GP of Brazil 2007

[Sureboss]

Did you just call Alonso a farce?

I believe Ferrari ended up with 204 points, and McLaren 203 points. Even if McLaren had scored one more point, Ferrari would have won based on having the most wins.

Hmmm....

McLaren weren't allowed to score constructor points at Hungary after one driver blocks another, Ferrari win race with an illegal part, part gets banned, results stand.

So a driver does something stupid, whole team gets punished.
A team use an illegal part, nothing happens.

Alonso stopping Hamilton was surely a driver penalty and not a constructor penalty?

All in vain though.

 

[mipuumal]

Hmmm....

McLaren weren't allowed to score constructor points at Hungary after one driver blocks another, Ferrari win race with an illegal part, part gets banned, results stand.

So a driver does something stupid, whole team gets punished.
A team use an illegal part, nothing happens.

The way I understood the Bending floor thing: When a team creates something innovative that bends the rules but doesn't necessarily break them, the FIA tightens up the rules so that they don't allow any bending.

Same thing happened with Renault's mass dampeners in 2006, the 2006 flex wing craze and McLaren's front/rear brakepedals in 1998 among a bunch of things I would imagine.

Alonso stopping Hamilton was surely a driver penalty and not a constructor penalty?

All in vain though.

They punished the team because they couldn't keep the ordeal from being made public the way it did. Still pretty harsh.

 

[Hun200kmh]

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071022220432.shtml

It seems that the "gearbox" problem Hamilton had was caused by a slip of his own finger ... it must be frustrating, but hopefully he'll get over it.

 

[Blake]

4 posts above yours…

 

[Hun200kmh]

it's a few more than 4, but I didn't notice it, sorry

 

[Sureboss]

Couldn't you make it so that when car is doing x speed the Launch system can't work?

 

[Metar]

Not when it was a team decision to leave him out 2 laps too long, though you could blame the pit entry 50% on him...50% on Trulli (a back marker) getting in the way.

Err... If I saw my tyres becoming white, I'd radio my team and tell them I'm ****ing pitting no matter what.

It was just as well his decision to do such an extremely long stint.

Exactly! Teams tried the chilled-fuel trick in 1984 (when re-fueling was first banned). It didn't work: The fuel warmed up in the 10-15 minutes while the car waited on the grid. I highly doubt an F1 car would carry the added weight of refrigeration devices to gain a tiny amount of fuel.

In race conditions, next to a hot engine, it's even less time.

3-4 degrees, as was recorded, is already a tiny difference. Add in the fact that it heats up again to the legal limit within a minute or two, and reaches close-to-ambient after around 10, it really is nothing.

And, as explained, there's an argument regarding the definition of ambient - as the Management screen showed a higher figure than others.

 

[Famine]

Err... If I saw my tyres becoming white, I'd radio my team and tell them I'm ****ing pitting no matter what.

Mirrors on an F1 car are primarily for decoration.

 

[Metar]

Front tyres on F1 cars are primarily in view.

Those where white as well.

 

[Diego440]

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071022220432.shtml

It seems that the "gearbox" problem Hamilton had was caused by a slip of his own finger ... it must be frustrating, but hopefully he'll get over it.

Maybe not


McLaren deny Hamilton caused gearbox error

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/63613

 

[SauberBMW]

Lewis Hamilton would have never won anyway, his luck ran out at the Gp China

 

[Hun200kmh]

written in the stars, was it?

 

[SauberBMW]

No, It that he got so cocky that he overpushed himself and so did Mclaren.
Alonso should have let him pass instead of cutting him off
(dont remember which lap it was)

 

[Famine]

Front tyres on F1 cars are primarily in view.

Having seen a driver's eye view from the cockpit, no they aren't.

Those where white as well.

I only recall the L/S/R being white, but I may not have been paying attention.

 

[Metar]

No, It that he got so cocky that he overpushed himself and so did Mclaren.
Alonso should have let him pass instead of cutting him off
(dont remember which lap it was)

Again, people keep calling this move a dangerous move, cutting him off, whatever.

I agree, as DN said, that the Spa move was reckless and dangerous, and totally unnecessary. But I must protest, his pass at Interlagos, turn 3, was perfectly fine. Most overtaking maneuvers are like this - and with the championship at stake, I'd expect more dangerous things.

Hamilton tried to re-overtake from a position he couldn't do it, overshot the corner, and lost time. Not Alonso's fault, is it?

Having seen a driver's eye view from the cockpit, no they aren't.

I only recall the L/S/R being white, but I may not have been paying attention.

But it still makes one question why nobody else said: "Lewis, you're tyres are down to the canvas. Maybe you should pit earlier?" over the radio.

