The GTP Unofficial 2020 US Elections Thread

[Dotini]

...apparently this is how incorrect statements get validated by vague nebulous platitudes. Everyone take note, here are the gymnastics required to do it.

You made a statement about novel problems with voting that was directly contradicted immediately by over a century of mail-in voting throughout the US. Somehow you still think that (easily) demonstrably wrong statement was correct.

Nope, not in my opinion. Which I stand by. You now say mail-in voting has never been a problem, and therefore it never can be, is that it?

 

[Danoff]

Nope, not in my opinion. Which I stand by. You now say mail-in voting has never been a problem, and therefore it never can be, is that it?

No. I did not say that. You're still working so hard to much such a wrong statement right.

 

[TexRex]

Dotini has a preternatural capacity for deflection and obfuscation.

 

[McLaren]

Nope, not in my opinion. Which I stand by. You now say mail-in voting has never been a problem, and therefore it never can be, is that it?

It hasn't been an issue in the last 20 years. Only 1 person in the country is now saying it's an issue to gaslight yet, there remains no evidence.

 

[Dotini]

But you started it here.



Which to me you're saying the entire process of mail in voting has always been flawed which isn't the case as many others have pointed out.

Then you spun it into this singling out the 2020 Election.



So to me, no you were not correct with your first assumption.

In my opinion, mail-in voting has been used sporadically and sparingly in the past, and with some success. Now new variations of it, like drop-off boxes, are to be adopted on an emergency basis by many additional jurisdictions precisely at a time when partisans seethe with anger and desire to use every legal/available means to sway the results.

I believe we are facing exceptional times and circumstances. It won't be long before the show starts.

 

[McLaren]

In my opinion, mail-in voting has been used sporadically and sparingly in the past, and with some success. Now new variations of it are to be adopted on an emergency basis by many additional jurisdictions precisely at a time when partisans seethe with anger and desire to to use every legal/available means to sway the results.

lul

 

[Boston77]

 

[Blitz24]

It hasn't been an issue in the last 20 years. Only 1 person in the country is now saying it's an issue to gaslight yet, there remains no evidence.

Maybe the people saying it's a problem are those who think that all of the states who are trying it for the first time are bound to fail....

 

[Danoff]

In my opinion, mail-in voting has been used sporadically and sparingly in the past, and with some success.

It has been used remarkably successfully for over a century. Colorado and Utah switched to it for everything in 2013. Washington state has been using it extensively since 2005, and has had versions of it since well before that. I don't care to look up the history of every state. But I think sporadically and sparingly is not right, and "with some success" is underplaying the remarkable success.

Now new variations of it, like drop-off boxes,

Not new.

are to be adopted on an emergency basis by many additional jurisdictions

Yes this is true.

precisely at a time when partisans seethe with anger and desire to use every legal/available means to sway the results.

Mail-in ballots are not the only target of this. Polling places are dramatically compromised this year (eg: COVID-19, harassment). Moreso than mail in my opinion.

I believe we are facing exceptional times and circumstances. It won't be long before the show starts.

Vague platitude. Mail-in voting is not causing "the show".

I don't know why you're still trying to create this link other than that Trump has tried to create it.

 

[Imari]

Now new variations of it, like drop-off boxes, are to be adopted on an emergency basis by many additional jurisdictions precisely at a time when partisans seethe with anger and desire to use every legal/available means to sway the results.

Drop off boxes are new are they? That revolutionary new technology - the box.

Now someone just has to invent the wheel, and we'll be able to have soap box derbies. Oh, and invent soap too I suppose. And hills.

 

[Dotini]

I don't know why you're still trying to create this link...

Of course not, since I'm not creating anything, merely describing/giving my opinion of present reality, which is much more than just mail-in/dropbox voting and ensuing legal challenges. We'll let the blame fall where it may, to Trump, Russians, the pandemic, the economy, social unrest and anything else. That's not my task; there are plenty of others nearby who excel at that fun job. I expect there will be lots of blame to go around., and we don't know the half of it yet.

 

[Chrunch Houston]

Better?

Yeah, like add a line at the bottom that says something like 'Provided courtesy of the L. A. County GOP'.

By that do you mean not labelled in a clearly and deliberately misleading manner that clearly breaks the law?

Whoa, didn't know you were a lawyer, solicitor or barrister.

The GOP has lawyers, and don't feel like they are in violation of the law. This will be for a court to decide.

Let me ask you the same question @Danoff dodged. What sinister thing do you think the evil Republicans plan on doing with those ballots?

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Well, I got an email that my ballot was received, but the ballot won't be counted until election day. Hope their machines work well.

