Career discussion

[Magdelayna]

The car will pull if you have the steering turned even remotely when braking, but I had that at Spa as well, found it helps to set the car up quite nicely.

I had a wonderful round at Laguna Seca, with a third place finish despite a run off at the Corkscrew on lap 4 (of 5).

But when i quit out of career and went to Zolder in Time Trial it didnt pull to the side at all,even when turning? Its very odd as Spa & Bathurst were fine - it only happened at Zolder & Laguna Seca in career.

 

[Scaff]

I may be able to help out here, way back in the GT4 days I wrote a tuning guide that included a piece of 'Reading the circuit' as some corners on a track are far more important to get right than others because the speed you carry out of a corner before a straight will determine the speed you can achieve on the straight itself and only a small difference in the corner can make a huge difference at the end of the straight.

The wall of text for this is as follows:

Reading the Circuit

The Theory

When driving or tuning a car for a specific track it very quickly becomes clear that certain corners are more important than others are. These important corners are the ones that can make or break a good lap time or really push the car to the limits of is potential.


While it is perfectly possible to discover these corners through track time and trail and error is quite handy to be able to identify them early on and be able to focus on them from the start of tuning or driving.


Various methods have emerged over the years for prioritising corners on a track, the one I use is based on a method first outlined by Alan Johnson in his 1971 book ‘Driving in Competition’. He proposed that when you look at a track you would find only three types of corners:


Type 1 - One that leads onto a straight

Type 2 - One that comes at the end of a straight

Type 3 - One that connects two other corners


Type 1 corners are of more importance than Type 2 corners, which in turn are more important than Type 3 corners.


Over the years various people have taken this method and revised it further, each adding a little more to it. One of the most commonly used variations (and my preferred one) Is to then break each of these three corner type down further into fast, medium and slow corners. With fast being the highest priority and slow the lowest.


The reasoning behind this is twofold.


First you have more time to gain or lose on a fast corner, corner at 90% of the car’s limit on a 50mph corner and you are doing 45mph, do the same on a 100mph corner and you are doing 90mph. You lose and extra 5mph on the faster corner by being the same amount under the cars limit. This is of course even more critical on a corner that leads to a straight, as it will have a huge effect on the maximum speed you can reach on the straight.


The second reason behind subdividing corners into speeds is that generally people will be slightly more cautious on faster corners than slower ones, so if you can master them you have an advantage over a more cautious driver.


This now gives us the following corner rankings, from most important to least important.


Type 1a - Fast corners that lead onto a straight

Type 1b - Medium corners that lead onto a straight

Type 1c - Slow corners that lead onto a straight

Type 2a - Fast corners that come at the end of a straight

Type 2b - Medium corners that come at the end of a straight

Type 2c - Slow corners that come at the end of a straight

Type 3a - Fast corners that connect two other corners

Type 3b - Medium corners that connect two other corners

Type 3c - Slow corners that connect two other corners


When a corner could fall into two different types it will always be of the higher ranking.


Grand Valley Speedway - An Example


Now let’s take a look at a track in Gran Turismo 4 and apply our ranking system to it and for this example we will be using the Grand Valley Speedway.


1. This could be either a corner at the end of the main straight or the corner before the next straight. As already mentioned it will always fall into the higher ranking so this is a Type 1c – Slow corners that lead onto a straight.


2. This high speed chicane is made up of corners that link other corners and as such it is a Type 3a - Fast corners that connect two other corners.


3. As with corner 1 this hairpin could fall into two categories, so it again goes into the higher one, so is a Type 1c – Slow corner that lead onto a straight.


4. This left hander is quite clearly a Type 2b - Medium corners that come at the end of a straight.


5. This very slow complex is a Type 3c - Slow corner that connect two other corners, and while tricky is rarely critical to overall laptimes. It is in fact the lowest ranking section of the track.


6. The left hander after the slow complex leads onto a short straight and as such ranks as a Type 1b - Medium corner that lead onto a straight.


7. This quite tricky left hander is a medium corner at the end of a straight and as such ranks as a Type 2b - Medium corners that come at the end of a straight.


8. And it leads straight onto this quite important corner, a medium right hand corner before a nice straight over the bridge, ranking as a Type 1b – Medium corners that lead onto a straight.


9. This fast sweeping right hand corner through the tunnel section ranks as a Type 2a - Fast corners that come at the end of a straight, and requires good throttle control to get around without running wide.


10. A tricky one to class this, at first glance its potentially a set of linking corners, but it does lead onto a straight, so it goes in the higher class. It’s a Type 1c - Slow corners that lead onto a straight.


