2014 F1 Mechanics/Aero; Design predictions to win the WCC/WDC. READ FIRST POST

[Saidur_Ali]

On outright pace, I'm hoping Mercedes got the speed. It will be interesting to see how Red Bull manage without the exhaust blowing effect, start of 2012 they struggled a bit, now they don't have it as something to recover, they are likely to be biggest losers in this change. Fuel efficiency might be key so who got the best engine, one with least compromises and reliability might be strongest out of the big teams. My main worry is the tyres, hope they don't blow out. Very dangerous even if only in testing.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

On outright pace, I'm hoping Mercedes got the speed. It will be interesting to see how Red Bull manage without the exhaust blowing effect, start of 2012 they struggled a bit, now they don't have it as something to recover, they are likely to be biggest losers in this change. Fuel efficiency might be key so who got the best engine, one with least compromises and reliability might be strongest out of the big teams. My main worry is the tyres, hope they don't blow out. Very dangerous even if only in testing.

They just switched to using blown air in different areas (e.g. brakes) that is supposedly pretty good, and I don't recall any other teams doing it yet so...

Doesn't bode well unless they do something over this break. (other teams that is.)

EDIT:

Just looked and I found that Williams also run the blown wheel hubs, RBRs are obviously better at this point -Brazilian GP that is- but they have time to improve.

Also this should make me happy since I've already called Mercedes Benz to win the WCC this year. And maybe Saidur you'll like this, but MBGP have gotten two of RBR's senior staff for next year. Only downside is they wont be working on the team until July...

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2013/12/15352.html

 

[Ferrari_458]

I can definitely not confirm that having been inside one of the factories that their nose does infact look pretty much exactly like the Autosport mock up in the first post (nudge nudge wink wink )

I have to say, it looks awful to someone used to 2013 rules, but I'm sure we'll get used to it...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I can definitely not confirm that having been inside one of the factories that their nose does infact look pretty much exactly like the Autosport mock up in the first post (nudge nudge wink wink )

I have to say, it looks awful to someone used to 2013 rules, but I'm sure we'll get used to it...

Getting use to an appendage on the nose that looks like that...I don't think anyone will get use to it.

 

[Ferrari_458]

Getting use to an appendage on the nose that looks like that...I don't think anyone will get use to it.

It's a ridiculous decision by whoever made the rules this year..

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

It's a ridiculous decision by whoever made the rules this year..

Do you know why they did it at all? Cause I'd really like to know if it is a safety measure or something...

 

[Ferrari_458]

Do you know why they did it at all? Cause I'd really like to know if it is a safety measure or something...

I can't say I do but it's all about safety with the FIA now.. I can only assume they didn't realise the way the teams would use the rules, because they'd have to be mad to give rules that mean that those noses are all that are possible

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

So here it is...the new Ferrari engine but sadly they decided not to show a picture of the turbocharger and thus you only get one side...

Also Rosberg suffered a tire failure at Bahrain during testing yesterday but Pirelli say the tires shouldn't be a worry next year. Let's hope not, 2014 will probably have enough issues as it is.

 

[AnAL0G]

Also Rosberg suffered a tire failure at Bahrain during testing yesterday but Pirelli say the tires shouldn't be a worry next year. Let's hope not, 2014 will probably have enough issues as it is.

On the fastest part of the circuit at that. "Shouldn't be a worry", okay, Pirelli... 👎

 

[hairy_scotsman]

Here's a kinda cool new video I just received from Shell & Ferrari. I uploaded to our FB page. In it, Shell's Guy Lovett & Mike Evans, and Ferrari's Luca Marmorini & Mattia Binotto take a look at the new F1 powertain & walk us through some 2014 F1 engine & ERS design considerations brought on by the new regulations.

https://www.facebook.com/FoF1ATX/posts/761343930546821

 

[HKS racer]

Ferrari- Here is the problem I worry about for Mercedes, Rory Byrne and the fact he took over the key role for the 2014 challenger. That is a worry for me, the guy is good and an argument could be made that he is better than Newey or at least on an even level. Also people make fun of Merc for buying up many of the best head engineers, but the other half of the coin is Ferrari doing the same thing. Ferrari has Fry, Bigois(last two were at MGP), Tombazis, and of course James Allison (Lotus). So...I feel this is the other team to really watch.

