Gran Premio d'Italia

[Pink_the_Floyd]

Pos Nr. Driver Team Laps Time Pitstops
1 2 Rubens Barrichello Ferrari 53 - 3
2 1 Michael Schumacher Ferrari 53 +1.347 2
3 9 Jenson Button BAR Honda 53 +10.197 2
4 10 Takuma Sato BAR Honda 53 +15.3 2
5 5 Juan Pablo Montoya Williams BMW 53 +32.3 2
6 5 David Coulthard McLaren Mercedes 53 +33.4 1
7 4 Antonio Pizzonia Williams BMW 53 +33.7 2
8 11 Giancarlo Fisichella Sauber Petronas 53 +35.4 2
9 14 Mark Webber Jaguar Cosworth 53 +56.7 2
10 7 Jarno Trulli Renault 53 +1:06.3 2
11 16 Ricardo Zonta Toyota 53 +1:22.5 2
12 12 Felipe Massa Sauber Petronas 52 +1 laps 3
13 15 Christian Klien Jaguar Cosworth 52 +1 laps 3
14 18 Nick Heidfeld Jordan Ford 52 +1 laps 5
15 21 Zsolt Baumgartner Minardi Cosworth 51 +2 laps 2
O 8 Fernando Alonso Renault 11 +33 rlaps 0
O 19 Giorgio Pantano Jordan Ford 33 +20 laps 0
O 20 Gianmaria Bruni Minardi Cosworth 29 +24 laps 2
O 6 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren Mercedes 13 +40 laps 1
O 17 Olivier Panis Toyota 0 +53 laps 3

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

Please wet start, PLEASE wet start!!!

Ahem, triple post?

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[livemusic]

So nice to hear Brazil´s anthem on F1 again. Congrats Rubens! 👍

 

[Brett]

How did Schumi get past Button near the end of the race? It just so happens that that was one of the couple times I slipped out of conscienceness.

These early starts--well relatively early for me--are just extremely hard for me to get up for and remain awake the whole time. Well more than likely I will be watching the replay tonight.

 

[Nasadus]

Talk about Ownage.Any doubts in Ferrari should now be clearly shattered,absouloutly amazing what Ferrari have done.Schumacher who spun in the first lap,losing 30 seconds to the leader in the race and then finishing 2nd,that's unheard of.Barrichello did well,i had doubts at the start seeing him start on wets(or intermediates,not sure) but it turned out ok,all in all a great race.

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

What the heck was Schumi doing???Man,from 15th to 2th!!!!!Good result for Rubens 👍 Dissapointing for Alonso,why didn't the marshall's pushed him?He was in a danger zone.

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

How did Schumi get past Button near the end of the race? It just so happens that that was one of the couple times I slipped out of conscienceness.

These early starts--well relatively early for me--are just extremely hard for me to get up for and remain awake the whole time. Well more than likely I will be watching the replay tonight.

The drivers didn't defend they're race line.If you watched close to the battles,you saw it.

 

[Brett]

Like I said, I slipped out of conscienceness at that point in the race. I just wanted to know how Schumi managed to get past Button. The last thing I saw before the end of the race was Button still in second place and then shortly there after Barrichello pitting for his third and last stop.

 

[daan]

Dissapointing for Alonso,why didn't the marshall's pushed him?He was in a danger zone.

Do you need to ask? It helped Ferrari and we were in Italy....

Like I said, I slipped out of conscienceness at that point in the race. I just wanted to know how Schumi managed to get past Button.

Schumacher came out of the Parabolica quicker and passed him down the start/finish straight. He was well in front by the first corner.

 

[Brett]

Ahhh, so that is how it happened.

 

[Eagle]

Best. Race. Ever.

Ok so it probably wasn't but omg. Rubens pitted on lap 4, 3 stopped the race, Michael spun down to 15th, and my heart just sank. I wasn't looking forward to coming online and finding Blake and others gloating about another Ferrari fumble, on home soil. But what can you say, they just never give up and the cars are lightning. If there was anywhere to turn nothing into something, it was at home in Italy and they did it. Absolutely phenomenal. I couldn't stop cheering and pumping the air. Brilliant. I'm still bouncing.

