dancardesigner
(Banned)
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- dancardesigner
Slightly Mad: GT5's damage isn't "quite so realistic"
- Thread starter Tenma
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- England
or it wouldnt have served much purpose to quote a whole rambling and mostly irrelevant post when the point i was after was at the end.
Wake up Troll.
dancardesigner
(Banned)
- 822
- dancardesigner
Your the troll. You say it is rambilng and irrelevent. No it is not. I stated many facts based of personal experience. I will requote them just so people can see. You tell me what was incorrect about my experiences and what was wrong.
[Quote dancardesigner] +1000:tup: TO THIS
I never thought i would hear that come out of a moderators mouth, or keyboard rather lol. Seriously people need to wake up and realise GT is still very much a game, yes the game does convey the ''charachter'' quite well in all aspects, of each individual car, but when it comes down to it, it is nothing like driving in real life.
I have yet to pass my driving test in real life, i'm still a student. I consider myself a reasonably good driver in GT5, i have a g25 and play on a hd screen and can drive all the cars easily, the F1 IS A PIECE OF CAKE. I can drift and don't use trac most of the time and have ABS set to 1.
Now when i had a go of my mums Golf GTI, i can drive it, but it is harder just going down the road, than it is going flat out in the Ford GT LM in GT5. I had lessons a while back and was almost ready to take the test, i was comfortable in driving the car. I however took a year out from driving since, and have being playing GT5 in that time. I thought my experience playing GT5 in that time would mean i would be comfortable getting right back in the seat of a real car. Boy was i wrong. I've always being very good at karting, even from a kid, just casually however, but driving a proper car in real life after taking time out, i felt very uncomfortable. Obviously i'm going to be a bit more wary because of potential hazards around me than in GT5, but regardless of that the overall immersion and feel of the car in real life is completly different. I feel like i'm going much faster in just a GTi in real life than any car in the game, not purely visually but rather how the car feels and responds. In GT5 its is easy to put your right foot through the floor and steer. Not so in real life when you are a newby driver. The steering, the size of the vehicle on the road, the gearbox, the brakes, the weight and inertia of the car and especially the clutch feel night and day different to GT5. Playing with the G25 in GT5 feels like your pressing buttons in comparison to real life. In real life it really does feel like you have to concentrate and work to get the car going smoothly. My mums car has powersteering and all the pedals feel much lighter than the G25 but with way more travel, so it feels like i have to be much more delicate and precise in real life. I'm 99% certain i could not drive half the cars i do in GT5, drive anywhere near as fast, and even contemplate attempting to drift.
Famine hit the nail on the head when he said people think they can use this game to gain real life experience for the cars real counterpart. I bet 90% or more of GT5 players couldn't even get an F1 car off the line. Don't get me wrong i do think the game probably does represent the general behavioural characteristics of the cars when pushed to the extreme, like oversteer, understeer, power on, power off, brakin behaviour from a mathematical point of view. But when it comes to actually being there in real life driving that particular car, the overall feel is night and day. Driving is much harder in real life, at least trying to drive smoothly and at moderate speeds without the engine cutting out or the clutch kicking in too hard. Driving the GTI in the game i was like WTF, my mums car aint that slow, i was litterally bored to death driving it, but in real life it gives me 10x the pleasure and sense of speed than any car in the game.
The use from a tutorial point of view irespective of having fun etc for GT5, i think is it is a good tool for learning the corners of tracks and markers, it gives a very good sense of what the car looks life in real life, the sounds are OK, similar but nowhere near as exhilerating and complex as real life, the physics and handling as i said probably would tell a driver how a car would respond if pushed in real life, like for example, if i nailed the throttle in an F40 in real ife when the turbos have spooled, the back end would become very skittish and floaty, and also on off power oversteer, these are what i consider to be ''general charachtersitics'', but the overall feel and general level of difficulty of the game compared to driving that car in real life is absolute night and day.
