Gran Turismo 7 Physics

Do you want more detailed and realistic physics on the next GT

  • Total voters
    203
  • Poll closed .
BigSarj
Watching Jimmy right now and I think he placed the "siminess" of the game somewhere between Project Cars 2 and iRacing. I've never played either of those games so I'm contextless.
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That's not good IMO. I had a hard time with feeling my way around a circuit with both games.
 
Just a possible heads up. Z28 said that he feels chase cam may be OP (overpowered) now because you can see the body roll before you feel it in the wheel. His very early impression, of course, but he did wonder if it will be an advantage.
 
Front wheel drive cars are way more fun to drive now. Rear-drive cars are way more temperamental but I have to say that a lot of my concerns have been addressed. The way cars rotate through a corner is way better and far less awkward than before. Throttle input is more important now and that's how it should be if Assetto Corsa has taught me anything.
 
Okay, I think I'm starting to see what people are talking about. I'm on license test A-7 with the BMW at Catalunya and none of how this car drives really makes sense. Doesn't make it any less fun, I guess, but I don't know why I'd spin with no chance of recovery; especially at these speeds.
 
BigSarj
Just a possible heads up. Z28 said that he feels chase cam may be OP (overpowered) now because you can see the body roll before you feel it in the wheel. His very early impression, of course, but he did wonder if it will be an advantage.
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I always thought the chase came gives you a better understanding of what the car is doing, and its easier to judge the cars around you. I don't use a wheel though.
 
So now that I’m deep into golding the license tests on PS4 using a DS4 and no aids, I’ve come to a conclusion.

The tuning of the inputs must be VERY different for gamepad and steering wheel. I’m not having much difficulty at all, and in fact the cars are behaving more appropriately, more predictably, and the controller inputs seem much more direct and appropriate than they were in GTS. It’s a challenge but it’s doable and very rewarding.

I assume the tuning for steering wheels is basically just 1:1, i.e. the game only gives you what you put in, i.e. if you want to control oversteer you actually have to turn the wheel lol. It’s like a self-imposed hard mode and it makes a lot of sense to me.

I also think this oversteer “problem” people are discussing is a myth. I’m not having any trouble on gamepad at all. Everything I’m seeing is a direct result of riding a car on the limit, and since none of us are enjoying an actual seat-of-the-pants sensation, the limit is very easy to approach and exceed. I’d wager that most of our instincts are actually to exceed the limit which is why Super GT or Ollie get on there and instantly spin out on the rain. Well no ****, it’s raining, but they’re not feeling the sense of delicacy that you can feel in the seat of a real car.

I do expect PD to update this behavior because there are so many complaints but I personally, on gamepad, am not seeing a problem that can’t be fixed with sticky tires, tuning, and a bit of aero, all of which are tools that race cars use to eliminate the instabilities of road cars. We do have wings in the game now after all.

Edit: Also I think muscle memory plays a roll. The most advanced drivers on GTS play often, are precise, and have a lot of expectations for each car and each track. Throw a new system at them and it forces a difficult re-learning process. I think most of us won’t suffer from that problem and will be able to adapt quicker, but obviously we’ll likely still never reach the ceiling of those more advanced players.
 
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Things I've learned from GT7 thus far:

  • There should be far more crashes on the road daily because at any point your car can break traction and fling itself into the nearest barricade for reasons unknown.
  • Driving any car with HP values north of, say, 300 requires a training course that's mandated by law because you need to learn to feather the throttle like your life depends on it. And it does.
  • If you approach a hill in said high-powered car you're going to die. Just accept it. Your life is over. Bye.
  • Rain is practically impossible to drive in and the fact there aren't more deaths in the real world is a lie fabricated by The Man.
 
Some weird oddities with the RWD road cars aside - I'm so happy with how the GR Yaris handles in this game. In Sport, the thing was an absolute unpredictable nightmare, especially on some of the better quality tyres. The behaviour of the car can actually be read with the body roll and car movements. It's great.
 
Keef
So now that I’m deep into golding the license tests on PS4 using a DS4 and no aids, I’ve come to a conclusion.

The tuning of the inputs must be VERY different for gamepad and steering wheel. I’m not having much difficulty at all, and in fact the cars are behaving more appropriately, more predictably, and the controller inputs seem much more direct and appropriate than they were in GTS. It’s a challenge but it’s doable and very rewarding.

I assume the tuning for steering wheels is basically just 1:1, i.e. the game only gives you what you put in, i.e. if you want to control oversteer you actually have to turn the wheel lol. It’s like a self-imposed hard mode and it makes a lot of sense to me.

I also think this oversteer “problem” people are discussing is a myth. I’m not having any trouble on gamepad at all. Everything I’m seeing is a direct result of riding a car on the limit, and since none of us are enjoying an actual seat-of-the-pants sensation, the limit is very easy to approach and exceed. I’d wager that most of our instincts are actually to exceed the limit which is why Super GT or Ollie get on there and instantly spin out on the rain. Well no ****, it’s raining, but they’re not feeling the sense of delicacy that you can feel in the seat of a real car.

