Project CARS General Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Terronium-12
- 20,825 comments
- 1,567,866 views
- 5,619
- Belgium
That's right. Maybe it is because I am getting older that I like more adjustability, so I can get it all right right from the start.
Some pics I took to compare the size my Fanatec (32cm) rim to the TM GT wheel.
You can see the way Fanatec solved this.
Drilling a few holes and adding some screws is not that big a cost and it really makes the wheel easier to set.
Using the same paddles for a 28 and a 30cm wheel is not really a wise move of TM (just my thoughts).
Btw: there are more things to adjust on the Fanatec: position, angle, distance to rim and travel.
- 2,393
- FLX81
They really desperately need some PR help. It is straight up idiotic to release those news to the public now, what is there to gain? Why should anybody care about a license for a game that is 2 years down the line, all they manage to do with that announcement now is to make pcars1 feel even more incomplete. *facepalming*
- 904
- York Virginia
- chilybee
- 3,268
- London
- Mauler_77
Yeah it's really nice. Sometimes I just walk into my room and stroke it. And the wheel heheheh.
It's both thinner and lighter than the stock rim, and I'm finding I need to grip it less tight so better for longer play times. I almost bought the leather one but glad I didn't.
- 904
- York Virginia
- chilybee
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
If you go through the RSR Live Timing and look at the Monza event for the Lotus 49, you can see the top spot is a G25, then a CSR, then a G25, next is a DFGT, then a Clubsport wheel then a G27. G25's and G27's are by far the most dominant wheels on the boards in terms of sheer numbers. Ben Cornett is in the top spot with a G25 and he's the top ranked driver in the PRO Rankings before and after the boards were reset recently and one of the fastest aliens in the world. I'd say the pedals are probably more important than the wheel when it comes to speed. All wheels above the DFGT give you enough FFB to feel what the car is doing and give you the opportunity to be fast, the better wheels just make the experience more enjoyable. Since most of us, as in 99.99% of us are never going to be on Ben Cornett's level, we might as well enjoy ourselves
- 6,946
- United Kingdom
On a technical level, something like a T300 and G29 offers more steering accuracy than say a G27. T300 offers more pedal accuracy even with G27 pedals than what G29 manages IIRC. You can feel the difference although it probably doesn't make a massive difference regarding lap time. I think what is really important for lap times is pedal deadzone which is why I dislike Thrustmaster pedals which seem to have more of a deadzone than Logitech ones. What I dislike about the G27 is FFB fade as it doesn't have a fan and that is important for lap time. Anyway if I can beat Ben with stock G27 setup, then it can't be too bad.If you go through the RSR Live Timing and look at the Monza event for the Lotus 49, you can see the top spot is a G25, then a CSR, then a G25, next is a DFGT, then a Clubsport wheel then a G27. G25's and G27's are by far the most dominant wheels on the boards in terms of sheer numbers. Ben Cornett is in the top spot with a G25 and he's the top ranked driver in the PRO Rankings before and after the boards were reset recently and one of the fastest aliens in the world. I'd say the pedals are probably more important than the wheel when it comes to speed. All wheels above the DFGT give you enough FFB to feel what the car is doing and give you the opportunity to be fast, the better wheels just make the experience more enjoyable. Since most of us, as in 99.99% of us are never going to be on Ben Cornett's level, we might as well enjoy ourselves
- 904
- York Virginia
- chilybee
Since most of us, as in 99.99% of us are never going to be on Ben Cornett's level, we might as well enjoy ourselves
I've long since given up on growing up to be an alien. I just like the fun of competing. I do sometimes think the wheel is just a touch slow reacting. Especially at the Green Hell. And I never gave much thought to the pedals. Still I am happy with what I have for now. You are right JP, the bottom line is enjoyment.
Maybe one day I'll put aside the cash and go for it.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Monitors can introduce quite a bit of lag. Really good gaming monitors are 5ms or less, poor tv style monitors are 50ms or more. 50 ms of lag doesn't seem like much but at 250 km/h it's about 3.5 metres on the track.I've long since given up on growing up to be an alien. I just like the fun of competing. I do sometimes think the wheel is just a touch slow reacting. Especially at the Green Hell. And I never gave much thought to the pedals. Still I am happy with what I have for now. You are right JP, the bottom line is enjoyment.
