Theory on the Audi R8 LMS Ultra Handling

It's capable of high 2:04s, I had low 2:05s with some slow section, especially that last left turn before conrod, avoiding the tire stack :lol:
 
I can do 2:03s in my Ultra(non-phoenix) the setup is very easy to work out. A mate of mine gave it to me and I added some tweaks to it.
 
I'm working on the non-Phoenix currently, low 2:06s with no aids.
 
LVracerGT
I'm 97% sure I remember the same exact handling flaw on the stock setup in GT5. I would test it, but I don't have GT5 anymore.

Anyone with a copy still mind testing this?
Click to expand...

Well since no one wanted to test it, I borrowed my buddies copy of GT5 last night and tested this to double check. The R8 LMS exibits the same exact low speed "snap oversteer" on the default setup in GT5 as it does on the default setup in GT6, just like I remembered.

This is not a new thing guys, it may just feel a bit different because of the new physics model which everyone seems to be overlooking.
 
It was a bit unstable in GT5 so you had to be a bit gentle but it's nowhere near as bad as GT6, but still I get with the car pretty well.
 
I've been trying everything to get it to the place I want, but I don't think it'll ever be easy going. Interestingly, this happened at Bathurst yesterday, so the real life car is susceptible to high speed instability:

 
Don't yet know Bathurst very well, did only the required career laps until now.
Tried it this afternoon, 12 laps, settings exactly as in my previous post.
Best: 2:04:375 (lap 7, with two or three little mistakes though, so open for better times).
Still have to be very conservative on the throttle... :scared:
(The R8 Phoenix)
 
Oh, i'm doing stock power and weight. I think our setups would be similar then.
 
@Ninners, ok assuming at going on ABS?
@Ridox2JZGTE, gotta test that tune, just tested quickly setup something on my own, had nice easy cruiser from RH to RS noABS, by just altering a bit suspension and wings along LSD.
Maybe I make it proper tune and do exception and publish it to all for cruising purposes. :)
 
OdeFinn
@Ninners, ok assuming at going on ABS?
@Ridox2JZGTE, gotta test that tune, just tested quickly setup something on my own, had nice easy cruiser from RH to RS noABS, by just altering a bit suspension and wings along LSD.
Maybe I make it proper tune and do exception and publish it to all for cruising purposes. :)
Click to expand...

Sure, it's on my replica garage, page 3, please read the tune notes, kind of important :)
 
Are people still claiming this car is broken in stock form after patch 1.04?

I ask this because I haven't driven this car until today. So I would like to share my opinion here. Before I go on, so you know, I use a G27.

Before going for a lap, I decided to take the car to the skidpad in Willow to see how the car would behave on steady-state cornering.

So I lined the car with the circle, turned the wheel and gently started to accelerate the car. The car gained speed very slowly and the grip required to corner started to increase. As I aproached the cornering limit the car behaved very neutral, no sign of oversteer. Actually, there was a little hint of understeer. Until I hit the limit where the car started to understeer out of the circle. Then I started to wonder why people were complaining so much about this car. Then I tested a little of the lift-off oversteer of the car and it seemed very normal for an MR car.

Next I thought "maybe the snap oversteer people are talking about happens only when you try to do a lap somewhere". Okay, I took the car to Nurburgring Nordschleife, as it is the track I am most comfortable with, has lots of kinds of corners and ranges from smoother tarmac to bumpier ones. No aids, just ABS 1 and brake balance 8:3, grip set to real.

Mind you that I don't drive racing cars often. The last time may have been for the 24 minute races that I did last month. From that time, I have only been driving road cars with comfort tires.

So, I start my adaptation period with the car and it seemed pretty normal, actually. Plenty of grip. Until I try to attack a kerb and the car spins out of control. Then I say, "okay, better not use those kerbs". So, some spins after here and there learning breaking points and cornering speeds, I reach the last corner before the first split (Hoheneichen, I think) and the car spins out of control. I think, "I wasn't specting that!". Then I remember that I have some problem there with practically every car. That corner have some weird bank changing. So I take down a notch on the corner and the car handles no problem.