I do expect PD to update this behavior because there are so many complaints but I personally, on gamepad, am not seeing a problem that can’t be fixed with sticky tires, tuning, and a bit of aero, all of which are tools that race cars use to eliminate the instabilities of road cars. We do have wings in the game now after all.

Edit: Also I think muscle memory plays a roll. The most advanced drivers on GTS play often, are precise, and have a lot of expectations for each car and each track. Throw a new system at them and it forces a difficult re-learning process. I think most of us won’t suffer from that problem and will be able to adapt quicker, but obviously we’ll likely still never reach the ceiling of those more advanced players.
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It is not a myth. I have gold in every license test up to IA6 using a T300 wheel. I understand that it is possible to control the cars. Despite this, I can attest that the snap oversteer problem is real.

Fundamentally, it should not be easier to control a Group C car flat out through the Porsches curves than it is to drive a road legal Corvette through a large radius turn at 100kmh without spinning.
 
Yeaaahh, I just reached the FR Challenge that featured muscle cars, and HOLY 🤬 the new physics are 🤬 atrocious in the ovals. I can't believe I have to coast around Turn 2 in Blue Moon Bay Speedway (which is the slightest corner in the track) or else my '69 Camaro just completely loses it. This is just terrible.
 
CBH
Playing GT Sport using my GT DD Pro was very good for that game, but playing it on GT7 the wheel feels out of balance with the game physics at the moment.
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Because you're using the wrong settings, as I believe you were in GTS, but the consequences here are much worse. That goes for Z28Gaming as well.
Just try the recommended settings by Fanatec. The only thing you should lower if you want to experiment is FF, INT and NDP. Drop the magic formulas.

I'm having a blast with GT7 with all cars on my GT DD Pro. Nothing unexpected happens. And I only use ABS, as in GTS. But I totally see what people mean - the physics engine has become much harder without assists.

I love it and hope they don't change much with time. To me, it feels like going from 480p to 4k in visual resolution.
 
Terronium-12
Things I've learned from GT7 thus far:

  • There should be far more crashes on the road daily because at any point your car can break traction and fling itself into the nearest barricade for reasons unknown.
  • Driving any car with HP values north of, say, 300 requires a training course that's mandated by law because you need to learn to feather the throttle like your life depends on it. And it does.
  • If you approach a hill in said high-powered car you're going to die. Just accept it. Your life is over. Bye.
  • Rain is practically impossible to drive in and the fact there aren't more deaths in the real world is a lie fabricated by The Man.
Click to expand...
Tbf my RX-7 on Nitto NT05s couldn’t go above about 70mph on the highway in a moderate rain. It just didn’t want to go straight above that speed lol. I think the rain is pretty realistic - what’s appalling to me is how close to the limit everybody actually drives in the rain. Think about it. They’ll gladly drive 20 under the speed limit on a straight section of highway but take the off-ramp at normal speed and not brake any earlier for red lights or turns in the road. They’ll still blast through parking lots at 20mph not realizing their ABS doesn’t work that slow. People are nuts, they have no idea what they’re dealing with. And yeah my FC with a whopping 160hp could be sideways all day if I actually drove to the limit, especially in the rain. As for the hill crests, I’ve spun out three times in my life creating hills. One of those times I was a passenger and we ended up in a pond lol. We were going 60 on a road with a 35 limit…that’s not a huge margin but it was enough to spin a Mazda 3.
 
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Picked up my copy this morning and was so excited to try out the new physics model only to have my expectations expertly dashed. 😂

As an autocross/track guy who has raced a huge variety of cars both stock and heavily modified and on everything from all-season tires to Hoosiers, I can safely say the physics model for the RWD cars is completely and utterly broken.
The sudden loss of rear grip as soon as the rear tires start to develop the tiniest amount of slip-angle just isn't accurate to real life. If it were, there would be no RWD cars left because they would all have been crashed by now.

I'm also amazed at the lack of feedback running over curbs and for feeling the weight of the car when it starts to slide compared to GT-Sport using the same Thrustmaster T150 wheel and PS4 Pro.
Really weird.

I am hoping PD patches the weird RWD physics soon.
 
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This is going to sound off the wall, but I have a hypothesis developing. The hypothesis is that the "physics" that we are experimenting early in the game may not be what PD has in mind for us. Allow me to explain with an even weirder example that will demonstrate where this line of thought comes from. A quick background:

My 14 year old daughter has unexpectedly taken over my PS5 playing GT7. Yes I am dying to play some more but I don't have it in my heart to stunt the possibility of a budding sim racer and I have been intermittently coaching her between relaxing Friday beers with my wife.. She has never been interested in car games. She's inexperienced and has been playing through on easy AI (which doesn't seem much different than what I have seen on hard) and with TCS 2 or 3 depending on the car. ABS Default but no other assists besides TCS.

She mangled a few of my gold times on the first round of license tests.

She was doing great until the FR American muscle car menu which is farther than I have advanced. Using the stock '69 Camaro Z28 she managed Willow Springs all by herself. But at Blue Moon Bay infield she hit a brick wall. The car was all over the place and causing her to overdrive because the AI seemed to be much quicker than normal. I saw she was on comfort tires and suggested buying sport tires. That helped but she couldn't get higher than 4th. So I suggested sport suspension. That's when everything changed. After that she hit the track and murdered the AI. The Camaro was still a bit skittish but much more planted than before. It was an instantaneous improvement.

