Your faith in Gran Turismo - has it been permanently damaged?

[The_Tullster]

Sometimes it's good to be old enough to have learned how satisfying it is to work hard to achieve a goal compared to how soul sapping it is to get everything on easy mode 🤷‍♂️

 

[RacingFan1]

I don't believe we should blame the PS4 when we had a visual masterpiece like Driveclub release exclusively on it almost 10 years ago. Polyphony's tech is just really old, but yeah I expect the visuals to be overhauled for the next game. Hopefully all the tracks and environments get some nice next-gen TLC.

I played Driveclub and i though it was overrated garbage with bad gameplay and bad physics and running at 30 fps was one of the main reasons for that. You simply don't make a 30 fps driving game. It kills everything. 30fps allows creating more detailed graphics with the same power, but no, don't! Pretty graphics but who cares if the game itself isnt good?

 

[AudiMan2011]

Use your brain, then you realise it is positive if its still a work in progress as there is a hell of a lot more to come - The really, really unacceptable thing, would be if the game in its current state would be almost done in updates. The negative thing, if anything, is the rushed release. Got it?

It shouldn't be a postive that games are released half finished. Back then people were quite content to play games that were sold as COMPLETE products and would drop DLC and proper expansion packs every 3 or 4 months. Nowadays people have drilled it into their heads to constantly expect updates every month just to give them reasons to keep grinding. That mindset smacks of entitlement.

 

[ICEYOU3]

I played Driveclub and i though it was overrated garbage with bad gameplay and bad physics and running at 30 fps was one of the main reasons for that. You simply don't make a 30 fps driving game. It kills everything. 30fps allows creating more detailed graphics with the same power, but no, don't! Pretty graphics but who cares if the game itself isnt good?

I genuinely agree.

 

[pburford]

So I booted up GT7 yesterday and checked the Legendary Car Dealership. Spotted the Mercedes 300 SL for sale at a little over a million and thought this would be something worth grinding for. But then having completed the Menu Books with only a smattering of events left to complete, I just thought I can't be bothered engaging with this pointless grind anymore. Racing the same event for meagre payouts, just to win a car there's not even an appropriate event to use it in. The GT7 experience just feels incredibly hollow and seemingly rather pointless.

I think a lot of us would agree the last few months have been a very trying time as a Gran Turismo fan. I've been playing the series since 2000 and have always admired and respected the work of Polyphony Digital. GT4 represented the absolute pinnacle of the series, only for a steady decline to occur with subsequent instalments. However the brand damage done by GT7 has seriously shaken my faith in the developer. I no longer believe Kaz and his team are capable of creating a compelling "game" any more. Don't get me wrong, the "feel" of GT, the driving in itself, is still incredible. But the "game" side is just sorely lacking and hopelessly outdated. Unlike Sport mode, the PVE experience is woefully unsatisfying with no sense of competition thanks to it's hopelessly outdated chase the rabbit AI.

Personally I feel like I've reached a bit of a turning point with the series. I've just lost faith with the franchise having been repeatedly disappointed with recent instalments. Why is it so hard for PD to create a compelling campaign mode? If PD actually communicated with their community they would know what their audience demanded. I feel like a lot of the fans on GTPlanet understand what it is that makes a truly great Gran Turismo game. If only PD could be bothered to listen and take their opinions into consideration.

As much as I respect Kaz for all that he's done with GT as a franchise, I think it's time he passed the reins on to a new generation of developers. Either within Polyphony or further afield. Imagine what Evolution Studios could have done for example, given their excellent work on Drive Club. The series needs a fresh start and new perspectives to move forward. Otherwise the goodwill the brand has built up over the last 25 years will continue to be exhausted if the disappointments continue.

Here's my question for the GTPlanet community, does GT7 represent the end of the road for you? If not, how badly has your faith been shaken in the franchise and do you trust PD to restore the series to its former glories?

Personally I'll be taking a break from the franchise but will continue to keep an eye on things hoping for positive developments. Whether PD can restore my faith is another question entirely, but the fact is I simply don't think they're capable of fixing an inherently broken and downright boring game.

No, I’m really enjoying the game

 

[Staquix]

My faith in gaming as a whole is taking a beating lately. GT7 was just a large contributor to my disbelief of gaming company's and there conspicuous desire to milk every cent from there costumers they think they can get away with. Not to mention there scrupulous PR teams pumping out bullet points and media just short of lies to get us to buy half baked broken games.

 

[CodeCmdr]

I've probably only played GT7 for something like 5 hours since I purchased it on release day.

