"Standard Car" does not correspond to the interior view.Update read 1st page

[Antti-san]

Oh dear. I anxiously await the release of GT5, although every day it's becoming less about playing it, and more about what I can only imagine this place will look like, filled with members who believe Standards are going to be Prologue-quality, or that Standards will have a cockpit view that, even if they do appear, amount to anything more than the PSP's black-frame.

TBH, I couldn't care less that many people here have decided to stick their head in the sand - I just wish I wouldn't have to bump into their wacky "rationalisations" in every thread I go!

Oh well, when I finally get the game, this forum will be the last thing on my mind for quite a while.

 

[Dravonic]

EDIT: Well, nevermind.

 

[analog]

Well, that was phrased wrong. Basically, based on what Sony and PD have factually given us, there will be no standard interior views. But, I hope there will be, my gut tells me there will be, and logically, I can't see PD failing to include that.

I couldn't see PD failing to include it either a short while ago and many of us didn't really see this coming, that's probably part of the reason this debate went ballistic and is still probably the most argued topic around here.

But the "unthinkable" now unfortunately seems to become a reality we possibly have to deal with and yes, there isn't a 100% confirmation they definitely won't be in as the text on the GT5 site still leaves room for interpretation it seems.

Like you I really expected it to be a new permanent feature since Prologue ( where it's the only view I use ) and the piece IMZIZ wrote makes a lot of sense but McLaren correctly pointed out it's still an hypothesis.
Hopefully this whole issue will finally be clarified either way very soon but if those interiors aren't included I bet this debate will carry on for a while with people expressing dissapointment mostly I guess.

 

[McLaren]

I dont know if you know but PD said that they have used up all most all the memory on the blu ray disc so unless sony come up with a new disc in like a few months or you want it on like 5 discs not every car will be a premium i do not mind the 2 different classes and kaz cannot make everything perfect without the right tools.

That's basically what I said. It's not do-able with the resources & time Kaz. has at his disposal.

 

[SlipZtrEm]

Well, that was phrased wrong. Basically, based on what Sony and PD have factually given us, there will be no standard interior views. But, I hope there will be, my gut tells me there will be, and logically, I can't see PD failing to include that.

I still don't see that as logic, but a hope for a company to achieve a goal

TBH, I couldn't care less that many people here have decided to stick their head in the sand - I just wish I wouldn't have to bump into their wacky "rationalisations" in every thread I go!

Oh well, when I finally get the game, this forum will be the last thing on my mind for quite a while.

It'll only be off your mind for a bit; you know as soon as you head online, it's only a matter of time before you see a GTP_x in the starting lineup .

I couldn't see PD failing to include it either a short while ago and many of us didn't really see this coming, that's probably part of the reason this debate went ballistic and is still probably the most argued topic around here.

But the "unthinkable" now unfortunately seems to become a reality we possibly have to deal with and yes, there isn't a 100% confirmation they definitely won't be in as the text on the GT5 site still leaves room for interpretation it seems.

It's a lot easier to approach PD games with low expectations. It's just like when we got GT4, we all loaded it up and went to play online... oh, wait.



When they start announcing features at the beginning of development, I know some are going to be dropped, or scaled back. It's just how it is with them. The Standards came as a shock just because since they've made it clear they're very focused on graphics, this kind of thing was the least expected, not to mention a little bit underhanded by finally showing the first hint of Standards a few months before release. On the other hand... this rumour of go-karts is completely the other direction, an addition totally unexpected.

 

[SuperShouden]

I dont know if you know but PD said that they have used up all most all the memory on the blu ray disc so unless sony come up with a new disc in like a few months or you want it on like 5 discs not every car will be a premium i do not mind the 2 different classes and kaz cannot make everything perfect without the right tools.

But...Sony has already made six-layer 200GB BD-Rs. Heck, Avatar comes on a dual layer 50GB Blu-ray. I think, if need be, PD could have a large compacity disc in a snap. the space isn't the problem it's the time it takes to create and render the premium models and their interiors.

 

[Goshin2568]

I still don't see that as logic, but a hope for a company to achieve a goal

I dunno, it just seems to me like a given. That would be like if there was no online mode, or no GT mode. It just kinda seems like an obvious thing to do.

