Make all cars available from the start?

[CBH]

While I still kind of like the good old GT Mode career model (although I'd love a mixture of that and a proper racing career instead), I do realize that after 15 years it has gotten stale for many as well turned people off from playing the game.

So, again - why is it bad to offer people other ways to enjoy the game? How does it affect you personally and your enjoyment of the game?

If they want to enjoy cars available at the start of a game, go to the one place the arcade mode and they can have all the fun their, and leave the career mode the way has it always been. My enjoyment when I get GT7 go straight to the career mode an enjoy wining races, getting credits and buying cars and stuff that where the true fun is.

 

[MXH]

If they want to enjoy cars available at the start of a game, go to the one place the arcade mode and they can have all the fun their, and leave the career mode the way has it always been. My enjoyment when I get GT7 go straight to the career mode an enjoy wining races, getting credits and buying cars and stuff that where the true fun is.

Emphasis on ''my enjoyment''. What you and I might enjoy shouldn't dictate other players' experience. How they choose to play the game won't affect anyone else but themselves.

After all, it doesn't hurt anyone. Remember?

 

[Fat Tyre]

Yes I have brought a car in real life a Ford Laser, to your second question, you can try them out in the arcade mode and I hope every car in the dealership can be in the arcade mode in GT7 to try out before you buy.

There you go, now you can change your answer to yes. If you would take a moment to carefully read what others have wrote you would see that they are referring to having cars unlocked for arcade and online modes. They would be fine leaving career mode as it is, they don't have any desire of doing any grinding whatsoever.

Another question. Would you oppose to being able to carry over your progress from GT6 to GT7? So lets say you only had 500 cars bought/unlocked in GT6 then for the next game you are only grinding for 700 or 800 more cars.

Final question. What is your take on collector's editions giving players several "unlocked" cars before they even compete in one race? Does that trouble your enjoyment as well?

 

[CBH]

Emphasis on ''my enjoyment''. What you and I might enjoy shouldn't dictate other players' experience. How they choose to play the game won't affect anyone else but themselves.

After all, it doesn't hurt anyone. Remember?

As I have said the arcade mode is the only place for this and not the career mode, I hope GT7 has all the cars form the dealership in the arcade mode so you can have that fun.

 

[CBH]

There you go, now you can change your answer to yes. If you would take a moment to carefully read what others have wrote you would see that they are referring to having cars unlocked for arcade and online modes. They would be fine leaving career mode as it is, they don't have any desire of doing any grinding whatsoever.

Another question. Would you oppose to being able to carry over your progress from GT6 to GT7? So lets say you only had 500 cars bought/unlocked in GT6 then for the next game you are only grinding for 700 or 800 more cars.

Final question. What is your take on collector's editions giving players several "unlocked" cars before they even compete in one race? Does that trouble your enjoyment as well?

To your first question, I have not thought about it Sorry. to your second question, Do you mean like the anniversary edition cars you get when you buy GT6.

 

[MXH]

As I have said the arcade mode is the only place for this and not the career mode, I hope GT7 has all the cars form the dealership in the arcade mode so you can have that fun.

You never explain why though. Is it the fact that it goes against your idea of how GT Mode should be, now and forever?

Frankly, I'll have to agree with Johnny about the one-size-fits-all model, which is getting pretty outdated at this point. I really think it needs to evolve, offer more options and add different career paths.

Final question. What is your take on collector's editions giving players several "unlocked" cars before they even compete in one race? Does that trouble your enjoyment as well?

Anniversary cars. Chromelines. Stealth cars. In-game credits. Oh, the horror!

 

[Fat Tyre]

To your first question, I have not thought about it Sorry. to your second question, Do you mean like the anniversary edition cars you get when you buy GT6.

Exactly just like the Anniversary edition cars. I ordered that version therefore I didn't start with 20k cr. and one car, I started with a million cr. and about 10 cars I think. So you see Kaz himself bends that rule you think is set in stone.

 

[niky]

Long, meandering woe-is-me post

Imagine... I haven't even had the time to get on GTPlanet today... because I spent most of it behind the wheel of a Jetta hypermiling in a media challenge...

I'm so lazy.

 

[CBH]

Exactly just like the Anniversary edition cars. I ordered that version therefore I didn't start with 20k cr. and one car, I started with a million cr. and about 10 cars I think. So you see Kaz himself bends that rule you think is set in stone.

But you payed for the GT6 Anniversary edition which cost a lot more than the GT6 Standard Edition.

