The F1 driver transfer discussion/speculation archiveFormula 1

[prisonermonkeys]

I would say at this point Kyvat is in danger of losing his seat to Verstappen.

If they replace him, I doubt they'll do it mid-season. Especially considering that Verstappen resisted efforts to promote him for this year because he wanted the experience.

And I think you're juding Kvyat based on one sloppy kilometre of racing. It might not have been pretty, but it's nowhere near as horrendous as Palmer's season, Gutiérrez wasting a seat, ir Hülkenberg apparently not really caring anymore.

 

[mustafur]

If they replace him, I doubt they'll do it mid-season. Especially considering that Verstappen resisted efforts to promote him for this year because he wanted the experience.

And I think you're juding Kvyat based on one sloppy kilometre of racing. It might not have been pretty, but it's nowhere near as horrendous as Palmer's season, Gutiérrez wasting a seat, ir Hülkenberg apparently not really caring anymore.

I said this before the race started.

Although Fairly early, I would say Kyvats seat is looking very much in danger now. Ricciardo has firmly dominated qualifying over him and with Verstappen going well I bet Marko will be applying the pressure.

And I know this is not going to happen untill after the season if it does.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I said this before the race started.

Less than an hour ago?

 

[mustafur]

Less than an hour ago?

That was posted directly after qualifying and before the race on the Russian GP thread.

Redbull care little about lucky results, they judge a driver by things inside their control which is qualifying and general speed, because these are what win championships in situation neutral.

Infact your comments on Vergne were very similar when STR replaced him if I remember correctly, it is still early in this season but going by Redbulls track record it would be a similar situation to what is unfolding.

If Verstappen wasn't doing as well then the pressure would be less though imo, Kyvat is a good driver and it wouldn't be like the others mentioned where his F1 career would be over, he is still very young and likely has more potential to unlock but there is Verstappen who is looking like both of those things but more.

 

[Jimlaad43]

Motorsport.com speculating out their bums again
http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/r...rstappen-kvyat-as-early-as-spanish-gp-733475/

 

[Dennisch]

What a load of bullcrap.

 

[twitcher]

I'll believe that when I see it happen.

That said, I don't see how this helps the situation at all. Prematurely put a kid in a situation where he has zero room for mistakes, with a new car and new team to boot; at the same time as conpletely killing off Kvyat's career.

One bad race on a track which doesn't suit their car, and where they made the mistake of fitting the mediums after T1, and Redbull feel their entire season is in jeopardy? C'mon man!

 

[mustafur]

There is zero logic in that, whilst I think it will eventually happen if things go the way they are now this is for the end of the season, Redbull have no reason to rush as they are not exactly fighting for a title right now, and Kyvat hasn't proven himself to be Sato in 2005 levels of useless at this point.

Things that will stop this from happening:

1. Kyvat somehow starts beating Ricciardo in a straight fight, including Qualifying.

2. Sainz starts to cement a Qualifying advantage over Verstappen like he did in the middle of last year.

 

[TenEightyOne]

For this rumour to work it would need to be in a team where;

- The potential world champion is angry and favoured by the management
- The senior management are ruthless, single-minded nutters
- There is a supply of replacement drivers with talent.

Check, check, check. It stands well as a rumour because it's credible. I still have doubts about its truth, but hey.

To be clear though; our presumption from the outside is that this is entirely prompted by Kvyat .vs. Vettel over the three visible rounds, what we don't know is how the atmosphere feels behind the scenes. If Kvyat and Ricciardo are at logger heads, or Kvyat and Marko, or Kvyat and Horner... anything could happen. We also don't know what contractual limitations/obligations are in place to either prevent or facilitate this move.

 

[Pilitev]

Confirmed:

http://www.redbullracing.com/

 

[Jimlaad43]

New the BBC think it's a done deal
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/36206848

 

[TenEightyOne]

For this rumour to work it would need to be in a team where;

- The potential world champion is angry and favoured by the management
- The senior management are ruthless, single-minded nutters
- There is a supply of replacement drivers with talent.

Check, check, check. It stands well as a rumour because it's credible. I still have doubts about its truth, but hey.

To be clear though; our presumption from the outside is that this is entirely prompted by Kvyat .vs. Vettel over the three visible rounds, what we don't know is how the atmosphere feels behind the scenes. If Kvyat and Ricciardo are at logger heads, or Kvyat and Marko, or Kvyat and Horner... anything could happen. We also don't know what contractual limitations/obligations are in place to either prevent or facilitate this move.

Well, I said it was credible!

 

[prisonermonkeys]

The potential world champion is angry and favoured by the management

Given Mercedes' run of form, I doubt Vettel would be a serious title contender, even without Kvyat hitting Vettel. As a Ferrari driver, he has less power within the team than he did when he was with them. And there are mitigating circumstances in both China and Russia; in China, it's hard to pin it on Kvyat as Vettel left the door open and got taken by surprise when Räikkönen rejoined (I honestly think Räikkönen was further over to the left than Vettel realised); as for Russia, the initial contact is on Kvyat, but the second incident was triggered by Vettel slowing on the racing line. Contact square on the gearbox was the best outcome of a bad bunch - Kvyat couldn't go left because Hamilton was there, couldn't go right because he would get on the marbles and have a Grosjean-style accident (if he didn't hit Vettel's rear tyre, which is all kinds of nasty), and he couldn't slow down because there was a gaggle of cars behind him. It's easy to blame Kvyat for the second contact, but I would expect a four-time World Champion to get off the racing line if he thought he had a problem.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Given Mercedes' run of form, I doubt Vettel would be a serious title contender, even without Kvyat hitting Vettel.

