North Korea threatens with a nuclear strike.

[ExigeEvan]

Dare I say it, but war might be the best outcome - it would force action against Pyongyang, maybe replace the hardliners with someone who is actually aware that their country is in crisis. Unlike the Middle East, North Korea isn't populated by an insurgency totally willing to die if it means repelling an invasion. Of course, war would result in countless deaths and if the North have The Bomb ...

I completely disagree.

For a start, a war in Korea would unsettle the region that is brimming with more man power than possibly any other region in the world, though not the technology. Not only that but a single attack on a populated area would be far, far more devastating that anything seen since WW2.

On top of that we don't know what to expect if NK is invaded. Vietnam style guerilla warfare is entirely plausible, whether there are elements of NK willing to fight that battle in NK is unknown.

 

[Dotini]

It is just boasting of North Korea, they will not have a lot of support from any allies at this moment.

I guess the international community should be very diplomatic on this and avoid any escalation to a larger scale. Support South Korea, but with structures to talk, not to shoot.

It must be recalled that North Korea is supported by China.

South Korea has requested that its Ally the US reintroduce tactical nuclear weapons to the peninsula. China will regard this with grave concern. So the US has an instant decision to make: structure to talk, or structure to shoot.

 

[Robin]

I would say this is pretty serious, saw the CCTV footage from the island on the news just now. I would say this all will pan out depending on what China does. China has always been tolerant (but not really a friend) of North Korea because they share a huge border. If China jumps in and denounces this attack like with the rest of the world then maybe it wont escalate because North Korea has ever reason to be scared of China and its army.

If the North invades the South I don't think in this generation the US alone could mount an assault to defend it, especially if the Chinese are not in support.

 

[Dotini]

If the North invades the South I don't think in this generation the US alone could mount an assault to defend it, especially if the Chinese are not in support.

It must be recalled that the US is there now with 30,000 troops in place specifically trained and pledged to defend South Korea.

In the previous Korean War, technically never ended, war swung to the advantage of the North and the Allies were almost pushed off the peninsula at one point. It "ended" in a stalemate with a truce which still (?) exists.

Our military is exhausted, its equipment worn out and has its hands full staving off defeat in Afghanistan and figuring out what to do with gays. The last thing we need financially or militarily is another war. This is precisely the reason why China, our great strategic rival for global hegemony, would be delighted to see us bogged down in more misery.

 

[Joey D]

China looks like they are going to stay out of it. All they have said is both countries should do more for peace. The US, EU and Russia all condemned the attack so 3 outta 4 world powers isn't bad. I don't think China wants to escalate anything since a destabilisation of the region would put China in a tough spot, their economy is already in a bubble that could could burst and if they lose out on foreign investments it wouldn't help the situation.

I really hope this doesn't escalate. A war would cost millions of civilian lives.

 

[Robin]

It must be recalled that the US is there now with 30,000 troops in place specifically trained and pledged to defend South Korea.

Yes but North Korea has a potential 9½ million man Army that hates the west with a passion! Seriously if this escalates the US should ship all the soldiers from Afghanistan over to South Korea. Even if you are better trained sheer numbers of men and terrain which is familiar to them has proved a deadly combination (Vietnam).

Robin.

 

[Famine]

Our military is exhausted, its equipment worn out and has its hands full staving off defeat in Afghanistan and figuring out what to do with gays. The last thing we need financially or militarily is another war. This is precisely the reason why...

...the US has Japan, with the most advanced and best-equipped military on the face of the Earth on a leash. All it needs is NK to rattle a short range missile in Tokyo's direction and Japan can turn the place into ash so sterile that life will never set foot on it again.

 

[Tornado]

Joey's right. If this escalates into open war, expect China to basically lock down their border and stonewall North Korea just as much as everyone else. They won't want anything to do with a country with leadership who not only started a conventional war but would think nothing of turning it into a nuclear one.

It must be recalled that the US is there now with 30,000 troops in place specifically trained and pledged to defend South Korea.

In the previous Korean War, technically never ended, war swung to the advantage of the North and the Allies were almost pushed off the peninsula at one point. It "ended" in a stalemate with a truce which still (?) exists.

Our military is exhausted, its equipment worn out and has its hands full staving off defeat in Afghanistan and figuring out what to do with gays. The last thing we need financially or militarily is another war. This is precisely the reason why China, our great strategic rival for global hegemony, would be delighted to see us bogged down in more misery.

South Korea could beat back North Korea with barely any outside help on our part. And outside help would certainly come, from almost everyone, if North Korea decided to invade again.

 

[Dotini]

Joey's right. If this escalates into open war, expect China to basically lock down their border and stonewall North Korea just as much as everyone else. They won't want anything to do with a country with leadership who not only started a conventional war but would think nothing of turning it into a nuclear one.


South Korea could beat back North Korea with barely any outside help on our part. And outside help would certainly come, from almost everyone, if North Korea decided to invade again.