 

[Joey D]

Got my ballot today in the mail, now I need to make the difficult decision of whether or not to vote Kanye 2020.

It's going to be difficult because:
I miss the old Kanye, straight from the 'Go Kanye
Chop up the soul Kanye, set on his goals Kanye

And:
I hate the new Kanye, the bad mood Kanye
The always rude Kanye, spaz in the news Kanye

But you know, I love Kanye like Kanye loved Kanye.

===

Seriously though, I'm glad I got my ballot so early because I have a ton to research on these Constitutional Amendments and all of the Judges. I used to be under the impression with judges, just vote them all out, but a guy I got to know from our legal team at work explained to me why I shouldn't do that. So now, I need to actually read up about them.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Seriously though, I'm glad I got my ballot so early because I have a ton to research on these Constitutional Amendments and all of the Judges. I used to be under the impression with judges, just vote them all out, but a guy I got to know from our legal team at work explained to me why I shouldn't do that. So now, I need to actually read up about them.

Oh, I always did the opposite and voted for retention. This time I checked to see if there were any major issues out in the news. There was a judge on admin duty, since they were under investigation for harassment. But it looks like they resigned, before a sanction was handed down.

 

[Crash]

Question: why wouldn't the ballots be collected from the box at the designated time/date. Anything submitted after that is not collected? Seems simple. The fundamental problem with voting in the US, as I understand it, is that unlike other countries there is no universal national standard in place & partisan local & state party officials appear to have an inappropriate amount of control over the process.

Ballots are collected at designated times by election officials. On the day of election, officials are posted at official drop off boxes to shut them down at the deadline. Official ballot boxes are non-partisan and partisan ballot boxes cannot be official. The actual voting process is conducted and counted by non-partisans. Of course, you have partisan folks trying to tamper with the process, and that's the news that you're hearing a lot of.

I will try to explain my understanding of ballots which are either mailed in or dropped off to a remote box.

A ballot mailed in to a post office will receive an official time stamp upon reception. Thus the ballot will be legible to count even if the ballot envelope is not opened, counted or discovered for hours or even days after the time for voting on election day has expired.

Ballots deposited in a convenient drop-off box should be no problem either - if it can be established that the box was properly sealed and/or taken into the custody of election officials at the expiration of the time allowed for voting on election day.

However, if a drop-off box full of ballots was discovered and secured hours or days after the election, there would be no way to assure the ballots were all placed into the box during the allowed time period. Thus, they would be subject to a legal challenge and quite likely not allowed to count.

You live in a state that has had state-wide universal mail-in voting for a decade (even longer in some counties). There is an official ballot drop off box right in front of your local library, and that box has been there for every election for years and years. There has not been mail-in voting fraud issues in this state. Yet, you still write about official ballot boxes as if they are some huge unknown that no one has ever thought about or used successfully. A team of election officials are at the ballot boxes to shut it down at polling deadline, so late ballots cannot be submitted. As long as the ballot is submitted before the poll close, then it'll get counted.

That's the thing, as long as the ballot box is put there by the local election authority, then they know exactly where all the ballot boxes are, and can, oh I don't know, take physical steps when polls close to ensure that the boxes cannot be used anymore. Funny how that works.

Once you deviate and start letting every state and local jurisdiction invent its own rules and processes, chaos and mistrust is invited into the system.

Elections have always been devolved to state and local jurisdictions to invent its own rules and processes, even with in-person voting, so nothing's changed there.

 

[Biggles]

Elections have always been devolved to state and local jurisdictions to invent its own rules and processes, even with in-person voting, so nothing's changed there.

That's what seems problematic. State & local jurisdictions are often controlled by party partisans. Having them in charge of the rules & processes leaves things open to abuse, as we have seen most obviously with the history of overt voter suppression in the South.

 

[TexRex]

You live in a state that has had state-wide universal mail-in voting for a decade (even longer in some counties). There is an official ballot drop off box right in front of your local library, and that box has been there for every election for years and years. There has not been mail-in voting fraud issues in this state. Yet, you still write about official ballot boxes as if they are some huge unknown that no one has ever thought about or used successfully. A team of election officials are at the ballot boxes to shut it down at polling deadline, so late ballots cannot be submitted. As long as the ballot is submitted before the poll close, then it'll get counted.

That's the thing, as long as the ballot box is put there by the local election authority, then they know exactly where all the ballot boxes are, and can, oh I don't know, take physical steps when polls close to ensure that the boxes cannot be used anymore. Funny how that works.



Elections have always been devolved to state and local jurisdictions to invent its own rules and processes, even with in-person voting, so nothing's changed there.