I should have been far clearer - the team's potential WDC, I think most would argue that it's Ricciardo.

On other wonderings... does this give RB an opportunity to nail Verstroppen to a new 2 or 3 year contract? He'd be mad to say no, and that solves the 2017 Verstroppen-to-Ferrari worry, or at least increases the monetary value of a buyout.

 

[spyrrari]

I should have been far clearer - the team's potential WDC, I think most would argue that it's Ricciardo.

On other wonderings... does this give RB to nail Verstroppen to a new 2 or 3 year contract? He'd be mad to say no, and that solves the 2017 Verstroppen-to-Ferrari worry, or at least increases the monetary value of a buyout.

Verstroppen??...




Spy.

 

[Jimlaad43]

This is a similar strategy to swapping goalkeepers in football. When De Gea moved to Man U, he pretty much sucked for his first season, so United spent the rest of the season swapping backup keepers in to show De Gea he needed to perform to play. He proceeded to work hard and step up a level, pretty much becoming the best goalie in the league for the last few years now. This could have the same effect, giving Kvyat (and Sainz to a lesser extent) the need to improve, potentially making them a lot better.

 

[Liquid]

Red Bull and their hot potatoing again. Helmut Marko must be having an orgasm about now.

 

[MagpieRacer]

I'm stunned at the decision. A real snap decision, almost out of character even for red bull. Verstappen I feel though can drive without pressure unlike Kvyat who now has a point to prove.

One must wonder what Vettel said to Horner now though.

 

[Samus]

Surely going to kill the morale of Kvyat although takes the pressure off.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

that solves the 2017 Verstroppen-to-Ferrari worry

And I suspect that plays a role in the decision.

I am disappointed that Red Bull have made the decision, if only because it means that they're letting a driver from another team influence the way they run their own house. Especially when that other team is racing them for position in the WCC. Ferrari stand to benefit from this, because no matter how good Verstappen is, it will take time for him to settle into the team. Red Bull will be less competitive as a result, giving Ferrari an advatage. And what's worse, in the three episodes of contact between Vettel and Kvyat, Kvyat is only responsible for one of them. The other two were racing incidents, and arguably Vettel was more responsible for them.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Verstroppen??...

Spy.

A "strop" is a typically-teenage arm-flinging flouncing sulk. That's our Belgian friend all over

 

[prisonermonkeys]

That's our Belgian friend all over

Belgian?

 

[spyrrari]

A "strop" is a typically-teenage arm-flinging flouncing sulk. That's our Belgian friend all over

Ok,whatever...but Belgian?... dude


Spy.

 

[Scuderia Paul]

That's our Belgian friend all over

He races under the Netherlands flag although he was born in Belgium.

 

[Mike-ZENKAI]

Very strange decision from "Dr. Marko". Just heard it confirmed by Jos on the Dutch radio.
Wondering how this will be working out, great change for Max, but as seen you can be dropped just as easily.
Cannot imagine Kvyat racing again for Torro Rosso, easily said, but he should just quit driving for Red Bull.

(He has dual nationality)

 

[mustafur]

Whilst unexpected this makes for an interesting season, now we get to see how Verstappen fares up against a proven talent In Ricciardo and see how Sainz is compared to Kyvat.

And I suspect that plays a role in the decision.

I am disappointed that Red Bull have made the decision, if only because it means that they're letting a driver from another team influence the way they run their own house. Especially when that other team is racing them for position in the WCC. Ferrari stand to benefit from this, because no matter how good Verstappen is, it will take time for him to settle into the team. Red Bull will be less competitive as a result, giving Ferrari an advatage. And what's worse, in the three episodes of contact between Vettel and Kvyat, Kvyat is only responsible for one of them. The other two were racing incidents, and arguably Vettel was more responsible for them.

I Very much doubt it's a crash issue and more a speed issue.

I have a Feeling they did this so they can get him doing alot of miles in the Spanish test, they have obviously seen something and my bet is it is race pace related, Kyvat has been really weak in that department this season where as Verstappen has been at his best in that.

 

[mustafur]

delete.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Belgian?

He's Dutch in the same way that Rosberg is ze German. One might say I'm a perennial nit-picker, one might be right. Apologies

 

[Liquid]

If Kvyat being inexperienced is the problem, perhaps the Head of Youth at Red Bull has something to answer for, promoting these young drivers too soon.

Not only that, but let's replace one young and inexperienced driver with an even younger driver with even less experience.

It is a typically ruthless decision from Red Bull, who use Toro Rosso to test out young drivers and then either promote them within two years or dump them.

And it raises serious questions over the F1 future of 22-year-old Kvyat, who was described by Red Bull team boss Christian Horner as "the real deal" when he was promoted to replace Vettel in 2015 after just one year at Toro Rosso.

Sainz must be sweating. He's in his second season with STR now.

 

[Jimlaad43]

This is probably more of a "Verstappen is ours" move than anything else. I can'tsee Gasly, Stoneman or any of Tue other RB young drivers being a threat at the moment unless they step it right up, but Red Bull know what Kvyat can do, so they can be compared.