Nothing about it really excites me. The single-player career mode feels worse than GT1, because there are hardly any options; it's such an on-rails experience. The actual race style (always starting in the back and driving against a bunch of chimps) is so outdated and boring. The physics are bad by today's standards. Music Rally is a joke. The only great thing about GT7 is the presentation, but that's merely a nice-to-have feature, not one that has a significant impact.

I kept telling myself a couple of times: "hey, I should probably go play some GT7, it shouldn't be collecting dust". But then I can't really find a compelling reason to actually go ahead and play it.

 

[The_Tullster]

My faith in gaming as a whole is taking a beating lately. GT7 was just a large contributor to my disbelief of gaming company's and there conspicuous desire to milk every cent from there costumers they think they can get away with. Not to mention there scrupulous PR teams pumping out bullet points and media just short of lies to get us to buy half baked broken games.

That's nothing new. It's been going on for twenty years at least. It just easier for them to do now with nearly the entire customer base online. And it's often not the development team that's to blame, it's the publisher and investors who are pushing for quick returns on their money.

 

[Magog]

The OP is probably trying to play the career mode normally. Using like-for-like cars in difficult mode. It takes time to find the right cars/strategies.

If you’ve really played them all from GT1 onwards, why are you always telling people to use stupid cars to complete/win events? Aren’t you over that by now? You’re advising silly stuff like use of the Radical to win 600 races, the RB Junior or Lambo VGT in races against ordinary road cars or Gr4s. Of course it’s easy if pick inappropriate cars that’d never ever really be competing with the other cars in the race.

Pls don’t brag about getting through the game or winning easily if you’re basically cheating. Some of us want to play in a way that’s more challenging and immersive, similar cars to the AI and little or no tuning.

And the OP taking time to get through whatever content’s on offer (for whatever reason) has nothing to do with the undeniable fact that there simply isn’t much content on offer in this game compared to what was there at the end of Sport’s updates, and Sport wasn’t even supposed to be a single-player focused game. Let alone GT4.

I recommend those cars to people who say they can't beat the races. From the way he is talking it doesn't seem like the OP even looked at the events after the menu was over and assumed he had beaten the game.

 

[RacingFan1]

It shouldn't be a postive that games are released half finished. Back then people were quite content to play games that were sold as COMPLETE products and would drop DLC and proper expansion packs every 3 or 4 months. Nowadays people have drilled it into their heads to constantly expect updates every month just to give them reasons to keep grinding. That mindset smacks of entitlement.

A game release being rushed isnt positive, i never said that. What is positive is the fact that there is a lot more to come.
But some negative nancies somehow always manage to never look at the bright side

 

[Niop]

I just wonder what they have been doing for the past 3-4 years.
How did they manage to deliver a product with less content than GT Sport?

It was downhill from GT5 to GT6. Then massively downhill from GT6 to GT Sport.
But then they said Sport wasn't meant to be a "Full GT iteration". So, what the hell is GT7?

Most likely the last GT I will buy at launch.

 

[Razamataz]

The OP is complaining about the lack of single player events and yet he admits he hasn't even beaten all of the post menu races which are the best the game has to offer. Funny you should mention Sport as it has shown how we can expect literally hundreds of additional race events and cars to be added over time as well as probably dozens additional tracks/layouts.

If there's one thing we can agree on, this is without a doubt the best handling GT yet. That's why it's such a shame there's nothing new and original to do in this game. At the very least they could have replicated every event from GT League in GT Sport, but PD couldn't even be bothered to do that. Utter laziness and total incompetence.

As a game, how can you say this is the best GT yet? Please enlighten me as I simply cannot see it. A 15 hour campaign just doesn't cut the mustard, especially when this game was advertised by the developer as being a spiritual successor to GT4. A game which featured a proper campaign that seriously delivered on value.

I've done all the menu books and thus seen the credits. As far as I'm concerned I've beaten the game. The handful of post menu races that you're talking about fail to make for engaging endgame content. The Group 3, Group 4 and Group B races, I've already played their equivalent in GT Sport ages ago. With no vehicles to win and only a meagre amount of credits to earn, what is the point?

 

[Hellburner]

Yes, but it was already damaged because of GT Sport. I was hoping GT7 would be a turning point but it isn't. To be fair, I think I lost faith in the whole gaming industry so it isn't just Gran Turismo...

 

[GingerBredMan]

Use your brain, then you realise it is positive if its still a work in progress as there is a hell of a lot more to come - The really, really unacceptable thing, would be if the game in its current state would be almost done in updates. The negative thing, if anything, is the rushed release. Got it?

People shouldn't be paying $80 for something that's being classified as a work in progress.

 

[sixty4half]

I think we should be able to start the game over on the same account for those who want to complete it once again sometime when the game is "finished"

How would that even work? About half to 2/3rds of the menu's are "Go get these 3 cars."

