If hell exists it is this...

  • Thread starter AlexGTV
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Would you like to see everyone you love grow old and die while you don't?

It kind of depends on what kind of immortality we are talking about here... if I get to live longer than earth itself somehow, being completely alone in the universe, then I can see it being hell.

But if somehow everything turns out ok, and my only problem being finding new people to love every 50 years or so like you mentioned, then yeah, I much rather have to deal with that then face death.
 
Hate to spoil it for you people but there is no hell or heaven. It's impossible. First of all why would there be only for humans and not animals? What makes us so much better just cause we are smarter? Doesn't make sense. Or are you telling me that there is hell for animals. Is there a squirrel hell. Who would go there the ones who killed others because they had rabies and it's not really there fault. That would be killing which is wrong tho. The point I'm making is there can't be a hell or heaven because it would be too much confusion on which to go to.
 
In all life-or-death decisions, the 'experimenter' finds that he has chosen life. At the same time all around him die as expected - will he meet life again?
 
The point I'm making is there can't be a hell or heaven because it would be too much confusion on which to go to.

People who believe in heaven and hell believe that God created everything and everyone, and he is all seeing and all doing. They do not believe that their 'systems' have to constrain to anything that we know of. There would be no confusion, just as there is no limits to what god can see or do if he so wishes.

I personally believe that you rot in the ground or get burned and scattered somewhere and I'm dead set against religion. But people will decide for themselves what they like. I'll just say one thing:


Dinosaurs
 
Ok if god decides all which is basically don't break the ten commandments and you go to heaven. Let's say you kill someone while driving and they jumped in front of your car. Technically it's not your fault but you still killed the person breaking a commandment? Or if you steal some bread to save a poor family. Is stealing a loaf of bread that's worth like two bucks really worse than saving a family of 5 to eat for at least another day? It's just too confusing. Conrad Murray for example got sentenced to jail because he killed Michael Jackson but would he go to hell when he dies since he killed him or will god say you were a doctor and had no real way of knowing that there was too much of that certain drug in him which caused him to die. What about the devil is he wanting people to come to hell. If he's so against and the opposite of god than why is he in an agreement allowing god to decide who comes to hell. Why wouldn't he fight back and try to send them to heaven so he wins. It would be a huge court case every time.
 
Those are tales, the Quantum Immortality Theory is a scientific hypothesis based on the Many Worlds Interpretation which people like Hawking, Tegmark and Deutsch support.
 
People who believe in heaven and hell believe that God created everything and everyone, and he is all seeing and all doing. They do not believe that their 'systems' have to constrain to anything that we know of. There would be no confusion, just as there is no limits to what god can see or do if he so wishes.

I personally believe that you rot in the ground or get burned and scattered somewhere and I'm dead set against religion. But people will decide for themselves what they like. I'll just say one thing:


Dinosaurs

I have to agree. I've read a book that tells about how humans would function just fine without a pineal gland (free will). It explains how we humans are just biological machines and once we die, we simply turn off. (To put it simply)
 
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I have to agree. I've read a book that tells about how humans would function just fine without a pineal gland (free will). It explains how we humans are just biological machines and once we die, we simply turn off. (To put it simply)

Exactly. What makes humans so good to have a heaven and hell. Why wouldn't animals as well. We are slightly smarter and that's it.
 
shmogt
Ok if god decides all which is basically don't break the ten commandments and you go to heaven. Let's say you kill someone while driving and they jumped in front of your car. Technically it's not your fault but you still killed the person breaking a commandment? Or if you steal some bread to save a poor family. Is stealing a loaf of bread that's worth like two bucks really worse than saving a family of 5 to eat for at least another day? It's just too confusing. Conrad Murray for example got sentenced to jail because he killed Michael Jackson but would he go to hell when he dies since he killed him or will god say you were a doctor and had no real way of knowing that there was too much of that certain drug in him which caused him to die. What about the devil is he wanting people to come to hell. If he's so against and the opposite of god than why is he in an agreement allowing god to decide who comes to hell. Why wouldn't he fight back and try to send them to heaven so he wins. It would be a huge court case every time.

Yea murray was a good friend of mj and just giving him his pain meds to keep him out of agony. I find it stupid he went to prison for being a good friend.
But all this quantum mechanics stuff is amazing. I have looked up so many things and never thought of our universe like this. Just wow....
 
ilikewaffles11
My brain just exploded.