I'm also thinking about upgrading my wheel but I don't think I'll be any faster, I just think it'll be smoother/quieter/stronger and thus more enjoyable and lifelike.
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
- 6,946
- United Kingdom
I think G27 has really fast FFB response IIRC so that helps to drive more quickly.I've long since given up on growing up to be an alien. I just like the fun of competing. I do sometimes think the wheel is just a touch slow reacting. Especially at the Green Hell. And I never gave much thought to the pedals. Still I am happy with what I have for now. You are right JP, the bottom line is enjoyment.
Very unlikely to find the information there. Best to find a review of your TV on websites like HDTVTest, DisplayLag and AVForums. My TV has really low input lag.
*Goes off to find TV manual*
- 666
- StOcKhOlM
- EmArA
+1 a huge difference between TVs and monitors.
Used to play on TV back in the days but then got a 24 inch (TN panel) back in 2009 with 2ms response time and that was the turning point. Even my new dell 2715 (IPS panel) which has 6-8 ms is miles better than my led TV.
*Goes off to find TV manual*
For info:
- Input lag:
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/input_lag.htm
- Response time
http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/articles/response_time.htm
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- 5,619
- Belgium
Agree completely. The difference between the 32" LG led HD TV and my actual BENQ 27" gaming monitors (1ms) is HUGE...! I did not expect that much...
I have them right behind my wheelbase. Could not do that with the TV because it gave me motion sickness.
On the wheel side: my FANATEC CSW set has made me faster. The wheel looks and feels awesome and the FFB is great too, but I have the distinct feeling that the pedals gave me more advantage than the wheel/base.
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- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/3725/measuring_responsiveness_in_video_.php?print=1
https://www.avforums.com/threads/plasma-vs-lcd-response-time-and-input-lag.1513714/
What really matters for gaming is input lag, response time also important.
1) Reponse Time is the time taken for a pixel to change value and back again (effectively in an LCD display, how quickly the pixels shift to allow different amounts of light to pass through).
- In simple terms, the lower this number the better as it means the pixels will shift quicker; therefore displaying fast-paced motion with less visual artefacts than a display with a higher pixel response time.
==> Response Times tend to decrease with advances in display technology
2) Input Lag is the delay in time between a signal being input to a display and that same signal being displayed on-screen.
- In simple terms, the lower this number the better as it means the display will take less time to display what you are inputting (a typical example is when moving the mouse cursor on a display with high input lag, the cursor appears to lag slightly behind your own hand movement). Even milliseconds make a difference to those highly susceptible to input lag.
==> Input Lag tends to increase with advances in display technology
https://www.avforums.com/threads/plasma-vs-lcd-response-time-and-input-lag.1513714/
What really matters for gaming is input lag, response time also important.
1) Reponse Time is the time taken for a pixel to change value and back again (effectively in an LCD display, how quickly the pixels shift to allow different amounts of light to pass through).
- In simple terms, the lower this number the better as it means the pixels will shift quicker; therefore displaying fast-paced motion with less visual artefacts than a display with a higher pixel response time.
==> Response Times tend to decrease with advances in display technology
2) Input Lag is the delay in time between a signal being input to a display and that same signal being displayed on-screen.
- In simple terms, the lower this number the better as it means the display will take less time to display what you are inputting (a typical example is when moving the mouse cursor on a display with high input lag, the cursor appears to lag slightly behind your own hand movement). Even milliseconds make a difference to those highly susceptible to input lag.
==> Input Lag tends to increase with advances in display technology
- 904
- York Virginia
- chilybee
I did read somewhere that having a plasma set introduced more lag. Especially in shooter game like Battlefield 4.
Based on that article I can see how the reaction time for steering in a racing simulation could be adversely affected.
Even putting you monitor & Receiver in "Game Mode" may not defeat the lag effect. So LED/Projection based video processing is the best bet. It may well be that my best investment might be to add two more 32inch monitors and utilize my GTX980 SC to configure three monitors.
