Quality over Quantity (GT7)
- Thread starter Bloodmasters
- 330 comments
- 18,017 views
- 8,705
That's 40 cars per year, when the fewest modelers they've had this gen is over 40. Which implies each car takes over 12 man months to make.
Surely you're still missing something? Any idea what?
They made 200 between GT5 and GT6, plus a few semi Premiums. Extrapolate that.
What are
What are Semi Premiums? Are those the cars that have been slightly improved for GT6, but still have no interior? Can you give me some examples?
- 8,705
Yes, exactly right; the Rufs would be prime examples - check the "good / bad / ugly" thread. EDIT: here.
I forget how many they retouched (EDIT: over 70), but there would have been some that didn't make the cut. Regardless, that needs to be factored into the effort expended modeling cars.
My theory is that there will only be Premiums and semi Premiums in GT7.
You can probably expect another 200 full Premiums by GT7, regardless.
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- 922
- Naples
- MarchingSaint
Semipremiums instead of standards is a good deal for me, i mean, look at those Rufs.
There's no way all of them are going to be converted to Semi-Premium if it's released in 2016. There's going to be at least 100 Standard cars remaining in GT7. Or they could postpone it for 2017 and fix all the cars.
Anyway, only 100 Standard cars wouldn't be that bad, but some cars really need work, for example Nissan Option Stream Z, it has horrible pixelated textures that need to be fixed ASAP.
- 922
- Naples
- MarchingSaint
That is true. There are at least 3 duplicate models from each of these manufacturers to remove: Nissan, Mazda, Toyota, Mitsubishi, Honda. Even if that's just 15 less cars to worry about, it doesn't make as little difference as it looks like.
- 8,705
I imagine they'll convert as many as they can and drop the rest. The Option Z is a prime candidate for removal, especially if we get a livery editor...
EDIT: this list has 180 semi Premium entries, many of them are the duplicates. So 100 unique models is probably a good guess. That means 400 cars, unique or not, need to be converted to semi Premium or dropped.
I'd wager that a semi Premium takes less than half the time to model (and only model) than a full Premium. So, as long as the other tasks per car don't take longer than that, that could be a significant boost.
EDIT: this list has 180 semi Premium entries, many of them are the duplicates. So 100 unique models is probably a good guess. That means 400 cars, unique or not, need to be converted to semi Premium or dropped.
I'd wager that a semi Premium takes less than half the time to model (and only model) than a full Premium. So, as long as the other tasks per car don't take longer than that, that could be a significant boost.
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- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
There were less than 100 new unique premiums for GT6. About 30 DLC from GT5 but a few like the BRZ/GT86 were duplicates of each other. I don't count base models, different liveries or different trim packages as new cars. That's about 120/3 years. Not sure where you get 200 from even if you count all the duplicates, base models and liveries.
http://www.gran-turismo.com/local/jp/data1/products/gt6/carlist_en.html
Show me where you've ever gotten 40 new unique premiums (not slightly different versions of a car already in the game) cars in 6 months. That's just completely made up.
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That's all true, they should definitely convert as many Standards as possible and drop the rest, but I don't want them dropping more than 100 cars from the game. There are no more than 100 unwanted duplicates.
- 8,705
It was just a very rough guess based on 200 premiums in GT5, 400 in GT6.
Include duplicates on the basis that the duplication rate is constant from game to game, roughly. Can reassess as necessary.
1042 cars in GT5, 69 DLC. 122 new to GT6, ignore GT6's DLC because not indicative of production rate yet.
191 total inc. duplicates. Plus 180 semi Premiums including duplicates, which I estimate at half effort.
Duplicate rate is 22% according to you, which means 191 cars is 156 "unique", in two years, i.e. 78 per year. (EDIT: 40 per year is a duplication rate of 100%.)
Almost double your claim, before accounting for the semi premiums.
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I think this is accurate enough:
https://www.gtplanet.net/forum/thre...-bad-and-the-ugly.291012/page-51#post-9130606
- 8,705
- 40,757
I got 82 either being a duplicate of a Premium or of another Semi-Premium, without taking the time to actually go through the thread and try to find comparisons (might bump it up a few). Not as bad as I was expecting considering the initial glut of it was the made up Miatas and RX-7s. I was assuming there would be a lot more Skylines since there were already Premium versions of all 3 generations. Wonder why they held off on those, or the other odd ones left off.
