Will GT7 Get Left behind when Forza Motorsports 8 hits the Market?

[A Night Away]

Besides, there's really no excuse for people on this forum to dogmatically stick to Blue Team or Green Team like this is 2011 again, and people will get medals for their service to either franchise.

Assetto Corsa runs on a 1050, and there's already one Italian guy who's made a career mode mod that's significantly more in tune with what people actually want in a career mode compared to what Kaz has continually pushed out for close to two decades. One could start there.

 

[Beezer215]

I mean, I'm not interested in PD's NFT simulator either; but that doesn't mean much for Turn 10's alienating announced changes to their game structure.



Like, you can just not buy games. Just because GT7 has been designed to be Genshin Impact with cars doesn't mean you have to buy Forza 8.

Right but we're comparing the 2. But you're right, neither are necessary. My personal interests are in something to pop some tops and a gummy and get into something not too serious with a career structure you can follow. Something that gives you things to do. Everything doesn't have to be an rF2 serious hour long race although I completely enjoy those for what they offer in immersion. If I find that FM(2023) has nothing more to offer than GT7, which I find somewhat hard to believe, I'll walk away.

 

[Techlet]

Like, you can just not buy games. Just because GT7 has been designed to be Genshin Impact with cars doesn't mean you have to buy Forza 8.

I don't think it's fair to compare GT7 to a free to play mobile game.

Not when Genshin has meaty content updates on a regular schedule designed to keep players engaged right through to the next update with a road map of upcoming content that's openly communicated to the players.

 

[A Night Away]

I don't think it's fair to compare GT7 to a free to play mobile game.

Not when Genshin has meaty content updates on a regular schedule designed to keep players engaged right through to the next update with a road map of upcoming content that's openly communicated to the players.

I legitimately wonder who is worse in terms of pushing out updates: Polyphony or Infinity Ward. Infinity Ward straight up tells the community to pound sand after lulling them with what they want to hear - Polyphony straight up doesn't bother with anything, and believes that it is correct to communicate entirely in smoke signals and silhouette posts on Kaz's Twitter account.

 

[UKMikey]

Right but we're comparing the 2. But you're right, neither are necessary. My personal interests are in something to pop some tops and a gummy and get into something not too serious with a career structure you can follow. Something that gives you things to do. Everything doesn't have to be an rF2 serious hour long race although I completely enjoy those for what they offer in immersion. If I find that FM(2023) has nothing more to offer than GT7, which I find somewhat hard to believe, I'll walk away.

This is exactly it. If you find a game mode alienating then you won't want to buy or play the game. Not everyone is going to be alienated though. Perhaps divisive would be a fairer term.

I'm going to give the new Forza a chance and see whether driving a car stock for a couple of hours before upgrading it makes me more attached to each vehicle and feels more rewarding and fulfilling when I get to that point than simply slapping on the same upgrades as everyone else to make it competitive and not getting to experience what the manufacturers and game developers had in mind when they created the car in that form and configuration.

It's something to do. Hopefully it won't become boring.

 

[UKMikey]

I don't think it's fair to compare GT7 to a free to play mobile game.

Not when Genshin has meaty content updates on a regular schedule designed to keep players engaged right through to the next update with a road map of upcoming content that's openly communicated to the players.

Obligatory Apollos Hester pic:

 

[SU_Tempest]

This is exactly it. If you find a game mode alienating then you won't want to buy or play the game. Not everyone is going to be alienated though. Perhaps divisive would be a fairer term.

I'm going to give the new Forza a chance and see whether driving a car stock for a couple of hours before upgrading it makes me more attached to each vehicle and feels more rewarding and fulfilling when I get to that point than simply slapping on the same upgrades as everyone else to make it competitive and not getting to experience what the manufacturers and game developers had in mind when they created the car in that form and configuration.

It's something to do. Hopefully it won't become boring.

I'm of the opinion it's time for the end of the era of getting a car and immediately engine/drivetrain swapping it with over 1000 HP. If the new FM is gonna be about the cars and making you appreciate each one, then conceptually, they couldn't have come up with a better idea.

In practice is where everything hinges on. Before even playing FM I can tell that the general idea is to learn the car, which means drive it a lot. As obvious as it might sound, it's actually really, really, really important they nail the incentives to drive.

I'm sure Turn 10 knows their audience and knows what Forza players are usually like up until now, I'm sure they realize swapping cars like you change shirts - sometimes 10 times in an hour - is completely normal and sort-of encouraged, given the Festival Playlist format of the last two Forza-branded titles.

The fact that conceptually, FM wants Forza players to change their habits is the real, actual test. If they succeed, if it's as good as it looks in the Forza Monthlies and the trailers, we just might have one of the most interesting racing games of this generation and it might deserve to be called a reboot. But if they don't, if leveling is too easy, and players can go right back to their usual antics within a few hours, then yeah, it really is just going to be FM8.

Maybe I'm overthinking the name symbolism here, but do bear with me, I think this matters.