 

[Johnnypenso]

Alright, I'm awake and active this time. Let me see here

About the 6/4 split you did, that doesn't make sense. The way I see it , if it's done ( ie. All Cars Available) then 100% of players will be happy and if it isn't done then 40% of players will be unhappy. So as I'm part of the 'No' crowd, if it's done then I should be happy about what I'm not happy about? Nah son, doesn't work like that. Weren't you guys the ones who brought up the act of "forcing" in to the picture?

In terms of the poll, the way it should be looked at is this: If it's done, 40% are happy, 60% aren't happy , If it isn't done then 40% unhappy, 60% happy. In this case, the higher number should be favoured. That's how a poll works doesn't it? The public has spoken.... Well they're still speaking.

Options are good but in this case it shouldn't be an option in my opinion. Why? It's because of what consequences it will bring for GT. As @ironman44321 said,



However, I think it's a good idea to reduce the prices of some cars, have a bigger pool of cars for arcade and online along with having a test drive feature. Also, winning more cash from achievements from races. Speaking of features, if all cars aren't available then some say potential features will be killed off, what about the flip-side? No UCD? No Potential Auction House?

This thing of saying it's 'forceful', 'abusive', 'tedious', 'Soldier-fashion' to play GT Life and grind for cars (Personally I haven't spent 5 hours grinding for a car in 1 stint, I was just smart with how I got money in game without micro-transactions. As a matter fact, who has time to buy all the cars let alone drive all of them even?) when it has even been said that AI and the latter will be improved is just a plea to make the game easier and have parity.

This is just in the case of GT though. @Johnnypenso , since I know you love Project CARS , please explain how and why it will benefit from their side? I'm not saying it's bad to have Cars Available from the start in general, for some games it has worked but as I've said, In the case of GT it shouldn't follow suite.

Why would you be unhappy about me getting an option to play the game a different way from you, that doesn't affect you in any way, so long as you still have your classic GT Career Mode? Do you understand the word "option"?

 

[Tornado]

But you payed for the GT6 Anniversary edition which cost a lot more than the GT6 Standard Edition.

Actually it cost exactly the same.

 

[Fat Tyre]

But you payed for the GT6 Anniversary edition which cost a lot more than the GT6 Standard Edition.

You said

This is what everyone is going to do when they buy GT7, you start of with 20,000 credits then buy a car to win races and build up your credits and buy some cars and stuff as you go along...

Costs aside that shows you that even today you have different ways to play the game, even career mode. A lot of other people have played the game in a different way to the one you think is the ONLY way. That extra option didn't ruin YOUR enjoyment of the game it just allowed others to play it differently.

Regardless there is no point continuing with this since you already agreed that it is fine to have all cars unlocked for arcade/online.

 

[CBH]

Actually it cost exactly the same.

No, on the Gran Turismo.com website there is a $20 difference in costs.

 

[Johnnypenso]

No, on the Gran Turismo.com website there is a $20 difference in costs.

I paid the same price for the Anniv. edition in December as the regular version as a pre-order.

 

[CBH]

You said

Costs aside that shows you that even today you have different ways to play the game, even career mode. A lot of other people have played the game in a different way to the one you think is the ONLY way. That extra option didn't ruin YOUR enjoyment of the game it just allowed others to play it differently.

Regardless there is no point continuing with this since you already agreed that it is fine to have all cars unlocked for arcade/online.

When GT7 comes out they can go straight to the Arcade Mode and have their fun in there. 👍

 

[FS7]

But you payed for the GT6 Anniversary edition which cost a lot more than the GT6 Standard Edition.

Here in Brazil Anniversary edition is the only one available and it costs the same as any other regular PS3 game. In my case I got it for half price at a sale, so I'm wondering how many players had their game ruined because of me getting GT6 for half price and having 25 cars available from the start in my career garage.

 

[lazywolfe]

Redacted

 

[TayeezSA]

Why would you be unhappy about me getting an option to play the game a different way from you, that doesn't affect you in any way, so long as you still have your classic GT Career Mode? Do you understand the word "option"?

Yes, I do understand the meaning of the word option. The ability to choose.

As I've said. If it's in the case of Online and Arcade then it's alright, just with some exclusions. Simulator Mode should be left alone.

GT3 - GT4 if memory serves, you could transfer credits from GT3 - 4

 

[Johnnypenso]

Yes, I do understand the meaning of the word option. The ability to choose.

