Gran Turismo 7 takes center stage in an all-new State of Play, arriving Wednesday at 2pm Pacific:

[bnight]

View attachment 1112768

This image contains 26 cars all bumper to bumper across the first corner.

In Gran Turismo 20 cars were separated by over 40 seconds with 4-5 second gaps between each car.

But what is the time difference between 1st and the last car in that image you think ?

 

[Samus]

But what is the time difference between 1st and the last car in that image you think ?

Three seconds, max? It's clearly nothing like the Gran Turismo example is it? They couldn't possible get any closer together.

 

[Boston77]

@Bright, it’s difficult to swallow what your writing.
It’s made even more difficult without proper punctuation.
Please make an attempt.
Thank you.

 

[bnight]

@Bright, it’s difficult to swallow what your writing.
It’s made even more difficult without proper punctuation.
Please make an attempt.
Thank you.

As clearly stated by my flag english is not my main language. Also speaking of proper punctuation do you mind spelling my nick name right ?

Three seconds, max? It's clearly nothing like the Gran Turismo example is it? They couldn't possible get any closer together.

Again just because GT does it worst (same as actual racing simulation) doesn't mean is not based on real events. I guess this is what the Simulator part in title mean it's not the same 3 seconds is a Simulated 30 seconds

 

[Samus]

Again just because GT does it worst (same as actual racing simulation) doesn't mean is not based on real events. I guess this is what the Simulator part in title mean it's not the same 3 seconds is a Simulated 30 seconds

So it's based on real events but other than the fact the cars are moving at the start, it's completely different. Got it.

 

[mwoodski]

So it's based on real events but other than the fact the cars are moving at the start, it's completely different. Got it.

Big "Based on True Events" energy.



Man, what I would give for GT to implement a proper double file rolling start.

 

[Scaff]

Does it say GT ? Same logic that you applied for the name of the game. So technically GT can mean so many things.

Yes it can, still doesn't stop it being a racing game.

But still if you are last in that stacked field you will be 10-15 seconds off the lead car at the start of the race if you want to win that event you need to make up that time even if they are stacked. So Chase the rabbit (Lead Car).

Because you qualified in that position, and it still doesn't change the fact that GT's version has no real world equivilent.

Because they changed it just like it's changed in GT (to more accurately represent current start type). Ether way the goal of GT is to represent the move from Sunday Cup type racing to Prototypes.

It doesn't accurately represent real rolling starts.

Somewhere in the past 25 years this goal changed to now represent collecting cars.

Nope. GT has always had a element of car collecting, and the core route for collecting cars has always been via racing.

It is well enough but it seams you are so stuck to argue for the sake of argument that I don't want to accept if someone has different opinion than you.

It has nothing to do with opinion, you got it wrong.

 

[Silver Arrows]

Big "Based on True Events" energy.

 

[bnight]

So it's based on real events but other than the fact the cars are moving at the start, it's completely different. Got it.

at least that's what you guys are trying to convy for me rolling start in N24 is no different than roll start in GT but you don't like it for some reason even though I already bring two examples of such starts even ones where the lead cars were crossing the start line when the last cars were how the circuit off.

 

[o000o]

It has nothing to do with opinion, you got it wrong.

"It's just my opinion" is regularly abused like this and I honestly got no idea what to say regarding this, not everything is a subjective matter of which those peeps seem to think (to milk it to say whatever they say freely).

 

[Samus]

at least that's what you guys are trying to convy for me rolling start in N24 is no different than roll start in GT but you don't like it for some reason even though I already bring two examples of such starts even ones where the lead cars were crossing the start line when the last cars were how the circuit off.

I've clearly demonstrated that it isn't the same at all. There is no N24 race where each car was separated by 4-5 seconds and where the car at the back doesn't get to start racing until it crosses the line, 40 seconds after the lead car.

They're both rolling starts. That is literally the only similarity.

 

[MatskiMonk]

I'm going to have to drop out of university at this rate. The justifications for GT not being a racing game have damaged my brain so much that I don't think I'm smart enough to continue my degree.

Think of the money you'll save.

 

[Gingerale]

Maybe it's time to move on and ignore any trolls? I think the last 5 pages multiple persons are trying to convince 1 single user that GT is a racing game...
99% agree its a racing game, so don't see any added value to try and reach 100%?

Although it were some good laughs haha.

 

[bnight]

They're both rolling starts. That is literally the only similarity.

