrating to drive now. And also why people are racing crappy, in part, because to lap fast you really have to respect that dynamic, and you can't defend properly if you do... it's like having a hand tied behind your back. So people are squeezing gaps and forcing lanes on turn-in that aren't really open, but they know they have to.

 

[Nebuc72]

This means ragging the hell out of the AWD cars will be faster all the time. And why I suspect the BoP is not working right, because I'll bet Sophy is trying to drive 'correctly' while the reality is all us humans figure out how to drive the 'game' model.

What does Sophy have to do with any of this? I recall BoP calculations coming from a human driver (probably PDs test driver) going around a track; I think it was rumored to be Interlagos - to get them all close enough to eachother.

I don’t think they do that as much now, and certainly are just not touching anything but Gr.3 for the time being. I assume they want that figured out first, as it's ridiculous nothing but that has really been touched.

Sophy will unequivocally have nothing to do with it though. If Sophy was in a position to figure BoP out then.. well, BoP would be figured out.

 

[Childe Roland]

I've run maybe a hundred or so practice laps at NGP this week for Race C. I'm not qualifying as well as I'd hope I would but I was planning on working on it. But I did one race last night and two today and in every one of them I got blown up so badly by the fourth turn of lap one that my race was over. This is not a strategic race like I hoped it would be. It amounts to being the biggest unpenalized bully on the first lap, and then proceed for nine more laps with no real overtake opportunities.

To make it all worse, I just got completely humiliated in a PM from one of our own forum members, and a TPC member to boot (I mistakenly thought he was a TCR member) calling me names and assuming the worst about me (I'm malicious, I didn't bother practicing, I'm out to ruin his race, etc.). I'm flummoxed that one of our own would behave in such a way to another forum member who is very public about trying to race clean and be fair.

I had a rough start with the T1 dive-bombers and my tires got so overheated by T4 that I couldn't control the car anymore and I was all over the track. In all fairness to the other person (I don't know if you'll see this) I watched the replay to see what happened and I did see him turn into me as I was trying to find my way through the crowd. At least that's how it appeared to me. I deleted the replay before I got dressed down so I can't go back and double check, but that's how I saw it. That many cars going into T2 without being able to see to my sides is difficult under the best circumstances, and this wasn't that. I made mistakes, but nothing was intentional. I think you all know me well enough by now to know that about me.

I'm a bit sickened that a GTPlanet member would assume that about me and take the time to send a series of unkind messages. I was so busy trying to respond that I got kicked out of the race I was in (another last place effort after getting booted at the chicane) for being on the pause screen too long.

Anyway, this race is a disaster. I had high hopes this week, but I don't believe I'll be racing it again. And in all honesty my joy for this forum is a bit tarnished for a while as well. I think maybe I'm stepping back for a bit . . .

I can confirm that @Bullwinkle is a class act.
We have been matched on the same lobbies in the past (dont remember how many times).
I have been on the attacking and defendig side against him and he always drove fair and super clean.

What happened here, its no new to me.
Theres a lot of people who asumes the worst after one single incident.

I can "understand" the PM harrasment once you get punted race after race after race by the same driver.
But this situation its really annoying.

I really think theres very few people out there who race just to ruin others races in the A/A+ lobbies.

The vast majority of us are not sim pro racers, we are just people who want to relax doing 2 o 3 dailies after an 8 hour working shift and sometimes we make mistakes.

Just simple as that.

 

[KosmoKazi]

What does Sophy have to do with any of this? I recall BoP calculations coming from a human driver (probably PDs test driver) going around a track; I think it was rumored to be Interlagos - to get them all close enough to eachother.

I don’t think they do that as much now, and certainly are just not touching anything but Gr.3 for the time being. I assume they want that figured out first, as it's ridiculous nothing but that has really been touched.

Sophy will unequivocally have nothing to do with it though. If Sophy was in a position to figure BoP out then.. well, BoP would be figured out.

I have assumed they are simulating laps for setting BoP using Sophy. It seems a natural use of it. I assumed they always used Daily races as inputs to the BoP management (and yea was understood Interlagos was a key reference track) in the past, but I’d guess they would like to be able to simulate it for more precise and available data to use. Maybe I’m wrong to guess it. But it’s a hunch.

 

[Famine]

I have assumed they are simulating laps for setting BoP using Sophy.

They are not doing that. Sophy isn't at that point in any case.

