F1 Winter Testing (2012)

[Liquid]

BMW, Honda and Toyota should never have held a factory stake in an F1 team. I guess they thought that they could be like Ferrari, in which case, the only manufacturer that even has a chance at that would be Mercedes.

Don't forget the Ford works team too. Jaguar was just a name to promote that particular brand.

 

[peter_vod69]

Don't forget the Ford works team too. Jaguar was just a name to promote that particular brand.

It's funny how while they were "Stewart", they were actually pretty good, and then as soon as Jaguar/Ford took over, they went downhill.

 

[Liquid]

It's funny how while they were "Stewart", they were actually pretty good, and then as soon as Jaguar/Ford took over, they went downhill.

Well Stewart was an independent team but with substantial backing from Ford, with engine preferences over Minardi and Tyrrell for example.

You're right though, look at Stewart's rise to arguably the best of the rest at the end of 1999. Ford took a lovely pan of hot, Scottish broth that just needed to simmer at 80 degrees celsius, then clumsily boiled all the flavour away.

 

[peter_vod69]

Well Stewart was an independent team but with substantial backing from Ford, with engine preferences over Minardi and Tyrrell for example.

You're right though, look at Stewart's rise to arguably the best of the rest at the end of 1999. Ford took a lovely pan of hot, Scottish broth that just needed to simmer at 80 degrees celsius, then clumsily boiled all the flavour away.

It's as if Ford assumed they could just buy the team, come up with a snappy livery (and it was a good one) and the rest would sort itself out.

 

[Liquid]

Hiring Rahal was very risky. A gamble that just didn't pay off. Success running a team in the States doesn't translate to success in F1. I think what destroyed Rahal was when he failed to sign Adrian Newey. Newey agreed but Ron Dennis convinced him to stay at the last minute.

And Newey ended up at Red Bull anyway! Who knows how different things could have been for Jaguar if Newey went there 2001/2002.

 

[peter_vod69]

They still would've had to get on top of all the reliability problems they seemed to endure, but I agree regarding Rahal, I remember thinking at the time it was an odd choice.

 

[lemansfanatic]

Please understand that Bernard Charles Ecclestone has nothing to do with the technical regulations, design, or any of the sporting regulations.

He just makes sure the races happen, the cameras are on, and the cars show up on time, becoming very rich and powerful in doing so.

I think Bernie could have his own thread here. does he make the rules, no. but he does own F1, so part of me thinks there is a lot more than you think going on behind the scenes. he carries a lot of weight so when he doesnt like something or someone, he'll lean on it or them, and whatever he leans on inevitably breaks. he is more powerful than that FIA. feel free to argue that last point, but thats just how i see it.

 

[lemansfanatic]

Hiring Rahal was very risky. A gamble that just didn't pay off. Success running a team in the States doesn't translate to success in F1. I think what destroyed Rahal was when he failed to sign Adrian Newey. Newey agreed but Ron Dennis convinced him to stay at the last minute.

And Newey ended up at Red Bull anyway! Who knows how different things could have been for Jaguar if Newey went there 2001/2002.

Yes the chips fall with whoever has Newey it seems. i dont know if it will ever get to the point where aero is NOT the most important aspect in developing a car, but as long as it still is the person who best understands it will triumph every time.

 

[Northstar]

but he does own F1

He is only the CEO of FOM and owns 10% of it, would hardly call that owning it.

he is more powerful than that FIA.

As long as FOM is just the promoter of F1, he isn't.

 

[GTPorsche]

It's funny how while they were "Stewart", they were actually pretty good, and then as soon as Jaguar/Ford took over, they went downhill.

Perfect example right there.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

The all caps was because I getting annoyed at the fact that I had to repeat myself, because you couldn't be bothered reading.

I did read you just don't make as much sense sometimes

And you weren't? With your snide, "I wonder how long Peter's been watching F1" rubbish?

I can't wonder? It's a forum, not a inquisition, calm down.

Again, where is their car? Why wasn't it at the first, or even second test? Because it wasn't (and still isn't) ready!

As far as having it built...they did but when you fail a couple portion of the overall crash test you have to go back and fix it. So technically it has been built but needed adjustments to pass a crash test. Same goes to Marussia, if the chassis wasn't ready to go then what the hell did they use to test with? Also if HRT show up at the final test with the new car would that still not be ready to you?

Yes, there have been teams in the past that have done a much worse job than HRT or Marussia, but the era has long since passed where you should be excused for any of the rubbish they are going on with. The sport is simply too professional these days to have teams not showing up to tests. Especially, especially when the aforementioned teams are as far behind the eight ball as they are. I don't think they are a joke, I think they aren't up to the job.

Who made you the ambassador of F1 to make such claims? The era has long passed? It's been going on since the 70s onward, there is not a set era that this only happened. Yet it wasn't too professional back in the late 90s and early 2000s? Once again read opening line of this passage. I just want to know what technical information helps you come to the conclusions you arrive at. I gave you plenty of info to show they've been proactive in catching up to other teams, yet it doesn't seem to matter. Both teams are building their own chassis, which is a new experience so to expect them to build something that will pass with flying colors under brand new regulations is sort of laughable. Another reason why I don't give Ferrari too much negativity for failing because it's new.

Baffles you? You took the first shot chief. Oh and why would you (and these "others") need to "strike out" if you are so much better at arguing, and you can leave emotion out of it? Methinks what is good for the goose isn't necessarily what is good for the gander...

