Who's at fault?

[Imari]

Taking into account the fact that the vehicle ventured to run over the biker who stopped in front of him abruptly just to flee from a devastating situation of being surrounded by the knot, the driver of the car is at fault.

Ah, the old "it's your fault for escaping from a group of angry bikers with knives looking to injure or kill you and your family" argument. An old chestnut that one.

What would you do? After you've accidentally hit a biker and pulled over, as you should, and your vehicle is then being attacked by thugs with knives, what exactly is the correct response?

And what do you think of the biker who parked his bike and himself in front of an SUV while his friends threaten the driver? No fault for him at all? Sure seems like a pretty moronic position to put yourself in. I don't think I'd want to put my body and my 200kg bike between a 2000+kg SUV and escape from certain injury.

 

[eight6er]

Just watched the video and at first I was annoyed with the bikers blocking up the whole road and acting like asses, but by the end of the video I was happy to see them smash the windows of the rover.

I Don't know who's at fault overall as I don't know everything that happened, but at the start of the video the bike didn't look like he was brake checking to me, it looked like he left off the throttle and the rover failed to slow down in anyway and hit the back of him.

 

[Carbonox]

Just watched the video and at first I was annoyed with the bikers blocking up the whole road and acting like asses, but by the end of the video I was happy to see them smash the windows of the rover.

I Don't know who's at fault overall as I don't know everything that happened, but at the start of the video the bike didn't look like he was brake checking to me, it looked like he left off the throttle and the rover failed to slow down in anyway and hit the back of him.

You're clearly blind. The bikers were actively looking for trouble by deliberately brake checking the SUV so they could have an excuse to beat up the driver. Too bad this stunt didn't end too well for Hollywood C**tz.

 

[eight6er]

You're clearly blind. The bikers were actively looking for trouble by deliberately brake checking the SUV so they could have an excuse to beat up the driver. Too bad this stunt didn't end too well for Hollywood C**tz.

I'm not blind at all, the bike didn't even appear to apply brakes. He just left off the throttle, he only had one hand on the bars and the rover made no attempt to stop.

 

[Carbonox]

I'm not blind at all, the bike didn't even appear to apply brakes. He just left off the throttle, he only had one hand on the bars and the rover made no attempt to stop.

What's the reason for him to suddenly slow down? Maybe if you had considered the fact there were bikers all over the RR at this point and trying to swerve around or even brake hard could've caused much more ruckus than just rear ending the perpetrator...

And again, even if he managed to avoid hitting the guy, the bikers would've just found another excuse to attack him anyway. That bunch of pussies couldn't stand their ground against one man without having dozens of their little buddies in a swarm all over the place.

 

[Danoff]

And what do you think of the biker who parked his bike and himself in front of an SUV while his friends threaten the driver?

Conspiracy to assault with a deadly weapon at the minimum.

 

[eight6er]

What's the reason for him to suddenly slow down? Maybe if you had considered the fact there were bikers all over the RR at this point and trying to swerve around or even brake hard could've caused much more ruckus than just rear ending the perpetrator...

And again, even if he managed to avoid hitting the guy, the bikers would've just found another excuse to attack him anyway. That bunch of pussies couldn't stand their ground against one man without having dozens of their little buddies in a swarm all over the place.

I'm just commenting on what I saw in the video, you can't know what those bikers intended or would have done outside what happened in the video. I'm just saying that accident which seemed to kick the whole thing off in the video was not really brake checking. Before that happened the bikers didn't seem to be doing anything wrong they just seemed to be overtaking slowly, besides that one guy.

 

[McLaren]

The bikers didn't seem to be doing anything wrong? Then, you haven't seen the rest of the footage of these guys. They went out acting like idiots.

 

[Adamgp]

One of the stories I read explained how it started.

Apparently in a biker mob like this there are 2 groups. One group rides slowly at the back and blocks traffic, allowing the other group plenty of road to do stunts and ride like idiots.

Apparently the SUV came upon the slow moving blockers and honked at them, possibly managed to pass them. This is supposedly what set off the bikers.