 

[Bogie 19th]

This is like a troll thread in disguise. GT is an awesome game. Forza Motorsport is an aweseome game. Accept and enjoy both.

 

[SU_Tempest]

I don't think it is, it's not necessarily an unfair question to ask if FM will be more successful than GT7 once FM releases, taking into account how much disappointment surrounds GT7. I'm also not saying it's wrong to enjoy GT7 or think of it as an awesome game, just that the discontent is real and has been sustained.

I doubt the OP had troll intentions here (unlike some other threads in the GT7 subforum). Yes the title could certainly be worded better; "get left behind" is not what I'd have picked. But this thread is 19 pages long and I've been following it on and off, there HAS been some good discussion on the subject.

 

[Bogie 19th]

I don't think it is, it's not necessarily an unfair question to ask if FM will be more successful than GT7 once FM releases, taking into account how much disappointment surrounds GT7. I'm also not saying it's wrong to enjoy GT7 or think of it as an awesome game, just that the discontent is real and has been sustained.

I doubt the OP had troll intentions here (unlike some other threads in the GT7 subforum). Yes the title could certainly be worded better; "get left behind" is not what I'd have picked. But this thread is 19 pages long and I've been following it on and off, there HAS been some good discussion on the subject.

Outside of the MTX in GT7, I haven't had any disappointment around GT7. The only change I would have made is improved physics and a bit longer campaign. But since they continue to add cafe menus over time, that seems to help, IMO.

 

[Batschisane52]

Outside of the MTX in GT7, I haven't had any disappointment around GT7. The only change I would have made is improved physics and a bit longer campaign. But since they continue to add cafe menus over time, that seems to help, IMO.

Higher Payouts for the races would be fine or just more high payout races than those 4 we actually got...otherwise I agree(and I am actually quite happy with the actual physics the game has)

 

[SU_Tempest]

Outside of the MTX in GT7, I haven't had any disappointment around GT7. The only change I would have made is improved physics and a bit longer campaign. But since they continue to add cafe menus over time, that seems to help, IMO.

Fair enough if you're happy with it! Like I said, it's not wrong to enjoy GT7 as it stands if it's enough for you. All I'm saying is that's definitely not the case for everyone and it's important not to completely dismiss that.

 

[Nathan88]

I don't think it is, it's not necessarily an unfair question to ask if FM will be more successful than GT7 once FM releases, taking into account how much disappointment surrounds GT7. I'm also not saying it's wrong to enjoy GT7 or think of it as an awesome game, just that the discontent is real and has been sustained.

I doubt the OP had troll intentions here (unlike some other threads in the GT7 subforum). Yes the title could certainly be worded better; "get left behind" is not what I'd have picked. But this thread is 19 pages long and I've been following it on and off, there HAS been some good discussion on the subject.

There are multiple answers to GT7 being "Left behind".

On a technical level FM should have some advantages by virtue of releasing 18 months later and current-gen only. From what I've seen, it has a very clean image, but the art style & lighting are reminiscent of previous titles. GT7 looks more realistic in gameplay and replays. I'm sure FM will look better when you get the microscope out and look at trackside foliage & assets.

In terms of gameplay, who knows. T10 have talked about improved physics & AI. But again, from looking at gameplay, there are still traits of old Forza's in the way cars move on track. Career, again, down to personal preference. I like FM's use of the AI difficulty slider. But I don't like the idea of unlocking and upgrading one car at a time.

Commercially, FM isn't a big hitter, even in comparison to earlier years (1-4 in particular). I've seen little marketing from Xbox beyond official Forza channels. I get the impression Starfield will take a lot of steam out of FM's launch for the Xbox community. Since the Horizon series hit the scene it's been taking chunks out of the FM userbase, particularly casual players. MS will publish impressive Gamepass numbers, but it wouldn't surprise me if 2-year-old FH5 has more players by Christmas.

 

[UKMikey]

I'm not sure what the difference is in terms of sales between a player who plays a game on a subscription service like GamePass, decides they don't like it and moves onto something else, and someone who buys a game but only completes a small part of the overall experience and moves onto something else. Both seem like legitimate player engagement to me, however slight.

 

[Nathan88]

The difference is about £50/$60 per game for the publisher.

Subscription services, particularly in gaming, are starting to falter as people simply don't have the time to play even a fraction of the major AAA titles. So we've hit a point where gamers are prepared to download a full title (if they don't have data caps) just to try a game as an extended demo. That's a very different proposition to paying £60/$70, or even half that down the road, to pick up at retail or digitally.

I'd expect many FH5 players to at least tryout FM. But I'm not sure player retention will be particularly high.

 

[UKMikey]

If money is the absolutely overriding consideration for publishers as opposed to any kind of innovation or advancement of the genre, perhaps they should concentrate solely on emulating the best selling racing series of all time.

Unfortunately, incorporating Mario Kart mechanics in Blur didn't do Bizarre Creations much good as they folded soon afterwards...

