North Korea, Sanctions, and Kim Jong-un

[Azuremen]

I forgot the million bit, look again

Whoops. Not that it matters sense we are discussing an absurdly hypothetical brought on by a member that has a tendency for hyperbole. The fact is North Korea could likely kill several million, which isn't something to be taken lightly.

 

[Bacon]

Do you really think that NK have the capability to kill over 1000 million people?

A full scale nuclear war can. So if it came down to it and the USA needed to strike North Korea first before a global nuclear war broke out, they must do it.

 

[MisterWhiskers]

Whoops. Not that it matters sense we are discussing an absurdly hypothetical brought on by a member that has a tendency for hyperbole. The fact is North Korea could likely kill several million, which isn't something to be taken lightly.

I am convinced that their military power is not much. If they try to launch a nuke at South Korea or the US possibly, the US military power will counter-attack. You are right about how the situation should not be taken lightly. North Korea may not be powerful, but many lives at risk should be taken seriously. There is always that %1.

 

[Dennisch]

The US of A or the UN can cripple North Korea without causing Global nuclear war.
Even if the North creates a mushroomcloud somewhere in the world. Which I highly doubt.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

A full scale nuclear war can. So if it came down to it and the USA needed to strike North Korea first before a global nuclear war broke out, they must do it.

Which will never happen, so that's the end of that.

 

[Bacon]

Which will never happen, so that's the end of that.

Ah because you know how to predict the future, yes? People think a lot of things won't happen and they don't. An equal amount of times they do.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

Ah because you know how to predict the future, yes? People think a lot of things won't happen and they don't. An equal amount of times they do.

I do, how did you know?

I was blessed with this gift by a gypsy many years ago.

 

[arora]

NK is not going to do anything worth a hissy I'm sure. It's important to understand that no one wants the bad things. The grinding down will continue imo and it will work eventually.

 

[gokartman78]

Ah because you know how to predict the future, yes? People think a lot of things won't happen and they don't. An equal amount of times they do.

There would be very very few circumstances in which the US would fire a Nuclear missile, and even fewer where they initiated a war with a nuclear missile.

 

[Bacon]

I do, how did you know?

I was blessed with this gift by a gypsy many years ago.

I predicted that kind of reply

There would be very very few circumstances in which the US would fire a Nuclear missile, and even fewer where they initiated a war with a nuclear missile.

Hey, missiles don't kill people. Assumptions do.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

I predicted that kind of reply

Wow. U r teh smartz. I wuff woo, fwend <3.

Hey, missiles don't kill people. Assumptions do.

I thought that was guns, or rappers, or the NHS or something. I'unno.

Don't you think that there would be some sort of build-up (and by build up I mean something more than a short, fat kid shouting the odds) to a nuclear war? I doubt any military with nuclear weapons is going to launch one just because.
Until that happens, I'd put all of my savings on a nuclear war not happening.

 

[MisterWhiskers]

There would be very very few circumstances in which the US would fire a Nuclear missile, and even fewer where they initiated a war with a nuclear missile.

But it still is possible! Lives are at risk; a lot of them! Analogy: The Soviet Union (USA) hockey team in the 80's were absolutely unstoppable, but the US (NK) beat them 4-3.I know I'm using the US as NK but you know what I mean.

 

[Bacon]

Wow. U r teh smartz. I wuff woo, fwend <3.



I thought that was guns, or rappers, or the NHS or something. I'unno.

Don't you think that there would be some sort of build-up (and by build up I mean something more than a short, fat kid shouting the odds) to a nuclear war? I doubt any military with nuclear weapons is going to launch one just because.
Until that happens, I'd put all of my savings on a nuclear war not happening.

I take it you did get the little joke in my reply. I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes, nuclear war probably won't happen. That doesn't mean we can all assume it won't. We have to assume it will if we are going to have the best chance of preventing it if the worst scenario does happen as it is always a possibility.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

But it still is possible! Lives are at risk; a lot of them! Analogy: The Soviet Union (USA) hockey team in the 80's were absolutely unstoppable, but the US (NK) beat them 4-3.I know I'm using the US as NK but you know what I mean.