11. The final corner of the Grand Valley Speedway and a very high speed corner leading onto the longest straight on the circuit. The single most important corner on the track and the only 1a – Fast corners that lead onto a straight.


So if we apply our new ranking system to our map of Grand Valley Speedway its looks like this.


Now I’m quite sure that some of the people reading this will by now be saying, “that’s rubbish corner x is a Type xx corner”, and that’s fine by me. The point of this section and the above exercise is to get you thinking about the very process of corner ranking. As I mentioned at the beginning the above method has been adapted and tweaked over the years for different people, and that’s fine. Because more than anything else the simple act of thinking about the circuit itself and how one corner relates to the next and to your overall time is the single most important thing.



Now while the above uses a GT4 track as an example it may well help to work it out for a track you are having issues with and it will soon become second nature.

Hope it helps.

 

[crowhop]

I felt like I had it figured out by the end of the weekend. I think my qualifying results had me 5th and 7th, or something like that. I had a hard time in the first race, but was making mental notes on where I was loosing time to the AI, with the two biggest causes of timeloss being Becketts and Club.

I was having trouble sighting the entry at Becketts and would end up either braking too earlier or turning in too early. I used a small patch of concrete (maybe even an access road) on the left as my braking point and found that you can carry a lot of speed through the corner, especially if you use all the road on exit.

Club was the other (and probably most important), which was simply me driving too deep into the first part of the corner. I found that the Clio is quite happy to curb hop rather aggressively and that the best way around Club was to brake hard and turn in very early, using all of the available curb on the left hander, all while aiming at the apex of the first right hander, then flowing it through onto the home straight. This sequence is also critical for setting up passing moves at Village.

I managed a 6th in the first race, but by the second race I had identified all these areas and put them to good use. I pitted from 5th as soon as the pit window opened and was able to use clear track to jump myself up to 3rd by the end of the pitstop cycle. I attempted a pass for 2nd at Village on the last lap, but couldn't pull it off. At first I had thought I didn't like the new International layout, but by the end of this race, I was enjoying it.

(track map for corner references

I had no hopes at Overtaking at either Village or Club. I simply couldn't out-brake them, no matter what I tried. If I tried to even match their braking zone, I'd overshoot the corner and be off the track. I could make hay on exit of Club and Becketts though. If I made it well enough I could clear them through Abbey and Hangar.

Overall, my laps were so close theirs it was maddening, but they could kill me at Club, the best overtaking spot on the track. And they did. Thankfully, I was more or less a wash at Village. I didn't really gain time, but I didn't lose it either. They were probably .2 quicker at Club though. My only hope was a good exit and box them out at Abbey.

I definitely need to try to take more curb on the initial lefthander though. But it always seemed I bounced the car too much, would get unsettled and lose time on exit (perhaps a tuning issue).
Part of the frustration is I am pretty quick through there on GT6 and would probably be quick through there if the AI were at 95%. But I love the challenge and frustration.

I really enjoy the Clio Cup series. For me it is a lot of work as I don't know these tracks. I know Silverstone and Brands because of GT6, but I'd never even heard of Snetterton or Oultan. And only knew of Donington because of Senna. I have to practice these tracks quite a bit, admittedly more than the regs would allow, just to be competitive with the AI at 100%.
I'm currently in the Final Round at Brands. From what I've read here, it will be a difficult one. I'm pretty far off the pace through practice so far, but I've just mainly been tuning, trying to learn all I can on how it works. I really love this game.

 

[crowhop]

I may be able to help out here, way back in the GT4 days I wrote a tuning guide that included a piece of 'Reading the circuit' as some corners on a track are far more important to get right than others because the speed you carry out of a corner before a straight will determine the speed you can achieve on the straight itself and only a small difference in the corner can make a huge difference at the end of the straight.

The wall of text for this is as follows:

Reading the Circuit

The Theory

When driving or tuning a car for a specific track it very quickly becomes clear that certain corners are more important than others are. These important corners are the ones that can make or break a good lap time or really push the car to the limits of is potential.


While it is perfectly possible to discover these corners through track time and trail and error is quite handy to be able to identify them early on and be able to focus on them from the start of tuning or driving.


Various methods have emerged over the years for prioritising corners on a track, the one I use is based on a method first outlined by Alan Johnson in his 1971 book ‘Driving in Competition’. He proposed that when you look at a track you would find only three types of corners:


Type 1 - One that leads onto a straight

Type 2 - One that comes at the end of a straight

Type 3 - One that connects two other corners


Type 1 corners are of more importance than Type 2 corners, which in turn are more important than Type 3 corners.