I obviously agree with Byrne be one of the greatest but he is not immportal, we can't rely on him because Tombazis and Fry are not able to give us a winning car. Allison is a good one, I'm happy he came back but I don't think the Team is enough for a title win. And on a race track week-end Domenicali is definitely not what Ross Brawn was in Schumacher era.
Actually if you want to win in F1 you either need Newey or a drastic change of rules with the reintroduction of test.

I can't believe it, F1 doesn't care about its hard core fans they just want to make it into a show to try and get people who couldn't care less about F1 more interested.

I thought you were talking about Gran Turismo for a second.

 

[MagpieRacer]

I wonder if we will see some radically different interpretations of the lower nose. The rule is that the tip has to be lower than last season. (Can't remember exact measurements) But looking at the first post, the mock ups of the RBR and the McLaren already show 2 interpretations of it. I think some may go for the shlong nose, perhaps we will see someone go the other route, some teams may just run lower normal looking noses like the Brawn from 2009. Certainly will be interesting once cars start launching.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

I obviously agree with Byrne be one of the greatest but he is not immportal, we can't rely on him because Tombazis and Fry are not able to give us a winning car. Allison is a good one, I'm happy he came back but I don't think the Team is enough for a title win. And on a race track week-end Domenicali is definitely not what Ross Brawn was in Schumacher era.
Actually if you want to win in F1 you either need Newey or a drastic change of rules with the reintroduction of test.

...You don't need Newey considering Byrne is as good as Newey if not better, that has been proven on several occasions. You say one is not "immportal" rather immortal but then you put one on an ivory tower because his counter part is semi-retired and has been for some time and is now coming out of it. Also Bob Bell beat both of them at the same time twice so not sure what that says to you, if anything but it speaks volumes to me.

The only thing I see on Newey's side is momentum, but that can turn into being complacent to some degree.

 

[MrWednesday]

I was under the impression it would change the compression ratio of fuel to air in the cylnider so that it's just the same fuel used to ignite more air than before, resulting in a greater energy transaction and therefore more power, as the air is more compressed by a greater boost from the turbo

That's not how engines work.

More boost means more air going into the engine assuming the same displacement. Fuel is metered based on the amount of air, they're aiming for a particular air-to-fuel ratio on a mass basis. If they're wrong, they'll either burn extra fuel and be down a bit on power (too rich), or they'll melt pistons or burn up the engine (too lean). Higher compression is also more susceptible to knock or detonation, which also weighs in favor of aiming a little richer on air-to-fuel ratio since a richer mixer is less likely to knock or detonate.

The upshot is, definitely more fuel consumption with more boost.

 

[HKS racer]

...You don't need Newey considering Byrne is as good as Newey if not better, that has been proven on several occasions. You say one is not "immportal" rather immortal but then you put one on an ivory tower because his counter part is semi-retired and has been for some time and is now coming out of it. Also Bob Bell beat both of them at the same time twice so not sure what that says to you, if anything but it speaks volumes to me.

The only thing I see on Newey's side is momentum, but that can turn into being complacent to some degree.

Thanks for your grammar nazi joke on a honest typo.
For a title win if we don't need Newey we need at least the come back of test on proper race tracks, how many test Ferrari could have done at Fiorano using all those money they wasted into the spaceship simulator.

Also Rosberg suffered a tire failure at Bahrain during testing yesterday but Pirelli say the tires shouldn't be a worry next year. Let's hope not, 2014 will probably have enough issues as it is.

Here's the message Christian Horner sent to Hembery right after that: " Back to 2012 specs!!!1!!1! "

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Thanks for your grammar nazi joke on a honest typo.
For a title win if we don't need Newey we need at least the come back of test on proper race tracks, how many test Ferrari could have done at Fiorano using all those money they wasted into the spaceship simulator.

It's wasn't a nazi grammar joke, I could have made it one and once again stop with the leap to conclusions you can be quite emotional/defensive. What spaceship simulator? The one that is a joke compared to RBR, Mercedes, and McLaren. The one that their owner even says isn't great and cries how he wishes they could waste millions upon millions of their money and the FIAs to run multiple test in a season? Sorry the world changes and so do sports and societies and a multitude of other things.

