Israel - Palestine discussion thread

G.T.Ace
You played too much Call of Duty. War is far from being as precise as you think, especially in such an area.
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I don't play call of duty thank you , you didn't understand what I posted I am afraid ...I said bombs ain't the answer
 
vasiliflame
I don't play call of duty thank you , you didn't understand what I posted I am afraid ...I said bombs ain't the answer
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War is never an answer.

You said they don't need to bomb and could use snipers, but that's not how it works.
You have to have the terrain, the possibility to move in undetected, you directly risk the life of your soldiers and even then, you don't know if there aren't any colleteral damages.

Bombing is dirty, yes, but I understand why they're doing it (I'm not justifying it).
 
G.T.Ace
War is never an answer.

You said they don't need to bomb and could use snipers, but that's not how it works.
You have to have the terrain, the possibility to move in undetected, you directly risk the life of your soldiers and even then, you don't know if there aren't any colleteral damages.

Bombing is dirty, yes, but I understand why they're doing it (I'm not justifying it).
Click to expand...

Yeah but they are ww2 tactics , Israel are dropping bombs were there are buildings touching , is it guilty by proximity? They don't have to use bomber harris tactics , you cannot just bomb them out civilians and all
 
G.T.Ace
War is never an answer.

You said they don't need to bomb and could use snipers, but that's not how it works.
You have to have the terrain, the possibility to move in undetected, you directly risk the life of your soldiers and even then, you don't know if there aren't any colleteral damages.

Bombing is dirty, yes, but I understand why they're doing it (I'm not justifying it).
Click to expand...

How do you understand it?
 
vasiliflame
Yeah but they are ww2 tactics , Israel are dropping bombs were there are buildings touching , is it guilty by proximity? They don't have to use bomber harris tactics , you cannot just bomb them out civilians and all
Click to expand...
These are not WWII tactics, WWII tactics would mean to just bomb the place up, which they're clearly not doing.
There are no carpet bombing runs.

zzz_pt
How do you understand it?
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From a military standpoint I understand it. This has nothing to do with morale and ethics.
It doesn't really matter anyway, every act of war is unjustified from both sides.
Neither Israel, nor the Hamas have the right to shoot.
 
Israel's aim here is to batter Hamas into submission because Hamas have steadfastly refused to renounce violence, unlike Fatah (from whom Hamas seized power in Gaza in 2007, but who remain in charge in the West Bank). Israel wants Abbas's authority in Gaza restored, and that is probably the only likely solution to the current crisis other than Israel trying to batter Hamas into submission.

But Hamas are almost as likely to reconcile with Fatah as they are to host a Woody Allen film festival, so it's hard to see that happening any time soon. That said, the international community are considerably more behind Abbas and Fatah, and so the solution is far more likely to lie with them than it ever was with Hamas.
 
Israel is never going to succeed in battering Hamas into submission. It will only make Hamas more violent, which in turns provokes Israel, and vice versa, and the circle of war will continue. So long as Israel exists, so too will Hamas.
 
sumbrownkid
Israel is never going to succeed in battering Hamas into submission. It will only make Hamas more violent, which in turns provokes Israel, and vice versa, and the circle of war will continue. So long as Israel exists, so too will Hamas.
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Or some other group, because there's a possibility that Israel will wipe out the Hamas (with many civilian casualties).
 
G.T.Ace
Or some other group, because there's a possibility that Israel will wipe out the Hamas (with many civilian casualties).
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And when that happens, more often than not, an even worse organization takes over. Like ISIS in Iraq replacing Al-Qaeda.
 
sumbrownkid
Israel is never going to succeed in battering Hamas into submission. It will only make Hamas more violent, which in turns provokes Israel, and vice versa, and the circle of war will continue. So long as Israel exists, so too will Hamas.
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I agree to a large extent - the harder you hit Hamas the more popular they seem to become - but Fatah offer a way out for Gazans. So long as Hamas refuse to accept the Israelis right to exist, there will be severe hardship for the people of Gaza. Fatah at least have renounced violence against Israelis. The people of Gaza seem hellbent on supporting Hamas, and attacking Hamas may well backfire/not produce the desired effect - but it might at least remind Gazans that intolerance and violence towards the people/state of Israel will bring pain and war upon them, whilst supporting a non-violent/political approach such as that adopted by Fatah might just bring an end to that pain.
 
G.T.Ace
Yup, no doubt about that.
Although, I wouldn't say Al-Qaeda was in Iraq. ;)
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Well according to post war "YEAH BRINGING FREEDOM TO IRAQ!!!" reports Al-Qaeda infiltrated the Sunni population and started the insurgency against American forces. Kinda became a self-fulfilling prophecy of sorts for our "War on Terrorism".
 
sumbrownkid
Well according to post war "YEAH BRINGING FREEDOM TO IRAQ!!!" reports Al-Qaeda infiltrated the Sunni population and started the insurgency against American forces. Kinda became a self-fulfilling prophecy of sorts for our "War on Terrorism".
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Yeah, but Al-Qaeda and "Al-Qaeda" you know? ;)
 
Not sure how legit, but:

Bsx2QGrCEAERyTH.jpg:large
 
Why wouldn't Israeli's cheer when they see retaliation befalling their aggressors, and they know, as we do, that Hamas is targeted (albeit, there will always be some 'collateral damage' as there is in any war). Unlike when Hamas fire rockets into Israel hoping to kill as many civilians as possible because they are incapable of doing otherwise.
But anyone who thinks that Palestinians don't cheer and shout when an Israeli dies (or one of their rockets is seen hitting something which causes a large explosion) is a fool and a liar.
 