As I've said. If it's in the case of Online and Arcade then it's alright, just with some exclusions. Simulator Mode should be left alone.

GT3 - GT4 if memory serves, you could transfer credits from GT3 - 4

I believe you actually said:

Options are good but in this case it shouldn't be an option in my opinion. Why? It's because of what consequences it will bring for GT.

Have you now changed your mind and you're ok with having the option of all cars from the start in online and arcade? What exclusions are you referring to?

 

[Earth]

To the crowd that thinks offering all cars in some separate mode negatively affects the career mode, please read and respond to these questions. I honestly want to understand your perspective:

Pretend Call of Duty 15 has come out. It has a multi-player online (let's say mode A) and multi-player offline mode (mode B). In these modes, all weapons, stages, characters, whatever, are available to the player from the start. It also has a single player campaign-style mode (mode C) with 8 missions where you start from mission 1 and progress linearly after you complete some objective. Weapons are gradually introduced in the later stages. This mode has 3 difficulty settings: Easy, Normal, Hard.

- Is the enjoyment of mode C negatively affected by modes A and B because they have everything available from the start? If so, how?

Assume modes A and B do *not* have everything available from the start and that those features (weapons, stages, etc) are unlocked as you progress through mode C.

- Do you believe this scenario is better than the first one? If so, why?

Again, assume modes A and B do *not* have everything available as mentioned before. But now, the developers add cheat codes that unlock everything in modes A and B. In addition, they provide a code to skip to any mission desired and to unlock all weapons in mode C.

- Has this cheat code negatively affected the game? If so, how?

Multiplayer offline and Multiplayer online? What?

 

[ironman44321]

Other than saying it's your opinion, why don't you think it will make for a better game to have an "all cars" option? Keep in mind, no one is advocating that it be the only way to play, just one of several. I'd like to see a classic GT career mode, various other career modes perhaps linked with FIA participation, Career Designer etc. So if you choose when you fire up your game, you can just choose GT Classic Career and off you go and you'll never know any different. I can choose, "all cars" and start racing online in just about any race. Who is worse off with that?

Well for starters, where do the options end? Maybe I want an option to do a career that runs in chronological order that starts with the oldest cars and goes to the newest. Maybe I want an option to only drive and race Japanese cars, what about Italian cars? German cars? French cars? Maybe I want to be able to only see red cars.

How many options do we get? Who decides what we get?

Once we get those figured out, are they worth the effort? It's going to take time and resources to add this options to the game. So, does PD take away from other things to add them? Or do they push the game back so they can add them?

What are you (or the rest of the fanbase) wiling to give up to have options (remember that there would likely be several, only one of them being the one you want) or how much extra time would you want to wait?

 

[Tornado]

Maybe I want an option to do a career that runs in chronological order that starts with the oldest cars and goes to the newest.

That would actually be a pretty cool new way for PD to design the game, though as an "option" it is questionable as a comparison to this thread since it would require an entirely new career mode to be done from scratch. Since they basically just churn out the same career mode with tweaks game after game (even reusing UI art assets from GT4 in the process), that would be a pretty daunting task to say the least.

Maybe I want an option to only drive and race Japanese cars, what about Italian cars? German cars? French cars?

Things that the game is already capable of doing so (and does do so) under certain circumstances means that these aren't really examples that detract from what is being said in this thread.

Along those lines:

Maybe I want to be able to only see red cars.

Luckily, even though this would be hardest theoretical option for PD to actually implement since I'm pretty sure there is no option built into the game as it stands to determine what color a car actually represents as painted, it is esoteric enough to be meaningless to the conversation.

How many options do we get? Who decides what we get?

Sadly, the people who decided forcing you to buy a Honda Fit when you boot up the game was an improvement to the GT formula after 3 years of people shouting from the rooftops for change to how GT is designed.

Once we get those figured out, are they worth the effort?

Quite a few threads on this topic, two of which were in the past 6 months, and not a single soul has stepped forward and explained why this specific option is not worth doing when the effort required would be minimal and the potential reward could be great. Well, aside from hall90's repeated appeals to how "" the idea is, of course.

It's going to take time and resources to add this options to the game. So, does PD take away from other things to add them? Or do they push the game back so they can add them?
What are you (or the rest of the fanbase) wiling to give up to have options (remember that there would likely be several, only one of them being the one you want) or how much extra time would you want to wait?
Once we get those figured out, are they worth the effort? It's going to take time and resources to add this options to the game. So, does PD take away from other things to add them? Or do they push the game back so they can add them?

