Mass Shooting in Las Vegas

[Obelisk]

Same in the UK, you can even drive one alone on a learner (Class H) licence under certain circumstances. That raises an interesting point... as far as I'm aware there's no vetting for militaria ground vehicle sales, and imagine trying to stop one in the Nice attack?

I would think it's impractical because:

1. Tanks are loud. You'd hear it long before you'd see it.
2. It's a tank. People know tanks are big trouble.
3. Horrid fuel efficiency. Especially something like an M1 Abrams.

Just loose guesses based on what I know of tanks.

 

[Sprite]

Same in the UK, you can even drive one alone on a learner (Class H) licence under certain circumstances. That raises an interesting point... as far as I'm aware there's no vetting for militaria ground vehicle sales, and imagine trying to stop one in the Nice attack?

There is a guy on my bus journey who has one parked at the side of his house. unfortunately Google Maps isn't very clear.

 

[TenEightyOne]

I would think it's impractical because:

1. Tanks are loud. You'd hear it long before you'd see it.
2. It's a tank. People know tanks are big trouble.
3. Horrid fuel efficiency. Especially something like an M1 Abrams.

Just loose guesses based on what I know of tanks.

If you're used to seeing tanks (or other heavy armoured vehicles) around then 1 and 2 aren't really problems - especially in an area with a high police/military presence such as the kind of event one might want to attack. The people who are most likely to recognise that 2 is inbound are still going to have to stop the thing. I'm guessing that a road stinger isn't going to have much effect.

If one's going immediately to heaven then I imagine that 3 isn't a big concern either.

 

[Rage Racer]

I would think it's impractical because:

1. Tanks are loud. You'd hear it long before you'd see it.
2. It's a tank. People know tanks are big trouble.
3. Horrid fuel efficiency. Especially something like an M1 Abrams.

Just loose guesses based on what I know of tanks.

4. The tracks ruin the road.

But it could be useful as a nuclear shelter (modern MBTs have protection from radiation and chemicals). Especially if you lived in South Korea or Japan.

Same in the UK, you can even drive one alone on a learner (Class H) licence under certain circumstances. That raises an interesting point... as far as I'm aware there's no vetting for militaria ground vehicle sales, and imagine trying to stop one in the Nice attack?

Something like Iveco LMV would be fine for that.
Light armor (protects from pistol gunfire, at least), decent speed and easier to maintain and doesn't destroy the asphalt like a tank.

 

[Carbonox]

4. The tracks ruin the road.

I don't think a would-be terrorist would have much concern for the unbelievers' roads.

 

[Jump_Ace]

Yeah because it's totally is the weapons fault for what the individual did.

Could the guy do it without a gun? No. People kill people with guns. EOD.


Jerome

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

Time to ban fully automatic machineguns. Anyone know exactly what type of weapon the shooter use?

 

[Danoff]

Could the guy do it without a gun? No. People kill people with guns. EOD.

Sarcasm detector is going off... I think.

Time to ban fully automatic machineguns. Anyone know exactly what type of weapon the shooter use?

Irony detector is going off.

 

[Obelisk]

Time to ban fully automatic machineguns. Anyone know exactly what type of weapon the shooter use?

For all intents and purposes, the fully automatic weapon has been banned since 1986.

Also, important aside: A machine gun is a crew-served weapon firing a high caliber weapon and mounted on a tripod or vehicle. A light machine gun can be operated by one man but fulfills a similar role.

The shooter here used a semi-automatic or selective fire carbine or rifle, although they said they found 10 different weapons in his apartment. He was a licensed hunter, so I suspect he had some stuff in high caliber hunting rounds (7.62 (.308 Winchester) comes to mind).

 

[Dotini]

It turns out the guy was a former pilot, firearms expert and licensed hunter in Alaska and elsewhere. He had converted/retrofitted approximately 10 AR-15's into full auto.

 

[Jump_Ace]

Sarcasm detector is going off... I think.

No sarcasm, time to calibrate your radar

It boggles the mind why people continue to support guns these days. I love the irony that Republicans support guns which people use to kill others yet hate the notion of abortion. Which is it? Do you 'support life', or not?


Jerome

 

[Danoff]

No sarcasm, time to calibrate your radar

It boggles the mind why people continue to support guns these days. I love the irony that Republicans support guns which people use to kill others yet hate the notion of abortion. Which is it? Do you 'support life', or not?

Ok, sorry for the misunderstanding.

Could the guy do it without a gun? No. People kill people with guns. EOD.

Yes, the guy could do it without a gun. People kill people. EOD.

 

[Obelisk]

He had converted/retrofitted approximately 10 AR-15's into full auto.

Those kind of things aren't legal, are they?

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

Sarcasm detector is going off... I think.



Irony detector is going off.

What you mean exactly?

For all intents and purposes, the fully automatic weapon has been banned since 1986.

Also, important aside: A machine gun is a crew-served weapon firing a high caliber weapon and mounted on a tripod or vehicle. A light machine gun can be operated by one man but fulfills a similar role.

The shooter here used a semi-automatic or selective fire carbine or rifle, although they said they found 10 different weapons in his apartment. He was a licensed hunter, so I suspect he had some stuff in high caliber hunting rounds (7.62 (.308 Winchester) comes to mind).

So how the shooter get this automatic weapon? He Steal it? Or maybe buy illegally?

 

[Danoff]

What you mean exactly?

I find it funny that you're calling for a weapon ban in response to this event without knowing the weapon used in this event.