What they are doing... I'm not exactly sure. My best guess is that a small team of PD employees - perhaps three or so - drives hot laps in the cars, maybe on some representative tracks, maybe on every circuit in the game. The results would then be used to calculate a mean time and new power/weight figures calculated to bring the outliers within a couple of percent of the mean (weight seems to have around twice the effect that power does, so 1% less weight is around the same as 2% more power) - focusing on reducing/increasing power of the most/least powerful cars, and reducing/increasing weight of the heaviest/lightest cars - before running laps again with the new figures. Lather, rinse, repeat.

It's not necessarily the right explanation, but it accounts for what we see: one BOP for all tracks (well, three now: H, M, L), representative of hotlap pace only and ignoring tyre degradation, and resulting in the same few cars being on top all the time except at unusual (and long) circuits - which have an undue effect on the mean calculations due to the longer lap times.


I am hopeful that Sophy will be used to automate the task (with the human drivers still involved to check the results) and generate a proper per-race BOP like it should be.

 

[NevilleNobody]

The rotation of the cars is so impossibly binary: the transition from 0% to 5% throttle and the dynamics of the model, including both available traction and side force loading, is wrought with unreal step functions.

So the fastest way around is to time your rotation, then mash the gas at the earliest possible moment, and let the front end pull the car around while the rear is at it's limit for combined slide/drive traction.

There's less reward for managing the throttle through the turn, and on acceleration off it, because the damage was done when you had to fake the car's rotation in the front end, and you may have missed the window to get to 100% throttle as early as the dumb model allows in the former scenario I mention.

This means ragging the hell out of the AWD cars will be faster all the time. And why I suspect the BoP is not working right, because I'll bet Sophy is trying to drive 'correctly' while the reality is all us humans figure out how to drive the 'game' model.

I don't disagree but just so happens that is exactly as i drive so it kinds works for me given my ham fisted approach It's a balancing act though, to do things more purely you're going to need a twitchier back end and more turn in which will head towards "serious sim" mode and turn off casual/serious users.

My 2c, you are ready for iRacing.

 

[KosmoKazi]

They are not doing that. Sophy isn't at that point in any case.

What they are doing... I'm not exactly sure. My best guess is that a small team of PD employees - perhaps three or so - drives hot laps in the cars, maybe on some representative tracks, maybe on every circuit in the game. The results would then be used to calculate a mean time and new power/weight figures calculated to bring the outliers within a couple of percent of the mean (weight seems to have around twice the effect that power does, so 1% less weight is around the same as 2% more power) - focusing on reducing/increasing power of the most/least powerful cars, and reducing/increasing weight of the heaviest/lightest cars - before running laps again with the new figures. Lather, rinse, repeat.

It's not necessarily the right explanation, but it accounts for what we see: one BOP for all tracks (well, three now: H, M, L), representative of hotlap pace only and ignoring tyre degradation, and resulting in the same few cars being on top all the time except at unusual (and long) circuits - which have an undue effect on the mean calculations due to the longer lap times.


I am hopeful that Sophy will be used to automate the task (with the human drivers still involved to check the results) and generate a proper per-race BOP like it should be.

Thanks for the informed answer. Really appreciate that. I’d assume they have teams of player lap time data to digest and inform adjustments to the BoP. Shame if they aren’t properly accounting for it in favor of a few paid hands’ work. The data would be immensely valuable for making those adjustments.

I’d almost like to see them be open about it and just tell us that the BoP is gonna get tweaked weekly for x amount of time, and without notifications. But I suppose they have a process that they are comfortable with. It all seems very culturally conservative for sure, which is not surprising.

I don't disagree but just so happens that is exactly as i drive so it kinds works for me given my ham fisted approach It's a balancing act though, to do things more purely you're going to need a twitchier back end and more turn in which will head towards "serious sim" mode and turn off casual/serious users.

My 2c, you are ready for iRacing.

I would love it, I'm sure. But another $2k in equipment and doubling up on the time investment aren't things that are going to fit into my life these days. It would be great to race against Tony Kanaan and the others, I'm sure beating them would be fun. But for now I'm just hoping to have some great races in Dailies and maybe share a few grids with SuperGT, errr Scott Chegg.

 

[Famine]

Thanks for the informed answer. Really appreciate that. I’d assume they have teams of player lap time data to digest and inform adjustments to the BoP. Shame if they aren’t properly accounting for it in favor of a few paid hands’ work. The data would be immensely valuable for making those adjustments.