 

[<_Spike_>]

Metar - So...you've not listened to any F1 drivers when they say how hard it is to spot anything in those wing-mirrors then? May be what you'd do, but pitting when you haven't been told to (unless it's actual damage to the car) probably isn't the smartest thing to do. Would cause the pit crew to rush and again, that isn't all that helpful now is it?

Plus you seem to have also missed the part where Martin Whitmarsh said "We made a mistake because we weren't sure on the tyre choice and rain. In heinsight we should've brought him in 2 laps earlier" Hmmm...sounds a lot like it's down to the team to me

Anyway...I find it funny how Monetzemelo is going on about how McLaren isn't a team and Ferrari is because Massa helped Kimi...how the hell did Massa help Kimi? Stayed out in front until they could switch them over in the pit stops. I don't call that "helping", I call that pre-organised team orders. Helping would've been letting Kimi go and putting him in the position he needs to win the Championship.

 

[Famine]

But it still makes one question why nobody else said: "Lewis, you're tyres are down to the canvas. Maybe you should pit earlier?" over the radio.

[Conspiracy Theory] Perhaps McLaren didn't want Lewis to win the WDC, like the mysterious gearbox fault when he'd just fought his way up through the pack [/Conspiracy Theory]

That information is between Ron and Lewis...

 

[SauberBMW]

Your right, maybe mclaren wants the DC and CC all in one go
Do you think they'll do it in 2008

 

[mipuumal]

[Conspiracy Theory] Perhaps McLaren didn't want Lewis to win the WDC, like the mysterious gearbox fault when he'd just fought his way up through the pack [/Conspiracy Theory]

That information is between Ron and Lewis...

Also Bernie Ecclestone said on the grid in Brazil that he wanted Alonso to win, yet a week earlier he had said that Alonso was a bad champion and Lewis would be amazing. Maybe there is something to that.

Then again, maybe Bernie is just senile.

 

[Sureboss]

Err... If I saw my tyres becoming white, I'd radio my team and tell them I'm ****ing pitting no matter what.

It was just as well his decision to do such an extremely long stint.

No way, if he'd have come in on his own thinking there'd be no pit crew. The drivers don't do the strategy work.

Also his tyres only went down to the canvass on the lap he pitted, they were very bald, but only went to the canvass after passing the pits the last time before he 'pitted'.

 

[Metar]

No way, if he'd have come in on his own thinking there'd be no pit crew. The drivers don't do the strategy work.

There would be had he told them, a lap, two laps, three laps earlier that grip is fading at an alarming rate. Halfway through a lap, should he say, "I'm coming in", they should be at least halfway organized.

 

[I-Runner]

Mirrors on an F1 car are primarily for decoration.

If Ricardo Zonta hadn't got the rear Mirrors in [SIZE=-1]Spa-Francorchamps
(2000 Season) ..we would had another sad day for the racing sport
..after Imola 94!

I-R
[/SIZE]

 

[Blake]

He didn&#8217;t see Mika during that pass anyway, only saw Michael.

 

[I-Runner]

Right !

But if the Mirrors are for decoration.. HE didn't see Michael too !

 

[Lee]

There have been crashes down that straight before you know, I don't think we would have had 'another tragedy', especially with the increases in safety since '94.

I think Famine is right, especially with the HANS device, I'd be suprised if they can turn their heads enoguh to make the mirrors useful at all.

 

[Famine]

Right !

But if the Mirrors are for decoration.. HE didn't see Michael too !

I said "primarily". You'd see a bit of a car - you'd probably not be able to identify what car it is - but not enough to see a white stripe on your tyre (or indeed your tyre at all).

 

[Sureboss]

There would be had he told them, a lap, two laps, three laps earlier that grip is fading at an alarming rate. Halfway through a lap, should he say, "I'm coming in", they should be at least halfway organized.

Who's to say he didn't tell them grip is going?

 

[Metar]

Who's to say he didn't tell them grip is going?

Yet they didn't get the clue and prepared the mechanics a bit earlier?

 

[peterjford]

Who's to say he didn't tell them grip is going?

And if he did, you would hope the team would listen to him. He is the one that should know about things that can change, like tires wear. The engineers should be able to predict things and tell him what to expect but I would hope that the ultimate call would come from the guy in the car.

"Our telemetry says you still have enough fuel for another lap, maybe the engine just got quieter?"

"We just had the B-Spec drive do 25 laps on similar tires on this track in GT4, you should be fine"

 

[Year.Zero]

Is there a video of this race? I had a hangover that day and slept through it. I was so pissed too, because I booked work off just to watch it and never got to.