Metal Gear Solid V: Ground Zeroes/The Phantom Pain

[prisonermonkeys]

there would be ways discovered in how to infiltrate Camp Omega in the main mission to obtain the best time.

It sounds like something Kojima would do. He intends for this to be the prologue to THE PHANTOM PAIN, and that THE PHANTOM PAIN will be the series' first open-world game. Assuming that the prologue concept applies to more than just the story, but also to the game mechanics, it makes no sense for there to be just one way into Camp Omega. I imagine that there would be several ways in with varying degrees of difficulty.

 

[Sanji Himura]

It sounds like something Kojima would do. He intends for this to be the prologue to THE PHANTOM PAIN, and that THE PHANTOM PAIN will be the series' first open-world game. Assuming that the prologue concept applies to more than just the story, but also to the game mechanics, it makes no sense for there to be just one way into Camp Omega. I imagine that there would be several ways in with varying degrees of difficulty.

And the rewards would be there to give players an incentive to take those risks. For example, if you turn off your HUD and go through Ground Zeros mission, you can achieve a trophy based on time and skill.

 

[sesselpupser]

So Konami hosted an event yesterday or today (or both, it is Japan after all) for the world's gaming press to play Ground Zeroes. Here's the first link Konami UK has tweeted about their opinions: http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02...ot-camp-not-a-two-hour-game-best-stealth-yet/

Now, obviously this has been shared by Konami so it's going to be positive, but there are some objective facts in there:

- Soldiers have unique faces (oooh)
- Objects make noise when they're knocked over (ahhh)
- One guy finished it in 90 minutes, but that was 9% completion of the whole game
- Another played for 4 hours and achieved 10%
- PS4 version is noticeably better than the Xbox One, PS3/X360 versions weren't played at the event...

Then there's another link from the same site: http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02...ely-prettier-xbox-one-fine-more-info-surface/

It makes no difference to me, as I've said before I'm a massive Metal Gear Solid fanboy who will buy anything Kojima Productions is responsible for (note: I think that safely excludes The Twin Snakes?) so I was always going to buy Ground Zeroes. I'm glad there seems to be a lot of replay value, though.

 

[F1 fan]

(note: I think that safely excludes The Twin Snakes?)

Of course. TTS was developed by Silicon Knights. I doubt Kojima and his team had much input. While on the subject, we can rule out the NES port of "Metal Gear" and "Snake's revenge". I do acknowledge Ghost babel as it was great.

As for me, this has went from a maybe to a day one buy based on the recent info and the fact that the ps4 version is only ¥2,480 (£14.58) in Japan. I doubt it will have English support as the majority of JP retail Konami games don't, but I can watch the cutscenes on YouTube and buy an English language copy when the price is right.

 

[sesselpupser]

Of course. TTS was developed by Silicon Knights. I doubt Kojima and his team had much input. While on the subject, we can rule out the NES port of "Metal Gear" and "Snake's revenge". I do acknowledge Ghost babel as it was great.

Well TTS was produced by Kojima, so it could be that he's ultimately responsible for what happened to it, but that's why I said Kojima Productions and not Hideo Kojima himself! And yeah, Ghost Babel was great. It was the only game I ever played on my Gameboy Advance, I didn't mind having most of the cartridge poking up above the screen because it was so good, full of typical Hideo Kojima attention to detail and style.

I say this every time a new Metal Gear Solid game is due to be released (or re-released), but I honestly fully intend to play through the series again (in release order rather than chronological) in time for Ground Zeroes. Only five weeks to go now...

 

[F1 fan]

Well TTS was produced by Kojima, so it could be that he's ultimately responsible for what happened to it, but that's why I said Kojima Productions and not Hideo Kojima himself!

Maybe I'm just being cynical, but producer is quite an ambiguous title. As this game was made in Canada and released only six months before Snake Eater, it's likely that his involvement was minimal.

 

[Sanji Himura]

Maybe I'm just being cynical, but producer is quite an ambiguous title. As this game was made in Canada and released only six months before Snake Eater, it's likely that his involvement was minimal.

Still, many regard Twin Snakes as the better version of MGS even though it is easier. I regret selling my copy.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Still, many regard Twin Snakes as the better version of MGS even though it is easier. I regret selling my copy.

I'm not sure I can say that with full confidence. Some of the cutscenes in the Twin Snakes with all that Matrix stuff was just wrong imo.

The gameplay was better though with the addition of MGS2 elements.

 

[F1 fan]

Still, many regard Twin Snakes as the better version of MGS even though it is easier.

That implies that a majority prefer TTS to the original. In my experience (and I used to be part of a large online MGS community), there are a few people who adamantly believe it is better whilehe majority prefer the original. And for good reason too. TTS contained new gameplay elements from mgs2, coupled with the same enemy patrols from mgs1. It was far too easy. And don't get me started on those cutscenes. And I regret selling my copy too. I sold it for a pittance without realizing that it actually sells for a fairly high price.

