Israel - Palestine discussion thread

[Bram Turismo]

Yeah, just watch how a broke country outspends the world on their military. Funny how that happens without any money, right?

Is the military really where you want all your money to go to at this point in time, though?

 

[terminator363]

As Villain said, continue this in the 'Merica thread please.

Apparently Israel is firing from the sea now..

 

[Grayfox]

As Villain, said continue this in the 'Merica thread please.

Apparently Israel is firing from the sea now..

A war will start and the one that has most weapons and most troops wins.

Civ V proofs this.

 

[MarinaDiamandis]

A war will start and the one that has most weapons and most troops wins.

Civ V proofs this.

Israel has one of the strongest militaries in the Middle East, they may be small compared to, say, Egypt but they are much better trained and equipped than most of the Egyptian forces.

Israel could march into Gaza with few problems and give Egypt (a much bigger force) a good battering if they got involved too.

I'm expecting a repeat performance of the 2009 invasion, as Scaff said earlier.

 

[NLxAROSA]

Civ V proofs this.

Because real life works exactly like in computer games?

Israel could march into Gaza with few problems and give Egypt (a much bigger force) a good battering if they got involved too.

I doubt Egypt will do anything, especially since they are at the moment playing a primary role in negotiations to solve this in a political way.

 

[arora]

What ever came of Clinton's proposal to go back to some older borders?

 

[terminator363]

Update: BBC

"An office block used by Western media as well as a Hamas TV station was hit early on Sunday"

Well, that's not too good on Israel.

 

[arora]

Someone said 1000 years of fighting or some sort so I decided to put some perspective on the mater.

The creation of the State of Israel in 1948 was preceded by more than 50 years of efforts to establish a sovereign state as a homeland for Jews. These efforts were initiated by Theodore Herzl, founder of the Zionist movement, and were given added impetus by the Balfour Declaration of 1917, which asserted the British Government's support for the creation of a Jewish homeland in Palestine.

In the years following World War I, Palestine became a British Mandate and Jewish immigration steadily increased, as did violence between Palestine's Jewish and Arab communities. Mounting British efforts to restrict this immigration were countered by international support for Jewish national aspirations following the near-extermination of European Jewry by the Nazis during World War II. This support led to the 1947 UN partition plan, which would have divided Palestine into separate Jewish and Arab states, with Jerusalem under UN administration.

On May 14, 1948, soon after the British quit Palestine, the State of Israel was proclaimed and was immediately invaded by armies from neighboring Arab states, which rejected the UN partition plan. This conflict, Israel's War of Independence, was concluded by armistice agreements between Israel, Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, and Syria in 1949 and resulted in a 50% increase in Israeli territory...

Taken from here

http://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3581.htm

May or may not be the most accurate account and could be leaving some things out 👍

 

[Grayfox]

Because real life works exactly like in computer games?

During war in CIV V.

I invade from all side and put an end to the nation that starts a war with me.

 

[Dennisch]

During war in CIV V.

I invade from all side and put an end to the nation that starts a war with me.

And I can take a .50 cal. to the chest and continue the fight.

 

[Grayfox]

And I can take a .50 cal. to the chest and continue the fight.

I use Panzers, their rounds are bigger than a 50 cal.

 

[Blitz24]

I use Panzers, their rounds are bigger than a 50 cal.

How often are your wars fought against crudely designed ICBMs?

 

[Grayfox]

Were those not the missiles the U.S was cry about then N.Korea were making them.

 

[Joel]

Enough about nukes. It's not going to happen.

 

[Furinkazen]

Any nuke in the Arab area's will just cause a major-ass regional war that will result in US and UK going in sending troops in a "oh we are saving our own asses here" camraderie in something that isn't to do with us whilst it mothballs towards a WWIII.

Seems a bit slap dash and dismissive, but thats just my attitude of western governments who like jumping in at every oppurtunity. Beside middle east has enough turmoil with Iraq, Egypt, Tunisia, Afghanistan, and Syria all in varying degrees of uproar at one point, whether it be political or war.

