Kaz interview on Eurogamer - Standards are here to stay! Poll added
- Thread starter Johnnypenso
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- 22,551
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- HamiltonMP427
Okay thanks for that, it's a wonder why I spent 50k on an education when I should have come to you. If you want to be rude about it, then that's fine. I was simply trying to get you to make sense of what you wrote.
Perhaps if you stated: "GT7 would probably never get close to that, let alone FM5." Because that seems to be what you mean, the rest wasn't attached correctly and you were probably trying to say that in comparison to past games GT7 will be the worse when stacked against the competition.
Rather what you wrote made it seem as though the competition wont seem as good as GT7, that is aside from PCars.
It's only been up for 15 minutes...I guess that's just ample amount of time for the mass of the community to peruse and find issue. Also most people don't read the entire threads like I tend to so even if it was longer I'm sure there are those that don't care.
I don't get what the question is, I was quite blunt about it. I don't see the point in being annoyed by me quoting you and asking you a question that you could have easily cleared up with better syntax than do this back and forth. The eyeroll was unnecessary, no one was being rude to you are saying anything bad about you. Also no one is mad?
EDIT: Also I'm not here to split hairs on grammar I actually never do, because I couldn't care less. However, I didn't understand your post and wanted you to clarify whether you thought FM5 looked bad or not. You seemed to take it as an attack.
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- Belo Horizonte
Oh, yeah? Wait until Forza 6 is released, probably before GT7, and we'll see if you'll still be saying that. I bet Forza 6 is gonna screw GT7 real hard.
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- HamiltonMP427
Can we not do this song and dance, there are threads for GT v FM. This thread has good conversation and I rather not see it closed.
What part you talking about FM in an area that doesn't need it before I even asked my question? A bit ironic to call me on it because I made a simple request, that you don't even want to clarify for me. Yeah you really know a thing or two about intellectual discussion (not really).
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- Belo Horizonte
The guy started it, and his argument was completely blank. And I'm not a Forza fan, by the way.
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- Twoclicks_ZA
It's already a good sign that GT7 won't be released this year. It'll hopefully give PD enough time to iron out any potential wrinkles. By Kaz answering questions with 'I think' probably gives a hint that further information on standards should be taken with a grain of salt.
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- HamiltonMP427
Never said you were one, just saying there are threads for this and I'm sure the mods are just waiting to close some of these threads that seem to be turning into mirrors of one another.
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My post was to those above me who said Forza has done more which I find funny because GT6 is doing stuff on PS3 that Forza could not manage to do on a new hardware 
So keeping this under consideration. GT7 on PS4, they should be well ahead. Moreover Polyphony are really good in gfx in spite of PS3 gpu and split ram as bottleneck. On PS4 they will be more comfortable.
So keeping this under consideration. GT7 on PS4, they should be well ahead. Moreover Polyphony are really good in gfx in spite of PS3 gpu and split ram as bottleneck. On PS4 they will be more comfortable.
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- MHFanatik
Forza also does stuff that GT 5/6 never managed to do, like locked 60 fps and smooth shadowsMy post was to those above me who said Forza has done more which I find funny because GT6 is doing stuff on PS3 that Forza could not manage to do on a new hardware
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- iResurrectionz
Can you provide a source on who, within the walls of T10/Microsoft, said dynamic weather/time can't done with Forza on X1?
Oh and, Forza Horizon 2.....
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- Twoclicks_ZA
Dude I get what you are saying, but please for the sake of this thread, don't try and swing it into a comparison with a game on a rival platform. If you read my above comment, and looked at the interview, there should be plenty of time for PD to implement standards in an acceptable way. It's not getting released this year so nothing is set in stone yet with your regards to how people should react to standards.My post was to those above me who said Forza has done more which I find funny because GT6 is doing stuff on PS3 that Forza could not manage to do on a new hardware
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- MHFanatik
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- TheLordSnowden
- LordSnowden
Forza uses baked shadows and the "dynamic" shadows are layered alphas of black. The banding is clearly visible. They do this to cover up detail they can't show like suspension and blacking out most of the bottom of the cars. It's a very old 90's tech solution but to their credit, they do it well enough to be convicting.Forza also does stuff that GT 5/6 never managed to do, like locked 60 fps and smooth shadows
GT 5's hard shadows was some serous tech and even with its flaws it added tremendous amounts of depth. They could have done softer shadows in GT 5 (like they did with 6) but they chose not too. Its a leading reason GT 6 does not look as good as 5 did. Soft shadows are for objects that are far from surfaces like tree branches etc. not for objects that are close to surfaces... When there is a direct light source like the sun or a spot light. Cloudy or hazy then soft shadows are fine as there is a lose of luminosity.