 

[Jay.]

Just watched the video and at first I was annoyed with the bikers blocking up the whole road and acting like asses, but by the end of the video I was happy to see them smash the windows of the rover.

I Don't know who's at fault overall as I don't know everything that happened, but at the start of the video the bike didn't look like he was brake checking to me, it looked like he left off the throttle and the rover failed to slow down in anyway and hit the back of him.

If actions like this bring joy to your being then you clearly have never been bullied or a victim of crime, and you are likely to be as much of an ass as many of the bikers in the video. Your attitude is wrong. "I don't know everything that happened, but I'm glad the bikers beat the crap out of the guy and slashed his face open with a knife."

Read all the posts in this thread, watch a few more of the available videos and gather a bit more information about the incident.

THEN your opinions may actually be listened to and discussed. Until then my friend your comment may as well just be deleted as 'crap'.

 

[eight6er]

The bikers didn't seem to be doing anything wrong? Then, you haven't seen the rest of the footage of these guys. They went out acting like idiots.

Your right, I'm just commenting on the video in the original post. They didn't really seem that aggressive considering some idiot in a SUV just did a hit and run and seriously injured some of their buddies during his get away. As that's how it looks in the video from the bikers point of view.

@Jay then add me to your ignore list if it bothers you so much, as you obviously didn't bother to read my post fully in the first place.

 

[Carbonox]

You know what is never a valid solution to situations like this?

Apologism. And right now, a certain someone is exercising that by only taking the bikers' view into account.

@Jay then add me to your ignore list if it bothers you so much, as you obviously didn't bother to read my post fully in the first place.

Thing is, he was right. Your opinion is full of crap. It wouldn't be surprising if you were a part of this or a similar group yourself.

 

[Imari]

Your right, I'm just commenting on the video in the original post. They didn't really seem that aggressive considering some idiot in a SUV just did a hit and run and seriously injured some of their buddies during his get away. As that's how it looks in the video from the bikers point of view.

He did not do a hit and run. Regardless of what you think of the brake checking or not, the driver of the SUV did the right thing afterwards and stopped. Accidents happen, the SUV driver has done nothing seriously wrong so far.

Then he has a group of bikers threatening to beat the hell out of him and/or kill him and his family. Keep in mind that there's been an accident, and he's done the right thing to stop and try and sort it out sensibly. You know, by NOT doing a hit and run.

When he sees that his physical safety and possibly his family's lives are in danger, he does what a sensible person does and runs for it. That a bike happened to be in the way was simply unfortunate, no one is silly enough to be beaten to death just because a bike was parked in front of their 2 ton SUV. At that point it was no longer about the initial accident, it was about not being killed by a pack of yahoos.

You'll note that he was on the phone to the police shortly afterwards. Hardly the actions of a criminal performing a hit and run on a helpless biker.

 

[eight6er]

You know what is never a valid solution to situations like this?

Apologism. And right now, a certain someone is exercising that by only taking the bikers' view into account.



Thing is, he was right. Your opinion is full of crap. It wouldn't be surprising if you were a part of this or a similar group yourself.

So which part is crap? I can see it from both sides, but the posts I read seemed to be taking the SUVs side, so I thought I would mention my observation from the biker's point of view.

 

[Jay.]

Your right, I'm just commenting on the video in the original post. They didn't really seem that aggressive considering some idiot in a SUV just did a hit and run and seriously injured some of their buddies during his get away. As that's how it looks in the video from the bikers point of view.

@Jay then add me to your ignore list if it bothers you so much, as you obviously didn't bother to read my post fully in the first place.

I read your post in its entirety. You obviously didn't see the driver acting responsibly after the initial incident. HE PULLED OVER! It wasn't a 'Hit-and-Run'

The driver had his wife and infant daughter in the car.
The bikers attempted to slash his tyres and banged against the side of the vehicle.
THEN the driver tried to run away fearing for the lives of himself and his family.

