GTRA | RSeat WSGTC S3 | Main Thread

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Sail IC
Masi,

Do you plan to change the car regulations?

One issue I see with the current regulations is that on some cars its quite easy to cheat and still having the car pass all regulation tests. As an example, there is no problem to configure a Lexus to have 522hp/1100kg/612PP or a Motul to have 522hp/1130kg/610PP, both cars still having full aero.

Even if most drivers will not cheat, in a sizable starting field there will always be the few drivers that will cheat especially if its watertight that it cannot be discovered. In setting regulations I think a good guidance is, "if it cannot be policed, allow it".

The issue with relying on a HP based regulation is that if the car will have the powerlimiter set at less than 100%, it can in reality only be set at 10Hp increments even if its combined with a PP regulation.

I think the best regulations is to use a PP based system that can still be combined with not allowing engine upgrades as all of this can easily be policed. Then leave it up to each driver to configure the best car. One other benefit in my view that it opens up the possibility to run with less aero, ie tuning becomes much more interesting.
Click to expand...
The system is HP, Weight, and PP based.

Meaning: SC430 must be under 522HP, (weight can't be lowered) and PP must be below 612.
The GTR can only be modified with easily viewable boost, or an engine upgrade that make 600+ HP, meaning it would be obviously faster then the GTR's at spec.

Looking for new specs atm anyway, I'm not going to be so bold as to say there's no way to cheat, but no real effective ways, no.
 
Masi_23
Just thought i'd bump the list. PAL filling up nicely.


.: Preseason Round 2 | Roll-Call | Laguna Seca 175km :.
Color Code: PAL Conference | NTSC Conference
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Awards: Reserved Regular Season Spot​

Reply and follow template below to join the race (Round 1 winners can join):


PAL Conference
Connect Time: 19.30 GMT | 11.30 PST | 14.30 EST
Green Flag: 20.00 GMT | 12.00 PST | 15.00 EST​

GT500 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Honda Arta NSX '06.....................[ | ]
  • Honda Raybrig NSX '06..................[ | ]
  • Honda Takata Dome NSX '06..............[ | ]
  • Lexus Petronas Tom's SC430 '08.........[NEPALII | GTF_Apollo]
  • Lexus Denso Dunlop Sard SC430 '08......[RedReevos | BiffyClyro93]
  • Nissan Calsonic Impul GTR '08..........[Sticky_Goldfish | tony1311]
  • Nissan Xanavi Nismo GTR '08............[GTP_Aderrrm | ]
  • Nissan Yellowhat YMS Tomica GTR '08....[IMMORTALPILOT | ProPersian]
GT300 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Lexus Weds Sport IS350.................[Jashugan01 | hellboyfr]
  • RE Amemiya Asparadrink RX7 '06.........[joshua1994 | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '08..............[ByGGy | GTP_PaggyDaggy]
  • Subaru Cusco Dunlop Impreza '08........[GTP_Masicampo | GTP_cicua]
  • Toyota Weds Sport Celica...............[GTP_Niss | Moieman]
  • Toyota Apex MR-S.......................[ | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '03..............[ | ]
  • Subaru Cusco Advan Impreza '03.........[Paginas | Toyotsupra]
S3PaBr2-1.png


NTSC Conference
Connect Time: 18.30 PST | 21.30 EST (Sunday 02.30 GMT)
Green Flag: 19.00 PST | 22.00 EST (Sunday 03.00 GMT)​

GT500 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Honda Arta NSX '06.....................[ | ]
  • Honda Raybrig NSX '06..................[ | ]
  • Honda Takata Dome NSX '06..............[GTP_CSL | ]
  • Lexus Petronas Tom's SC430 '08.........[El_Aliens69 | oalithgow]
  • Lexus Denso Dunlop Sard SC430 '08......[ | ]
  • Nissan Calsonic Impul GTR '08..........[GTIC_RamStig | MONSTAR-1]
  • Nissan Xanavi Nismo GTR '08............[BORTECH | elysiriar]
  • Nissan Yellowhat YMS Tomica GTR '08....[Trajikone | ]
GT300 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Lexus Weds Sport IS350.................[Troylee2601 | ]
  • RE Amemiya Asparadrink RX7 '06.........[GTP_Erick | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '08..............[ | ]
  • Subaru Cusco Dunlop Impreza '08........[Skikkelsens | ]
  • Toyota Weds Sport Celica...............[ | ]
  • Toyota Apex MR-S.......................[ | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '03..............[ | ]
  • Subaru Cusco Advan Impreza '03.........[GTP_OVERHEATING | ]
S3PaBr2-1.png

.: Drivers Briefing (Read! Read! Read!) :.​
Welcome to WSGTC newbies! I'll keep this brief and in simple English. Race clean, disciplined, and respectful around your fellow competitors! Fast but incompetent drivers need not apply - rather have slow and clean! Read the Racing Code 685 times (Click Here!).