GTP Worst Analogy 2013? Or ever? Whichever it is, you're bound to get an award for that.

I take it you did get the little joke in my reply. I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes, nuclear war probably won't happen. That doesn't mean we can all assume it won't. We have to assume it will if we are going to have the best chance of preventing it if the worst scenario does happen as it is always a possibility.

That doesn't mean that you can assume that I'm not

We already have the best way of preventing it - anti-ballistic missiles (especially in the case of a country like N.K who couldn't care less about coming to the table to talk like grown ups).

 

[McLaren]

But it still is possible! Lives are at risk; a lot of them! Analogy: The Soviet Union (USA) hockey team in the 80's were absolutely unstoppable, but the US (NK) beat them 4-3.I know I'm using the US as NK but you know what I mean.

That had to be the worst analogy I've ever read on here.

I suggest you actually do some reading up on the topic of "sports upsets" before attempting to use one as analogy to "anything is possible".

 

[Bacon]

That doesn't mean that you can assume that I'm not

There we go. That's why assumption is so dangerous and so hard to avoid. It's built into our brains. We all like to assume and predict and we think they are correct and when they are not we are all taken by surprise. NK may just surprise all of us which is why the US government are on such high alert and not assuming NK will do nothing.

 

[Joel]

That had to be the worst analogy I've ever read on here.

I suggest you actually do some reading up on the topic of "sports upsets" before attempting to use one as analogy to "anything is possible".

The 1980 US Olympic hockey gold vs the Soviets was one of the biggest upsets in hockey (and sports) history (there's a reason it's called the Miracle on Ice). That was before NHL players went to the Olympics, so the US team was comprised of NCAA players who by and large didn't go on to play professionally. The Soviet team was a state run and trained team full of the absolute best players in the Soviet Union, in a time where USA Hockey was a shadow of what it is now. The Soviet team was one of if not the best international hockey teams of all time, and in exhibition games the year before went 5-3-1 against NHL teams, and beat an NHL all star team 6-0.

The Miracle on Ice would be like if an NCAA basketball team beat the US Olympic basketball team (and the US Olympic basketball team played and trained together from the time they were 16). If the US were to beat Russia in hockey today it's really not an upset because best on best players it's pretty close. But we're talking about a team comprised of the best Russian players against a rag tag collection of NCAA hockey players. It was a colossal upset.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

NK may just surprise all of us which is why the US government are on such high alert and not assuming NK will do nothing.

There is making a wild assumption, and taking an educated guess. I don't make wild assumptions - I look at all the information and make a judgement from that.

Even if N.K do launch something big, it will be intercepted before it gets wherever it was trying to go. There will be no real surprises, because all bases are covered... unless they decide to act like a normal country, that'd be a huge surprise!

 

[McLaren]

The 1980 US Olympic hockey gold vs the Soviets was one of the biggest upsets in hockey (and sports) history (there's a reason it's called the Miracle on Ice). That was before NHL players went to the Olympics, so the US team was comprised of NCAA players who by and large didn't go on to play professionally. The Soviet team was a state run and trained team full of the absolute best players in the Soviet Union, in a time where USA Hockey was a shadow of what it is now. The Soviet team was one of if not the best international hockey teams of all time. The Miracle on Ice would be like if an NCAA basketball team beat the US Olympic basketball team (and the US Olympic basketball team played and trained together from the time they were 16).

If the US were to beat Russia in hockey today it's really not an upset because best on best players it's pretty close. But we're talking about a team comprised of the best Russian players against a rag tag collection of NCAA hockey players. It was a colossal upset.

That's all known & amazing, but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a sports upset. Is it the biggest & most famous? Yes. Is occurrence of such events rare in sports? No. Giants vs Patriots 2007, Mike Tyson's loss, low seed teams down 0-2 in NBA Playoffs, Rulon Gardner, etc.

 

[Joel]

That's all known & amazing, but it doesn't change the fact that it's still a sports upset. Is it the biggest & most famous? Yes. Is occurrence of such events rare in sports? No. Giants vs Patriots 2007, Mike Tyson's loss, Seed #8 Nuggets down 0-2 in NBA Playoffs, Rulon Gardner, etc.

