Kim Jong Il is dead

  • Thread starter Mike Rotch
  • 204 comments
  • 11,018 views
Maybe not, but they all want to be Jong-un's inner circle. It might get nasty. But I don't think there was ever a chance of revolution. That's for the idealists to hope for. The realists know it won't happen.
 
I suspected it from the beginning. Who knows? But if anybody were to claim some bull:censored: like that, it would be North Korea.

Then again, Elvis might still be alive......
 
Sach_F1
I've seen some reports now that his death is being claimed as a hoax.
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Ya they said its very common with dictators to fake things about how they died. They said he died of exhaustion on a train lol. Like what huge dictator just randomly takes the train with all the regular people. However it makes him look like he is one of them and is working super hard for them. Adds to the legend I guess. Other funny things that were prob already mentioned in here is he said he invented the hamburger and once had 11 hole in ones in a single round of golf. There is only 18 holes which would make him the worlds greatest golfer lol.

Reports came out that he only took the train because he was scared to fly, but always had prebooked trains and schedules for his military people to go with him. The train that he allegedly died on never left the station nor is there any records of any pre planning for him to take the train. They are saying he died the night before at his house randomly I guess. That doesn't sound as special tho.
 
shmogt
Ya they said its very common with dictators to fake things about how they died. They said he died of exhaustion on a train lol. Like what huge dictator just randomly takes the train with all the regular people. However it makes him look like he is one of them and is working super hard for them. Adds to the legend I guess. Other funny things that were prob already mentioned in here is he said he invented the hamburger and once had 11 hole in ones in a single round of golf. There is only 18 holes which would make him the worlds greatest golfer lol.

Reports came out that he only took the train because he was scared to fly, but always had prebooked trains and schedules for his military people to go with him. The train that he allegedly died on never left the station nor is there any records of any pre planning for him to take the train. They are saying he died the night before at his house randomly I guess. That doesn't sound as special tho.
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To be fair, with the amount of bs that the north korean governmnent tell their people then I'm surprised that they say this is how he died, it seems kinda unheroic. Even if he did die that way I would expect a story to make him look awesome.
 
lbsf1
I would expect a story to make him look awesome.
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But the North Korean definition of awesome is different to ours. Officially, Kim Jong-il was an enlightened ruler who brought hope and prosperity to North Korea. He worked tirelessly to shape the country into paradise on earth, and he did it out of love of and in service to the North Korean people. Now, they could probably invent a story about how awesome he was, but the official version of events is very specific: it places him on a train, travelling to some event or other. It makes out that his death occurred in service of the people, so that he would always be remembered as a champion of the people, that everything he did from birth until death was in service of his people. It legitimises him and his rule. The North Koreans probably had this version of events written in advance (if Kim didn't write it himself).
 
prisonermonkeys
But the North Korean definition of awesome is different to ours. Officially, Kim Jong-il was an enlightened ruler who brought hope and prosperity to North Korea. He worked tirelessly to shape the country into paradise on earth, and he did it out of love of and in service to the North Korean people. Now, they could probably invent a story about how awesome he was, but the official version of events is very specific: it places him on a train, travelling to some event or other. It makes out that his death occurred in service of the people, so that he would always be remembered as a champion of the people, that everything he did from birth until death was in service of his people. It legitimises him and his rule. The North Koreans probably had this version of events written in advance (if Kim didn't write it himself).
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I see your point, however I would have expect something a little grander. Not "He died of fatigue on a train", surely they could have came up with something, believeable and that showed him as you said, but still was slightly grander than what they said.

Or, horror of horrors, they could actually be telling the truth. ;)
 
lbsf1
Not "He died of fatigue on a train", surely they could have came up with something, believeable and that showed him as you said, but still was slightly grander than what they said.
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The fatigue just adds to the story. It's common. It's everyday. It's everything that we know Kim is not, but it was written for people. They will see him as someone who was in service o North Korea until his final breath.

lbsf1
Or, horror of horrors, they could actually be telling the truth.
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South Korean intelligence agencies are reporting that the train Kim supposedly did on did not actually move during the weekend when he died. It's unlikely Kim was on that train.
 
Bobert power
When i was little i thought that.
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However as seen with the soviets, some of the policies of the regeime change with the leader. However with Kim Jon Un I doubt that he is going to be that much different from his father.
 
He looks no different. To me, he looks like a guy who is always thinking "duh, WTF is going on?" Sorry to those who seem offended. But seriously, i doubt and capitalist country cares. Because he was a crazy man. His son is 97.9% like his father. Lets see a Team America II. :D
 
shmogt
Like what huge dictator just randomly takes the train with all the regular people. However it makes him look like he is one of them and is working super hard for them.
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Yes, because all North Koreans have access to an armoured train.
 
driftking18594
Yes, because all North Koreans have access to an armoured train.
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Your sarcasm is noted. But, given the way the North Koreans are told the West is corrupt and evil, they could just as easily be told that the West would assassinate Kim given half an opportunity, and so an armoured train is a necessity for him in order to continue his "good work" on the peninsula.
 
I've just worked out the timing. Kim Jong-Il was a sacrifice from the North Korean's to the Roman god Saturn!
 
prisonermonkeys
Your sarcasm is noted. But, given the way the North Koreans are told the West is corrupt and evil, they could just as easily be told that the West would assassinate Kim given half an opportunity, and so an armoured train is a necessity for him in order to continue his "good work" on the peninsula.
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Thats more of what I was expecting. For them to say that he had been assasinated by the West.
 