 

[arora]

Seems a bit slap dash and dismissive, but thats just my attitude of western governments who like jumping in at every oppurtunity. Beside middle east has enough turmoil with Iraq, Egypt, Tunisia, Afghanistan, and Syria all in varying degrees of uproar at one point, whether it be political or war.

The U.S. policies on the mater are dictated by aipac, just ask Nancy Pelosi

 

[a6m5]

Any nuke in the Arab area's will just cause a major-ass regional war that will result in US and UK going in sending troops in a "oh we are saving our own asses here" camraderie in something that isn't to do with us whilst it mothballs towards a WWIII.

Seems a bit slap dash and dismissive, but thats just my attitude of western governments who like jumping in at every oppurtunity. Beside middle east has enough turmoil with Iraq, Egypt, Tunisia, Afghanistan, and Syria all in varying degrees of uproar at one point, whether it be political or war.

I hear this way too often. I think this is similar to how some Americans label their own country as imperialists, but conveniently ignores the perks that comes by being the powerful nation that are in fact plugged into all sorts of resources from around the world.

From conflicts in Asia to Middle East, I routinely hear(or read on gtplanet) how U.S. shouldn't get involved, then they go out and vote Republican or Democrat, do countless activities that uses material & energy made available because of the political stability provided by the United States(imperialistic) Military.

Sort of related, on the news, they repeatedly talks about how the economy has returned to normal, or how it could recover. I have doubts that it can, at least in my lifetime. These "resources" we fight for, with force, or politically, they have been much harder to come by since countries like China, India has started their surge. We have just one pie(resources on this planet), they might grow slightly larger, or slightly smaller, but we still have to share this one pie. Developed nations want to keep all the goodies like TV in every room, two car garage, etc., you get the idea. But as long as we are dependent on steel, oil, same old resources that comes with limited availability, 1) I think the economy will show limited improvement 2) U.S. will have its' scuffles around the world. Militarily, or politically.

P.S. I don't want to give impression that I'm above voting Republican or Democrat, TVs, PS3/X360, etc., etc. I can't vote(not a citizen), but I am those everything else.

 

[sumbrownkid]

America is stuck with world issues ever since WWII and it's not gonna change anytime soon.

Israel however, has been told by Obama to basically chill out on the invasion thing because it can spiral out of control.

Gaza is the hornet's nest, so to speak.

 

[a6m5]

America is stuck with world issues ever since WWII and it's not gonna change anytime soon.

Israel however, has been told by Obama to basically chill out on the invasion thing because it can spiral out of control.

Gaza is the hornet's nest, so to speak.

Yeah, I honestly don't know what Israeli should do. If this was happening in my home country(Japan), or where I live(U.S.), I'd say definitely retaliate. They are firing rockets at civilians. That needs to stop. Now. However, we are talking about the cluster 🤬 called the Middle East. Things are not remotely close to being simple.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Well one thing that's on the good news front, Egypt thinks the negotiations will produce a truce soon. 👍

In other news, A UN attack chopper attacked rebels in the Congo.

When did the UN started getting attack choppers?

 

[arora]

I hear this way too often. I think this is similar to how some Americans label their own country as imperialists, but conveniently ignores the perks that comes by being the powerful nation that are in fact plugged into all sorts of resources from around the world.

This is true, it's also why I consider my conservative views above the two party system. What do I know though, I never thought expanding governments raping resources would be considered conservative lol.

I saw a soccer mom once in a giant suv, with of course the bumper sticker "no blood for oil" I often wonder how she feels about oil exploration in Alaska.

 

[Furinkazen]

When did the UN started getting attack choppers?

For when peacekeeping fails?

 

[sumbrownkid]

For when peacekeeping fails?

Seems like a legit bargaining tool though.

 

[Blitz24]

Well one thing that's on the good news front, Egypt thinks the negotiations will produce a truce soon. 👍

In other news, A UN attack chopper attacked rebels in the Congo.