At last I finished my first lap with the car: 7:03.8

I don't know what would be considered a respectable time for that car, but I don't think it's far from that.

After all, I will conclude with some things to consider:

1 - I'm no racing driver, neither am I trying to be. The time I did was limited by my skill, not the car capability. Know your limits and you can drive any car in the game. If THE Chris Harris so many people seem to praise so much had to resort to a high setting of TC, why would you be able to control the car just fine?

2 - As long as I stayed clear of kerbs, was careful on banked corners and bump sections and did not lift off suddenly, the car did nothing unexpected.

3 - Racing cars are tuned specifically for each driver. The stock setup might not suit you. It doesn't mean the car handling is broken.

4 - I'm no defender of PD. They make a lot of mistakes in specifications of the cars. But some mistakes don't make the car "broken".
 
I just want to know why the Phoenix ultra has much more stability than the plain ultra. Another interesting difference between the two is the max downforce that can be applied, so here comes another theory:

The Phoenix car can go up to 400/700. The plain ultra can only go up to 400/650 however, like the original R8 LMS. If this is a mistake by PD, then placing full downforce on the plain ultra would create a car that is aerodynamically unbalanced. I tried with 350/650, and guess what, it was far more stable.
 
@hsv010, suspension need full rework if applying full aero. You need stiffer springs, maybe more height etc.. So please don't blame PD for that.
 
I have a friend asked me about running the LMS for top speed, even going at very high speed requires certain ride height and stiffness on spring rate, otherwise the car will bottom out at a banked turn even with minimum downforce :) I included the notes on my tune for this special case.
 
Read what I said before making comments like that. The plain ultra has max rear downforce of 650, yet the Phoenix ultra has 900. That's 250 more 'clicks' on the rear wing so to speak. The Phoenix is much better to drive than the plain one, and when I took front downforce off it, it became much more stable. I'm beginning to think that this car's issues are down to an aero imbalance.
 
It wasn't directed at you, but I do think there is some form of aero imbalance when you adjust it.
 
You clearly don't get what i'm saying. I have an excellent setup for it, you can view it in my thread. I'm saying that the in game R8 suffers from a front to rear imbalance. If you add equal amounts of downforce to each end, it'll be unbalanced, so you will need to take a substantial amount off the front end to make it aerodynamically balanced.
 
@hsv010, I'm getting it, but have you thought at 400 front and 650 on rear is not same amount on front and and, or 350/650.
If scale was 0-400 on front and 0-400 on rear then 400/400 would be equal by amount, still not by handling, there is few things more to consider, car height, weight, springs, dampers, LSD, brake bias, all those are making own values for tune to get it work with aero and different speeds etc, so can't understand that statement of imbalance on full aero.
 
Running same amount or very close amount of downforce on ANY car is bad IMO, it will give instability on mid to high speed. I always keep moderate differences to make it almost neutral balanced.
 
It's equal in terms of disrupted airflow. 400/400 would be theoretically equal to about 400/150-200. I still don't get why the two ultras have a rear wing difference of 250 'clicks'. They should be identical.
 
LVracerGT
You compared your knowledge of karting to how the R8 handles, so you can see how that made me think you were comparing karts to full size MR cars. Many other cars have had bad handling characteristics on track that have raced. Just because the R8 had some bad handling doesn't mean teams won't run it. Teams choose cars based on their budget, relationships and alliances. Teams don't choose cars by what's the easiest to drive.

Also just because a car looks planted doesn't mean it is. Until you experience heavy braking from 100+mph you don't know what it feels like to have the car move around under braking.
Click to expand...
I agree with you that we can't talk about these cars, because we didn't drive them in real life. But there are person that can talk about it.

Just because the R8 had some bad handling doesn't mean teams won't run it.
Click to expand...
It hasn't a bad handling in real life according to the person in the video.
 

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