My brain just imploded... :D
This stuff requires patience, concentration and will with a pen and paper while sitting at a desk in a blue room while being drugged up with stimulants to even begin to comprehend the theory.
 
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Particles are not aware of anything. An observer simply collapses the wave function.

Think of it like this, the electrons want to go through the slits in every possible way, and they do. When an observer comes and watches them do that, he is automatically placed in one universe where one of the ways that the electrons passed through the slits has occurred. The observer can't see the other ways that the electron passed through the slit because it would require the observer being in multiple universes at once.

But wouldn't that mean the target board would also have been in one universe or the other?

Why is it that only the observer can collapse the wave function. What's the difference to the particle whether we observe the after math recorded on a board or the event itself?

I get what you're trying to say, but I just don't see why it matters that someone was looking right at it, when the effect on the board was every bit as real as it was for the observer. What stops the board itself from collapsing the wave function?

I'm not saying it doesn't happen, but if everything effected by this occurrence is sent to a separate universe, wouldn't the same rule apply to anything used to measure the occurrence, or the result of it?
 
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Scientists should spend less time thinking/studying stuff of this nature and figure out solutions for more urgent problems in this world, in my opinion.

Umm, that is actually incredibly shortsighted. We don't look so deep into things because we always necessarily want to, but we have to. You never know where the answer will lie.
 



To the best of my understanding,

The particle does everything that has a non zero probability, when the observer observes, he is then put in one of resulting universes that arise from the split. In another universe, a different observer (who is actually the same observer) is observing a different particle event.

Observe does not mean watch. I don't really think I can tell you what it means, but I think I know what it doesn't mean. It basically comes down to us not being able to experience multiple outcomes of the same event, apparently.

The Heisenberg uncertainty principle also plays a part. In the slit experiment, the electrons can do all sorts of crazy things because their positions and velocities are probabilities. The uncertainty principle says that when you measure one more accurately, the other is less well defined. So when the electrons were measured (which would be observing, at no time could we see them) passing through the slit, their positions were bound tightly, which limited their ability to pass through the wall and do other crazy things.

I hope that makes sense. I also hope it's correct but I'm not completely sure myself.
 
TankAss95
My brain just imploded... :D
This stuff requires patience, concentration and will with a pen and paper while sitting at a desk in a blue room while being drugged up with stimulants to even begin to comprehend the theory.

Haha that's one way to put it, this is all I can think about now! Garrgh!!
 
So in another um, world universe time thing my head literally exploded while reading this but because I am always in the world I live forever in I'm still alive?
 
Funny thing is, I've never heard of this theory until now, but I've always had the nagging feeling that this is what life would be like.

There are many times in the past where I could have possibly died yet didn't. Sometimes the chances of death were small ( flying through a bad storm in a plane in the 80's), sometimes moderate (rolling a car, almost falling out of a car door, heart problems, present at a riot), sometimes big (falling on the back of my neck off a vault, falling headfirst off my bike onto a cement planter, extreme hypoglycemia, being the fourth pregnancy and the first to actually come out non-stillborn).

I've often pondered whether I would actually experience death when the time comes or whether I would instead live to see the best possible outcome of my life.

See, we live in a Universe where trillions upon trillions of turns of the dice have produced a world suited for us. And even more turns of the dice have resulted in us being born. Would it not be poetic if this particular Universe was one in which I was not only born, but one wherein I actually get live out my life to the fullest.

And, yes, I do consider it a kind of hell, outliving everyone else. But I'll remember you fondly as I sit on my rocking chair in my 250th year, surveying the wasteland that was once the Earth...

Alternatively, given that all of us are unique in a quantum mechanical way, and that information can't be destroyed or created... we could possibly, at the point of death, relive our lives backwards, and loop forwards again at the point of inception... in this aspect, live infinitely within a finite loop.
 
Ok I just read the actual article and so what. Time travel is impossible so he wouldn't go back in time to shoot himself. It's a time travel problem which is that time travel creates a paradox. You can't go back in time and do something or it will change the future making you not even doing it in the first place. What of he did pull the trigger and it did fire and kill him. Than he wouldn't of been able to back and try again because shot one was it.
 
Exorcet
Or it produces a new event which spawns a new universe.

No, you don't get it. If I get a gun and step into a time machine and go back 5min and shoot myself with it I will be dead. However how can I be dead if I came from the future to shoot myself. I should of been dead already since it was 5min before I shot myself.