You must follow the Car Specs and Regulations pictured below (TBA)! Not following specs will result in an immediate Disqualification.

While inside the race lobby, do not use the 'CHAT' feature while Stewards are sending out instructions for pre-race checks. If you have questions, go ask them NOW! Otherwise, read the OP. We will be using a special pre-race qualifying that is listed below - Read it! Thank you for your patience!

Car Specs and Regulations (All cars at Max Downforce!)
GT500 TBA
GT300 TBA​
Pre-Race Qualifying
  • Since we're not doing the weekly qualifying, we'll do a pre-race one instead.
  • After pre-race PP Checks are done, the track will be reset.
  • The field will be given 15 minutes to do their Qualifying in Free-Run
  • If you are satisfied with a lap, DRIVE back to the pits. DO NOT press PAUSE and then EXIT!
  • Again, drive back to the pits! Do not press pause and exit!
  • Stay in the Pits and wait for the start of the race.
  • Once everyone has been confirmed to be inside the pits, the host will start the race.
  • Once the countdown hits ZERO, DO NOT MOVE!
  • The field will roll slowly and maintain 50mph/80kph
  • Maintain your grid spots while holding a double-file grid (8 rows, 2 columns)
  • Follow the Rolling Start Procedure Inside the OP!
  • Goodluck and Have Fun!
Eligibility for Winning Reserved Spot in Championship:
  • Win the race
  • Finish 2nd if a Veteran (or previous round 1 winners) Wins
  • Finish 3rd if Veterans (or previous round 1 winners) finish 1-2
  • Must not ask any questions that you can easily answer by reading the OP. :sly:
Click to expand...

NTSC Masi.
 
Masi, scrap me from the List of the Pre-Season Race 2, my TV's Power Supply Died, i hope i can participate in WSGTC Season 3, maybe :(
 
Niss
Masi, scrap me from the List of the Pre-Season Race 2, my TV's Power Supply Died, i hope i can participate in WSGTC Season 3, maybe :(
Click to expand...
Good avatar.:lol:
That sucks man, get a new TV!!! ASAP! 👍

Hope to see you soon
 
I have a small question about the racing code. Might be a stupid one but I have to make sure:

b. If an overtaking car is fully alongside its competitor within or after the braking ZONE, the rights to the corner goes to the overtaking driver.
Click to expand...

I don't quite understand what rights to the corner mean. Does it mean you have to forfeit the corner altogether, or if the overtaking car is alongside at corner entry on the inside line, you have to leave sufficient room for him on the inside while taking the outside line yourself? If so, does this count for corner exit aswell or is the overtaking car entitled to the full width of the track?

In short I'm asking if defending like this is allowed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IYqoKKQ0A-w#t=338s
 
OK8
I have a small question about the racing code. Might be a stupid one but I have to make sure:



I don't quite understand what rights to the corner mean. Does it mean you have to forfeit the corner altogether, or if the overtaking car is alongside at corner entry on the inside line, you have to leave sufficient room for him on the inside while taking the outside line yourself? If so, does this count for corner exit aswell or is the overtaking car entitled to the full width of the track?

In short I'm asking if defending like this is allowed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IYqoKKQ0A-w#t=338s
Click to expand...
Well the outside car came down on the inside car, so I guess depending on the severity of the action itself and whether it caused an incident would both play factors, but repeatedly coming down on cars that have the inside established like the black car in the video does can be determined "aggressive driving".
That video in itself would be a nothing overall, only if repetitive would it be an issue.


Interesting the rule you quoted is the one I suggested get a re-wording. :P
 
The Lexus can have over 515HP while keeping 612PP? Didnt know that, or didnt even bother to try it :D. I think we should do PP AND HP check before starting a qualifying and race session. That way no cheating will happen :)
 
The outside car came close but there was no contact and no incident.