I’d almost like to see them be open about it and just tell us that the BoP is gonna get tweaked weekly for x amount of time, and without notifications. But I suppose they have a process that they are comfortable with. It all seems very culturally conservative for sure, which is not surprising.

I forgot to note - World Tour events have custom BOP, for closer and more exciting racing among the top drivers.

The World Final last year had race-specific BOP for each event - taking into account the rain too for the final race - designed by one particularly well-qualified person, and it appeared to work extremely well...

 

[NevilleNobody]

It's not necessarily the right explanation, but it accounts for what we see: one BOP for all tracks (well, three now: H, M, L), representative of hotlap pace only and ignoring tyre degradation, and resulting in the same few cars being on top all the time except at unusual (and long) circuits - which have an undue effect on the mean calculations due to the longer lap times.

Thing is though, the three amigos are faster, ho tlap or long race, tyres wear or not.

It's abundantly clear all three need to be nerfed but they just cannot seem to bring themselves to do it.

 

[Kujala67]

Well 🤔🤔 this week" Road to Atlanta" Daily races Area somewhere Hilarius - Awful 😔 ... Surviving battle couple first corners .. Clean race on my mind always and so on .. I'm not so fast, driving 1:28:00 1:30:00 laps, but still fun 👌

 

[GrumpyOldMan]

I can confirm that @Bullwinkle is a class act.

100% agree! He's a good one, and I respect him 100%. Everyone makes mistakes (me more than most, it feels like), but he's not dirty. Personally, if it were me who said those things to him, I'd apologize to him publicly on this forum. Wait... @Bullwinkle, back when I was mouthing off in the chats against anyone I felt wronged me, did I ever do it to you? If so, sorry, and mea culpa!!! I'm a recovering chattacker, and one of the steps is supposed to apologize to anyone I've wronged, right?

Not sure I'm any faster myself, but a few thoughts from a passenger seat perspective:

1) I think you can 'back up' T1 a bit to get more speed through the apex. Off the throttle a little earlier and back on it earlier too. That turn really re-pays the slow-in / fast out mantra with the uphill portion after it meaning apex speed differences are amplified. (it's SO HARD to get the speed down to the max min-speed there, without the feel of the car to know how much to brake. And if you extend it so that you can watch the speedo, you lose 3 tenths or so compared to when you just get it right. I sometimes double-up on the overlap with the brake, rather than coast-then-brake, applying brake against the throttle there. Important with a turbo car, too, to keep the boost up without that loss in power.

1b) Maybe a bit more speed if you devour the right side curb through the esses... I noticed you were off the throttle a little longer than I try to be... I only blip it to flip the rear end, but then I try to line the RF tire up on the outside of that first right side curb... every little bit of speed through there helps... about a 0.1 in there I bet.

2) Take a bunch more of that entry-side curb on the right, just before the tricky left hander at the end of the first sector. Your apex is good but you can carry a ton more apex speed if you start on the entry-side curb and then work that apex hard and early. I noticed you were feet off the right side of the track on entry, and I think you're giving up a lot of apex speed as a result. The track limits on that inside curb seem non-existent, by the way, so I keep reminding myself to take it as deep as I can, because the exit curb limits are... well, you know. We all know!

3) You can really work the power on early if you nail the last slow right hander before the long straight. It's almost a coin flip whether I can hit it right or not every lap... but when you do, it's like 3 or 4 tenths easy just because you stay ahead of the speed profile all the way up the back straight then. It's one of those where you hope you get it right when you're otherwise on a good flyer, and when you do... bonus. I think that lap you didn't get all of it, and bet there's some speed difference there when comparing top laps.

Like I said, not sure I'm faster, but those are the things that jump out at me when I watch your replay.

(Side note: it is cool how we can rely on our friends list speeds to assess where we are most times. First thing I do, now that Kudosprime and GTBlade aren't available, is look to see who I know I can usually best, and work until then. Then I look at the top times, and measure what % off of those I am, based on the data I had in GTS, by Gr3 / Gr4 / category, etc. and try to gage whether I should have more speed in me or not before I hit the grid.)

Thanks for the review! It seems like I'm on the right track - I just need to focus on optimize some things. I'll see what I can do. Thanks again.

 

[NevilleNobody]

I would love it, I'm sure. But another $2k in equipment and doubling up on the time investment aren't things that are going to fit into my life these days. It would be great to race against Tony Kanaan and the others, I'm sure beating them would be fun. But for now I'm just hoping to have some great races in Dailies and maybe share a few grids with SuperGT, errr Scott Chegg.