 

[Sanji Himura]

That implies that a majority prefer TTS to the original. In my experience (and I used to be part of a large online MGS community), there are a few people who adamantly believe it is better whilehe majority prefer the original. And for good reason too. TTS contained new gameplay elements from mgs2, coupled with the same enemy patrols from mgs1. It was far too easy. And don't get me started on those cutscenes. And I regret selling my copy too. I sold it for a pittance without realizing that it actually sells for a fairly high price.

TTS is more cinematic, and the gameplay is much too easy, I will concede that, however, that is half its charm, especially when you consider that David Hayter gave up his salary for TTS to have the majority of the original voice cast from MGS to reprise their roles. The superior voice acting is why I personally think that TTS is better than the original.

In Ground Zeros news, here are more impressions from other members of the media from Konami's shindig. One even comes right out and says that Game Informer was wrong:

 

[F1 fan]

The superior voice acting is why I personally think that TTS is better than the original.

In what way is TTS' voice acting superior? Perhaps you prefer it, but that doesn't make it superior. IMO, the only thing superior about TTS are the graphics.

It all boils down to a matter of opinion, but TTS is generally ignored by the metal gear community.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Well Konami has held a bootcamp for previewers, and apparently they were gushing over it.

http://www.metalgearinformer.com/?p=12511

The PS4 version has also been touted the best, but really seeing Kojima is Japanese, and Japan is the land of Playstation and Nintendo, we all saw that coming.

That said, March 18th cannot come quick enough.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

“Get Ground Zeroes on PS4, not XB1. Way better visuals, frame rate, everything… I believe @HIDEO_KOJIMA_EN said so himself.”

“The PS4 version of Ground Zeroes is gorgeous. Quite a lot better looking than the Xbox One version, too… controversy…”

“Btw, the frame rate is butter smooth on PS4.”

“So here’s the thing: I finished the main mission in 2h. Back to the main menu, it said that I completed 8% of the game. So yeah.”

“After completing the main mission and a side mission in 4 hours the game says I’m at 10% completion. Sounds good to me.”

“You really are free to take on the same objective in many ways. Many different ways to be really awesome.”

“Listening to sounds and guards conversations can totally change a mission sometimes. Very cool.”

Not bad ...

 

[PletdeKoe]

Can't wait!

 

[F1 fan]

The PS4 version has also been touted the best, but really seeing Kojima is Japanese, and Japan is the land of Playstation and Nintendo, we all saw that coming.

So why isn't there a Nintendo version? And why isn't he praising that version too? The PS4 is either slightly more powerful or vastly more powerful than the X1 depending on who you listen to. I'm going with the former. Either way, the multi platform face offs have proven that it is a more capable machine.

 

[sumbrownkid]

So why isn't there a Nintendo version? And why isn't he praising that version too? The PS4 is either slightly more powerful or vastly more powerful than the X1 depending on who you listen to. I'm going with the former. Either way, the multi platform face offs have proven that it is a more capable machine.

It's probably because the Wii U has paltry numbers compared to the other consoles.

 

[wicken]

Konami just posted some comparison pictures between all platforms (video is coming soon).

Comparison Screens (PS3 vs PS4)

Improvements on PS4 version:

Improvements on PS4 version:

Comparison Screens (Xbox 360 vs Xbox One)

Improvements on Xbox One version:

Improvements on Xbox One version:

 

[Ellis]

Nice comparison that. Although I would like to see a Xbox 1 vs PS4 comparison in a real time video. To see how it deals with dynamic events and moving lighting.

 

[sumbrownkid]

They all look fantastic.

 

[Omnis]

It's probably because the Wii U has paltry numbers compared to the other consoles.

Wii U has sold like boxed cancer.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I get the impression that Kojima really wants us to slow down and think about what we are doing. In previous games, it was easy to simply figure out the patrol routes of guards, then time your movement to take advantage of the situation. I am reminded of the Tanker Chapter in "Sons of Liberty" when you could run down a corridor when a guard's back was turned, slip into a locker before he turned back, then wait until he walks away to get by. Granted, it was a tutorial mission, but as a general rule, there was only one entrance and one exit to the area. I don't mind the occasional bottle-neck, but I also like the ability to think laterally - like when you break into the Granin Design Bureau in "Snake Eater".

This time, I imagine that Kojima will want us to be aware of how we fit into the game world, and how our actions might have consequences ten, thirty or sixty minutes from now.

 

[F1 fan]

It's probably because the Wii U has paltry numbers compared to the other consoles.

That is true. However, the point I was trying to make is that saying it looks better on Playstation because Kojima is Japanese and Sony is a Japanese company is ridiculous. For a start, the Playstation is just that little bit more powerful. Secondly, not everyone subscribes to the tiresome "my country is better than other countries" belief.

 

[sumbrownkid]

Oh I didn't mean that at all. I'm coming from the fact that since the Xbox brand is virtually non-existent compared to Sony, let alone Nintendo, in Japan it's not surprising that his team put more effort into the PS4 version. Besides, his games, even when they were on Xbox and were seen as superior in terms of performance, sold a lot more on Sony Playstations systems.