When you don't have them, yes, you get races to do. But we already have them

 

[Nagaremono]

A game release being rushed isnt positive, i never said that. What is positive is the fact that there is a lot more to come.
But some negative nancies somehow always manage to never look at the bright side

Some of the improvements coming in the updates will be there because people protested loudly. So there is a benefit to voicing discontent about a product, especially if you’ve paid decent money for it.

You (and all the others who didn’t complain, and even those who complain about the complainers) will benefit from those changes too. A bit of gratitude wouldn’t go amiss.

P.S. What’s a ‘negative nancy’? I’ve only ever heard ‘nancy’ used as a homophobic slur.

 

[Magog]

If there's one thing we can agree on, this is without a doubt the best handling GT yet. That's why it's such a shame there's nothing new and original to do in this game. At the very least they could have replicated every event from GT League in GT Sport, but PD couldn't even be bothered to do that. Utter laziness and total incompetence.

As a game, how can you say this is the best GT yet? Please enlighten me as I simply cannot see it. A 15 hour campaign just doesn't cut the mustard, especially when this game was advertised by the developer as being a spiritual successor to GT4. A game which featured a proper campaign that seriously delivered on value.

I've done all the menu books and thus seen the credits. As far as I'm concerned I've beaten the game. The handful of post menu races that you're talking about fail to make for engaging endgame content. The Group 3, Group 4 and Group B races, I've already played their equivalent in GT Sport ages ago. With no vehicles to win and only a meagre amount of credits to earn, what is the point?

There are far more than a handful of post menu races. The remaining races are the most fun and challenging in the game. If you haven't beaten them you haven't beaten the game. You can also arrange your own races at any track with any style of car you want. The racing is fantastic. That's all that matters.

 

[Nagaremono]

There are far more than a handful of post menu races. The remaining races are the most fun and challenging in the game. If you haven't beaten them you haven't beaten the game. You can also arrange your own races at any track with any style of car you want. The racing is fantastic. That's all that matters.

It really, really isn’t.

 

[RacingFan1]

Some of the improvements coming in the updates will be there because people protested loudly. So there is a benefit to voicing discontent about a product, especially if you’ve paid decent money for it.

You (and all the others who didn’t complain, and even those who complain about the complainers) will benefit from those changes too. A bit of gratitude wouldn’t go amiss.

P.S. What’s a ‘negative nancy’? I’ve only ever heard ‘nancy’ used as a homophobic slur.

I think people who protested loudly will likely make no difference in the planned upcoming updates (planned long, long ago), besides the in game money prizes being raised a bit
About negative nancy you can google it

 

[ICEYOU3]

A game release being rushed isnt positive, i never said that. What is positive is the fact that there is a lot more to come.
But some negative nancies somehow always manage to never look at the bright side

Don't you think 100% of Gran Turismo 7's problems would be solved if Polyphony Digital collaborated with Snoop Dogg again? I believe he'd spit some sense into Kaz and the rest of the suits at Sony honestly.

 

[GTxForza]

Massive changes are coming anyway and they are listening to community feedback. So NO, my faith in PD is not damaged at all.

This may take a long time for Polyphony Digital to overhaul.

 

[Razamataz]

People shouldn't be paying $80 for something that's being classified as a work in progress.

100% agree. I gave PD the benefit of the doubt with GT Sport because of the limited car roster and the time required to model next gen assets. GT7 had a huge library of cars and tracks to deal with, yet where is the content? Where are the Group 1, Nostalgic 1979 and Vision GT cups? Where are the endgame championships? There's literally nothing to do other than a handful of event races. Frankly it's not good enough. Paying full price at launch for an unfinished game I'll tolerate once, not twice.

 

[kilesa4568]

If they'd at least got the physics close to enjoyable, I might have had something positive to say that took away some of the sting of PD's nefarious launch but they couldn't even get that right.

I can say with absolute certainty I'd never buy their half cooked chicken pie and food poisoning at launch again.

 

[Nagaremono]

I think people who protested loudly will likely make no difference in the planned upcoming updates (planned long, long ago), besides the in game money prizes being raised a bit
About negative nancy you can google it

New tracks and cars are planned for sure.

But things like increased payouts and ability to sell cars (whatever form that takes) will almost certainly be as a result of the protests. Kaz’s statement confirmed they’d been heard and would be addressed.

 

[Magog]

100% agree. I gave PD the benefit of the doubt with GT Sport because of the limited car roster and the time required to model next gen assets. GT7 had a huge library of cars and tracks to deal with, yet where is the content? Where are the Group 1, Nostalgic 1979 and Vision GT cups? Where are the endgame championships? There's literally nothing to do other than a handful of event races. Frankly it's not good enough. Paying full price at launch for an unfinished game I'll tolerate once, not twice.