Facts aren't going to deter Dotini, and sadly they're no match for his efforts to deflect and obfuscate in the presence of the sort of partisan patsies to whom he panders.

 

[Tornado]

Let me ask you the same question @Danoff dodged.

Of the thousands of members on this forum I've interacted with in the last fifteen years, I cannot think of a single one who is still here where this statement means less from, Mr. "If Trump did something it cannot be corrupt, because Trump is too smart to be corrupt." Are you sure Danoff dodged a question, or were you too busy running away from another load of crap you tried to bring up that you got your conversations and threads confused?

 

[Danoff]

Let me ask you the same question @Danoff dodged. What sinister thing do you think the evil Republicans plan on doing with those ballots?

Not dodged, refused to respond because you ignored me. You ask for a courtesy you do not extend. That question is irrelevant. I don't have have any sinister plot in mind. I was merely answering your post, which was saying you couldn't see the difference. There was a clear difference, an important legal difference, and I clarified that for you.

Thinking that I have some evil sinister plot in mind is just your own preconceived nonsense clouding your judgement.

 

[McLaren]

And it's now been successfully appealed.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/arti...-box-restrictions-reinstated-by-appeals-court

All judges appointed by Trump? No proof is necessary? Corrupt as it gets in Texas, esp. with Paxton involved.

And re-lifted once again.

A Texas judge on Thursday lifted an order by Republican Gov. Greg Abbott that limited counties to a single drop-off location for absentee ballots in the Nov. 3 presidential election, siding with Democrats who have denounced the limit as voter suppression.

“The limitation to a single drop-off location for mail ballots would likely needlessly and unreasonably increase risks of exposure to COVID-19 infections, and needlessly and unreasonably substantially burden voters’ constitutionally protected rights to vote,” said state court judge Tim Sulak, who sits in Austin, in a short written order.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/20...kuBF5nJvoOLvMpf5Y06k1nVmpRKbk58RLMTCHnQdx0j9E

 

[Biggles]

And re-lifted once again.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/20...kuBF5nJvoOLvMpf5Y06k1nVmpRKbk58RLMTCHnQdx0j9E

The corrupt, partisan nature of this is just unbelievable. Time to send in "international observers" to monitor the application of "democracy" in the US?

 

[Danoff]

The corrupt, partisan nature of this is just unbelievable.

The tolerance of the corrupt partisan nature of this is unbelievable. How is it that republicans have come to the conclusion that if this benefits them it's good. Where did any principles go?

 

[Blitz24]

The tolerance of the corrupt partisan nature of this is unbelievable. How is it that republicans have come to the conclusion that if this benefits them it's good. Where did any principles go?

It's now win at any costs, ethics and morals be damned.

 

[Biggles]

The tolerance of the corrupt partisan nature of this is unbelievable. How is it that republicans have come to the conclusion that if this benefits them it's good. Where did any principles go?

Because, judging by my experience of the commentary on the Fox News website (I'm not even considering more right-wing media like Breitbart), Democrats are communists &/or anarchists &/or elitists , hate America, hate God, are perverts & child molesters & like to kill unborn babies. Why wouldn't you use all the means possible to prevent them coming to power? That's what a few years of the increased polarization fostered by social media has brought things to.

Principles are nice, but you need a system that prevents corrupt partisanship. Leaving the governing parties with so much control of the electoral process at the local & state level makes corruption inevitable.

 

[McLaren]

Oh my god, if any of ya'll are not tuning in, we are not 20 minutes into Trump's Town Hall & he is not doing well.

 

[ROAD_DOGG33J]

Well, at least he said he will accept a peaceful transfer, but not sure what that means in Trump speak.

 

[Danoff]

Principles are nice, but you need a system that prevents corrupt partisanship. Leaving the governing parties with so much control of the electoral process at the local & state level makes corruption inevitable.

I'm not sure it's possible to create a system (run by people) that cannot become corrupted.

 

[NotThePrez]

Oh my god, if any of ya'll are not tuning in, we are not 20 minutes into Trump's Town Hall & he is not doing well.

I just got home, but I tuned in to listen while driving when a woman asked him how he would protect people with pre-existing conditions.

I don't think I've ever in my life heard someone put so much effort into not answering a question. I had to tune out after 30 seconds of loud rambling.

 

[McLaren]

I just got home, but I tuned in to listen while driving when a woman asked him how he would protect people with pre-existing conditions.

I don't think I've ever in my life heard someone put so much effort into not answering a question. I had to tune out after 30 seconds of loud rambling.

Then it won't shock you to learn he did that with many questions.