It's all well posting videos of some geezer taking an F1 around Suzuka as fast as Schumacher, and saying wow look how realistic it is. Pfffttt, do you really think that guy could do that in real life. Not a chance. Yes the cars can probably set a similar laptime to the real life cars, but that all comes down to a few simple mathematical parameters. The real challenge for developers from a physics and feedback perspective would be to get the cars to ''FEEL'', not just respond similar to the real counterparts. I'm pretty sure a large element for all of this is that GT5 probably has many undercover unchangeable stability, and general ease of control parameters to make driving the car in game feasible. Come on you really think you could drive a real life car with a Sixaxis.
WAKE UP PEOPLE
dancardesigner
(Banned)
- 822
- dancardesigner
I personally don't see the fact that the cockpit can't really be invaded to be a problem. I mean most cars would be a rightoff if the damage got that far anyway, which realistically would mean you are out of the race. I very much doubt cars will damage as easily as in real life. At least on normal roadcars if damage is to be implemented on them. Grids level of damage i think is as far as it would go, and TBH i would be very happy with.
- 4,323
I wonder if he just meant that the way it happened looked unrealistic (ie the door tears off but the rest of the car around it is fairly pristine...)
- 28,270
- Brooklyn, NY
- KR_Viper
- I Renown I
Wasn't that shown at E3 or something?
In any case, I'm curious as to why it didn't have any tracking problems, and what the hell happened at 2:53?
Despite all of that, it looks good and sounds good but the driver moaning and grunting is annoying.
In any case, I'm curious as to why it didn't have any tracking problems, and what the hell happened at 2:53?
Despite all of that, it looks good and sounds good but the driver moaning and grunting is annoying.
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- 1,156
I know this thread is referring to the slightly mad comments but I have to say I don't understand this fixation with damage unless many of you plan on crashing alot lol.
So what if NFS Shift damage model is better than GT5. It would be very difficult for PD to excel in all aspects of a racing game, i.e graphics, physics, number of cars/tracks, online features etc. At the end of the day its all about the overall package and in an ideal world GT5 would excel in all aspects but its unlikely. Now Slightly mad might be commenting on the damage but do they have photo realistic graphics? do they have 1000 cars? the answer is no!!
When I look at videos of Forza 3, NFS Shift I can tell instantly these are video games. However when you look at GT5 you have to think twice whether this is real or a game. This IMO is why car manafacturers have been so strict with PD because their games represent the cars the most realistically.
Rather than worrying about damage I shall be looking forward to all the other wonderful features of what makes GT in a different league to its competitors. Already im excited at the announced features and yet we still have TGS to come!
So what if NFS Shift damage model is better than GT5. It would be very difficult for PD to excel in all aspects of a racing game, i.e graphics, physics, number of cars/tracks, online features etc. At the end of the day its all about the overall package and in an ideal world GT5 would excel in all aspects but its unlikely. Now Slightly mad might be commenting on the damage but do they have photo realistic graphics? do they have 1000 cars? the answer is no!!
When I look at videos of Forza 3, NFS Shift I can tell instantly these are video games. However when you look at GT5 you have to think twice whether this is real or a game. This IMO is why car manafacturers have been so strict with PD because their games represent the cars the most realistically.
Rather than worrying about damage I shall be looking forward to all the other wonderful features of what makes GT in a different league to its competitors. Already im excited at the announced features and yet we still have TGS to come!
McLaren
Premium
- 45,248
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How is he the fanboy when he's just stating that cars have been driven by game controllers?
Your post is the one coming off with a fanboy attitude, not his.
evilfoxhound
(Banned)
- 639
dancardesigner
(Banned)
- 822
- dancardesigner
If you read the thread you would see i was referring to the bit where he replaced my text with blah blah blah. All he did is pick up on the last point about the controller and tried to brush off the main purpose of my post as irrelevent.
Also how does my post have a fanboy attitude, if i'm not licking GT5's ass. I'm baffled?