Congratulations to Rubens for finally winning in much deserved fashion, and to BAR for leapfrogging Renault.

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

Best. Race. Ever.

Ok so it probably wasn't but omg. Rubens pitted on lap 4, 3 stopped the race, Michael spun down to 15th, and my heart just sank. I wasn't looking forward to coming online and finding Blake and others gloating about another Ferrari fumble, on home soil. But what can you say, they just never give up and the cars are lightning. If there was anywhere to turn nothing into something, it was at home in Italy and they did it. Absolutely phenomenal. I couldn't stop cheering and pumping the air. Brilliant. I'm still bouncing.

Congratulations to Rubens for finally winning in much deserved fashion, and to BAR for leapfrogging Renault.

What?!!Best Race Ever?!!!This was a silly one like the rest of the season,the only good race we had was in Belgium!

 

[kensei]

It was a good race, not the best of the seaosn but one of the top. It made me happy to see Button fail at winning, I can't even tell you how happy (used to be a JB fan until he did the lame move of going to Williams and all his Rhetoric since then, loser).

Rubino had a great drive, as did Schumi (though he sorta forced himself to do it). Poor Kimi, yet again, when oh when will McLaren and Merc pull their thumbs out of their asses.

I did enjoy the race!

 

[SouL]

Unbelievable. A well deserved win for Ferrari. And for once... I'm actually glad they won.

A dissapointing result for Alonso, though. I was cheering for him throughout the race. I actually thought he'd give a good run for a good podium finish... or a win!
What do you guys think of the Marshalls' decision to not push Alonso back on the track? I heard the commentators of SPEED mention that they could push Alonso back on track because he was in an unsafe position. But the moment alonso got breached in the gravel... one of the Marshalls quickly ran up to him and waved off his request to be pushed.

 

[kensei]

Unbelievable. A well deserved win for Ferrari. And for once... I'm actually glad they won.

A dissapointing result for Alonso, though. I was cheering for him throughout the race. I actually thought he'd give a good run for a good podium finish... or a win!
What do you guys think of the Marshalls' decision to not push Alonso back on the track? I heard the commentators of SPEED mention that they could push Alonso back on track because he was in an unsafe position. But the moment alonso got breached in the gravel... one of the Marshalls quickly ran up to him and waved off his request to be pushed.

I'm not a huge Alonso fan and don't know the rule but I do remember Schumi beaching himself just like that last season and he did get pushed back in. I'm sure someone here knows the rule but I would have liked to see Alonso out there, though I doubt he would have cracked the top 5 in the end.

 

[Brett]

The rule is something along the lines of that if the car is only partially beached and still running, then the marshalls can help the driver get the car back onto the track. Though I do not really know the exact rule. Hopefully someone can clarify the exact rule.

 

[kensei]

The rule is something along the lines of that if the car is only partially beached and still running, then the marshalls can help the driver get the car back onto the track. Though I do not really know the exact rule. Hopefully someone can clarify the exact rule.

That sounds about right. I remember the thing about the car running. I know the marshals (or any outside source) can't push the car to get it back running if it stalls.

 

[Solid Lifters]

A course marshall can refuse to push a car back in if it's a danger zone. I love Alonso and the Renault team, but it was obvious a danger zone where he spun out and got himself beached. It was also obvious Alonso didn't get any help because he was in Italy at the time.

 

[Brett]

That sounds about right. I remember the thing about the car running. I know the marshals (or any outside source) can't push the car to get it back running if it stalls.

Yep, you are right there. But if the car is still running, then the marshalls can help to get the car back on the track. Though I still do not remember the exact wording of the rule dealing with this issue.

 

[Eagle]

Ok.

FIA Rules & Regulations - Outside Assistance

162) If a car stops during the race it must be removed as quickly as possible so that its presence does not constitute a danger or hinder other competitors. If the driver is unable to drive the car it shall be the duty of the marshals to assist him.