When did the UN started getting attack choppers?

How can they afford them is the better question.

For when peacekeeping fails?

Then honestly I'm surprised its taken them 65 years to first use one (as far as I can remember). The UN hasn't accomplished much in terms of peacekeeping as of late.

 

[Furinkazen]

Seems like a legit bargaining tool though.

Well attack helicopters get sent in, UN are hardly to be taken as great peacekeepers after this?

"We'll organise a ceasefire so no-one gets hurt... or we'll join in by attacking you...

 

[ExigeEvan]

Well attack helicopters get sent in, UN are hardly to be taken as great peacekeepers after this?

"We'll organise a ceasefire so no-one gets hurt... or we'll join in by attacking you...

The UN's priority isn't to stand in the middle shouting' calm down, calm down' like a rare pacifist Scouser, but to defend civilians from both sides of the conflict. This is often done by stopping the conflicting parties from attacking each other, but should one attack the UN or civilians the force will be used.

And of course the helicopters are supplied by member nations. But bare in mine an attack helicopter to the press is anything from and an apache to a 30 yr old Huey with a light machine gun in the door.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Well the one in the Congo was a Hind-D...

 

[Tornado]

A Hind-D!?


Quick, hide the F16s!

 

[Duman079]

This fire always gets oiled up when we are going towards winter ( northern area of the world ). Always the same problems.

People wonder why the world watches the civilians in Syria get murdered, people helped Libya within a year when they had a civil war. The world helped a lot of countries with certain groups having a war in their country in a matter of time.

Ever since the US gave Israel the ground of Palestina, for over 40 years, people have died in the same way as those who died in syria and libya. Why does no one help them ? Innocent children on both sides are grown up and learnt to hate eachother and if needed kill eachother. Israel needs to learn a lesson, they assasined innocent turkish people who were transporting goods from charity to Gaza. I always thought that the US were freedom fighters, but they never-ever say or do anything to Isreal. This makes no sence at all.


Sorry if this is too offensive, but talking about nukes is increadibly stupid imo . A nuke would cause Israel to get in war with Iran and probably with Turkey as well. The Israelian army is incredibly strong and should not be underestimated, they dont need a nuke to win a war.

Me, as a turk, hope that everyone will live in Palestina/Israel peacefully, just like they did after Salaheddin conquered Jeruzalem and they shared the holy grounds.

 

[a6m5]

This fire always gets oiled up when we are going towards winter ( northern area of the world ). Always the same problems.

People wonder why the world watches the civilians in Syria get murdered, people helped Libya within a year when they had a civil war. The world helped a lot of countries with certain groups having a war in their country in a matter of time.

Ever since the US gave Israel the ground of Palestina, for over 40 years, people have died in the same way as those who died in syria and libya. Why does no one help them ? Innocent children on both sides are grown up and learnt to hate eachother and if needed kill eachother. Israel needs to learn a lesson, they assasined innocent turkish people who were transporting goods from charity to Gaza. I always thought that the US were freedom fighters, but they never-ever say or do anything to Isreal. This makes no sence at all.


Sorry if this is too offensive, but talking about nukes is increadibly stupid imo . A nuke would cause Israel to get in war with Iran and probably with Turkey as well. The Israelian army is incredibly strong and should not be underestimated, they dont need a nuke to win a war.

Me, as a turk, hope that everyone will live in Palestina/Israel peacefully, just like they did after Salaheddin conquered Jeruzalem and they shared the holy grounds.

I'm no expert, and I'm sorry to hear about the Turkish casualties, but you must first understand that Israel is an U.S. ally. United States acts & sounds as though if they are World Police, but they are extremely political, like most any other nations. It's unrealistic to expect the U.S. to treat anything related to Israel without bias.

As for Israel reacting to, or retaliating to attacks, they often seem to go overboard, but having said that, I've never lived in a environment where your country is routinely attacked by military & terrorists, so I'm not really in the position to judge them.