So they are both rolling starts ? And also they both have lead car starting in front of the last car ? And your argument is that the last car is only 10 seconds behind not 40 seconds behind so GT did it wrong ? What about online rolling starts in GT are this also wrong ? Or what about rolling starts in ACC I guess they are also wrong ? I'm lost at what the real argument here is. It was that rolling starts in GT has no equivalent in racing turned out they did in Endurance racing where cars start in a rolling start type of a race. Now the argument is that in real racing the time differences are less and this is not equivalent in GT ?

Here is Spa 24 how far back is the last car and this are same GT3 class cars:

 

[NAXEHT]

 

[MagpieRacer]

So they are both rolling starts ? And also they both have lead car starting in front of the last car ? And your argument is that the last car is only 10 seconds behind not 40 seconds behind so GT did it wrong ? What about online rolling starts in GT are this also wrong ? Or what about rolling starts in ACC I guess they are also wrong ? I'm lost at what the real argument here is. It was that rolling starts in GT has no equivalent in racing turned out they did in Endurance racing where cars start in a rolling start type of a race. Now the argument is that in real racing the time differences are less and this is not equivalent in GT ?

The rolling starts on ACC are actually representative of real life rolling starts given that it's a licensed game and simulates the ruleset as best it can.

GT gets the rolling starts wrong because the gaps are wrong and it's been a consistent complaint since the introduction of these starts in GT. If it was double file, tightly bunched, accurate to real life rolling starts then it would be fine.

The only thing they have in common is they aren't grid starts.

 

[mwoodski]

Imagine a sanctioning body implementing rolling starts like the Gran Turismo series has and the outrage there would be.

The rolling starts in GT are equivalent to how starts are issued in stage rally. Each individual car starts when they reach the timing line and then they're free to race.

Unlike GT though, a stage rally has you racing against the clock so even if you're not at the head of the queue by the end of the laps, if you've turned a time quicker than the first to set off, you'd still be the winner.

 

[kjb]

So when is March 4th? Anyway I think I have said this in another thread but this is a good time to be a racing fan. GT7, Grid Legends, ACC next gen and I forgot about the Dakar rally game is coming out sometime this year as well. GT has its issues but I know I am going to play it until the disc breaks. The fact you can do engine swaps and they bought back customizations will be fun for me. Sometimes I find that more enjoyable than racing.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Imagine a sanctioning body implementing rolling starts like the Gran Turismo series has and the outrage there would be.

Closest thing is a well executed safety car restart in F1.

 

[bnight]

The rolling starts on ACC are actually representative of real life rolling starts given that it's a licensed game and simulates the ruleset as best it can.

GT gets the rolling starts wrong because the gaps are wrong and it's been a consistent complaint since the introduction of these starts in GT. If it was double file, tightly bunched, accurate to real life rolling starts then it would be fine.

The only thing they have in common is they aren't grid starts.

True but even online sometimes the gaps are to big especially online at Spa if you are 7th or 8th you are like 15-20 seconds behind from the get go from the leader. But this do happen in 24 hours of Spa surely not if you are 7th. I think GT was always though to be a big fields type of game but somehow technology wise Polyphony can't do more than 24-30 cars fields which understandable considering how good that game looks. I do agree that AI is poor in this game and that chasing the rabbit type events every time in single player is boring. And I also think that GT is a racing game or at least I buy it to do online racing in it. Something I hope they change this iteration is the Daily Races as most times this are a hit or a miss type of affaire. Where some week non of the Daily races is good and the other week all 3 are amazing and for someone that don't have infinite free time this is very frustrating experience.

Regarding the single player element there should be plenty to do even if you don't like chasing the rabbit or online racing. So the original complain that single player is boring why not improve it is something that got me triggered. Also I'm a member of this forum since 2013 when I was playing GT5 on my PS3. With that in mind I don't want to sound like a troll I just wanted to point out that just because someone doesn't like another opinion it doesn't mean there is not a difference.
Also I play GT since the original in 1997 I think I missed GT4 and GT6 but played every other version at least enough to have a lot of fun. Played not a lot of GTS because of the Daily races been broken some weeks and because Bulgaria was not part of FIA races for the first 3 years of the game.

 

[Samus]

And your argument is that the last car is only 10 seconds behind not 40 seconds behind so GT did it wrong ?

Yes. Yes I am. That's exactly it. Glad you understood.

Here is Spa 24 how far back is the last car and this are same GT3 class cars

Yes, because there is physically no way for them to be any closer! I don't know why you think this is some gotcha that 60 cars are going to be several seconds apart. Of course they are, but they're all bumper to bumper and double file, as close as they possibly can be. That's why we have qualifying, so if you want to be at the start of the queue you go faster in quali.