Here's the message Christian Horner sent to Hembery right after that: " Back to 2012 specs!!!1!!1! "

And Hembery cried that the teams and the sport in general aren't supporting Pirelli even though they're just doing what was asked of them.

 

[Bram Turismo]

On the fastest part of the circuit at that. "Shouldn't be a worry", okay, Pirelli... 👎

Oh, a tyre failed. Quick, another Pirelli witch-hunt!

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Anyways people, McLaren may very well go back to their orange traditional livery. The car is said to be released on Jan. 25th, I'll make one special post comparing side and front profiles of all cars probably when they're finally released.

 

[HKS racer]

It's wasn't a nazi grammar joke, I could have made it one and once again stop with the leap to conclusions you can be quite emotional/defensive. What spaceship simulator? The one that is a joke compared to RBR, Mercedes, and McLaren. The one that their owner even says isn't great and cries how he wishes they could waste millions upon millions of their money and the FIAs to run multiple test in a season? Sorry the world changes and so do sports and societies and a multitude of other things.

Racing is still based on a real track, MotoGP have their test sessions and as long as I'm aware they don't live in a vintage parallel Universe.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Racing is still based on a real track, MotoGP have their test sessions and as long as I'm aware they don't live in a vintage parallel Universe.

No one said they did, and the ratio spent between the two are vastly different, money doesn't take on some new monetary value to help your argument. Also your argument falls flat because of the massive cost cutting that moto gp is trying to do because they can't survive as is, and making new rules that make it more spec in ideal. This is why you see Moto GP titan like Honda saying they'll leave the series if said rules come into play.

Also it doesn't matter, because F1 has long term cost cutting into 2015 and forward also that makes the idea of mass testing impossible. Racing is based on a real track and there is testing just not to the wasteful extent Ferrari wishes it had. The fact that they had wind tunnel woes this year among other aero issues (there was more to it says Fry), gives more insight to why they're crying for additional testing.

 

[HKS racer]

No one said they did, and the ratio spent between the two are vastly different money doesn't take on some new monetary value to help your argument. Also your argument falls flat because of the massive cost cutting that moto gp is trying to do because they can't survive as is, and making new rules that make it more spec in ideal. This is why you see Moto GP titan like Honda saying they'll leave the series if said rules come into play.

Also it doesn't matter, because F1 has long term cost cutting into 2015 and forward also that makes the idea of mass testing impossible. Racing is based on a real track and there is testing just not to the wasteful extent Ferrari wishes it had. The fact that they had wind tunnel woes this year among other aero issues (there was more to it says Fry), gives more insight to why they're crying for additional testing.

And yet with the cost cutting F1 measures you actiually have a team, the winning team not declaring their budget. It is a long discussion it will never end. Like politics.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

And yet with the cost cutting F1 measures you actiually have a team, the winning team not declaring their budget. It is a long discussion it will never end. Like politics.

All four top teams BS the numbers and haven't given concrete figures and you just had Ferrari lying last month when a number came out and saying they don't spend anywhere near that. Yet it most likely was said because they are left with pie on their face after spending so much and only ending up third.

You wanna bash RBR go ahead but facts are facts and the end of the day and you shouldn't pick or choose which you like and then sum it up to, "this is a never ending discussion so let's forgo it"

 

[HKS racer]

All four top teams BS the numbers and haven't given concrete figures and you just had Ferrari lying last month when a number came out and saying they don't spend anywhere near that. Yet it most likely was said because they are left with pie on their face after spending so much and only ending up third.

You wanna bash RBR go ahead but facts are facts and the end of the day and you shouldn't pick or choose which you like and then sum it up to, "this is a never ending discussion so let's forgo it"

Facts are facts indeed, and you should be blind if you can't realize something is not working properly if with this reducing cost programm we have one team or more not declaring what they spent.
What's the point of a budget cap if top teams does not respect it and/or refuse to give accurate account?
It's pure hypocrisy, and of the worst kind.