I guess I'll just keep racing as I do and face the consequences later if there are any. Pulling outside line defenses in GT500 cars is a different ballgame anyway.

http://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Rules_of_Clean_Racing These are the rules I've raced by and they're pretty much the same but with better wording maybe.
 
OK8
The outside car came close but there was no contact and no incident.

I guess I'll just keep racing as I do and face the consequences later if there are any. Pulling outside line defenses in GT500 cars is a different ballgame anyway.

http://en.lfsmanual.net/wiki/Rules_of_Clean_Racing These are the rules I've raced by and they're pretty much the same but with better wording maybe.
Click to expand...
I thought there was contact, I don't have sound on. :lol:
If there's no contact, then there's no incident in the video at all. It could be done in every corner if neither car ever moves into the other. Usually one goes up or comes down though.
 
OK8
I have a small question about the racing code. Might be a stupid one but I have to make sure:



I don't quite understand what rights to the corner mean. Does it mean you have to forfeit the corner altogether, or if the overtaking car is alongside at corner entry on the inside line, you have to leave sufficient room for him on the inside while taking the outside line yourself? If so, does this count for corner exit aswell or is the overtaking car entitled to the full width of the track?

In short I'm asking if defending like this is allowed:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=IYqoKKQ0A-w#t=338s
Click to expand...

It doesn't mean the car being overtaken must automatically give up the spot - rather he must incline to give up the optimal racing line. He can still battle for position (holding the outside lane) but he must do his best to prevent any incidents.

p.s. The Racing Code is not final and will have further revisions before the Regular Season starts. :)
 
NEPALII
The Lexus can have over 515HP while keeping 612PP? Didnt know that, or didnt even bother to try it :D. I think we should do PP AND HP check before starting a qualifying and race session. That way no cheating will happen :)
Click to expand...

Let me expand and clarify a bit.

The current regulation states the following for below cars:
- Lexus: 515hp/512PP/1100Kg/full aero
- Motul: 514hp/510PP/1130Kg/full aero

What I'm saying is that you can get above cars to have the following:
- Lexus: 522hp/512PP/1100Kg/full aero
- Motul: 522hp/510PP/1130kg/full aero

No pre-race checks will catch this as you can't check whether the car has 514/515hp or 522hp. It's not visible in the replay display like if a driver have installed a not allowed engine upgrade.

The only way to potentially catch this is to measure top speed in the replay, compare it to other cars that persumably have not done it. I don't think this is a good way of policing car regulations.

In a smaller closed group of racers I think you can perhaps count on that people will not cheat, but in a large group like this league some will for sure. That's why I think the car regulations needs to water tight and there are ways of doing it.
 
Masi_23
It doesn't mean the car being overtaken must automatically give up the spot - rather he must incline to give up the optimal racing line. He can still battle for position (holding the outside lane) but he must do his best to prevent any incidents.
Click to expand...
That to me makes it sound like it's ok to come up from the inside knowing there's a car there.
If that's the case I'd like to see that one reviewed.

In my opinion, just getting side by side on the inside of someone doesn't give you that much of a right to ground, other then racing side-by-side with the guy (or girl ;) ). He has that lane, you have this one.
 
Sail IC
Let me expand and clarify a bit.

The current regulation states the following for below cars:
- Lexus: 515hp/512PP/1100Kg/full aero
- Motul: 514hp/510PP/1130Kg/full aero

What I'm saying is that you can get above cars to have the following:
- Lexus: 522hp/512PP/1100Kg/full aero
- Motul: 522hp/510PP/1130kg/full aero

No pre-race checks will catch this as you can't check whether the car has 514/515hp or 522hp. It's not visible in the replay display like if a driver have installed a not allowed engine upgrade.

The only way to potentially catch this is to measure top speed in the replay, compare it to other cars that persumably have not done it. I don't think this is a good way of policing car regulations.