 

[Antti-san]

I dunno, it just seems to me like a given. That would be like if there was no online mode, or no GT mode. It just kinda seems like an obvious thing to do.

I stopped associating PD with the word "logic" a while ago now!

 

[eSZee]

But...Sony has already made six-layer 200GB BD-Rs. Heck, Avatar comes on a dual layer 50GB Blu-ray. I think, if need be, PD could have a large compacity disc in a snap. the space isn't the problem it's the time it takes to create and render the premium models and their interiors.

But the PS3 can't use them, the laser is most likely incompatible.

 

[analog]

I stopped associating PD with the word "logic" a while ago now!

Ha, "fuzzy logic" or "beyond cryptic" is probably a more appropriate description of the current situation.

 

[SuperShouden]

WHAT? You mean that the they developed a brand new laser that was built to go in the PS3 and then they built a ultra-high compacaty disc that was, again, designed for the PS3, and somehow they stuck the wrong laser in it? How does that make sense?

 

[eSZee]

WHAT? You mean that the they developed a brand new laser that was built to go in the PS3 and then they built a ultra-high compacaty disc that was, again, designed for the PS3, and somehow they stuck the wrong laser in it? How does that make sense?

Where does it say BDXL disks are made for the PS3?
The PS3 MIGHT support the new standard of 33.3GB per layer, but it will not support the BDXL standard. No current BLU RAY players will.

 

[Shinu]

But the PS3 can't use them, the laser is most likely incompatible.

If I'm not mistaken. PS3 (and other bluray devices) is capable of using bluray's that has more then two layers. They just need to modify rom bios (I think that was one of bluray features. They can change the capacity but not the speed).

Of course there are multiple ways to add layers.

There also was an article that they upped layer capacity from 25 to 27.5 GB or so.

 

[G.T.Ace]

Not quite sure about "BDXL", but the PS3 can support Blu-rays with 800GB (prototypes were already produced) and more, it only needs a FW update.

 

[eSZee]

If I'm not mistaken. PS3 (and other bluray devices) is capable of using bluray's that has more then two layers. They just need to modify rom bios (I think that was one of bluray features. They can change the capacity but not the speed).

Of course there are multiple ways to add layers.

There also was an article that they upped layer capacity from 25 to 27.5 GB or so.

I know of the 25gb->33.4GB jump that the PS3 will support, but haven't seen anything else.
That means 66.7GB per disk. After that we have a jump to 100/128gb, which is BDXL and is not supported by the PS3. The reason for it, from what I remember, is that the laser isn't powerful enough to reach all 4 layers.

 

[SuperShouden]

Where does it say BDXL disks are made for the PS3?
The PS3 MIGHT support the new standard of 33.3GB per layer, but it will not support the BDXL standard. No current BLU RAY players will.

If I'm not mistaken. PS3 (and other bluray devices) is capable of using bluray's that has more then two layers. They just need to modify rom bios (I think that was one of bluray features. They can change the capacity but not the speed).

Of course there are multiple ways to add layers.

There also was an article that they upped layer capacity from 25 to 27.5 GB or so.

Not quite sure about "BDXL", but the PS3 can support Blu-rays with 800GB (prototypes were already produced) and more, it only needs a FW update.

These answer it quite well. Even if it can't support it now, they'll just release a firmware update so that it can. When the first PS3's were released they only supported HDDs up to 120GB. But, now, they've stuffed a 250GB HDD in there...how did they do that? They released a firmware update. Now, the PS3 supports up to 1TB.

When the PS3 was first released, it might have only supported 25GB. However, now it should not only support the new 33.1 GB discs but Avatar's 50GB disc, as well.

EDIT: Just read about the BDXLs. And they do say the the PS3's laser isn't powerful enough. However, I'm sure it won't be a problem for a while, and if it does, I'm sure Sony we'll either give current PS3 owners a discount on a new system, or let them send in their PS3's for free so they can upgrade their laser. 'Cause it'd be bad for business if you just said "hey, we're releasing something that's going to require you to buy a new player. But you'll have to buy a new on at full price." Besides, by that point, I'm sure the PS3 will have dropped in price at least once.