Well that's the rub right. The beauty with Sport has always been the way it allows busy middle aged types to quickly jump on and race in a tightish lobby with zero fuss.

 

[hollowkatt]

As some of you may know, I'm having a devil of a time understanding the Daily Race B track at Atlanta. My QT is behind a bunch of my friends who, no insult intended, I'm usually ahead of. I'm hoping some of you can look at my latest fastest QT and tell me what you think is going on.

Is it just a case of me needing to tighten up everything, or am I approaching the track wrong? Accelerating at the wrong places, that sort of thing?

I've tried just about every car, and the Alfa is the one I think suits me the best. So I'd rather not hear "just try car xyz", if you don't mind. I mean that's OK, but I'd rather focus on how I'm driving rather than what I'm driving.

I shared my QT in the game - search for "gtp4". Or, if you prefer:

Here's a video from bumper cam view:


And here's the same lap, from chase cam view:


Thanks to anyone who can help!

you are as fast or faster through the corners than I am all the way through to, but not including T5 (the left hander after the esses). I think you're braking too early for T5 and also turning in too early. I know that's a track limits area but the quickest line is to straddle the yellow curb on the right leading to the corner and then cut in hard, take some grass (but not all grass) through T5 and drift all the way out to having two tires over the yellow line on your right on exit.

your biggest time losses are T7 and the entry/exit to T10B. If you're quicker through there you're quicker through the lap.

 

[Famine]

Thing is though, the three amigos are faster, ho tlap or long race, tyres wear or not.

Precisely because tyre wear hasn't been factored in at all.

I'm meaning that if you're using every track in the game and taking a simple mean of hotlap times on which to base your BOP, laps of N24/La Sarthe/St.Croix will have an exaggerated effect compared to laps of, say, Brands Hatch Indy.


Let's say they use Alsace, Deep Forest, Dragon Trail Gardens, Interlagos, Lago Maggiore GP, Laguna Seca, Kyoto Miyabi, N24, Trial Mountain, and Tsukuba as the test courses. One car is a second a lap faster at all of the tracks than another except one, which is N24 where the other car is ten seconds a lap faster.

By the combined times or the mean the car that's better at N24 is the faster of the two, despite being slower at 90% of the tracks, and gets a nerf to end up even slower at not only all the tracks it was already slower at but even at N24 because it's one-BOP-for-all-tracks.

Net result: one car dominates pretty much everywhere, the other is demonstrably worse, but might get closer at N24...

Now, if this is indeed how it's done I'd like to think PD has sufficient foresight to at least use every track and track variant in the game (although as BOP has barely changed since launch, probably not Road Atlanta/Watkins Glen), except SSRX (no circuit experience suggests they're aware of its relevance) but even so being great at BB Raceway would have 1/20th the influence on BOP as being great at N24. Unless there's some kind of weighting applied, it will result in some cars being better everywhere with rare exceptions. Which is what we have.


Hopefully Sophy will automate the process and generate per-race BOP that takes into account not only the track (which would be a huge improvement alone) but the weather and fuel/tire factors too, so we get cars that might be nowhere in qualifying but all end up on the same bit of road come the chequered flag. Which is what BOP is supposed to do.

 

[RacingGrandpa]

I think I’ve reached my limit in Sport at low B. Not making any progress, consistently at the back of races a couple of seconds off the pace. It may be that user numbers are low and I’m racing people near the top of the ranking, but it’s just stopped being fun.

The alternate is also B/S so basically the same lobbies. Think I may call it quits. I’m starting to remember why I avoided online racing in the past. Might do some unranked road car races in A but that’s it.

That's where I have been since fall of 2019. Low to middle B. And I like it there. I have great races in the midpack, not all but enough to stay hooked.
The purpose of the matchmaking isn't to make it possible for us to win often or to raise our score. The purpose is to put us together with racers of similar pace and cleanliness.
A win percent of 1 or 2 is good enough.
I focus on having good races, even when it means to not take that pass or to make sure there's room for us both.
I will rather have a great fair fight for p10 than a pole to flag win.

 

[djolliea]

As some of you may know, I'm having a devil of a time understanding the Daily Race B track at Atlanta. My QT is behind a bunch of my friends who, no insult intended, I'm usually ahead of. I'm hoping some of you can look at my latest fastest QT and tell me what you think is going on.

Is it just a case of me needing to tighten up everything, or am I approaching the track wrong? Accelerating at the wrong places, that sort of thing?