- 736
- MrSchmo
The sense of speed is really overdone in NFS Shift. It looks like he's going 500mph
That "blur" vision is really annoying too.
I know. A little over done. Dont like all that blur. Especially when you crash, that would get annoying fast.
- 713
- UK
I really don't think for one second that manufacturers treat PD any differently to any other game manufacturer.
They could do more with visual damage, however so far they choose to employ resources elsewhere, like realistic xenon headlamps etc, I'd gladly for-go those if they did the same level of deformation as the other games, with added door/bonnet/boot flapping/removal where they can..
Each to their own, but if they are aiming for realism, the two stand out things from the Demo are the almost lack of deformation and bumper car collision physics.
McLaren
Premium
- 45,248
- Texas
Read his post. All he wanted to comment on within your post was the controller subject.
This below is the typical attitude of a fanboy response.
Doesn't help that you actually did call him a fanboy when all he did was comment cars have been driven with controllers. I don't see where he's taking any sides with that.
Then again, I've seen a lot of your posts, so this isn't all that surprising.
- 5,398
- Buenos Aires
Aloha62_2 seemingly tried to justify that GT is actually realistic, and one could drive a car with Sinaxis, or PS2 controller. Though it is possible in real life, as you are saying McLaren, dan basically said that, if you try to drive in real life a real car with a controller like you do in GT (speed, etc.), you will get killed. It isn't exactly a discovery, but it's truth. Aloha's mistake was that he made dan look like an idiot by quoting his post as "blah blah blah" and etc. He could have simply deleted most of the post, as he did, without adding the "blah blah blah" at the end, which actually made him write more than the essential. That's why dan's is rightfully pissed.
I wouldn't call dan a fanboy, but I wouldn't also call Aloha62_2 one. I wouldn't call dan a fanboy because if he is, what is he a fanboy of? And Aloha62_2 just said something that could be interpreted as the above, a simply reference to real life (in which only the bold part in my post above would stand), or an entire different thing, I would rather have Aloha62_2 to say what, to prevent further confusions.
I wouldn't call dan a fanboy, but I wouldn't also call Aloha62_2 one. I wouldn't call dan a fanboy because if he is, what is he a fanboy of? And Aloha62_2 just said something that could be interpreted as the above, a simply reference to real life (in which only the bold part in my post above would stand), or an entire different thing, I would rather have Aloha62_2 to say what, to prevent further confusions.
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- 1,906
- Rockford, MI
- dw-alba
Re-read my post and jay's, the sentence even translated is way too confusing so either we get an official English press release from PD or else it's not confirmed.
McLaren
Premium
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You're completely off the entire post.
At the end of dan's post, he said this,
Aloha responded,
Aloha stated a truth & was correcting dan. Keep in mind, this was Aloha's first post in this thread, so if he's trying to justify GT's realism, better show me where.
Dan, then responded with this.
There was no need to call Aloha a fanboy as he just stated a fact. Dan, in return, has made himself look like a fanboy because he posted with the same attitude as one.
The only person who has a right to be "pissed" is Aloha as he didn't do anything but correct dan's post.
- 5,398
- Buenos Aires
I am already telling you this, you are off my post too. You didn't answered why Aloha must say "blah blah" instead of deleting the post and adressing only the subject. I also said that it is a possiblity that both dan and me got his post wrong.
Me
1 - What you understand, that cars have been drived in real life with controllers. In which Aloha's post is right.
2 - What I and presumably dan understand, that cars have been driven in real life with controllers like Gran Turismo, doing all sort of crazy things, in which case Aloha's post is wrong.
Once again:
Me
If I'm right, he is to be called a fanboy, because he seemed to justify GT is so realistic that you can actually drive a car in real life like you do in GT, and with a wheel/controller. Though the latter is true, the other one isn't.
Why is dan a fanboy, again? And of what?
If what you understood by his post is right, then partially yes. If what I and dan presumably understood by his post is right, then totally no. In any case, dan has a reason to be pissed, since he wrote a "howknowshowlongtookhimtowrite" post, just for Aloha to replace it all with "blah blah blah".