When you are in a war, the other side gets a say in what happens. China is holding its cards close to its vest. We can only hope they know what they are doing, but they are none too cooperative just now on other matters. They support Iran, for instance.

Yes, probably the North if acting alone could be stopped with Allied resistance. But Seoul would be pulverized into rubble within minutes after serious shooting starts. Not good!

 

[sumbrownkid]

North Korea will not try to invade the South, or at least for a long time, because the dictators of that so-called country would lose too much of their own wealth in the process.

I think the top leaders of North Korea profit off of counterfeiting our own American dollars.

And if they do attack, What we lack in manpower can be made up in sheer overwhelming air power and naval power until more troops can be sent to the Koreas.

 

[ExigeEvan]

It must be recalled that North Korea is supported by China.

South Korea has requested that its Ally the US reintroduce tactical nuclear weapons to the peninsula. China will regard this with grave concern. So the US has an instant decision to make: structure to talk, or structure to shoot.

America doesn't need to have a big sign pointing to it's nuclear weapons, China is well aware the US has many nuclear armed subs that could be in the seas nearby and China can't do anything about it.

China looks like they are going to stay out of it. All they have said is both countries should do more for peace. The US, EU and Russia all condemned the attack so 3 outta 4 world powers isn't bad. I don't think China wants to escalate anything since a destabilisation of the region would put China in a tough spot, their economy is already in a bubble that could could burst and if they lose out on foreign investments it wouldn't help the situation.

I really hope this doesn't escalate. A war would cost millions of civilian lives.

China's inflation is already racing, if food prices start to sky rocket the poor will begin to riot. Not sure how China will handle that.

 

[Robin]

Interesting breakdown from BBC News... Its like Top Trumps!

 

[Joey D]

China's inflation is already racing, if food prices start to sky rocket the poor will begin to riot. Not sure how China will handle that.

China won't be able to handle it. Looking at China's history, most of their revolutions were caused by flood and famine. If too many people get hungry they will overthrow the government. A war in the region would have huge implications with China and their ability to keep the people fed properly, not to mention the Yuan would be worthless.

 

[Famine]

Whoah there, not guilty!

 

[tfujiwara]

I remeber someone saying "I think the whole world will come to an end when GT5 comes out".
Well, I hope it dosen't.

 

[ExigeEvan]

*Pictogram*

Not really the whole picture there.

SK is US backed with very capable F16s and F15s. All of which will be maintained and be using reliable weaponry. Now, NK is abit of "guesstimation". It's fair to say they have MiG-29s which originally were near the standard of the F16/F15. But there's a huge question over their maintenance and availability.

The same goes for the rest of their hardware. Although mostly Chinese derived (and probably relies on chinese parts) there are questions about the quality.

 

[arvore]

China looks like they are going to stay out of it. All they have said is both countries should do more for peace. The US, EU and Russia all condemned the attack so 3 outta 4 world powers isn't bad. I don't think China wants to escalate anything since a destabilisation of the region would put China in a tough spot, their economy is already in a bubble that could could burst and if they lose out on foreign investments it wouldn't help the situation.

I really hope this doesn't escalate. A war would cost millions of civilian lives.

Ditto!👍

Interesting breakdown from BBC News... Its like Top Trumps!

But, probably, N.K. equipment is old and technologically overlaped.
Subs,and Ships and Planes are those kind of things in which number isn't everything...but that army.

 

[Keef]

Yeah, North Korea's equipment is neigh dilapidated. That's obvious by the fact that their military is overall twice as big, with a budget only 1/5 of South Korea's. That they can "maintain" 63 submarines on a budget like is lunacy. Hell, we can't even build two of our Virginia-class subs for that price, let alone maintain our entire fleet which isn't that much larger than theirs, actually.

 

[Famine]

Not really the whole picture there.

SK is US backed with very capable F16s and F15s. All of which will be maintained and be using reliable weaponry. Now, NK is abit of "guesstimation". It's fair to say they have MiG-29s which originally were near the standard of the F16/F15. But there's a huge question over their maintenance and availability.

And the fact the most likely course of action for a KPAF MiG-29 heading towards South Korean airspace is landing and defecting.

 

[ExigeEvan]

And the fact the most likely course of action for a KPAF MiG-29 heading towards South Korean airspace is landing and defecting.

They probably only give them enough fuel to take-off, circle and land for that reason alone!

 

[Famine]

And seven hours of training.

Also it seems the majority of the... errr... "air fleet" are MiG-21s and Chinese clones of MiG-17s. Mmmm, the height of 50s technology.

 

[Nero9]

Am i missing something here?
Interludes, a SUPER MOD!?
---
If the nuclear warfare happens, it happens. What can we do about it?

 

[Stevisiov]

...the US has Japan, with the most advanced and best-equipped military on the face of the Earth on a leash. All it needs is NK to rattle a short range missile in Tokyo's direction and Japan can turn the place into ash so sterile that life will never set foot on it again.