How much time and resources and effort would it take to expand the already functioning car list you can choose from arcade mode to include every car? I know this is PD we're talking about; the same developer who removed a feature (B-Spec) they had already started from scratch both times they had included it and promised its return for this game and promptly forgot all about it to date, but I struggle to think they would have worked themselves into a corner so that they have to manually program each car available to the player in quick select into the game.

 

[ironman44321]

That would actually be a pretty cool new way for PD to design the game, though as an "option" it is questionable as a comparison to this thread since it would require an entirely new career mode to be done from scratch. Since they basically just churn out the same career mode with tweaks game after game (even reusing UI art assets from GT4 in the process), that would be a pretty daunting task to say the least.


Things that the game is already capable of doing so (and does do so) under certain circumstances means that these aren't really examples that detract from what is being said in this thread.

Along those lines:

Luckily, even though this would be hardest theoretical option for PD to actually implement since I'm pretty sure there is no option built into the game as it stands to determine what color a car actually represents as painted, it is esoteric enough to be meaningless to the conversation.


Sadly, the people who decided forcing you to buy a Honda Fit when you boot up the game was an improvement to the GT formula after 3 years of people shouting from the rooftops for change to how GT is designed.


Quite a few threads on this topic, two of which were in the past 6 months, and not a single soul has stepped forward and explained why this specific option is not worth doing when the effort required would be minimal and the potential reward could be great. Well, aside from hall90's repeated appeals to how "" the idea is, of course.


How much time and resources and effort would it take to expand the already functioning car list you can choose from arcade mode to include every car? I know this is PD we're talking about; the same developer who removed a feature (B-Spec) they had already started from scratch both times they had included it and promised its return for this game and promptly forgot all about it to date, but I struggle to think they would have worked themselves into a corner so that they have to manually program each car available to the player in quick select into the game.

I actually said in my original post that if PD want's to let people use any car in arcade mode than that's perfectly fine. That also would take very little effort and time.

What I don't agree with is making a separate GT mode that allows people to have any car they want right away for free. One of the issues I take with that idea is simply the time and effort it would take even though a fairly small percentage of players seem to want it (remember that the poll doesn't specify between all cars in arcade and a separate career mode).

The other reason I don't want that as an option is that it would really diminish the feeling of accomplishment even for those who use the regular GT mode. How many people would play through the regular career mode if there was an option to play through with everything unlocked right away? If you're playing online in CoD, how many people would take the time and effort to level up and unlock guns and such if you could just choose at the beginning to have everything unlocked?

Now, I'm not saying that every game should just jump ship and have everything unlocked at the beginning because more people will use it. I'm saying you'd have people who would otherwise be perfectly happy playing through normally feeling like there was little to no value in the normal game anymore.

 

[Johnnypenso]

I actually said in my original post that if PD want's to let people use any car in arcade mode than that's perfectly fine. That also would take very little effort and time.

What I don't agree with is making a separate GT mode that allows people to have any car they want right away for free. One of the issues I take with that idea is simply the time and effort it would take even though a fairly small percentage of players seem to want it (remember that the poll doesn't specify between all cars in arcade and a separate career mode).

The other reason I don't want that as an option is that it would really diminish the feeling of accomplishment even for those who use the regular GT mode. How many people would play through the regular career mode if there was an option to play through with everything unlocked right away? If you're playing online in CoD, how many people would take the time and effort to level up and unlock guns and such if you could just choose at the beginning to have everything unlocked?

Now, I'm not saying that every game should just jump ship and have everything unlocked at the beginning because more people will use it. I'm saying you'd have people who would otherwise be perfectly happy playing through normally feeling like there was little to no value in the normal game anymore.

So basically you're saying that your feeling of accomplishment from career mode will be diminished unless everyone else who has the game is forced to use the same career mode as you to progress throught the game and build a garage.

That's mind boggling.

NOTE: Yes I realize you said it was ok for Arcade Mode but Arcade Mode doesn't allow you to progress through the game.

 

[MXH]

What I don't agree with is making a separate GT mode that allows people to have any car they want right away for free. One of the issues I take with that idea is simply the time and effort it would take even though a fairly small percentage of players seem to want it (remember that the poll doesn't specify between all cars in arcade and a separate career mode).

What's the difference between having them unlocked in Arcade Mode or your garage in GT Mode, besides a few more lines of code?