Over the years various people have taken this method and revised it further, each adding a little more to it. One of the most commonly used variations (and my preferred one) Is to then break each of these three corner type down further into fast, medium and slow corners. With fast being the highest priority and slow the lowest.


The reasoning behind this is twofold.


First you have more time to gain or lose on a fast corner, corner at 90% of the car’s limit on a 50mph corner and you are doing 45mph, do the same on a 100mph corner and you are doing 90mph. You lose and extra 5mph on the faster corner by being the same amount under the cars limit. This is of course even more critical on a corner that leads to a straight, as it will have a huge effect on the maximum speed you can reach on the straight.


The second reason behind subdividing corners into speeds is that generally people will be slightly more cautious on faster corners than slower ones, so if you can master them you have an advantage over a more cautious driver.


This now gives us the following corner rankings, from most important to least important.


Type 1a - Fast corners that lead onto a straight

Type 1b - Medium corners that lead onto a straight

Type 1c - Slow corners that lead onto a straight

Type 2a - Fast corners that come at the end of a straight

Type 2b - Medium corners that come at the end of a straight

Type 2c - Slow corners that come at the end of a straight

Type 3a - Fast corners that connect two other corners

Type 3b - Medium corners that connect two other corners

Type 3c - Slow corners that connect two other corners


When a corner could fall into two different types it will always be of the higher ranking.


Grand Valley Speedway - An Example


Now let’s take a look at a track in Gran Turismo 4 and apply our ranking system to it and for this example we will be using the Grand Valley Speedway.


1. This could be either a corner at the end of the main straight or the corner before the next straight. As already mentioned it will always fall into the higher ranking so this is a Type 1c – Slow corners that lead onto a straight.


2. This high speed chicane is made up of corners that link other corners and as such it is a Type 3a - Fast corners that connect two other corners.


3. As with corner 1 this hairpin could fall into two categories, so it again goes into the higher one, so is a Type 1c – Slow corner that lead onto a straight.


4. This left hander is quite clearly a Type 2b - Medium corners that come at the end of a straight.


5. This very slow complex is a Type 3c - Slow corner that connect two other corners, and while tricky is rarely critical to overall laptimes. It is in fact the lowest ranking section of the track.


6. The left hander after the slow complex leads onto a short straight and as such ranks as a Type 1b - Medium corner that lead onto a straight.


7. This quite tricky left hander is a medium corner at the end of a straight and as such ranks as a Type 2b - Medium corners that come at the end of a straight.


8. And it leads straight onto this quite important corner, a medium right hand corner before a nice straight over the bridge, ranking as a Type 1b – Medium corners that lead onto a straight.


9. This fast sweeping right hand corner through the tunnel section ranks as a Type 2a - Fast corners that come at the end of a straight, and requires good throttle control to get around without running wide.


10. A tricky one to class this, at first glance its potentially a set of linking corners, but it does lead onto a straight, so it goes in the higher class. It’s a Type 1c - Slow corners that lead onto a straight.


11. The final corner of the Grand Valley Speedway and a very high speed corner leading onto the longest straight on the circuit. The single most important corner on the track and the only 1a – Fast corners that lead onto a straight.


So if we apply our new ranking system to our map of Grand Valley Speedway its looks like this.


Now I’m quite sure that some of the people reading this will by now be saying, “that’s rubbish corner x is a Type xx corner”, and that’s fine by me. The point of this section and the above exercise is to get you thinking about the very process of corner ranking. As I mentioned at the beginning the above method has been adapted and tweaked over the years for different people, and that’s fine. Because more than anything else the simple act of thinking about the circuit itself and how one corner relates to the next and to your overall time is the single most important thing.



Now while the above uses a GT4 track as an example it may well help to work it out for a track you are having issues with and it will soon become second nature.

Hope it helps.

I remember reading this what seems like years ago. Really opened my eyes to just how fanatical some of you GT players were. Ha.

 

[Scaff]

I remember reading this what seems like years ago. Really opened my eyes to just how fanatical some of you GT players were. Ha.

Still am

 

[samurai8juice]

The Formula Rookie is a fun car, but I really hate the AI.

 

[Saidur_Ali]

I may be able to help out here, way back in the GT4 days I wrote a tuning guide that included a piece of 'Reading the circuit' as some corners on a track are far more important to get right than others because the speed you carry out of a corner before a straight will determine the speed you can achieve on the straight itself and only a small difference in the corner can make a huge difference at the end of the straight.