One good test of fast twitch steering is at Zolder. After the hump/down hill section there is a very tight chicane.
This is followed by another hump and yet another tight right hander. Braking, timing and quick steering input have to be there or you lose time and you connection to the track. At least I do. All of the chicanes at Zolder get your attention.
Zolder and the Nordschleife is where I feel my wheel is slow.
Based on that article I can see how the reaction time for steering in a racing simulation could be adversely affected.
Even putting you monitor & Receiver in "Game Mode" may not defeat the lag effect. So LED/Projection based video processing is the best bet. It may well be that my best investment might be to add two more 32inch monitors and utilize my GTX980 SC to configure three monitors.
One good test of fast twitch steering is at Zolder. After the hump/down hill section there is a very tight chicane.
This is followed by another hump and yet another tight right hander. Braking, timing and quick steering input have to be there or you lose time and you connection to the track. At least I do. All of the chicanes at Zolder get your attention.
Zolder and the Nordschleife is where I feel my wheel is slow.
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
I did read somewhere that having a plasma set introduced more lag. Especially in shooter game like Battlefield 4.
Based on that article I can see how the reaction time for steering in a racing simulation could be adversely affected.
Even putting you monitor & Receiver in "Game Mode" may not defeat the lag effect. So LED/Projection based video processing is the best bet. It may well be that my best investment might be to add two more 32inch monitors and utilize my GTX980 SC to configure three monitors.
One good test of fast twitch steering is at Zolder. After the hump/down hill section there is a very tight chicane.
This is followed by another hump and yet another tight right hander. Braking, timing and quick steering input have to be there or you lose time and you connection to the track. At least I do. All of the chicanes at Zolder get your attention.
Zolder and the Nordschleife is where I feel my wheel is slow.
I recently upgrade to plasma from LCD, and the improvement is very noticeable for gaming, everything felt more responsive, Wipeout HD, MK 9 and GT6 takes the cake
It depends on the tv, but plasma generally have lower response time ( pixel )
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
Changhong still make plasmas, 1080p 3D I bought new very cheaply, basic tv but works great and managed to make my mate envy ( he has the latest Sony LED ) Calibrated and with pure black ( 2% gray ), never have to touch brightness or saturation anymore, only play with contrast
I bought new very cheaply, basic tv but works great and managed to make my mate envy ( he has the latest Sony LED ) Calibrated and with pure black ( 2% gray ), never have to touch brightness or saturation anymore, only play with contrast
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
My TV is an Acoustic Solutions LCD32761HDF, it's a budget model so I suppose it has high input lag. Hasn't stopped me from winning loads in Gran Turismo online though!
I Googled for input lag numbers for my TV, but found nothing.
I Googled for input lag numbers for my TV, but found nothing.
- 11,660
- GTP_Orido
If you have fighting game that runs at 60fps, it will be easier to notice the lag, like MK9 on PS3, be sure to use wired controller. You can compare it to CRT TV / monitor if you still have one. Wipeout HD is another game that is great for testing. My plasma is rated at 5ms and when I compared it to my old CRT, I didn't sense any difference at all in input lag ( playing MK9 in SD CRT vs HD 1080 on plasma )
Tried Battlefield Bad Company 2 a few hours ago for the 1st after getting new tv, it's miles better than with my old tv. Every input feels immediate and very quick to aim with old tv control settings, double and triple tapping tangos now feels much more natural.
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- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
It's like a lot of things, it's really only important at the upper limits. Even a "normal" input lag of around 50ms for a decent LED tv is basically imperceptible for most people and not likely would anyone even know it was there if it weren't for the steering wheel animations. Your eyes and hand-eye coordination can also easily adjust and overcome to input lag of that magnitude in a racing game. Shooters are different of course, as you can be dead from a couple of machine gun bullets in 0.05 seconds or at least be 1 or 2 bullets behind because of your lower response time and lose a lot of 1 on 1 battles that way.
- 904
- York Virginia
- chilybee
- 7,765
- Yorkshire
- ScapeGoat4U
- WhippingBoy
I'm not much of a gamer, I just stick to the racing sims, & I never play 1st person shooters because I find them incredibly boring.