Well yeah of course . I agree that sports analogies aren't really fitting for war, but it's as good of a sports upset you can get as one. Upsets do happen in every league all the time, but ones of that degree don't happen that often.

Sorry, just thought you were diminishing it as an upset.

 

[arora]

That had to be the worst analogy I've ever read on here.

Yeah, that is not working in the smallest degree lol.

 

[McLaren]

Well yeah of course . I agree that sports analogies aren't really fitting for war, but it's as good of a sports upset you can get as one. Upsets do happen in every league all the time, but ones of that degree don't happen that often.

Sorry, just thought you were diminishing it as an upset.

Not at all. There's been nothing quite like it in the history of sports, so it'd be incredibly ignorant to diminish it as such.

I'm just still trying to wrap my head as to how a hockey game which requires 2 opponents is an analogy in any way to gokartman's post that referred to whether or not 1 nation would unlikely in any circumstance fire a nuke, let alone use one to initiate a war. I don't think the game of odds-to-1 works applies the same way.

 

[Joel]

I'm just still trying to wrap my head as to how a hockey game which requires 2 opponents is an analogy in any way to gokartman's post that referred to whether or not 1 nation would unlikely in any circumstance fire a nuke, let alone use one to initiate a war. I don't think the game of odds-to-1 works applies the same way.

I kinda skimmed th thread so didn't see that part. Thought he just meant the potential of NK beating the US in a war.

 

[MisterWhiskers]

That had to be the worst analogy I've ever read on here.

I suggest you actually do some reading up on the topic of "sports upsets" before attempting to use one as analogy to "anything is possible".

You guys don't have to be mean about it!

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Treason is the word you're looking for regarding Manning. Also worth noting that 52.4% of prisoners in state prisons are in for violent crime.

Do you have a source for that, and how many of those are drug related violent crimes?

 

[arora]

Not only does the U.S. house 25% of the worlds prisoners, we are finding ways to criminalize our citizens starting with children in the public schrule system.

Yes I know I sound like a broken record, I love my country and it's citizens, we need to do a much much much better job then we are atm.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Not only does the U.S. house 25% of the worlds prisoners, we are finding ways to criminalize our citizens starting with children in the public schrule system.

Yes I know I sound like a broken record, I love my country and it's citizens, we need to do a much much much better job then we are atm.

Exactly ^ and with laws on the books like the once 100 to 1 difference between crack and cocaine punishment (now 18 to 1). So I can somewhat understand the comparision of the U.S. doing absolute punishment not reforming.

 

[Spoil-t]

Why can't we just go old school black ops & go into NK, kill Kim, & place our own guy into power? We did that back in the 60's & 70's but nowadays we don't because people throw hissy fits about **** being cruel. WHA WHA! I would broadcast torture on every TV channel just to show other countries we don't effe around.

 

[Tesla]

Do you have a source for that, and how many of those are drug related violent crimes?

http://bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/p09.pdf

Page 32 for end of 2008 stats, which I would assume are ±5% from todays'. There is no mention of drug related violent crime, although 18.4% of inmates were in for drug-related crimes. Also worth mentioning that in addition to that 52.4%, 18.4% were in for property crimes, including burglary, larceny, motor vehicle theft and fraud. Not exactly "victimless crimes" as was being purported.

Why can't we just go old school black ops & go into NK, kill Kim, & place our own guy into power? We did that back in the 60's & 70's but nowadays we don't because people throw hissy fits about **** being cruel. WHA WHA! I would broadcast torture just to show other countries we don't effe around.

Because the North Korean people see their leaders as a sort of god. They are told that the west (Americans in particular) are demons, and killing their leader would only serve to reinforce those views.

 

[MisterWhiskers]

Why can't we just go old school black ops & go into NK, kill Kim, & place our own guy into power? We did that back in the 60's & 70's but nowadays we don't because people throw hissy fits about **** being cruel. WHA WHA! I would broadcast torture on every TV channel just to show other countries we don't effe around.

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