Adding on to this, it is quite important to get downforce level right for track which also affects brake mapping and brake pressure choice which all end up affecting braking stability and speed. Did some laps on Monza in the BMW M1 Procar and it shows how vital it is to get type 1b and 1c corners right on that track. It was quite interesting trying to beat some ghosts which cut the track, some might make up a lot of time if they read your guide and execute it on track. Personally yet to get a decent balance but hoping I can do a time in 1:45's without cutting track.

 

[Elitekilla29]

The Formula Rookie is a fun car, but I really hate the AI.

I still have yet to test out this car in the game. Along with a few others.

 

[martinezlj]

Loving the Clio right now, but I would love to have some contract objectives, it will add a little push in career mode.

 

[azidahaka]

I went there, the other race is Suzuka well Sukatto? Or however it's spelt.

It's 3 rounds then it's the world championship if you qualify.

I hope not just first classifies qualifies else i'm dust

After a 1st/2nd place at dubai, i had a 2nd/8th at sakitto (ginettas unstoppable and ai cheating on tires is a BIG issue now) and i have little hope for Bathurst.

In any case the tires bug might mean i'll stop doing career T_T On sakitto long race (i always race 100% distance) the ginettas lapped half of the grid and by race end were impossibly fast...

Would hate to stop playing the career for such stupid reason as AI not having tire deterioration. Come on sms, fix such small thing it can't be that hard!

I can't understand how the tire bug is not there in single race weekends from what people says ?_?

Edit: the AI obviously did 2nd/1st at dubai, 1st/3rd at sakitto with most of the poles >_> I hate you AI lechampion or what is its name

 

[Maggor]

Yesterday I lost my first GT3 race on Laguna Seca by running out of fuel because I did not realize I have to adjust the fuel load at the beginning. I cannot even be mad, that was my mistake.

What bugs me though is the fact that I am using AI 80 and I am dominating GT3. With same settings I can hardly compete in some invitational events, which leads me to fact, that my chances of winning are highly dependent on mastering specific vehicle. Caterham Classic is probably my biggest nightmare.

 

[crowhop]

Question for those who've progressed into Season 2 of their Career and beyond:

Do the invitations to the one-off races like the Pro Car M1 race come every year? I'm just completing my first season and I'm not terribly interested in doing it now, but wouldn't want to lose the opportunity forever.

 

[JBF77]

Question for those who've progressed into Season 2 of their Career and beyond:

Do the invitations to the one-off races like the Pro Car M1 race come every year? I'm just completing my first season and I'm not terribly interested in doing it now, but wouldn't want to lose the opportunity forever.

I'm pretty sure they come back every year!

 

[priesty_lfc]

Watching your car being driven is painful.

 

[priesty_lfc]

Question for those who've progressed into Season 2 of their Career and beyond:

Do the invitations to the one-off races like the Pro Car M1 race come every year? I'm just completing my first season and I'm not terribly interested in doing it now, but wouldn't want to lose the opportunity forever.

Yeah, once they unlock they are there every year.

 

[azidahaka]

The ai cheating killed any chance i had on the gt4 season i started, so i didn't bother racing at Bathurst were ai has crazy grip in downhill section and does not suffer from rain or tires getting worn out. Also game gave me an ai that actually racketed almost 80 points out of 96... Just wow. So skipped last 2 races and restarted season. Finished 4th. Now i'll race shorter races like 30% ti be less affected by game bugs, and i'll try hard to get 66 points in first 3 rounds and hope will be enough. Maybe ginetta was a better choice lol.

 

[JBF77]

Just finished season 1 (Clio Cup) and got offers from GT5, Kart One, Formula Gulf. Chose GT5 in the end!

 

[m3lover1]

Holy **** that was an awesome quali. First round of the Historic 320 invitational race at Hockenheim Short...driving the BMW 320 Turbo Group 5 of course. What an awesome car. A bit of a handful...didn't really have a good practice. Into quali was 7th for a long time, up until 3 mins to go...went through first sector with the best time, and moved up to 4th after completed the lap. Still had close to 2 mins so pushed for one more lap. Went through first sector, best sector time again, second sector, best sector time there too! Couldn't quite nab the third sector but moved to 2nd position! Most satisfying quali ever, even more so than my poles that I got with my Clio.

 

[giorgos21]

started with formula rookie,won uk,european and world championship and i've signed a contract for formula gulf but haven't race yet.I also won the group 5 historic uk championsip and now i will participate to the european group 5 historic championship.

 

[m3lover1]

Damn Barcelona with the 320 turbo is a spin fest...

To give you an idea how bad I am...I'm 3 seconds off. Not 3 seconds off the lead...3 seconds off of second to last place, 15th. I ended practice session 16th out of 16th I spun out one time each lap I completed

 

[Brend]

Accidentally put wet tyres on my Clio at dry Brands Hatch and decided to roll with it..

the level of grip was insane. I was lapping 2 seconds faster.