- 8,705
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
I don't know why you're using these roundabout deductions when the actual numbers are available. I linked above:
The exact number of unique premiums in GT6 can be found here
GT5 DLC + Spec 2.0 DLC is here
Take out all the duplicates or near duplicates (C7 Test Prototype and Final Prototype is the same car, different skin - 3 identical karts, different motors - 2011 Nascar Cars, counted as 11, but it's 3 cars with 11 liveries etc.)
The GT6 additional unique premiums + GT5 DLC + Spec 2.0 is their total output for 3 years of unique premium cars.
Your numbers are way off and full of assumptions that are unnecessary when the actual data is there.
- 2,534
- Johannesburg
- Tayeedz1
I was being hypothetical @Johnnypenso @AITB
Key words of this in my last post :
"Let's say"
"Hypothetical"
Key words of this in my last post :
"Let's say"
"Hypothetical"
- 8,705
There will continue to be duplicates added with new models. We can go on the fact that the level of duplication is likely to decrease overall, and conservatively state that it will stay the same.
You implied that they only make 40 a year (400 in ten years), which is way off because you're basing that on a very unproductive lead up (GTHD Mk.1) and an average number of modelers much lower than it is today.
I used your own 100 unique cars figure to estimate a 22% duplication rate in the new material, and got 78 unique cars per year.
There's still the semi Premiums.
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- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
What? Its 100 new unique premiums + 30ish DLC from GT5-GT6. In 3 years. How exactly does that equal 78?
- 8,705
Lost track of time! Did it over 2 years, not three.
That's 52 unique per year. Plus semi premiums.
- 53
- FL
They should release Gt7 now and add the new cars for free as the they are done making them like what turn 10 did with forza 5.
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
Right..130/3 = 52...gotcha...now that we've cleared that up...
- 8,705
130 "ish", you said. Mine's ish, too. If you've counted them all and accounted for the unique interiors, extra modeling on exteriors and the true cost of a reskin for some of the "duplicates" like the NASCAR and TC cars, let me know.
The real number is still more than 40. Substantially more in practice.
On which note, let's turn to the semi Premiums. How much are they worth?
EDIT: I can't believe we got this far without realising Standard to Premium conversions aren't accounted for.
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- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
No, the real number is around 40 and the same in practice. The modeling effort that went into the standard to semi-premium conversion doesn't add any new premiums into the game and that's what I'm talking about, not a measure of "total modeling effort". And since we can't quantify it in any way because we don't know how long it takes to do a conversion it's meaningless. It might only take a week to brush up a car, meaning 26 conversions = 1 premium car, almost inconsequential. Even the VGT's I wouldn't count as a full car because they have no interior. They are pretty on the outside but without a cockpit they are just semi-premiums and not up to the full "premium" status of other cars or other sims.
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- 40,757
Er... Why not? If the goal is to measure PD's average level of production per year, it should encompass everything they've modeled to Premium quality, shouldn't it? I mean, the Ford GT obviously wasn't a huge expenditure of effort, but things like the Lotus Europa still were.
iirc, all of the Standard to Premium conversions were already counted as new cars in GT6 anyway in the official lists. Though apparently Johnny wasn't counting them?
- 28,470
- Windsor, Ontario, Canada
- Johnnypenso
My mistake, typing too fast. I did count them, they are all at the forefront of this list. What I meant to say was the semi-premiums shouldn't count in the total, which is why I referred to them as possibly taking a week to "brush up", which obviously isn't possible with a full premium car, but could be possible for a premiumized standard. Griffith is trying to assert that it's all part of the modeling effort of PD and skews my 40/year figure because it doesn't include re-skins and premiumized standards and I assert that it's impossible to quantify that effort and that it may be nearly inconsequential anyway. I'd rather measure what I can actually measure and count, which is unique premiums.
Sorry for the confusion. I added the single missing word and it all makes sense now
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