So it's actually somewhat ambiguous, as it depends on the context in which you read 'assist'. If by 'assist' you assume they mean assisting the driver to drive the car back onto the circuit and continue the race, then they didn't follow the rules. If however you read 'assist' as meaning assisting the driver to remove the vehicle from the track so it did not pose a danger/hinderance to other competitors, they did the right thing. We don't know for certain but I'd say that they simply made the decision that trying to push the car out and then allowing Alonso to perform a flick-spin there was too dangerous.

I would like to point out that Alonso spun all by himself, completely of his own accord, allowing Michael to move past. Whether the marshalls moved him or retired him was essentially irrelevant as Michael had been lapping anywhere up to 2 seconds faster than the Renault, so the chances of Alonso rejoining the race and repassing Schumacher were practically zero. Alonso would not have been a threat to neither Michael nor Rubens, nor was Renault a threat to Ferrari in the constructors race, so the marshalls had nothing to gain for "their" team by doing what they did.

At the incident in Nurburgring 2003, Michael was spun when Juan Pablo Montoya went around the outside of the Ferrari into the Dunlop hairpin. Just like Alonso, Schumacher beached the car and kept the engine running, however the marshalls covered the reasonable expanse of kitty litter on the outside of the hairpin and pushed the Ferrari back onto the circuit. At the time people felt that the marshalls should not have done so, and there was a brief debate about the rules, but nothing seems to have changed to make things clearer.

I'm sure the GPDA will raise the issue, as will Renault.

 

[GilesGuthrie]

I think that in this instance, since the whole field had already passed the incident under double-waved yellows, there was plenty of time to get a tractor in to move the car. And since there was a tractor about 30m from the incident, it wasn't going to take much time anyway.

In the Nurburgring incident, more of the car was on the track, and it would have taken longer to get a tractor to it.

Interesting race nonetheless. I think we saw Ferrari's true speed. And my assertion at the start of the season that Ferrari could go 30 seconds quicker over a race distance if they needed to was pretty much validated. Which is nice.

 

[Blake]

What about Bruni, that was pretty crazy. Good race, pitty to see Kimi retire AGAIN.

 

[SouL]

Oh yeah. That fire accident was wild. The pit guys were VERY quick to respond to it, though.

Quote: "Fortunately, it was extinguished immediately, but some of the fire retardant got into my helmet and I couldn't breathe properly. I'm fine now, but it's really a pity for the guys, as the car was good and I think we could have a solid finish today."

 

[Eagle]

I was impressed by the response to that incident actually, not only the instant reaction of the fire marshall (didn't hesitate for a moment) but also the Toyota team doctor (apparently a good friend of Gianmaria) coming down to check him up and make sure he was ok.

 

[Roo]

What?!!Best Race Ever?!!!This was a silly one like the rest of the season,the only good race we had was in Belgium!

You evidently missed Monaco and Hockenheim, then.

Very good fightback from Ferrari, considering they had both cars out of the points at around lap 6. Shame Button couldn't do anything about them. He did well to lead almost half the race, considering he started in 6th, and made some good passes.

Bad weekend for Minardi; Baumgartner gets hit by another car again, this time Pantano in practice, and Bruni has that pit fire. Good to see that they were both OK.

Looking forward to China already.

 

[Blake]

Minardi hasn't got much money left for this season do they? I heard they were on the brink of going broke.

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

The rule is something along the lines of that if the car is only partially beached and still running, then the marshalls can help the driver get the car back onto the track. Though I do not really know the exact rule. Hopefully someone can clarify the exact rule.

Right,also if the car's in the danger area,they are allowed to push.That's why Alonso was so angry(he would be anyway).

 

[Eagle]

Go read my post o_O

Last I heard Minardi was down on funds having lost a major sponsor after they chose to remove all livery from their cars for the British GP following the sudden death of their sporting directory John Walton.

 

[Blake]

Yeah, there recent run of crashes wouldn't help either.

 

[Pink_the_Floyd]

Minardi is needed in F1(my opinion).If Minardi goes away,there'll be only 9 teams!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!