Do you really need someone else to put a shiny bow on it to enjoy the races? You can do a Gr 1 race easily at any track with custom races. You can even do a standing start if that's you're preference. If you need someone else to set the challenges for you I've got one. Do a one make race with every car in the game at every track. Bam! This one game will now last you the rest of your life! 😀

 

[Razamataz]

There are far more than a handful of post menu races. The remaining races are the most fun and challenging in the game. If you haven't beaten them you haven't beaten the game. You can also arrange your own races at any track with any style of car you want. The racing is fantastic. That's all that matters.

I'm glad you find the racing fantastic, but chase the rabbit just doesn't cut it for me anymore. I picked up F1 2021 in the sales recently and was genuinely shocked by how good the AI was in comparison. Proper wheel to wheel action. Proper racing.

Sure we can arrange our own custom races, but when the payouts are utterly meagre, what is the point? Games need a sense of progression, a sense of reward for your time and effort invested. 4000 approx credits for a 3 lap race at Suzuka against bad AI on supposedly "Professional" difficulty? Not interested sorry.

 

[NotThePrez]

A game release being rushed isnt positive, i never said that. What is positive is the fact that there is a lot more to come.

People didn't spend $70-$100 on a "work in progress," they spent it on a complete game, because that what GT7 was presented as, as "The Complete Gran Turismo Experience" during it's dedicated State of Play event. There was NO indication whatsoever that the game was going to be a work-in-progress leading up to its release. As such, people are justifiably upset with PD and Sony about their purchase, because they feel like the 2 companies were being dishonest with them.

But some negative nancies somehow always manage to never look at the bright side

Believe it or not, it is possible to like a game (or any medium for that matter), but still point out and be critical of its objective flaws. There is nothing that is above criticism. In its case, GT7 objectively has a significant number of flaws (some of which were clearly intentional) that, for a large number of people, make the game very difficult to enjoy.

That being said, it's in some capacity thanks to these "negative nancies" that PD actually put out a response to the criticism (since they normally go for the silent treatment). It's because of this feedback that improvements will be coming at a hopefully more rapid pace, and hopefully be substantial. You're also going to be getting a better game as well, so people being critical and pointing out issues benefits you, too.

As for the question in hand, I lost a decent bit of faith with GT5 more than anything else. PD seemingly having not learned their lessons from that game definitely doesn't help.

 

[Magog]

I'm glad you find the racing fantastic, but chase the rabbit just doesn't cut it for me anymore. I picked up F1 2021 in the sales recently and was genuinely shocked by how good the AI was in comparison. Proper wheel to wheel action. Proper racing.

Sure we can arrange our own custom races, but when the payouts are utterly meagre, what is the point? Games need a sense of progression, a sense of reward for your time and effort invested. 4000 approx credits for a 3 lap race at Suzuka against bad AI on supposedly "Professional" difficulty? Not interested sorry.

The point is to enjoy the racing. If you aren't using the cars you already have why do you need more? What percentage of the cars you own have you even put one mile on?

 

[Silver_Wolf]

Simple answer.

No, what game have i played every day since release, Gt7.

Perhaps a few minor niggles but nothing about this game damages the series reputation, i am tired of the world dragging this game to the gutter.

Some flak is deserved i agree but games which damaged the franchise in my opinion were Gran Turismo 6 and Sport.

My faith was restored by this game after the hell that was Gt Sport.

 

[Zero2Oblivion]

No.

I think a lot people have issue because GT7's solo career is essentially non-existent (a career would be guided race to race, GT7 has Cafe Menus followed by pick your own race).

The early GT games had tiered brackets of races and championships for you to work through - complete the beginner events in a car picked up from the used dealership, move up to the next bracket or tier, upgrade your car and keep going. It gave the game a solid feeling of progression.

You'd have thought that would be included in GT7 instead of the Cafe Menus, as with the launch of GT Sport there was fan backlash over Sports lack of solo campaign, and to fix it PD actually implemented more races in a tiered format! Why didn't they learn from Sport and include that in GT7 from the start?

Instead PD gave us a sandbox - there are some races to complete once you've finished the Cafe Menus, but the expectation from PD is that you setup your own races on tracks with the car class you want to race against (remember that these races have lower payouts as well), but for a lot of racers that lack of a guided path falls short and leaves them feeling there was a lack of effort on PDs part in this regard.

Have I lost faith in PD? No, the Cafe Menus are a novel idea and PD wanted to try something different. It just wasn't what fans actually wanted. It should be fairly easy for PD to correct the games course through patches though, and what they have made so far is very well done.