I've tried just about every car, and the Alfa is the one I think suits me the best. So I'd rather not hear "just try car xyz", if you don't mind. I mean that's OK, but I'd rather focus on how I'm driving rather than what I'm driving.

I shared my QT in the game - search for "gtp4". Or, if you prefer:

Here's a video from bumper cam view:


And here's the same lap, from chase cam view:


Thanks to anyone who can help!

Some good advice above. Your driving is fine but a bit overly cautious. You can maintain more speed using the whole track width (and some curbs). Trail braking helps. You're loosing time at the last chicane aswell. Downshift to 3rd and floor it at first apex. No need to use 2nd gear at all. Did 1:24,6 with Alfa and didn't use 2nd gear once.

 

[skidmark69]

I have no inside information, but if PD really adjust the bop based on a few people doing some hotlaps, then that's disappointing. They have so much data from daily races and manufacturers and nations races that they should be able to make much better adjustments based on that. It's PD though so no surprise if they do it that way. Credit to pd it actually takes a bit of effort to master a car and adapt your driving style, not to mention all cars on all (or a lot of) tracks so a couple people doing a couple hotlaps will never be perfect I think.

It doesn't sound like they have any intention of a per race bop since they've implemented the fast, medium, slow bops, but that's something I actually think is a good thing. It means there is a bit more variance between the cars on different tracks, which makes for more interesting racing. For the world series manufacturer races I understand them doing it though, cause you don't want people to have a car advantage.

But I also think the fact that they ended up removing all aspects of tuning has turned bop into something they weren't expecting. If you could just BOP power and weight and leave downforce, suspension, diff, gearing, break balance (or at least some of it) open for tuning then I think a lot more cars could quickly become viable and it would be a much more realistic and dynamic game, and people could fine tune to their driving style and it would equalise some of the differences in the stock bop.

 

[Roggers]

I think I’ve reached my limit in Sport at low B. Not making any progress, consistently at the back of races a couple of seconds off the pace. It may be that user numbers are low and I’m racing people near the top of the ranking, but it’s just stopped being fun.

The alternate is also B/S so basically the same lobbies. Think I may call it quits. I’m starting to remember why I avoided online racing in the past. Might do some unranked road car races in A but that’s it.

I’ve been there before. I got to a point where I wasn’t really progressing in Sport mode and that when I took a break away from it. 3 things that helped me improve was.

1. Online lobbies with friends or group of people you can race with regularly. Once you learn how everyone drives in your group, you can then race not worrying some random will try a dive, or push to pass etc…
2. Custom races. I did my own like Touring Car series with stock cars and fitted them all with upgrades and racing trim parts. I found this a huge help as the cars were a nice mix of stock car/race car and helped me learn car control and speed.
3. Playing a different sim. I started to play ACC and I found I had to re learn how to drive again. Different physics etc… can reset your muscle memory which could get rid of those bad habits you have in GT7 (if that make sens)

As some of you may know, I'm having a devil of a time understanding the Daily Race B track at Atlanta. My QT is behind a bunch of my friends who, no insult intended, I'm usually ahead of. I'm hoping some of you can look at my latest fastest QT and tell me what you think is going on.

Is it just a case of me needing to tighten up everything, or am I approaching the track wrong? Accelerating at the wrong places, that sort of thing?

I've tried just about every car, and the Alfa is the one I think suits me the best. So I'd rather not hear "just try car xyz", if you don't mind. I mean that's OK, but I'd rather focus on how I'm driving rather than what I'm driving.

I shared my QT in the game - search for "gtp4". Or, if you prefer:

Here's a video from bumper cam view:


And here's the same lap, from chase cam view:


Thanks to anyone who can help!

I’ve not tried the 155 round here so might not help but..in my opinion these few things are potentially slowing you down

T1 - You need to carry speed through this corner. I dab the brakes a little, downshift to 4th and let the car coast until I can them put the accelerator down.
S’s - the first of the 3 corners i saw you took the foot of the gas a little. You can go flat into that right hander. Also 5th gear. Think you should have upshifted to 5th.
Left after the S’s - need to use all the track here. Track limits are nightmare here but you need to try and get those left wheels on the curb, which allows you carry more speed.
Final chicane - I struggle with this, as I never know what faster. 2nd gear or 3rd gear. I think you go into 3rd in the wrong position which then compromises your exit speed.
3rd gear - I believe 3rd gear is king for this car on corner exits.