G.T.Ace
These are not WWII tactics, WWII tactics would mean to just bomb the place up, which they're clearly not doing.
There are no carpet bombing runs.


From a military standpoint I understand it. This has nothing to do with morale and ethics.
It doesn't really matter anyway, every act of war is unjustified from both sides.
Neither Israel, nor the Hamas have the right to shoot.
Click to expand...


I would gladly join hamas if Israel would have killed my children. Every innocent father has the right to shoot against those who took their babies.

On one side we see innocent people being killed everyday and trying to escape as they can. On the other, we see people chearing with bombings. This is not war. Israel wants to call it a war and a "defensive" move but what they're doing is murder innocent unarmed people that did nothing wrong.
 
Dalone
Why wouldn't Israeli's cheer when they see retaliation befalling their aggressors, and they know, as we do, that Hamas is targeted (albeit, there will always be some 'collateral damage' as there is in any war). Unlike when Hamas fire rockets into Israel hoping to kill as many civilians as possible because they are incapable of doing otherwise.
But anyone who thinks that Palestinians don't cheer and shout when an Israeli dies (or one of their rockets is seen hitting something which causes a large explosion) is a fool and a liar.
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The cheering Palestinians side might be true but these days, you need a solid proof for your statement. Media nowdays can easily get the cheering Palestinians side but until, not once I have saw about the otherside cheering for the death of the civillians.

Provide you can give me the proof of that, then I may say you're right about your statement.

Also, guys. May I ask about this one. Is it true about this picture, if so, what's the story behind this?
I heard it was an intentional incident. Well, for one I can say by the looks of it, the children were use as what? Target practice? Wtf?

I warn you before you click this link. It's not gorish but some of you may find it disturbing.
Le link
 
zzz_pt
I would gladly join hamas if Israel would have killed my children. Every innocent father has the right to shoot against those who took their babies.

On one side we see innocent people being killed everyday and trying to escape as they can. On the other, we see people chearing with bombings. This is not war. Israel wants to call it a war and a "defensive" move but what they're doing is murder innocent unarmed people that did nothing wrong.
Click to expand...
The whole thing started decades (centuries actually) ago, only the names of the parties involved changed.
It's not that easy, not to mention that the Hamas also murdered innocent people before (with terror attacks), your argument works against both sides. There's no good or bad, only bad.

By the way, murdering unarmed people can also be a part of war.
 
ZEROX
The cheering Palestinians side might be true but these days, you need a solid proof for your statement. Media nowdays can easily get the cheering Palestinians side but until, not once I have saw about the otherside cheering for the death of the civillians.

Provide you can give me the proof of that, then I may say you're right about your statement.

Also, guys. May I ask about this one. Is it true about this picture, if so, what's the story behind this?
I heard it was an intentional incident. Well, for one I can say by the looks of it, the children were use as what? Target practice? Wtf?

I warn you before you click this link. It's not gorish but some of you may find it disturbing.
Le link
Click to expand...

I really am not 100% sure, but alot of people and journalists were saying it is and there were pictures of the families as well so a pretty good guess will be it is true, not the worst thing Israel has done, by their standards this is pretty average.
 
Dennisch
The Palestinians killing all Israelis isn't possible. The other way round could be possible. If that should happen, which is very very unlikely, I think Israel has to fight off pretty much the whole region. And I don't think anyone will help them after they have commited genocide on the complete Palestinian population.

But as I said. Never going to happen.
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Yeah, but if they're not willing to share, then there's really no solution other than killing every last person. I feel that Israel has more to blame since they basically tell the Palestinians to get out but then they have nowhere else to go. Can't they just divide the land in half and live happily ever after? "Hell no, because it's my God given land and you better stay the hell off it!" (Both sides actually, claiming it's their land) Which is why I don't really care for this whole conflict since it's caused by arrogant people who aren't able to see the bigger picture. The only sympathy I have are for the Palestinians as they're the underdog who are fighting Israel with the superior army/equipment.

The big question is, why do they keep on fighting? Why can't they kiss and make up?

Answer: Religion says so!!! :eek:
 
What a repulsive piece of work she is. I saw an article that mentioned her earlier in the week, in the Independent...

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/why-im-on-the-brink-of-burning-my-israeli-passport-9600165.html

mister dog
Israeli's supporting a holocaust, seems their memories don't reach back very far...
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It makes you wonder if the new generation even really know their history well at all. The Israeli treatment of the Palestinians has been (often unfairly) compared to the Nazi treatment of the Jews in WW2, but people like this who advocate the killing of Palestinians en masse really make you wonder.
 
What was the response of the international community? Pretty much nothing.

Imagine an European or American politician making such a statement.
 

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