Anyway, Forza has not overhauled their engine since 1, just adding to it. And it's age even shows on next gen. The next iteration of Forza? After Horizon 2? That might be impressive but currently GT is a real technical achievement, clearly not with all the bells and whistles not turned on, that it nearly excusing all lateness over the years.
Btw, I'm a huge Forza 4 fan... Many many more hours than GT 5, but I've been playing GT since GT 1.
This is 7yrs ago and they were ahead of the competition what makes you think on PS4 they can't do the same again
Let us wait for next year E3. The car models are already very good. But they can improve it and more detailed cockpits for sure. HQ shadows grand stand full of crowd. They can put so much detail in GT7. GT6 they already achieved so much with a gimped gpu, a powerful cpu and split ram. PS4 is balanced console so it should be rather easy for them.
...and then they'll bring that whole quality down by including PS2 assets, like creating a 5* dish then garnishing it with turd sprinkles.
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- Twoclicks_ZA
If PD try to update ALL of them that require updating (interiors, full adaptive tessellation notwithstanding.) and slate a 2015 release, then that is worrying. The PS4's hardware might be easier to work with than the Cell, but it's not like some sort of magic machine where standards go in, premiums come out. With the work required, I'm beginning to fear there will be inevitable delays...
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- Peg193
As it seems that Standards are in, ill wait and see before buying. As long as the ai and sounds are mostly useless, I am not buying before they are fixed. The Standard cars mean that they have really nail the rest of the Game. I understand that some People want to keep Standards but I don't care about cars such as Honda Fit and Other shopping carts. And the most important Standards could be premiumized. But as I Like Racing close wheeled Race cars mostly, there is lot of People who wants Race With every day cars and everyone should accept that People have different opinions. Big car count is Better for street car Racing. Many People says that GT7 should not have Standards because other games doesnt but why GT7 should be similar to All other games? And for me the only Real problem With Standard cars is the lack of modelled interiors because I Race always in cocpit wiew. After All, People who have too big issue With it, don't buy GT7. It may not be game for You, I realized that it might be that pcars is Better for me With focus on Race cars and realism. It is ok to give constructive criticism but the endless complaining is ridiculous.
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- MHFanatik
I might surprise you but every current engine is an evolution of a company's previous engine, I bet you Uncharted 4 uses some bits of code dating back to Crash Bandicoot on PS1 and it's virtually the same for all developers. Making a brand new engine entirely from scratch, like legit starting with a blank page isn't financially nor technically feasible these days, you can update and enhance the rendering engine for example, but there's absolute zero need to rewrite animation, sound or UI portions of the engine, so you don't touch that and keep it as is. And this approach isn't bad though it might sound like it, modern engines are built to be modular so you can modify a certain element of the engine without breaking other elements. GT6/7 is at its very basic core is the same engine they used for GT1 on PS1, but obviously a lot has been built on top of it, so now the GT1 engine that once was 100% of their codebase might make up something like 5% of their engine. These rules apply for almost any developer that's been developing a franchise for a number of years. But of course there are other examples like Ninja Theory that had a proprietary engine for Heavenly Sword made exclusively for PS3, but for their later games like DmC and Enslaved they switched to UE3 which allowed them to go multi platform without having to spend a lot of money and effort to make their own engine compatible with 360 and PC.
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- TPC_Raccooon23
- CRaccoon23
PD will never be able to please everyone. Congratulations on pointing out something every video game company goes through. It's not news that not everyone will be happy with certain decisions. But poor PD, right? Go over to the official Forza forums and let me know if T10 isn't dealing with the same situation from their fans.