Once again:
Me
Because you aren't Aloha62_2.
- 216
- Maggot666PL
Let me make it short:
- If you get in a real car and expect it to go 100% like the one in GT, you're an idiot.
- If you think that driver getting experience in GT doesn't develop some very important skills and abilities, which can be put to a good use while driving (especially racing) a real car, you're an idiot.
- If you compare driving a car during a full-on race on a closed race track to driving a car in everyday traffic, you're an idiot.
Generally learning to drive a new car in real life is just like learning to drive a new car in game/changing your controller to a new, very responsive one - you have to familiarize with it's limits, get a feeling, drive some. Most important rules still apply, just don't just go slamming into the throttle, use your senses actively.
Of course I'm just generalizing, not aiming it at anyone. Also - stop the fanboy analysis, it's just annoying and clots the topic.
Oh, the damage model in SHiFT:
It's nice, it's also bollocks. When I saw hood popped open, not jammed and not opening straight onto the windshield, pushed by the sick amounts of drag... Come on, give me a break.
Seems like a nice game, but still very much in "good fun" department, while (hopefully) GT is (if you want to trust KY) aiming to slowly give you realer and realer experience (not saying it's a pure hardcore sim).
I'd say that NFS and GT5's GC damage are different, but both leave much to be desired. Also FM2's damage is just ridiculously ugly and visually unrealistic. We'll see how they'll compare in depth after getting some new info, rather than vague statements from journalists at a game show.
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dancardesigner
(Banned)
- 822
- dancardesigner
Both you and Mclaren are goons. What you both do not seem to understand even though Codename L happens to understand me completly is that i was not getting p'd off about the controller argument. I was calling him a Fanboy, because he replace the main body of my text with blah blah blah. As far as i'm concerned that is ignorant, trlling and being a Fanboy period. He made no attempt to justify himself or say what was incorrect, just put blah blah blah. A typical fanboy doesn't want to accept the truth response.
Now on to the topic of the controller. What i was trying to imply is that you can not drive a real life car properly with a sixaxis. If you consider the attempts so far as ''driving'' then you don't know what driving is. Even with top end RC radio controls driving a real car is very difficult and the cars can not be anywhere near pushed to there limits. The fact you press go and it moves is irrelevent. The fact you press steer and the car turns is irrelevent. A child of 5 could probably get a car to move. Does that mean he can drive?
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- Murica
- BasedAckbar
Doesn't a fanboy usually have to compare the game to another game while blatantly putting the compared game down?
I don't think what Aloha said was fanboyish, but what he did with Dacard's post and putting blah blah blah makes him look stupid if anything.
I don't think what Aloha said was fanboyish, but what he did with Dacard's post and putting blah blah blah makes him look stupid if anything.
- 216
- Maggot666PL
Bollocks. You replace a wheel and pedals with a gamepad, sit your butt in and drive. It would take some serious practice and probably you would be much slower while racing, but since the controls are analog... It's doable. Just quite useless. Maybe if you couldn't use your legs (say - paralyzed, broken, some other unfortunate condition) installing a gamepad could actually give you the ability to drive, and to do it properly too.
dancardesigner
(Banned)
- 822
- dancardesigner
I don't know why i have to waste my time on these forums explaining each and every detail and concept of my post. It's like you pople skip through most of it and just nitpick certain details which are useless and have a different meaning on there own. What i am trying to say is not that it is not possible, but rather that it would be a lot harder to drive say a real F40 in real life with a gamepad than it is driving the car in GT5. So much harder that i don't think you could push the car to even 50% of what you can in GT5. And if you don't beleive that then i am wasting my time.
- 9,053
- Murica
- BasedAckbar
^He's right folks. Driving an F40 in real life with a steering wheel and pedals is hard enough. Doing it with a controller will be near impossible (Not saying it can't be done).
- 8,480
- P_Balance
I lol'ed.
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