Jumped on to do a lap in the 155 and I’ve beaten my own time.
Here is my lap. A bit scruffy it think but hopefully helps

They are not doing that. Sophy isn't at that point in any case.

What they are doing... I'm not exactly sure. My best guess is that a small team of PD employees - perhaps three or so - drives hot laps in the cars, maybe on some representative tracks, maybe on every circuit in the game. The results would then be used to calculate a mean time and new power/weight figures calculated to bring the outliers within a couple of percent of the mean (weight seems to have around twice the effect that power does, so 1% less weight is around the same as 2% more power) - focusing on reducing/increasing power of the most/least powerful cars, and reducing/increasing weight of the heaviest/lightest cars - before running laps again with the new figures. Lather, rinse, repeat.

It's not necessarily the right explanation, but it accounts for what we see: one BOP for all tracks (well, three now: H, M, L), representative of hotlap pace only and ignoring tyre degradation, and resulting in the same few cars being on top all the time except at unusual (and long) circuits - which have an undue effect on the mean calculations due to the longer lap times.


I am hopeful that Sophy will be used to automate the task (with the human drivers still involved to check the results) and generate a proper per-race BOP like it should be.

Im lead to believe BOP is feedback from PD employees.
At Bathurst Mikail Hizal was doing daily race all week and was driving each car. Now people believe he was BOP testing as he works for PD and they saying he doesn’t do daily races much. How true that is? I’m not sure.

 

[GOTMAXPOWER]

At Bathurst Mikael Hizal was doing daily race all week and was driving each car. Now people believe he was BOP testing as he works for PD and they saying he doesn’t do daily races much. How true that is? I’m not sure.

I think he was making the most of a combo he liked and racing for fun, he streamed for a while. I doubt the data would be much use for BOP because he was racing from the back so would've always been in traffic.

 

[hollowkatt]

I think he was making the most of a combo he liked and racing for fun, he streamed for a while. I doubt the data would be much use for BOP because he was racing from the back so would've always been in traffic.

I think IRL series use "crowded track" data to finalize BOP. For example there's a pre-season testing BOP done for WEC events but then you get to places like Spa, Le Mans, and whatnot and have "race specific" BOP developed during pre-race testing for that race weekend and even up to race start with post qualifying data. PD definitely doesn't have the resources available to do that.

My expectation is that they're developing BOP through clean track runs for each car but that they're not taking any traffic into account which does provide a baseline but isn't nearly as nuanced as IRL BOP can get. I also never expect PD to be as nuanced as IRL organizations can be.

 

[Hodd10]

Shared my replay. Tagged gtp3. Its a 1.25.8 in a wrx. I'm low B rated driver. Might help somebody. Might not!

 

[Roggers]

I think he was making the most of a combo he liked and racing for fun, he streamed for a while. I doubt the data would be much use for BOP because he was racing from the back so would've always been in traffic.

This was my thought too. Someone over the xmas period just having some fun

 

[Leon Kowalski]

As some of you may know, I'm having a devil of a time understanding the Daily Race B track at Atlanta. My QT is behind a bunch of my friends who, no insult intended, I'm usually ahead of. I'm hoping some of you can look at my latest fastest QT and tell me what you think is going on.

Is it just a case of me needing to tighten up everything, or am I approaching the track wrong? Accelerating at the wrong places, that sort of thing?

I've tried just about every car, and the Alfa is the one I think suits me the best. So I'd rather not hear "just try car xyz", if you don't mind. I mean that's OK, but I'd rather focus on how I'm driving rather than what I'm driving.

I shared my QT in the game - search for "gtp4". Or, if you prefer:

Here's a video from bumper cam view:


And here's the same lap, from chase cam view:


Thanks to anyone who can help!

Just back from work, I've watched your replays.

@KosmoKazi has already offered tons of good advice, so just some thoughts from my part:

1. Nothing egregiously wrong to be seen. Except maybe:
2. T4 (?, I mean the downhill right hander in the first sector): turn in right earlier (cut the curbs). Two or three tenths to be gained in the esses through the dip then, because of higher speed.
2. T5: Approach it with the right side wheels on the curbs (the curbs on the right side, of course 😆. Granted that they will sometimes throw you off track)
3. Final chicane: entry (left hander) in third gear, not second. At least upshift earlier.
3. Generally: The Alfa likes it tough 🤣. You can go much faster into T1 (you'll find out the hard way how fast is too fast...), into T6 and into the final chicane, you can catch slides in the Alfa.

Keep attacking! 👍