McLaren
Seriously? The man wasn't as terrible as Usama, but I doubt there are any South Koreans who are feeling like you do right now.
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Erm...Leading a country with famine rampant, and with freedom being the evil word that can condemn one to death or to a concentration camp, while at the same time living lavishly with plays written about you makes you worse than some guy who hated America with a passion.

Osama was bad, but he was nothing like Kim.

And to those saying we can attack North Korea, think again. The People's Republic of China is not enthused about American forces in South Korea, imagine how they will react if we are at their front door. The only real reason North Korea gets support from China is because they provide a good buffer between us and them.
 
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sumbrownkid
Erm...Leading a country with famine rampant, and with freedom being the evil word that can condemn one to death or to a concentration camp, while at the same time living lavishly with plays written about you makes you worse than some guy who hated America with a passion.

Osama was bad, but he was nothing like Kim.

And to those saying we can attack North Korea, think again. The People's Republic of China is not enthused about American forces in South Korea, imagine how they will react if we are at their front door. The only real reason North Korea gets support from China is because they provide a good buffer between us and them.
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The only reason china supports North Korea is because North Korea makes China look not that bad.
 
prisonermonkeys
Your sarcasm is noted. But, given the way the North Koreans are told the West is corrupt and evil, they could just as easily be told that the West would assassinate Kim given half an opportunity, and so an armoured train is a necessity for him in order to continue his "good work" on the peninsula.
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This is true. Anybody looking for a laugh read the official North Korean website, the entire thing about their country spends the entire time bashing the US :lol:
 
lbsf1
Thats more of what I was expecting. For them to say that he had been assasinated by the West.
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Sure. This is preceisely the kind of thing they would say if they wanted to provoke a war. And with the country in the middle of a succession (I posted a link to a story about three separate factions vying for power under Kim Jong-un), it would likely end very badly for them.

lbsf1
The only reason china supports North Korea is because North Korea makes China look not that bad.
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China (and Russia) support North Korea for three reasons:

1) They have a land border with the North. Since the border with the South is the most heavily-fortified place on earth (both countries are technically still at war), China and Russia are in the best position to talk sense into Pyonyang.

2) North Korea emphasises juche, the concept of self-reliance. We know it better as autarky, a state where a country is completely cut off from the rest of the world. Total autarky is almost impossible to achieve; while North Korea is close, they still have a need to trade - even if it is to bring fresh lobster into the country every day for Kim Jong-il.

3) North Korea is currently in the process of developing nuclear weapons, and likely has stockpiles of other weapons of mass destruction. This is of significant concern to the West because once they manage to get the Taep'o-dong 2 missile system working, North Korea would have the potential to launch a nuclear warhead up to 6000km away - which means they could comfortably hit northern Australia if they wanted to. Since they obviously can't be allowed to do this, China and Russia have a working relationship with the North to try and get them to disarm, because honey always works better than vinegar.
 
prisonermonkeys
Sure. This is preceisely the kind of thing they would say if they wanted to provoke a war. And with the country in the middle of a succession (I posted a link to a story about three separate factions vying for power under Kim Jong-un), it would likely end very badly for them.


China (and Russia) support North Korea for three reasons:

1) They have a land border with the North. Since the border with the South is the most heavily-fortified place on earth (both countries are technically still at war), China and Russia are in the best position to talk sense into Pyonyang.

2) North Korea emphasises juche, the concept of self-reliance. We know it better as autarky, a state where a country is completely cut off from the rest of the world. Total autarky is almost impossible to achieve; while North Korea is close, they still have a need to trade - even if it is to bring fresh lobster into the country every day for Kim Jong-il.

3) North Korea is currently in the process of developing nuclear weapons, and likely has stockpiles of other weapons of mass destruction. This is of significant concern to the West because once they manage to get the Taep'o-dong 2 missile system working, North Korea would have the potential to launch a nuclear warhead up to 6000km away - which means they could comfortably hit northern Australia if they wanted to. Since they obviously can't be allowed to do this, China and Russia have a working relationship with the North to try and get them to disarm, because honey always works better than vinegar.
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However as discussed in a previous thread, even China are starting to get fed up with NK. As China is becoming less and less extreme (To help trade.), North Korea is still stuck in the middle ages. When the cold war was on the communist countries all allied each other not because they liked each other, just because they were communist. Now the situation is less volitile then the alliance is pretty much meaningless.China only keep it going because it makes them money from trade. If push came to shove I doubt that China would be prepared to go to war over NK.


The alliance between the two countries is exaggerated because its NK's only ally.
 
North Korea is one of the larger political chips the Chinese have in dealing with the U.S., and other powers in the East Asia.
 
lbsf1
However as discussed in a previous thread, even China are starting to get fed up with NK.
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Well, yes; not everyone has limitless patience. But to suggest that China only support North Korea to stop North Korea going off the rails - and thereby making China look better - is ludicrous. China is strong enough, both economically and politically, that they do not need to worry about how other countries view them. China maintains a relationship with North Korea in the interests of keeping the region stable, not to make themselves look better than they really are. And China is really the only country that North Korea trusts (not that they trust China at all; they just trust China more than anyone else).
 
I doubt China would go to war over NK. I also doubt they're supporting NK because they "make China look better".

I think they're supporting NK because they don't want to allow the destabilization of NK to where the government loses control and 24 million people "escape" into China who are all uneducated, malnourished, don't speak Chinese, own no property, and have jobs or skills.
 

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