 

[eSZee]

These answer it quite well. Even if it can't support it now, 1they'll just release a firmware update so that it can. 2When the first PS3's were released they only supported HDDs up to 120GB. But, now, they've stuffed a 250GB HDD in there...how did they do that? They released a firmware update. Now, the PS3 supports up to 1TB.

3When the PS3 was first released, it might have only supported 25GB. However, now it should not only support the new 33.1 GB discs but 4Avatar's 50GB disc, as well.

A post filled to the brim with misinformation.
1) You've got to be joking. It can't support BDXL. PERIOD.
2)The PS3 HDD runs on FAT32 therefore it supported 2TB the whole time, it was only up to a software update to let us do so. HDD capacity increase is IRRELEVANT to BD capacity limits. There is nothing there that ties them together. This is a new standard, not simple size bump.
3)50GB DL disks were nothing new when the PS3 launched. The ps3 was, again, ready for BD DL disks.
4) Really, because 50gb AVATAR blu-ray is different from the 50gb disks of metal gear solid and final fantasy?

 

[Hubbe]

EDIT: Just read about the BDXLs. And they do say the the PS3's laser isn't powerful enough. However, I'm sure it won't be a problem for a while, and if it does, I'm sure Sony we'll either give current PS3 owners a discount on a new system, or let them send in their PS3's for free so they can upgrade their laser. 'Cause it'd be bad for business if you just said "hey, we're releasing something that's going to require you to buy a new player. But you'll have to buy a new on at full price." Besides, by that point, I'm sure the PS3 will have dropped in price at least once.

Loosing grip with reality?

 

[Devedander]

I dunno, it just seems to me like a given. That would be like if there was no online mode, or no GT mode. It just kinda seems like an obvious thing to do.

That's what I thought about gtpsp also... Then iit came out with no gt mode.

 

[G.T.Ace]

I know of the 25gb->33.4GB jump that the PS3 will support, but haven't seen anything else.
That means 66.7GB per disk. After that we have a jump to 100/128gb, which is BDXL and is not supported by the PS3. The reason for it, from what I remember, is that the laser isn't powerful enough to reach all 4 layers.

The PS3 can read BDs with 8 layers, can't find the article right now, but it can also read 400 GB BDs: http://www.gamepro.com/article/news/208115/ps3-can-read-new-400-gb-blu-ray-disc/

 

[eSZee]

The PS3 can read BDs with 8 layers, can't find the article right now, but it can also read 400 GB BDs: http://www.gamepro.com/article/news/208115/ps3-can-read-new-400-gb-blu-ray-disc/

http://www.pcworld.com/article/117867/sony_eyes_200gb_bluray_discs.html
^That one?

 

[G.T.Ace]

Yes, but I was looking for the article stating the PS3 is able to read them.
Anyway, as you can see above the PS3 can read discs bigger than BDXL, so I don't really care. It will take some time till we need discs bigger than 50GB anyway.

 

[eSZee]

Yes, but I was looking for the article stating the PS3 is able to read them.
Anyway, as you can see above the PS3 can read discs bigger than BDXL, so I don't really care. It will take some time till we need discs bigger than 50GB anyway.

That article is from 2004. More than 2 years before the ps3 came out. It also shows they might not be sure if the ps3 supports 54gb(50gb) disks, let alone 200gb. It even says PS3 COULD be compatible with smaller capacity BDs. Also, if BD disks "could" be 200gb back then, why are they just introducing 100/128GB disks? Sounds to me like they thought they could do a higher capacity disk compatible with current at the time laser. Since the BDXL disks are rather new, I can only assume their plans didn't work out so well.

 

[SuperShouden]

I don't understand how the Avatar 50GB disc is different than a Metal Gear Solid 50GB disc, other than the fact that they're two different types of media and are read by the machine differently. But if it reads a 50GB disc, then it should read a 50GB disc no matter what's on it. It IS a PS3. I DOES have a game processor. the only reason why your BD player doesn't read video game discs is because it doesn't have the processor for it.

 

[Goshin2568]

He was saying they are not different.