Okay...sure I took the first shot, we'll go with that. I'm not emotional about it, I took my time to answer you and obviously am not losing sleep over it. It's just a forum and I know that you'll be snide and obviously from how many comments you made to this point that's just how it is. *shrugs*

Andrea Moda, Fondametal, Zakspeed, Haas-Lola, Life, Dallara, BMS, Onyx, FIRST, Forti, Lola, Osella, EuroBrun, Coloni, Pacific, Modena and AGS are all teams from the 'professional' era of the mid-1980s onwards who were arguably worse than HRT or Marussia. Andrea Moda especially; they're the #1 team failure on F1 Rejects.

And that list doesn't include 'successful' backmarker teams like Minardi, Arrows or the late Tyrrells. Or flops that on occasion did well like Larrousse or Leyton House.

Give HRT/Marussia credit. They've come in and as others have pointed out, done better and been better prepared than some other teams, lest we forget.

^ This list right here shows what perspective people should really put things. I'd say Mastercard Lola was the worst, especially considering that it was a major sponsor. They were well beyond the 107% rule and the car created far more drag than downforce. At least the two teams being bashed have done much much better.

 

[Prince.M5]

Anyway, Heikki Kovalainen is not feeling well today and Vitaly will jump in the seat. It is unsure if he'll drive tomorrow and if his condition is still not good, it will be Vitaly again in the car...

 

[RTSolvalou]

"08:34 Beautiful little four wheel drift from Petrov as he exits the chicane ahead of the final corner."

 

[Sach]

Seems as though they're making changes to the exhaust on the Ferrari?

 

[Prince.M5]

Seems so. This is what they have on the previous Barcelona test...

 

[LewyOs]

 

[Matty]

Interesting...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Seems so. This is what they have on the previous Barcelona test...

Looks like a baby spit up flow vis paint all over the car.

So they're running a jet turbine this year? GE being a sponsor it had to happen sooner or later.

Seriously though that is much bigger than the opening they had last year as well as the one red bull had.

 

[jcm]

Unofficial Thursday test times from Barcelona:
1. Romain Grosjean, Lotus, 1:23.252, 73 Laps
2. Jenson Button, McLaren, 1:23.510, 64 Laps
3. Sergio Perez, Sauber, 1:23.820, 118 Laps
4. Mark Webber, Red Bull, 1:23.830, 102 Laps
5. Nico Rosberg, Mercedes, 1:23.992, 128 Laps
6. Jean-Eric Vergne, Toro Rosso, 1:24.216, 113 Laps
7. Paul di Resta, Force India, 1:24.305, 98 Laps
8. Felipe Masssa, Ferrari, 1:24.318, 105 Laps
9. Vitaly Petrov, Caterham, 1:24.876, 123 Laps
10. Pastor Maldonado, Williams, 1:25.587, 58 Laps

 

[aarror]

Wierd, the hole is larger than in the previous tests...
http://www.caterhamf1.com/gallery/2012/t02-barcelona-thursday-23rd-february-2012/vitaly-on-track-(2)

Edit: Sorry, don't know how to link pics.

 

[Prince.M5]

Looks like a baby spit up flow vis paint all over the car.

Meant to say the exhaust is different but yes, baby spit

 

[Timppaq]

1. Romain Grosjean Lotus 1.22,614 124 laps
2. Jean-Eric Vergne Toro Rosso +0,512 31
3. Sebastian Vettel Red Bull +0,747 85
4. Fernando Alonso Ferrari +0,833 125
5. Heikki Kovalainen Caterham +1,214 104
6. Kamui Kobayashi Sauber +1,222 77
7. Nico Hülkenberg Force India +1,279 33
8. Michael Schumacher Mercedes +1,364 79
9. Lewis Hamilton McLaren +1,497 65
10. Bruno Senna Williams +2,311 48
11. Pastor Maldonado Williams +3,187 20

So Lotus' back on track, no major problems this time it seems. 👍

Also read that the Lotus was much more gentle with the tyres on the race simulation than Ferrari (they ran a simulation pretty much simultaniously).

So far so good 👍

 

[Alex.]

Apparently Massa has been sacked. Rumours are spreading like wildfire. Sky Sports have just tweeted saying prepare for a dramatic announcement from testing.

I'm not holding my breath though. It would be an incredible decision.

 

[Liquid]

Apparently Massa has been sacked. Rumours are spreading like wildfire. Sky Sports have just tweeted saying prepare for a dramatic announcement from testing.

I'm not holding my breath though. It would be an incredible decision.

Link? I'm not on Twitter and I haven't found any other site that has a recenty story on 'Massa' + 'sacked'.

 

[PeterJB]

If it's true who on Earth would replace him?

 

[Alex.]

Apparently the news was that RBR have a new car for the final 2 days of testing.

 

[PeterJB]

Apparently the news was that RBR have a new car for the final 2 days of testing.

And somehow that got interpreted as Massa being sacked?

This can't be an entirely new car, unless they've built two and trying both out.

 

[Hun200kmh]

Just checked all my sources and found nothing. Ferrari's tweets never mention who's driving tomorrow but that doesn't mean anything

 

[csmeteora9]

Apparently the news was that RBR have a new car for the final 2 days of testing.

Red Bull have prepared another RB8 chassis for Mark Webber. Prior to this they were running the same chassis for both drivers during testing.

 

[Hun200kmh]

Scuderia Ferrari ‏ @InsideFerrari
The rumour mill on the internet appears to be working overtime with stories that Felipe has been sacked.


Scuderia Ferrari ‏ @InsideFerrari
It’s a shame he’s been too busy to keep up to date, as he’s been in the usual briefing with the engineers.


Scuderia Ferrari ‏ @InsideFerrari
Maybe the person writing this tale does not realise that Carnival ended some time ago…

Solved then ...