This view of multiple universes isn't new either. There are theories that have you do something totally different in each of them, but are sometimes linked and sometimes not linked to each other. Doesn't matter because you can't ever go to them since that would be like time travel and if your going to time travel to one in this life in another you will be traveling to a different one and so on. When you get to this other universe it will be the exact same since all the other universes are doing the same thing.
 
I don't even.

The whole possibility thing reminds me of the movie "Run Lola Run" where every aspect is take into consideration and alters events in the future.
 
It's based on quantum mechanics's weird rules. Google/Wiki Schrodinger's cat for something similar.

Don't go around hurting peoples brains. I know your smart but some people aren't ready for that.

Just to let you know Schrodinger's Cat will mind:censored: you for the next week alone as you begin to ponder it more and more, basically fair warning from me to those who read this.
 
The original article isn't a time travel thing. It's a quantum mechanical thing.

To summarize:

1. In Quantum mechanics, observation collapses the wave function such that you observe either x or y happening.

2. If you observe y, you die.

3. Since, if you die, there is no more observer, then you will always observe x.

4. Quantum immortality!
 
shmogt
No, you don't get it. If I get a gun and step into a time machine and go back 5min and shoot myself with it I will be dead. However how can I be dead if I came from the future to shoot myself. I should of been dead already since it was 5min before I shot myself.
When you go back in time, it creates an entirely different timeline, so anything you do there can't effect the universe you started in.

Ex: start in universe A. You go back in time, the moment you effect anything, you create an alternate universe; universe 1. So if you kill yourself in universe 1, you're only killing the universe 1 version of yourself. But, universe A you is still alive.

Just a theory.


EDIT: Right, sorry, forgot to keep on topic.
 
Hate to spoil it for you people but there is no hell or heaven. It's impossible. First of all why would there be only for humans and not animals? What makes us so much better just cause we are smarter? Doesn't make sense. Or are you telling me that there is hell for animals. Is there a squirrel hell. Who would go there the ones who killed others because they had rabies and it's not really there fault. That would be killing which is wrong tho. The point I'm making is there can't be a hell or heaven because it would be too much confusion on which to go to.

...who says it would only be for Humans, Quantum Mechanics doesn't pick and choose, it isn't some hair brained religion. However, I digress cause I respect you and this isn't the religion vs non-religion thread. I only bring this up cause your post seems more toward what religion says than what is being talked about here.
 
All these theories are just that. If you die you are dead but another you are alive. None of it matter because it will never be proven and because of that makes it irrelevant. Good for a movie maybe lol.
 
All these theories are just that. If you die you are dead but another you are alive. None of it matter because it will never be proven and because of that makes it irrelevant. Good for a movie maybe lol.

Well I can't say it wont ever be proven, that's a bold conclusion to come to.
 
It can't be because if you do something in one the others are also doing something. Which is why I brought up the time travel thing since they are the same. If you plan on going to another one somehow the you in the other one is also planning in going to another. So when you walk threw the time travel machine or whatever so will the other universe you making you come back to the one you already started in. You may actually be in a different one but will have no way to tell since the other you is gone and everything else is the same.
 
It can't be because if you do something in one the others are also doing something. Which is why I brought up the time travel thing since they are the same. If you plan on going to another one somehow the you in the other one is also planning in going to another. So when you walk threw the time travel machine or whatever so will the other universe you making you come back to the one you already started in. You may actually be in a different one but will have no way to tell since the other you is gone and everything else is the same.

...So what I'm getting from you is that all dopple gangers of you are doing the same thing in parallel universes? That is more bold of a conclusion than being able to prove a single parallel universe to begin with.
 
I'm basing this on the theory that all the universes are the same yet slightly different. You move your right arm in one you move it in all them, but the direction and height is different a million billion times. A small difference for each universe. However if you are planning on visiting one of these other universes which would be the only way to prove this crazy theory you would have to build some sort of time machine. Time travel to the past has been proven impossible by science due to the paradox situation I already explained, but not entirely ruled out to the future. So we assume you have somehow made a time travel machine to go to a different universe. In all these universe they all do different things, but it all works out to the same conclusion meaning they did it different ways and time machines where made in all them. When you walk threw it in that moment in time every universe is 100% lined up with one enough allowing you to move threw. When you get to the other side it will be identical to the one you came from and there will be no changes since the you in all the other universes did the exact same thing. Thus making it impossible to ever prove and only a theory.
 
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