SestoScudo
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Since this season is done for.
I hope Ferrari wins Monza to make Ferrari fans happy.
I hope Ferrari wins Monza to make Ferrari fans happy.
Formula 1 Pirelli Gran Premio d'Italia 2022Formula 1
- Thread starter Jimlaad43
- 328 comments
- 14,545 views
I think what makes it most confusing, and what leads to these penalties of lesser places, is that they apply the penalties one by one, and don't fill the resulting gap in the grid on each move. They only do that at the end, once they're all done. This drawing by Rachel Brookes from a few years ago illustrates, as even at the time for this race NOR thought he was starting 4th.
One difference this year though is the order they apply penalties. It used to be in the order they submitted the change to the FIA, now it's quali order. So in Spa VER got sent to the back first, then LEC, and so on.
Oh, and there is the other stipulation that if you gain more than 15 places penalty you're sent to the "back" and can't start ahead of cars with <15 place penalties, even if the math/movement order might have had that happen.
Here is an illustration of that for Spa. So you can see that BOT should get his 20 place drop after column I, but because he can't go behind the people at the "back" no matter what, he just doesn't move. Then they're finally shuffled up.
You can also therefore see that if for example SAI had got a 3 place grid drop, he'd still have started 2nd. Because his penalty would have been applied after column C, where he was still in grid slot 2, despite now being 1st. So he goes from position "2" to "5" despite there no longer being anyone in 1. Once LEC is also moved down in the next action SAI would still be in position 5, but with only PER actually filling a slot ahead of him.
The actions themselves are quite straight forward but still not something you can work out without writing it down somewhere where there are a lot of penalties.
- 86,845
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Drivers with positional penalties leave their grid slots vacant.
i still don't get it
Positional penalties apply in qualifying order.
People with 15-place penalties (or more) go right to the back, behind people with smaller penalties.
Vacant slots only closed up when all positional penalties are applies.
- 4,019
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- DG Silva
Kind of, it was a standing safety car restart, everyone else went into the pits to get off inters. I believe toastet is more about leaving the spaces empty and making the drivers start on positions 21 onwards.
Personally, I'd think it would be funny if they have to start as far back from their quali position as 6 metres x no of penalty positions.
ROAD_DOGG33J
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Start from Curva Sud. Good luck getting through barricade.
Someone made this website so you can at least keep track of all the F1 penalties, not just grid penalties.
F1 Penalties 2023
f1penalties.com
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Nyck will make his F1 debut
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MagpieRacer
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Problem Red Bull have is that Juri Vips has killed his career; Liam Lawson is made of 100% bad luck; Ayumu Iwasa is as inexperienced as Tsunoda was; Dennis Hauger has sucked balls in F2 despite walking F3; Jehan Daruvala is Jehan Daruvala; and unless any of them are the second coming of Verstappen, the F3 boys need to crack F2 before F1.
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- DG Silva
Par for the course for any Japanese driver, isn't it? Once or twice they're astonishingly brilliant, then just madness all around.
I can only think of Satoru Nakajima and Aguri Suzuki who wasn't a complete nutcase; Sato loved his bumper cars and spent more time mowing the grass, but was incredibly fast when the stars align (still a familiar trait in Indycar); Kamui Kobiyashi muddled around but destroyed everyone at Suzuka 2012; this is followed by the usual list of unfortunate but mad Japanese drivers - and then we have Taka Inoue....
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In broad terms, no, but he was the leading driver in an absolutely ***** team (which blocked him from racing for a decent team - alongside Red Bull team-mates Hauger and Lawson - in the last race, despite being all paid up, essentially ending his career) before the weirdness in the penultimate round.
They've been having a bit of a 'mare recently though, considering all of the above and the fact they had to buy a driver in from Force India (a former FDA driver at that) to go into their top team...
... Ricciardo in for Tsunoda in 2023?
Bit of a broad brush that, especially considering the number of WEC titles Japanese drivers hold. F1 has certainly seen some mad Japanese drivers, but that doesn't mean Japanese drivers are mad.
If I'm not mistaken, de Vries is now in his fourth F1 team this season and second this race. Is that a first?
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True, Charouz are pretty bad and he was never going to get near the podium, but I guess they had enough to see in the data and general performance. I can't think of many drivers RB Junior have let go and they've then flourished in open wheelers, although I guess you could argue it was being dropped that doomed many of them. Well, maybe Doohan will but AFAIK he moved to Alpine by choice, he wasn't dropped.
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- DG Silva
Ok, I was harsh. You certainly cannot discredit the racing ability of someone who has won the Indy 500 twice (Sato), the Le Mans 24Hr 3 times (Nakajima), the Daytona 24Hr twice and the WEC twice (Kobayashi), and I don't want to pour scorn on them, but you can't deny that a combination of a Japanese driver and an F1 car tends to get a bit exciting and/or unpredictable (although your F1 bingo card got dabbed last week).