The other reason I don't want that as an option is that it would really diminish the feeling of accomplishment even for those who use the regular GT mode. How many people would play through the regular career mode if there was an option to play through with everything unlocked right away?

If one's sense of accomplishment comes from what other players have or haven't achieved in GT Mode in comparison, then you're probably doing it wrong.

 

[ironman44321]

So basically you're saying that your feeling of accomplishment from career mode will be diminished unless everyone else who has the game is forced to use the same career mode as you to progress throught the game and build a garage.

That's mind boggling.

NOTE: Yes I realize you said it was ok for Arcade Mode but Arcade Mode doesn't allow you to progress through the game.

No actually, I'm not. I hardly play career mode. But, it's not hard to see a scenario where people would feel like that.

What's the difference between having them unlocked in Arcade Mode or your garage in GT Mode, besides a few more lines of code?


If one's sense of accomplishment comes from what other players have or haven't achieved in GT Mode in comparison, then you're probably doing it wrong.

Simply throwing all the cars into ones garage wouldn't work though. For one, your garage would be stuffed full of cars you might not even want that you'd then have to sort through. On top of that, you'd only have one of each car.

In order for it to really work you'd have to remove the money system from the game for those players. Which though I don't understand the intricacies of how the game is programmed, seems like a bit of a pain.

Haha I'm really enjoying the "well what you think is wrong " replies to me saying it would diminish the value of GT mode. I didn't realize there was a right or wrong answer here.

No wonder the poll is 99.9% for and just fickle selfish old me against. Wait...

Edit: This poll really needs more than just "yes" and "no" options. Since "all cars from the start" could take several different forms.

 

[Johnnypenso]

No actually, I'm not. I hardly play career mode. But, it's not hard to see a scenario where people would feel like that.

You can stop any change or progress with that same line of reasoning:

The game economy needs tweaking because stats show not many people drive the $20Mill cars.
Nope, can't do that, some people might think it reduces the exclusivity of those cars.

The physics could be much better.
Nope can't do that, some people might think it's too hard.

And on and on. Essentially it's a non-answer. You can't please everyone with every decision, but that doesn't mean you stop making decisions about the game or it stagnates and you churn out the same game version after version.

Simply throwing all the cars into ones garage wouldn't work though. For one, your garage would be stuffed full of cars you might not even want that you'd then have to sort through. On top of that, you'd only have one of each car.

There are numerous ways to handle this. The simplest is you just go and tick a box in each dealership for each car you want and it's downloaded into your garage. Essentially the same as you do right now, only without the money.

In order for it to really work you'd have to remove the money system from the game for those players. Which though I don't understand the intricacies of how the game is programmed, seems like a bit of a pain.

You don't have to do that at all. You could still have upgrades and tuning monetized and players could use seasonal events or online racing or part of the career mode to finance the upgrades. Removing the game economy should be relatively easy anyway, everything could stay the same, but opting for this mode could just zero out your transactions at the time of purchase.

Haha I'm really enjoying the "well what you think is wrong " replies to me saying it would diminish the value of GT mode. I didn't realize there was a right or wrong answer here.

No wonder the poll is 99.9% for and just fickle selfish old me against. Wait...

Edit: This poll really needs more than just "yes" and "no" options. Since "all cars from the start" could take several different forms

Ahhh, the martyr card. Kind of like the online version of the race card.👍

 

[CBH]

The simplest is you just go and tick a box in each dealership for each car you want and it's downloaded into your garage. Essentially the same as you do right now, only without the money.

What is the challenge in that Johnny, to tick a box in each dealership for each car you want and it's downloaded into your garage for free. I know why you want this to happen is to make it easy to get cars to progress through the game which is the silly idea.

 

[Johnnypenso]

What is the challenge in that Johnny, to tick a box in each dealership for each car you want and it's downloaded into your garage for free. I know why you want this to happen is to make it easy to get cars to progress through the game which is the silly idea.

I find no challenge in Career Mode and don't enjoy it. Who's silly now?

 

[CBH]

I find no challenge in Career Mode and don't enjoy it. Who's silly now?

If you don't enjoy it, and why are you talking about it, do you want free cars to progress through the game for, is it because the career mode is just to hard for you Johnny, and that is why you want free cars so it can become easy for you and to pick and choose that car for that event for not paying any credits for in the first place which is silly. Another reason why you don't enjoy the career mode Johnny, because you have to do some grinding and you just have to live with it.