The MGS collection I believe sold more on the PS3 than the Xbox 360.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I agree. While the manufacturers still compete in sales figures, the days of the console wars are largely over. They have established their market share, and so exclusive deals for major franchises are not really viable unless there is a rival franchise - like Gran Turismo and Forza - on the other console. To take the exclusivity arrangement means willingly giving up on half your potential market for the sake of a slightly bigger production budget, which puts more pressure on a game to sell because it needs to break even.

If the PS4 version looks better than the Xbox One version, it is because Hideo Kojima has always pushed consoles to their limits, and in this case, he can push the PS4 further.

 

[F1 fan]

Oh I didn't mean that at all.

Okay. Sorry I misunderstood. I've been ill recently, therefore I'm even grumpier than usual.

I'm coming from the fact that since the Xbox brand is virtually non-existent compared to Sony, let alone Nintendo, in Japan it's not surprising that his team put more effort into the PS4 version.

I'm not so sure. I don't think there's a single multiplatform game for PS4 and XBO that runs better on XBO. Microsoft have tried to keep info like this under wraps for as long as possible. It's possible Kojima just wanted to break the trend and tell the truth. After all, the customer is always right in Japan.

Besides, his games, even when they were on Xbox and were seen as superior in terms of performance, sold a lot more on Sony Playstations systems.

The MGS collection I believe sold more on the PS3 than the Xbox 360.

Since the 5th console generation, the metal gear series has enjoyed near exclusivity on playstation systems. Sure, MGS1 was ported to the PC, MGS2 eventually found its way to PC and Xbox, but it wasn't until a generation later that MGS3 found its way to MS. Then there's MGS4, PO and PO2 which were exclusives to Sony machines. Peace walker found its way to MS quicker, but it still took a while.

With that in mind, I remember a video I watched on IGN a while ago, where one of the editors theorized that even temporary exclusivity to one platform tends to make that platform the go to console for the franchise. Look at Mass effect and Demon's/Dark souls for example. The editor theorized that titanfall will always be considered mainly an Xbox game as the first game is exclusive to MS devices/Software. Then again, if the Xbone doesn't catch up to the sales of the PS4, it might not make much of a difference in this case.

 

[Ridox2JZGTE]

Konami just posted some comparison pictures between all platforms (video is coming soon).

PS4 1080p 60fps, and Xbone only 720p 60fps, the resolution difference is quite big margin IMO, and I also read that PS4 still managed to have butter smooth fps compared to Xbone. This is happening early in life of both console, not sure how Xbone will be able to keep pace when the devs have matured and able to extract the most of the hardware.

 

[Sanji Himura]

I've also noticed something else. Because the PS4 is scaled to 1080p, the comparisons between the 360 and the XBO is nearly identical graphically. Let's do some comparisons:

As you can see, there is virtually no difference between the 360 and the XBO versions compared to the PS4. It is sort of like seeing through a filthy milk glass that you let out for an hour or two. And all of that was from running the games in different resolutions.

To point the discussion in another way, it is sort of like how a fighter gets ported to non-native hardware. You naturally are going bugs into the game code because of the hardware.

It is clear by these shots that the game is optimized for 1080p at 60fps. Sure, we could throw around numbers to the contrary, but as we all know going into this gen, this was the first major test of the hardware going into 2014, and by all indications, it seems confirmed that the PS4 is one of the more powerful machines this generation.

 

[Akira AC]

Seems to be worth getting on PS4.

Then again, MGS4 was pretty impressive on the PS3 given the hardware that it had.


1080p vs 720p is a big difference, specially on FHD monitors, to have a better example of it you would have to imagine the difference between playing F1 2013 at 720p res in a computer and then playing it again at 1080p in the same computer, if it's a good card the difference will be ... pretty much almost a gen leap forward.

Frames might not matter that much, but resolution does, and now with 1080p becoming standard for almost everything I'm glad I choose to the PS4, even if there is nothing that interest me there yet.


Now, the gen price ... it better be at least 20 hours to get 100%.

 

[prisonermonkeys]

I think people are making far too much of the issue. The game might look fantastic on the PS4, but it still looks great on the 360 and One, and so long as it doesn't detract from the gameplay, it's not an issue at all.

Honestly, I think there is still a demographic of hardcore fans out there who are very protective of the series given its history of exclusivity on Sony hardware. This is the first MGS game (MGRR was more of a side-story than anything) that has been simultaneously released on each of the major consoles, and given the twenty-year relationship between the Solid and Naked story arcs, I think they are trying to convince themselves that GZ/TPP was made for the PS4 first and tweaked to fit Microsoft consoles, rather than both being made together to be released together.

Seriously, get over it. Haven't we got better things to argue about?

 

[sumbrownkid]

Gametrailers has a comparison video up for all versions, though I personally think the comparison video could use a better media player.

http://www.gametrailers.com/videos/...d-v--ground-zeroes-console-quality-comparison

From what I can see, they all look the same pretty much, except the PS4 has better lighting and resolution.