 

[Obelisk]

What you mean exactly?


So how the shooter get this automatic weapon? He Steal it? Or maybe buy illegally?

He had converted/retrofitted approximately 10 AR-15's into full auto.

^This is what happened. Full auto conversions are highly illegal.

Plus, the guy had the AR-15s likely for hunting. He was a licensed hunter elsewhere in the States.

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

I find it funny that you're calling for a weapon ban in response to this event without knowing the weapon used in this event.

You can hear from video that the weapon is 100% fully automatic. What I'm ask is EXACTLY what type of weapon he use...

^This is what happened. Full auto conversions are highly illegal.

Plus, the guy had the AR-15s likely for hunting. He was a licensed hunter elsewhere in the States.

This is confirmed that he use the AR-15 rifle for the shooting?

 

[hejustsits]

It absolutely beggars belief.

 

[Obelisk]

This is confirmed that he use the AR-15 rifle for the shooting?

Yes. Banning the AR-15 will not change anything because it wasn't the weapon's fault that the shooting occurred. It's just a tool.

 

[hejustsits]

Yes. Banning the AR-15 will not change anything because it wasn't the weapon's fault that the shooting occurred. It's just a tool.

But why is it then, that in the US, where firearms like these are legal, people are twenty times more likely to be killed by gun violence than other similarly developed nations? If it's not the guns, then what is it? Something in the water?

 

[ExigeEvan]

Same in the UK, you can even drive one alone on a learner (Class H) licence under certain circumstances. That raises an interesting point... as far as I'm aware there's no vetting for militaria ground vehicle sales, and imagine trying to stop one in the Nice attack?

Tanks are hard to relocate, moving one to an urban area would raise suspicions. They're hard to drive and change direction. They're not particularly fast (especially those that are the hands of enthusiasts). Some models are relatively inexpensive but difficult to maintain.

I'd reasonably expect most people could out run the danger before it made first contact.

 

[Danoff]

But why is it then, that in the US, where firearms like these are legal, people are twenty times more likely to be killed by gun violence than other similarly developed nations? If it's not the guns, then what is it? Something in the water?

"by gun violence" is not the right metric, "by violence" is the right metric. "Gun violence" is not the problem to solve, "violence" is the problem to solve... unless you care whether you get killed by a bullet, knife, car, or bomb.

 

[Obelisk]

But why is it then, that in the US, where firearms like these are legal, people are twenty times more likely to be killed by gun violence than other similarly developed nations? If it's not the guns, then what is it? Something in the water?

Twenty times is an over-exaggeration. This article from February 2016 gives us a more accurate ten-fold increase instead of twenty fold. As for why that is? I honestly am not sure. Perhaps it's because everyone thinks everyone else is armed.

The primary issue with gun control is it will not prevent true criminals from getting their hands on weapons. Remember, during the Prohibition era, it was equally likely for both Mafia and police to be able to buy the Thompson SMG, even though it was absurdly expensive for its time (half the cost of a then-new car).

In today's day and age, anyone who wants to buy a gun and have it now can find cartels and gangs without too much difficulty. Most of those are stolen or imported illegally, which really isn't something gun control laws can touch.

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

Yes. Banning the AR-15 will not change anything because it wasn't the weapon's fault that the shooting occurred. It's just a tool.

Yes if you ban the semi automatic rifle, the shooting will not happen. 50+ will not die if you do that before this happen.

 

[Danoff]

Yes if you ban the semi automatic rifle, the shooting will not happen. 50+ will not die if you do that before this happen.

Let's ban killing people.

 

[TetsuKobura]

Yes if you ban the semi automatic rifle, the shooting will not happen. 50+ will not die if you do that before this happen.

You are far more likely to die by a handgun, or hell, even a freakin' knife than you will by rifle.
Source: https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/table-20
Might not be "current" but you can clearly see the difference between rifle and handgun.

 

[Todo Em Lixo]

Let's ban killing people.

Let's unban and see what happen =)

You are far more likely to die by a handgun than you will by rifle.
Source: https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2014/crime-in-the-u.s.-2014/tables/table-20
Might not be "current" but you can clearly see the difference between rifle and handgun.

This type of shooting that we see inside Las Vegas is possible with only a handgun?

 

[Danoff]

You can hear from video that the weapon is 100% fully automatic. What I'm ask is EXACTLY what type of weapon he use...

...not an "automatic machine gun"... which you called for banning. Irony.

More irony, automatic weapons are legal to obtain and weren't used. Instead, an illegal-to-possess modified semi-automatic weapon was used.

Let's unban and see what happen =)

A lot more gun sales.

 

[TetsuKobura]

Let's unban and see what happen =)

This type of shooting that we see inside Las Vegas is possible with only a handgun?

That wasn't what I was referring to. Read the first part of the post I quoted. Banning the semi auto rifle does NOTHING, especially since you are banning something that causes far less deaths than normal handguns or knives.

 

[Obelisk]

Let's unban and see what happen =)

This type of shooting that we see inside Las Vegas is possible with only a handgun?

This is a rare situation where someone who knew what he was doing and had malicious intent decided to take multiple innocent lives. As a matter of fact, this guy probably picked the hotel he did just because he knew return fire (people shooting back at him) would cause unwanted civilian casualties. Think about it. 32nd floor of a busy hotel, in two of the hundreds of windows around that part of the building. How many other rooms were occupied? Also think about this: A pistol cannot hit 400 yards. A rifle can. He was sniping people from 400 yards away.

This has happened before.