Then I had to pit for burning out the tread!

 

[niceness-dk]

Wow. The Vintage GT 67 Mk IV Challenge at Sonoma must be the hardest race yet for me. I was struggling so hard, so I put the AI to 40 % just to get through the event.

Then... With 1,5 laps to go, it starts raining..................................

 

[azidahaka]

second gt4 season, still same issues with ai cheating. This is getting annoying now, i just have 5 points over the otjer driver so i basically lost again since there's bathurst now... this issues are ruining career for me and i fear i might drop the game until fixed.... i do not want to cheat setting ai at a lower level but i hate to be trolled by ai cheating. I'm in a dilemma, no clue what to do.

 

[talkin_2_me]

Guys, am I seriously the only one with this annoying setup bug where it's changed to somthing completely unusable every friggin' time I enter the 'edit setup' menu? (PS4)
I can live with my wheel or the sound ocrasionally crashing, or the inconsistent AI, but this bug sucks all the fun out of the game for me, at the moment. I'm seriously starting to regret having invested over 500 bucks in this game. Should've bought a motorcycle, instead.

 

[Scaff]

Guys, am I seriously the only one with this annoying setup bug where it's changed to somthing completely unusable every friggin' time I enter the 'edit setup' menu? (PS4)
I can live with my wheel or the sound ocrasionally crashing, or the inconsistent AI, but this bug sucks all the fun out of the game for me, at the moment. I'm seriously starting to regret having invested over 500 bucks in this game. Should've bought a motorcycle, instead.

I'm not getting it (for which I count myself lucky) on the PS4, I did however get a reply save mess up last night and corrupt all of my replays. I would get sound but the playback progress bar wouldn't move and the screen was black. Had to delete all my replays to get rid of it.

Did have fun tonight in one of the road car invitationals, two race event at Snetterton and Oulton Park, the BMW 1M Coupe is a nice little car.

 

[Brend]

I'm not getting it (for which I count myself lucky) on the PS4, I did however get a reply save mess up last night and corrupt all of my replays. I would get sound but the playback progress bar wouldn't move and the screen was black. Had to delete all my replays to get rid of it.

Did have fun tonight in one of the road car invitationals, two race event at Snetterton and Oulton Park, the BMW 1M Coupe is a nice little car.

Was just about to come post the same thing as I just finished the Snetterton!

In this event I won my first race in over a season, literally wooped with my fist in the air when I crossed the line -0.250 ahead of nearest competitor.

What has this game done to me!

(Had an interesting glitch that said I finished 2nd in Qualifying but awarded me pole anyway. )

 

[crowhop]

Guys, am I seriously the only one with this annoying setup bug where it's changed to somthing completely unusable every friggin' time I enter the 'edit setup' menu? (PS4)
I can live with my wheel or the sound ocrasionally crashing, or the inconsistent AI, but this bug sucks all the fun out of the game for me, at the moment. I'm seriously starting to regret having invested over 500 bucks in this game. Should've bought a motorcycle, instead.

Yes. Tuning is more or less completely bunk for me at the moment. I'm on PC. Mine started out minor in that it would revert to the default every time, but now it makes some very wild changes. I have to reset to default every time I enter the tuning menu otherwise I get a car with 2nd, 4th and 5th gears as the same.

 

[Elitekilla29]

Wow. The Vintage GT 67 Mk IV Challenge at Sonoma must be the hardest race yet for me. I was struggling so hard, so I put the AI to 40 % just to get through the event.

Then... With 1,5 laps to go, it starts raining..................................

Oh man I attempted it and didn't even complete it just skip passed it lol. And I had the AI at 80% so imagine how that is to you

 

[Daniel Pinho]

What bugs me though is the fact that I am using AI 80 and I am dominating GT3. With same settings I can hardly compete in some invitational events...

I had the same issue w/ the RUF in some invitational. It seema that SMS want you to learn how to setup the car. I kept difficulty @80 and start to adjust susp, after a hour or so Ive got pole

 

[talkin_2_me]

Yes. Tuning is more or less completely bunk for me at the moment. I'm on PC. Mine started out minor in that it would revert to the default every time, but now it makes some very wild changes. I have to reset to default every time I enter the tuning menu otherwise I get a car with 2nd, 4th and 5th gears as the same.

Hm, so it's not just on consoles. I wonder what triggers this stupid bug, as not many people seem to have it. Tried a new career: bug still appears. Tried single race: all good.
I'm close to deleting everything and installing the game again.