 

[crazedmodder]

The PS3 can read BDs with 8 layers, can't find the article right now, but it can also read 400 GB BDs: http://www.gamepro.com/article/news/208115/ps3-can-read-new-400-gb-blu-ray-disc/

That article reads a lot like a blog post. I don't have an account to view the original article but I am fairly certain it has no mention of the PS3 in it. Gamepro just decided that because it is a blu-ray disc that the PS3 can read it. Pretty poor IMO.

That article is from 2004. More than 2 years before the ps3 came out. It also shows they might not be sure if the ps3 supports 54gb(50gb) disks, let alone 200gb. It even says PS3 COULD be compatible with smaller capacity BDs. Also, if BD disks "could" be 200gb back then, why are they just introducing 100/128GB disks? Sounds to me like they thought they could do a higher capacity disk compatible with current at the time laser. Since the BDXL disks are rather new, I can only assume their plans didn't work out so well.

I remember around a year and a half ago reading about how Cree had achieved 161lm/W which was crazy for the time for the time (IIRC we were just seeing 100lm/W parts start to come out but they were very expensive and very difficult to get). This was in a lab. Recently Cree announced a 160lm/W LED coming to market in Fall 2010 which means if there are no delays the parts have taken 2 years to get to market.

Moral of that story? We always see press releases of crazy things engineers accomplish in a lab but production is something very different. Yield and cost are big factors. Although I do not mean to downplay the significance of these accomplishments because it is a big driving factor behind new technologies it is just meant to let people know what is technically possible. You guys should not read too much into stuff like that the 200GB disc was a lab disc, a proof that it was possible to make one not necessarily that they will be made and sold.

*Not really directed at you Dave, just thought some people might be interested.

I don't understand how the Avatar 50GB disc is different than a Metal Gear Solid 50GB disc, other than the fact that they're two different types of media and are read by the machine differently. But if it reads a 50GB disc, then it should read a 50GB disc no matter what's on it. It IS a PS3. I DOES have a game processor. the only reason why your BD player doesn't read video game discs is because it doesn't have the processor for it.

I'm pretty sure he means that there's no difference between the two 50GB discs (what you are saying here basically). I think there was just some confusion in the way your post was worded, made it sound like you meant the PS3 should be able to support the Avatar disc in the future.

 

[G.T.Ace]

That article reads a lot like a blog post. I don't have an account to view the original article but I am fairly certain it has no mention of the PS3 in it. Gamepro just decided that because it is a blu-ray disc that the PS3 can read it. Pretty poor IMO.

http://www.google.de/search?q=ps3+s...&rls=org.mozilla:de:official&client=firefox-a
Enough sources?
The stuff is all so old, unfortunately I can't find all the official quotes atm. or let's say, I'm really not in the mood to discuss 2 year old news.

 

[eSZee]

I don't understand how the Avatar 50GB disc is different than a Metal Gear Solid 50GB disc, other than the fact that they're two different types of media and are read by the machine differently. But if it reads a 50GB disc, then it should read a 50GB disc no matter what's on it. It IS a PS3. I DOES have a game processor. the only reason why your BD player doesn't read video game discs is because it doesn't have the processor for it.

I'd like to know where it says the Avatar disk is more than your standard DL blu-ray disk. It's the first time I've heard of this, then again avatar never did interest me.

 

[Peter]

You guys all turned off Topic street. Get back on Topic.

 

[crazedmodder]

http://www.google.de/search?q=ps3+s...&rls=org.mozilla:de:official&client=firefox-a
Enough sources?
The stuff is all so old, unfortunately I can't find all the official quotes atm. or let's say, I'm really not in the mood to discuss 2 year old news.

Wow, no need to get moody. Are you the author? I wasn't saying that it is not possible I'm just saying that source you used was pretty poor. Not directed at you but the article itself.

I know you were trying to be smart but regardless you are wrong to say "Enough sources?" because all of the top hits are not legitimate sources. A bunch of tech sites that quote each other as sources doesn't count. Neither does a forum.

Also why are you not in the mood to discuss 2 year old tech? A 400GB 16 layer blu-ray disc is still more advanced than the blu-ray discs available today. As are many things that came to life in a lab 2 years ago.

Anyways, here you go: Press Release