How many victims are ambushed in gang related incidents resulting in vicious and often fatal assault, women being raped, and even children being harmed?
It happens every day in NYC. This driver was within his rights to defend himself, and if that means using his vehicle as a means of escape, then so be it.

 

[Carbonox]

So which part is crap? I can see it from both sides, but the posts I read seemed to be taking the SUVs side, so I thought I would mention my observation from the biker's point of view.

All of it.

See, now us others are kinda like that gang bunch of pussies basically outnumbering you with our viewpoint. Do you now know how the SUV driver must've felt while being surrounded? Of course this is a bit of a sloppy comparison, since all of us are (I hope) decent enough not to assault you for disagreeing with us, but you see, when you're that badly outnumbered, no law can really stop you from using your vehicle as an offensive weapon to keep yourself safe.

 

[Jay.]

NYC Police Commissioner Ray Kelly seems to agree with most people here.

I am here to denounce the despicable behavior of these motorcycle crews that have made it their business to come across this neighborhood and the city and just basically disobey all traffic regulations.
~ ~ ~
Well, it depends on what the circumstances are ... It depends on whether or not your vehicle is being attacked, whether or not you think you’re being attacked, whether or not your wife and child’s in the car. You have to look at the totality of the circumstances, and that’s what we’re doing.
~ ~ ~
We believe that anyone faced with this sort of grave danger would have taken the same course of action in order to protect their family.

 

[eight6er]

I read your post in its entirety. You obviously didn't see the driver acting responsibly after the initial incident. HE PULLED OVER! It wasn't a 'Hit-and-Run'

The driver had his wife and infant daughter in the car.
The bikers attempted to slash his tyres and banged against the side of the vehicle.
THEN the driver tried to run away fearing for the lives of himself and his family.

How many victims are ambushed in gang related incidents resulting in vicious and often fatal assault, women being raped, and even children being harmed?
It happens every day in NYC. This driver was within his rights to defend himself, and if that means using his vehicle as a means of escape, then so be it.

In my first post I said I was happy to see them smash the windows of the rover in. I never said I was happy about them doing anything else like cutting the guys face, as I didn't know about it. That kind of stuff pretty much never happens here, not that I ever heard of anyway.

By hit and run I mean after he hit the biker, he fled the scene and took out some more bikers on his way. From the biker's point of view on cam, it's hard to see anything else, so I can see how they might think the guy in the rover was some idiot doing a hit and run.

I initially just intended to comment on the brake checking thing, but if I'm going to discuss anymore I should read the rest of the thread as you said.

@Carbonox If I was bothered about being outnumbered by opposing opinion, I wouldn't be here telling how I can see it from the bikers point of view. I'm not saying they are right, just saying I can see how they would take it badly.

 

[Carbonox]

If you feel like there has been a hit-and-run, you call the cops and let them take care of business. Any citizens, especially those with violent tendencies, don't have the right to take the law in their own hands. Clear?

 

[AzNTypeR]

I watched the clips of the bikers driving like ar*es before watching the actual clip in the OP.

The guy in the RR should have had killed them all. Total imbeciles that deserve to die.
Also, I hope that the little child isn't traumatized for life about what he/she has seen happen to his/her father.

*Sorry if you are a biker.

 

[Jay.]

By hit and run I mean after he hit the biker, he switched to the side lane and stopped, he fled the scene after bikers became aggressive and took out some more bikers on his way. From the biker's point of view on cam, it's hard to see anything else, so I can see how they might think the guy in the rover was some idiot doing a hit and run.

Fixed. The video shows the initial collision in the middle lane, then it shows the SUV fleeing from a stationary position in the first lane. Watch it again and you'll see it. There was no 'hit-and-run'.
Some people may still see this as wrong of the SUV driver but what would they do in his situation, with their wife and child in the car?

 

[Jay.]

I watched the clips of the bikers driving like ar*es before watching the actual clip in the OP.
Riding at high speed on the pavement, on the wrong side of the road weaving between oncoming vehicles.

The guy in the RR should have had killed them all. Total imbeciles that deserve to die.
Harsh. They don't deserve to die but if they want to act like knobsocks they MUST accept the consequences without crying about it.