In a smaller closed group of racers I think you can perhaps count on that people will not cheat, but in a large group like this league some will for sure. That's why I think the car regulations needs to water tight and there are ways of doing it.
Click to expand...
I'd like to know what specs will give you that much extra horsepower at the same PP on those cars with max aero.
Keep in mind a boost gauge on a GTR during a replay is automatic DQ. And the boost gauges read out differently on mid and high rpm turbos. Oh, and engine stages change the peak rpm, and moves the shift light, along with moving the red bar on the tachometer, not to mention cars like the GTR which have an all-new tach to accomodate the increased rpm of having an engine stage added.

And finally after passing all those checks, you can't reach to high of a speed on different spots on different tracks, or we'll know your car is out of spec. ;)
 
CSLACR
I'd like to know what specs will give you that much extra horsepower at the same PP on those cars with max aero.
Keep in mind a boost gauge on a GTR during a replay is automatic DQ. And the boost gauges read out differently on mid and high rpm turbos. Oh, and engine stages change the peak rpm, and moves the shift light, along with moving the red bar on the tachometer, not to mention cars like the GTR which have an all-new tach to accomodate the increased rpm of having an engine stage added.

And finally after passing all those checks, you can't reach to high of a speed on different spots on different tracks, or we'll know your car is out of spec. ;)
Click to expand...

I'm aware of above, and unfortunately it doesn't cut it. Appart from checking top speed, and I don't think that's a good way of policing regulations.

I'm a bit reluctant to disclose how to do what I'm outlining as I know some other racing leages are currently using similar regulations such as PURE. I actually thought it was common knowledge, but apparantly its not.

I wrote a PM to Chorda and Masi how to do it. As they are organizing events, I leave it up to them if they want to disclose.

Edit: I just saw that Masi published new regulations. Maybe it will fix it. I will have a look at it.
 
.: Preseason Round 2 | Roll-Call | Laguna Seca 175km :.​
​

Color Code: PAL Conference | NTSC Conference
Follow WSGTC on: Facebook | Twitter
Awards: Reserved Regular Season Spot​

Reply and follow template below to join the race (Round 1 winners can join):
PSN ID: Translator_San
Conference: PAL or NTSC
Class: GT500 or GT300
Car: any available car - first come, first serve!
Click to expand...

PAL Conference
Connect Time: 19.30 GMT | 11.30 PST | 14.30 EST
Green Flag: 20.00 GMT | 12.00 PST | 15.00 EST​

GT500 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Honda Arta NSX '06.....................[HugoVaz | OK8_]
  • Honda Raybrig NSX '06..................[ | ]
  • Honda Takata Dome NSX '06..............[ | ]
  • Lexus Petronas Tom's SC430 '08.........[NEPALII | GTF_Apollo]
  • Lexus Denso Dunlop Sard SC430 '08......[RedReevos | BiffyClyro93]
  • Nissan Calsonic Impul GTR '08..........[Sticky_Goldfish | tony1311]
  • Nissan Xanavi Nismo GTR '08............[GTP_Aderrrm | ]
  • Nissan Yellowhat YMS Tomica GTR '08....[IMMORTALPILOT | ProPersian]
GT300 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Lexus Weds Sport IS350.................[Jashugan01 | hellboyfr]
  • RE Amemiya Asparadrink RX7 '06.........[joshua1994 | Litchi_GTPlay]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '08..............[ByGGy | GTP_PaggyDaggy]
  • Subaru Cusco Dunlop Impreza '08........[GTP_Masicampo | GTP_cicua]
  • Toyota Weds Sport Celica...............[GTP_Niss | Moieman]
  • Toyota Apex MR-S.......................[ | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '03..............[Scanny_Flick | ]
  • Subaru Cusco Advan Impreza '03.........[Paginas | Toyotsupra]
S3PaBr2-1.png


NTSC Conference
Connect Time: 18.30 PST | 21.30 EST (Sunday 02.30 GMT)
Green Flag: 19.00 PST | 22.00 EST (Sunday 03.00 GMT)​