In addition, I don't think your car count example is a good way to point out double standards. You know why people expect hundreds of cars from GT but are okay if another racing game doesn't even have 100? Because ever since GT2, PD set that standard for themselves to have that many cars in a racing game, so of course that's what people expect from them. Why would you have the same expectations from a highly successful racing game series that's been around 15 years and then have equal expectations from another racing game series that's just starting out?
If my response makes me a "professional GT hater", then so be it. I wouldn't be playing GT at all if that were the case, so I don't really care. Have fun being "right".
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- MHFanatik
Actually another interesting point is how GT7 going to treat gamers that play with a controller since Sony got rid of analog face buttons in DS4? I've heard Kaz normally plays with face buttons when a wheel isn't available.
Also all of the Logitech wheels are pretty much useless now. I guess this gen will make everyone switch to Thrustmaster
Also all of the Logitech wheels are pretty much useless now. I guess this gen will make everyone switch to Thrustmaster
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Compared to other next gen racing games, this is completely baffling.
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- HamiltonMP427
Though I agree with this part here, the people who complain on these topics are different. A person that might take issue to the first point isn't going to take issue to the second. As for the final point both sides will do that as seen with GT5. Especially if there is merit like...saying I'll release it this date but having to cancel that as has been said for years.
I think many people want to see PD do better than the previous game, it's when arguments arise that PD can't do a certain thing that some newer or not as well established group can do that it becomes an issue. You then see comparisons and what not. Also I'm not sure what you're getting at with the number of cars in Project Cars to GT, because those I've seen mainly for PCars (for example @Johnnypenso ) would rather see a more trimmed down GT or a revamp. So I dont get the double standard, what you're doing is describing two different set of values for two sets of opposing views and placing it all on the one view you don't like.
Also it's a bit of a knee jerk to be this irritated and then claim that "those demanding more are fans...no they're not"...
Man I wish I could be a professional GT Hater it must pay something (joking here).
Also does me responding to you mean I'm hellbent? Since one I'm just trying to understand your position better and clarify, but you seemed to try and put people in a box and claim victory...which is as bad as those you claim will respond because they too think they're infallible.
On a side note I found it funny of a couple people who liked your post (not that they don't have the right to).
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- GTP_SEMS
Actually another interesting point is how GT7 going to treat gamers that play with a controller since Sony got rid of analog face buttons in DS4? I've heard Kaz normally plays with face buttons when a wheel isn't available.
Also all of the Logitech wheels are pretty much useless now. I guess this gen will make everyone switch to Thrustmaster
Not everyone will switch to a wheel that Expensive, Sony and Logitech better come up with a solution. Now that is a game breaker for me.
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Ugh, useless poll!
EDIT: I think I'm tripping over the wording. I won't buy GT7 utterly "regardless", but I can't see standards being much of a detractor. I also can't see what reviews can do in this particular case when they are almost a pure aesthetics issue for most: screenshots.
EDIT: I think I'm tripping over the wording. I won't buy GT7 utterly "regardless", but I can't see standards being much of a detractor. I also can't see what reviews can do in this particular case when they are almost a pure aesthetics issue for most: screenshots.
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- diegorborges82
Removing the standards won't raise the number of premiums.
Keep the standards as a bonus, just don't make them mandatory to the whole career of the game and we're good. If I'm not mistaken you can do the whole career of GT6 without touching standards, is that right?
Again, even if they are bad for the consistency, (and I really hope they keep updating them) they are important for those who like it. Bring the used car dealer back as a "Gran Turismo Memorial Dealership" and put those there!
Once it was said that Gran Turismo is like a car encyclopedia... it makes sense since GT2, the "good times" for most of us. People that still see it as a simple car/racing game need to think again.
Keep the standards as a bonus, just don't make them mandatory to the whole career of the game and we're good. If I'm not mistaken you can do the whole career of GT6 without touching standards, is that right?
Again, even if they are bad for the consistency, (and I really hope they keep updating them) they are important for those who like it. Bring the used car dealer back as a "Gran Turismo Memorial Dealership" and put those there!
Once it was said that Gran Turismo is like a car encyclopedia... it makes sense since GT2, the "good times" for most of us. People that still see it as a simple car/racing game need to think again.
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