As the things stands now I cannot see why a team, for the same money spent, have to be forced on using a simulator instead of a real race track. Since no one is respecting the budget let at least these teams spend THEIR money in the way they think it is more profitable. But I know, in the end the only fool was LCDM for actually agreeing with this no-sense, time ago. but hey he get paid for that and he likes money.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Facts are facts indeed, and you should be blind if you can't realize something is not working properly if with this reducing cost programm we have one team or more not declaring what they spent.
What's the point of a budget cap if top teams does not respect it and/or refuse to give accurate account?
It's pure hypocrisy, and of the worst kind.

There was/is no true cost cutting or cap implementation as I already said and wont be until 2015, you can be cynical about it all you want it's easy to do that. I'm sure the FIA have some type of audit system in place for them until a true system is in place not sure how you know an absolute, there is no budget right now and teams can lie all they want to keep face value. The fact is more in season testing will be put in place for the following years and thus that will help somewhat.

As the things stands now I cannot see why a team, for the same money spent, have to be forced on using a simulator instead of a real race track. Since no one is respecting the budget let at least these teams spend THEIR money in the way they think it is more profitable. But I know, in the end the only fool was LCDM for actually agreeing with this no-sense, time ago. but hey he get paid for that and he likes money.

Because the same money spent wont yield the results still, obviously it's doing just fine for teams along with other aids like wind tunnels and CFD systems. Even teams like Lotus are making good use out of them for less money than Ferrari and beating or being on par with Ferrari most times this year and a good amount of those times last year (2012). Why should they bend to teams (Ferrari) in any capacity?

 

[prisonermonkeys]

If this is at all representative of how the cars might look, then they're not going to be ghastly at all:



And here is a mock-up of how the VJM07 might look.

Craig Scarborough of scarbsf1 and Autosport reckons that at least three teams will do this. It has also been suggested that McLaren will be doing something extremely interesting - and the last time they did that, we got the moose sidepods.

 

[Third Reign]

Do you know why they did it at all? Cause I'd really like to know if it is a safety measure or something...

What I've picked up somewhere is that nose height and a front surface area is regulated. The height is regulated for crash safety ad in order for it to not be a spear the size needs regulation as well. The appendage type nose uses the minimal area in size. One theory on why teams might opt for this appendage is that the low and wide "visually nice" nose might disturb the airflow to the underbody too much. I already found the step nose ugly, I pray that they have some sense and don't add the appendage. It looks so wrong...

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

What I've picked up somewhere is that nose height and a front surface area is regulated. The height is regulated for crash safety ad in order for it to not be a spear the size needs regulation as well. The appendage type nose uses the minimal area in size. One theory on why teams might opt for this appendage is that the low and wide "visually nice" nose might disturb the airflow to the underbody too much. I already found the step nose ugly, I pray that they have some sense and don't add the appendage. It looks so wrong...

It does look wrong, and though that video I posted is from a reliable source the same man that has don't official F1 art renderings of technical pieces for years if not decades

If this is at all representative of how the cars might look, then they're not going to be ghastly at all:



And here is a mock-up of how the VJM07 might look.

Craig Scarborough of scarbsf1 and Autosport reckons that at least three teams will do this. It has also been suggested that McLaren will be doing something extremely interesting - and the last time they did that, we got the moose sidepods.

You mean the one I posted up in the opening post already? The video that is. Also the opening post shows a vision of what might also show up next year and is what the McLaren might look like.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I've had a few problems with embedded videos. They're not showing in posts. I know what the problem is, though - I'm posting from a mobile device and I'm due for an update from Android that I have been putting off because it's a big one.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

So the Lotus wont be ready for Test one supposedly even though this is the same team that told everyone some time back that they had started the 2014 project with an increasing degree up to now back in 2012. This before any other team and yet they are having issues...

McLaren have moved up their release to the 24th of January, so a team that hardly talked about the 2014 car will be first it seems or at least release the car when they usually do. Mercedes will be releasing their car on the 28th at Jerez so that's a plus too.

EDIT:

Caterham will also release on the 28th

 

[tuj]

Mclaren's 'unique' feature this year is venetian blind covers over the rear suspension members. Ferrari has their engine being tested in a LaFerrari mule around their track.

Oh yeah, direct injection is allowed this year, so expect to see stratified charge as a strategy to save fuel.