I didn't realise Japan's military capabilities are that great. I know Japan have recently been scaling up their military to an extent, and with Japan, its little surprise that their technology is cutting edge.

Do you have any info on this, I am quite curious?

 

[Famine]

Am i missing something here?
Interludes, a SUPER MOD!?
---
If the nuclear warfare happens, it happens. What can we do about it?

Glow.

I didn't realise Japan's military capabilities are that great. I know Japan have recently been scaling up their military to an extent, and with Japan, its little surprise that their technology is cutting edge.

Do you have any info on this, I am quite curious?

They don't necessarily have the troop numbers and their role is restricted to self-defence (they're even called the Japan Self Defence Force), but they have stuff out the wazoo. F15s mainly - outnumbering NK's whole airforce of flying prams - but Apaches, some Eurocopters, advance EM-intereference attack planes (to prevent enemies using electronics for defence or attack - radio, guidance systems, radar), Bell Cobras, more submarines than we've got... they've got everything but the nukes (their rules forbid the development of nuclear weapons, or to allow any inside Japan's borders).

 

[ExigeEvan]

And seven hours of training.

Also it seems the majority of the... errr... "air fleet" are MiG-21s and Chinese clones of MiG-17s. Mmmm, the height of 50s technology.

It's not just the planes that are the issue. Weapon wise they're still mostly reliant on cannon fire with their MiG's at best using heat-seekers. In the age of BVR missiles they'll be toast if they get off the ground. Infact, they'd probably be better off with WW2 piston-props, such a large speed difference to baffle a modern-jet pilot and low IR signature!

I didn't realise Japan's military capabilities are that great. I know Japan have recently been scaling up their military to an extent, and with Japan, its little surprise that their technology is cutting edge.

Do you have any info on this, I am quite curious?

Haven't you seen Small Soldiers? That wasn't fiction...

 

[boiltheocean]

Hes climbing in yo' windows, snatchin yo' food up.

 

[Anes]

^^

There's so many memes of that bloke.

 

[Sparty_McFly]

Honestly. North Korea threatens South Korea with a nuclear strike. All we need now is for the UN to discover NK shipping nukes to terrorists, followed by a vow from China to take over Korea, followed by the Mafia getting a slice of the action, and it's Mercenaries: Playground of Destruction all over again.

But going srs bsns for a moment, yeah, I am definitely hoping that all goes well. Considering North Korea's track record though, hoping against hope might not be enough.
And the above joke is rendered moot due to the fact that China is an NK ally. Oh well, at least it was a good comparison.

 

[YSSMAN]

I woke up to hearing about this on BBC World Service this morning, checked my phone for extra news, and decided to go back to bed. If the world was ready to blow itself up, I wasn't ready to be awake for it. Nine hours later, it seems like some things have settled down.

Realistically, this won't end well, regardless of what will happen. If the South Koreans and Americans do nothing, we will appear to be weak, and the North will be able to exploit it. If we choose to act on this aggression, we are likely to see open war. If we move to open war, there are some reasonable conclusions to be made:

• The North will use their artillery against Seoul immediately, placing millions of civilian lives at risk. Given the large amount of the South Korean people living near the border, it puts millions more lives at risk if an invasion force pushes through the DMZ.
• The immediate response will be via the skies, and it is difficult to estimate its effectiveness against the North Koreans. Even if we are able to strike their artillery and other weapons delivery systems, it is likely that a large number of shells will rain down on the South before our bombs will ever reach them. Even then, as soldiers stream across the boarder, it is difficult to estimate how well our air defense forces could keep them in a single spot, or down completely.
• Assuming that the North mounts a successful invasion of the South, they will do everything they can to hold the valuable industrialized land there. Furthermore, they will likely try to hold on to as many civilians as possible. These measures of capital will be a massive bargaining chip if we wish to negotiate with them. Assuming that we wouldn't, that means we need to be that much more careful when attempting to go in and take back lost territory.
• Assuming that the South is able to mount a defense, maintain the DMZ, and retaliate... It would likely be a matter of weeks before we could reach Peyongyang. It is safe to assume that Air and Naval superiority will lie safely within the hands of the US and South Korea, but the ground game is very different. It would be a long, hard-fought battle.
• Any kind of war is going to create an immediate humanitarian crisis for the North or South. Refugees from the South moving to areas of protection will need food and shelter, and it is fair to assume that refugees in the North will head to China almost immediately.
• Lastly, this is going to greatly destabilize the Asian economic landscape, which has arguably been one of the only stable areas in the world. South Korea and China represent some serious manufacturing and purchasing power, and if we lose any of that, it will mean game over in the US... Not even counting the cost of the war itself.

Any way that this ends up, it has some pretty serious implications. Even if we were to go to war, not only would it be costly, we would be tasked with rebuilding the North. I do not see a single way that this turns out well for the US and South Korea.

 

[Eric.]

Why do we need to care about rebuilding the North? The US needs to stop trying to adopt countries after invasions.