GT500 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Honda Arta NSX '06.....................[ | ]
  • Honda Raybrig NSX '06..................[ | ]
  • Honda Takata Dome NSX '06..............[GTP_CSL | ]
  • Lexus Petronas Tom's SC430 '08.........[El_Aliens69 | oalithgow]
  • Lexus Denso Dunlop Sard SC430 '08......[ | ]
  • Nissan Calsonic Impul GTR '08..........[GTIC_RamStig | MONSTAR-1]
  • Nissan Xanavi Nismo GTR '08............[BORTECH | elysiriar]
  • Nissan Yellowhat YMS Tomica GTR '08....[Trajikone | harrison1476]
GT300 Class
Room Host: TBA
  • Lexus Weds Sport IS350.................[Troylee2601 | ]
  • RE Amemiya Asparadrink RX7 '06.........[GTP_Erick | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '08..............[ | ]
  • Subaru Cusco Dunlop Impreza '08........[Skikkelsens | ]
  • Toyota Weds Sport Celica...............[ | ]
  • Toyota Apex MR-S.......................[ | ]
  • Autobacs Arta Garaiya '03..............[ | ]
  • Subaru Cusco Advan Impreza '03.........[GTP_OVERHEATING | ]
S3PaBr2-1.png

.: Drivers Briefing (Read! Read! Read!) :.​
Welcome to WSGTC newbies! I'll keep this brief and in simple English. Race clean, disciplined, and respectful around your fellow competitors! Fast but incompetent drivers need not apply - rather have slow and clean! Read the Racing Code 685 times (Click Here!).

You must follow the Car Specs and Regulations pictured below (TBA)! Not following specs will result in an immediate Disqualification.

While inside the race lobby, do not use the 'CHAT' feature while Stewards are sending out instructions for pre-race checks. If you have questions, go ask them NOW! Otherwise, read the OP. We will be using a special pre-race qualifying that is listed below - Read it! Thank you for your patience!

Car Specs and Regulations (All cars at Max Downforce!)
ProvisionalSpecsS3-1.png
Pre-Race Qualifying
  • Since we're not doing the weekly qualifying, we'll do a pre-race one instead.
  • After pre-race PP Checks are done, the track will be reset.
  • The field will be given 15 minutes to do their Qualifying in Free-Run
  • If you are satisfied with a lap, DRIVE back to the pits. DO NOT press PAUSE and then EXIT!
  • Again, drive back to the pits! Do not press pause and exit!
  • Stay in the Pits and wait for the start of the race.
  • Once everyone has been confirmed to be inside the pits, the host will start the race.
  • Once the countdown hits ZERO, DO NOT MOVE!
  • The field will roll slowly and maintain 50mph/80kph
  • Maintain your grid spots while holding a double-file grid (8 rows, 2 columns)
  • Follow the Rolling Start Procedure Inside the OP!
  • Goodluck and Have Fun!
Eligibility for Winning Reserved Spot in Championship:
  • Win the race
  • Finish 2nd if a Veteran (or previous round 1 winners) Wins
  • Finish 3rd if Veterans (or previous round 1 winners) finish 1-2
  • Must not ask any questions that you can easily answer by reading the OP. :sly:
 
Sail IC
Edit: I just saw that Masi published new regulations. Maybe it will fix it. I will have a look at it.
Click to expand...

Hey Johan,

I haven't been much involved with testing at the moment, so i can't reply with full knowledge. CSL and Aderrrm are the primary testers.
 
Masi_23
New Provisional Specs for Preseason Round 2

ProvisionalSpecsS3-1.png
Click to expand...

Are these specs the ones suggested by CSL? You said they are provisional, so the drivers can test the cars and give feedback and maybe, based on feedback, changes may occur, right? I was quite surprised with the handling of the downgraded GTR by CSL. I'll get some testing tonight. Will open a room, anyone free to join 👍

Edit: Just noticed, they are being used for the preseason race. Im okay with that, but I suggest having another preseason race to give us more time to test the new specs. And possibly in a balanced track, to really put the specs up to test. Maybe Indy road, Nurburgring GP/F? Hell, even at only 500HP I might even consider the NSX. Who knows...
 
Last edited:
Lowering the overall power level not a bad idea. It makes the NSX an easier drive and a viable car for more drivers.
 
@ NEPALII - Yes - feedback would be great.

If we get sufficient interest for a race (which would land somewhere between Christmas and New Year) then we'll have one scheduled. Nurburgring GPF would be the choice.

@ Johan - That was the primary goal 👍
 
the nsx just seems to have a lot more bhp but I have not tested so cannot comment on the specs at the moment. However I probably won't as I'm going to focus on the gt300s

masi are they new specs for gt300 as well or same as last season
 
Masi, i think you should add more hp too the Toyota's GT500 those cars have massive understeer!!
 
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