Here comes my train of thought behind my hypothesis: Considering how good the preorder Mazda GT3 feels, could it be that PD has deliberately implemented a tiered dynamic model that is purposely flawed on base street cars for the sole reason being to convince us to start tuning cars? There are reasons to support this insane idea spinning in my head:

1) Traditional collecting and tuning has returned .
2) Gameplay seems weighted to at least improve your tires to be successful, as demonstrated by the progressive increase in AI difficulty after unlocking the tune shop.
3) Sport Mode open to tuning.
4) Luca in the cafe repeatedly tells us to tune cars for performance and stability.
5) Overwhelming bias in the GT Auto talking heads towards tire and suspension upgrades.
6) Microtransactions to "fix" the "flaws" in the dynamic model by buying upgrades that are needed to make the car feel "normal' I admit this is tin foil hat territory but I feel it's important to at least have the idea out there.

It's as if PD is saying "buy tuning parts or your car will be undrivable".

This is a really insane train of thought. The thing is, sometimes you learn more observing a rookie than you learn with your own preconceived beliefs that have been baked into your brain from previous experiences. What to you guys think of this nutcase (or purely rational) post?
 
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Pfei
This is going to sound off the wall, but I have a hypothesis developing. The hypothesis is that the "physics" that we are experimenting early in the game may not be what PD has in mind for us. Allow me to explain with an even weirder example that will demonstrate where this line of thought comes from. A quick background:

My 14 year old daughter has unexpectedly taken over my PS5 playing GT7. Yes I am dying to play some more but I don't have it in my heart to stunt the possibility of a budding sim racer and I have been intermittently coaching her between relaxing Friday beers with my wife.. She has never been interested in car games. She's inexperienced and has been playing through on easy AI (which doesn't seem much different than what I have seen on hard) and with TCS 2 or 3 depending on the car. ABS Default but no other assists besides TCS.

She mangled a few of my gold times on the first round of license tests.

She was doing great until the FR American muscle car menu which is farther than I have advanced. Using the stock '69 Camaro Z28 she managed Willow Springs all by herself. But at Blue Moon Bay infield she hit a brick wall. The car was all over the place and causing her to overdrive because the AI seemed to be much quicker than normal. I saw she was on comfort tires and suggested buying sport tires. That helped but she couldn't get higher than 4th. So I suggested sport suspension. That's when everything changed. After that she hit the track and murdered the AI. The Camaro was still a bit skittish but much more planted than before. It was an instantaneous improvement.

Here comes my train of thought behind my hypothesis: Considering how good the preorder Mazda GT3 feels, could it be that PD has deliberately implemented a tiered dynamic model that is purposely flawed on base street cars for the sole reason being to convince us to start tuning cars? There are reasons to support this insane idea spinning in my head:

1) Traditional collecting and tuning has returned .
2) Gameplay seems weighted to at least improve your tires to be successful, as demonstrated by the progressive increase in AI difficulty after unlocking the tune shop.
3) Sport Mode open to tuning.
4) Luca in the cafe repeatedly tells us to tune cars for performance and stability.
5) Overwhelming bias in the GT Auto talking heads towards tire and suspension upgrades.
6) Microtransactions to "fix" the "flaws" in the dynamic model by buying upgrades that are needed to make the car feel "normal' I admit this is tin foil hat territory but I feel it's important to at least have the idea out there.

It's as if PD is saying "buy tuning parts or your car will be undrivable".

This is a really insane train of thought. What to you guys think of this nutcase (or purely rational) post?
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The physics feel great on the DualSense, feedback is plentiful and there’s more detail to the physics than Sport had. Rear traction is fine so far - granted, I haven't tried the Corvette yet but nothing has snapped on me. Will drive the Corvette tomorrow and report back.
 
HugoTwoWheels
Because you're using the wrong settings, as I believe you were in GTS, but the consequences here are much worse. That goes for Z28Gaming as well.
Just try the recommended settings by Fanatec. The only thing you should lower if you want to experiment is FF, INT and NDP. Drop the magic formulas.

I'm having a blast with GT7 with all cars on my GT DD Pro. Nothing unexpected happens. And I only use ABS, as in GTS. But I totally see what people mean - the physics engine has become much harder without assists.

I love it and hope they don't change much with time. To me, it feels like going from 480p to 4k in visual resolution.
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I read your post 30 minutes ago so I change to Fanatec recommended settings for GT7, by changing INT 3, and NDP to OFF and it felt better. So you have made me enjoy the game better and thank you :cheers:🙂.
 
HugoTwoWheels
People who don't prioritize learning it should just drop their egos and turn assists on.
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Bro I turned them on lol and I’m cool with it. We been driving in GTS for years so yeah this is gonna be a learning process for many including myself. However I’m loving it.. and it reminds the reason why I still play AC because the driving is so good even though the graphics are outdated (System version)
 

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