That is not in any way the same as 20 cars being spread apart with huge 4 second gaps between each car leading to a 40+ second spread.

 

[bnight]

Yes. Yes I am. That's exactly it. Glad you understood.


Yes, because there is physically no way for them to be any closer! I don't know why you think this is some gotcha that 60 cars are going to be several seconds apart. Of course they are, but they're all bumper to bumper and double file, as close as they possibly can be. That's why we have qualifying, so if you want to be at the start of the queue you go faster in quali.

That is not in any way the same as 20 cars being spread apart with huge 4 second gaps between each car leading to a 40+ second spread.

Thing is that this spread also happen in online racing in GTS at least on some tracks and if it's a short race if you start just after this spread zone no way for you to progress. But we do have qualifying in GTS though it only shows you the top 10 times and not where you stack in your split. Overall my argument is that GTS offline mode was very much an after though and so was the poor AI and chase the rabbit racing. My other argument is that all forms of racing IRL are chase the rabbit if you are not first and start 2nd, 3rd or 60th your goal is to catch the 1st car so it's chase the rabbit.

 

[mwoodski]

Closest thing is a well executed safety car restart in F1.

Not even!

At least when the restart happens everyone can go and pass at the same time, they all don't need to tool around until they each individually hit the control line to fire.

I do still wish that F1 restarts were packed up a bit more and didn't allow the leader to go until they were on the front straight, but that's a whole different argument.

 

[MagpieRacer]

Not even!

At least when the restart happens everyone can go and pass at the same time, they all don't need to tool around until they each individually hit the control line to fire.

I do still wish that F1 restarts were packed up a bit more and didn't allow the leader to go until they were on the front straight, but that's a whole different argument.

I didn't say exact, I said the closest thing. Which it is as it's typically single file with the leader pulling away before everyone else. It's the closest thing in real Motorsport to Gran Turismo's rolling starts.

They also can't overtake until they pass the start finish line.

 

[mwoodski]

I didn't say exact, I said the closest thing. Which it is as it's typically single file with the leader pulling away before everyone else. It's the closest thing in real Motorsport to Gran Turismo's rolling starts.

They also can't overtake until they pass the start finish line.

Is the no overtaking thing new? I remember a few years back MSC getting one on Alonso at Monaco with a final lap restart between Rascasse and the Finish line. Thought it was fair game once the leader fired.

Just went and looked back and he was penalized for it, whoops!

 

[Dave A]

I don't know whether to just be surpised or saddened that this discussion (if we can call it that) is still ongoing, not only that but it seems that @bnight has left behind his view that GT is not a racing game and nothing outside top tier motorports is racing and has moved on to GT simulates real racing starts well.

To cut this short once again, GT is a racing game but no, it doesn't simulate motorsport race starts very well when it does the single file rolling starts for the reasons mentioned many times.

 

[bnight]

I didn't say exact, I said the closest thing. Which it is as it's typically single file with the leader pulling away before everyone else. It's the closest thing in real Motorsport to Gran Turismo's rolling starts.

They also can't overtake until they pass the start finish line.

They actually can't overtake until they pass the Safety car line so even if Hamilton pass Safety cars Mazeppin can't overtake until he passes the Safety car Line (this is a line that is a little bit before the pit entry). So it's the same as a safety car.

 

[Silver Arrows]

"Is GT A Racing Game/What Is Racing" - the greatest thread in the history of forums, locked by a moderator after 12,239 pages of heated debate,

 

[MagpieRacer]

They actually can't overtake until they pass the Safety car line so even if Hamilton pass Safety cars Mazeppin can't overtake until he passes the Safety car Line (this is a line that is a little bit before the pit entry). So it's the same as a safety car.

Article 44.1 of the F1 sporting regulations states:
"No driver may overtake another car on the track until he passes the Line (see Article 5.3) for the
first time after the safety car has returned to the pits."

Article 5.3 referenced states:
"the control line (the Line)"

The control line is the start finish line.

 

[bnight]

Article 44.1 of the F1 sporting regulations states:
"No driver may overtake another car on the track until he passes the Line (see Article 5.3) for the
first time after the safety car has returned to the pits."

Article 5.3 referenced states:
"the control line (the Line)"

The control line is the start finish line.

How is that different than GT Sport not overtaking before start/finish line ? Though to be fair in GT you can't overtake after start/finish line as you need another 30-40 seconds to catch the next car in line And I'm sure The control line changed as someone already mentioned MSC vs Alonso in Monaco where the control line (safety car line was right after Rascas (entry of pitlane and finish lane). Probably after this was changed to be start finish line for easier life of all spectators.