Also, I hope that the little child isn't traumatized for life about what he/she has seen happen to his/her father.
Something nobody else seems to care about, but a VERY valid point.

*Sorry if you are a biker.

In a state where it is legal to carry firearms in a vehicle that last biker that smashed the SUV window could easily be dead.


Edit: Sorry, double post was not intentional.

 

[Tornado]

By hit and run I mean after he hit the biker, he fled the scene and took out some more bikers on his way.

But that's not what happened. He hit the biker who slowed down in front of him. He did stop afterwards. That makes it not be a hit and run. However, that part of the what happened is ultimately irrelevant to the rest of the story anyway, regardless of your original assertion that the Range Rover didn't slow at all.


After he stopped, his car was swarmed and attacked by the bikers (the action you said you were happy about), at which point he fled because the original actions were now irrelevant because now his life was in danger. Even if he intentionally didn't stop

 

[eight6er]

Fixed. The video shows the initial collision in the middle lane, then it shows the SUV fleeing from a stationary position in the first lane. Watch it again and you'll see it. There was no 'hit-and-run'.
Some people may still see this as wrong of the SUV driver but what would they do in his situation, with their wife and child in the car?

Ok I see how there is confusion, I always considered any accident where someone is injured and the driver doesn't wait for police to arrive, is a hit and run. Stopping and then driving away is as much a hit and run as not stopping at all. Also by your definition of hit and run, if he didn't do it to the first biker he did it to the other bikers he ran over and didn't stop.

@Tornado The action I was happy about was the smashing of the SUV's windows by the bikers at the end of the video. After the SUV driver had run over many bikers.

 

[Mikeybc]

I still don't grasp how any sensible person can see this as being the SUV driver's fault.

I feel both parties showed poor judgement. The SUV driver's bad decision to bolt and run over a person and bike was spurred on by panic while whe bikers actions were pure idiocy. Most of my sympathy lays with the SUV driver, I feel he's going to have quite a legal battle ahead if him.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Did eight6er just watch the video from the part where the SUV is stopped on the middle of a highway by bikers, and then where those said bikers get ran over? Cause for what eight6er argues is a bunch of a daft trite.

I feel both parties showed poor judgement. The SUV driver's bad decision to bolt and run over a person and bike was spurred on by panic while whe bikers actions were pure idiocy. Most of my sympathy lays with the SUV driver, I feel he's going to have quite a legal battle ahead if him.

This is a contradiction, quit playing both sides of the fence from your prior comments you came in here posting without looking at the evidence with absolute clarity.

 

[Northstar]

@Tornado The action I was happy about was the smashing of the SUV's windows by the bikers at the end of the video. After the SUV driver had run over many bikers.

Why exactly?

First, the only reason he ran over many bikers(which he didn't, but whatever) is because they started threatening him after the initial incident, had they just waited like civilized people the only injured party would have been the idiot who cut infront of the SUV.

Second, had they not acted like little kids on a playground the story would have been "Man runs over motorcycle" and that's it, all the blame would be on the SUV, the sympathy with the biker. However since they did act like little kids on a playground and chose to push around the SUV all the blame is on them and all the sympathy is with the SUV.

Also, it's hard to take someone serious when they are wearing a motorcycle helmet with spikes on it.(Aimed at guy from press conference)

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

It's hard to take eight6er seriously when he doesn't have any cognitive thinking.

 

[Mikeybc]

This is a contradiction, quit playing both sides of the fence from your prior comments you came in here posting without looking at the evidence with absolute clarity.

Well of course it's a contradiction ! My opinion has changed due to the fact I missed a couple details the first couple of views of the video on a phone. At first I thought the SUV driver had intentionally hit the bike when it slowed down in front of him.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Well of course it's a contradiction ! My opinion has changed due to the fact I missed a couple details the first couple of views of the video on a phone. At first I thought the SUV driver had intentionally hit the bike when it slowed down in front of him.

Yeah and I set you straight on that along with others, but it still seems you don't fully wish to leave your first opinion.