Judging by the seemingly proportionally low rates of career completion in GT7 according to trophy stats and leaderboard sizes I wonder how many users of that platform would also have demoed the game via a subscription service instead, were this an option that was open to them.

Personally speaking, what affects my enjoyment of a game is how consistently it provides a compelling experience across all aspects of its gameplay. As an offline racer I wouldn't expect AI opponents to behave differently in different events or the rate of payout of in-game credits to vary depending on which event I was running.

If that were the case I think I'd feel corralled or shepherded towards certain races in order to earn money to progress which would limit my choice and variety in how to proceed, and dampen my overall player experience.

 

[Theufcveteran]

No one’s saying there will be PS5 Pro exclusive titles. The next GT will be built for the PS5 with PS5 Pro enhancements. PS6 is only due in 2028.

While PS4 Pro was built to deliver a better 4K image. PS5 Pro is about framerates and a big jump in RT performance. Current machines can’t deliver high quality in-game RT without big compromises to resolution & framerate.

If they can build machine learning into the hardware, allowing for a DLSS 2.0-esque system, it’d be a huge boost to performance and let devs push visuals even further without sacrificing framerates (to an extent, of course).

I would imagine you could have GT7 running at 60 FPS with RT in gameplay at 1440p, perhaps even a bit higher.

 

[UKMikey]

If they can build machine learning into the hardware, allowing for a DLSS 2.0-esque system, it’d be a huge boost to performance and let devs push visuals even further without sacrificing framerates (to an extent, of course).

I would imagine you could have GT7 running at 60 FPS with RT in gameplay at 1440p, perhaps even a bit higher.

This is similar to what we greenies are hoping they implement on FM 2023.

Scorn on Xbox Series X: our first look at AMD's FSR 2 on consoles

Scorn is one of the most visually distinctive games released in recent times. Clearly inspired by the work of HR Giger,…

www.eurogamer.net

 

[gtracedriver1]

To me it already looks better. GT7 looks meh and honestly whats holding it back is PS5 hardware. Thats why playing these racing games on a high end pc rig is king. FM7 on a high end pc rig looks better than GT7 on PS5. I play both games on a LG oled 120hz gaming baby!

Most games if not all will look better on high end PC compared to a console. GT7 was limited with PS4 but gfx wise it is still holds up pretty good. New Forza barely looks any better inspite of 6yrs of dev cycle and targetting Series consoles.

 

[UKMikey]

Sounds like they didn't spend those six years just on prettying it up. But we've barely seen the game, lol.

 

[Bilu]

Forza will have the multiplayer of GT7 (much praised) and will have a campaign that is somewhat reminiscent of the old GTs. What's left?

 

[Beezer215]

Sounds like they didn't spend those six years just on prettying it up. But we've barely seen the game, lol.

It's almost as if there's more to racing cars around than graphics.

 

[05XR8]

This is like a troll thread in disguise. GT is an awesome game. Forza Motorsport is an aweseome game. Accept and enjoy both.

I don’t feel it is. It’s more of a whinging thread due to Kaz not offering up any answers to why GT7 is the way it is. I mean, Kaz mentioned this game is be nostalgic for veteran players and it’s to introduce new players to the world of cars.
Many veteran players feel GT7 missed that mark of nostalgia, in the way the GT1-4 games are. New players are getting one of the worse(in the eyes of veteran players) of any feel of progression GT7 is offering. If the only other game to compare GT7 to, is FM(8), it’s understandable.

If GT players don’t want to jump ship, but see all the cool looking stuff Forza are bringing to the table, it’s always going to raise the questions of why can’t Kaz do those thing for players in Gran Turismo.

 

[jergto]

Most games if not all will look better on high end PC compared to a console. GT7 was limited with PS4 but gfx wise it is still holds up pretty good. New Forza barely looks any better inspite of 6yrs of dev cycle and targetting Series consoles.

Barely looks better, you need to get your eyes checked. Also the PS5 with GT7 and GT8, it is limited in HDMI bandwidth unless they release the PS5 pro with what the SX can do. PS5's hdmi 2.1 is limited to 32gbps, SX's hdmi 2.1 is limited to 40gbps. Hardware limited to begin with.

 

[RobertHammer]

Barely looks better, you need to get your eyes checked. Also the PS5 with GT7 and GT8, it is limited in HDMI bandwidth unless they release the PS5 pro with what the SX can do. PS5's hdmi 2.1 is limited to 32gbps, SX's hdmi 2.1 is limited to 40gbps. Hardware limited to begin with.

That hdmi bandwidth limitation is only with when you use 4k 120hz with HDR - it works fine just you don't get the full HDR
and i don't think HDR can fix those x360 models ...

 

[UKMikey]

That hdmi bandwidth limitation is only with when you use 4k 120hz with HDR - it works fine just you don't get the full HDR
and i don't think HDR can fix those x360 models ...

Sure, but T10 can. I think they'd rather get the game out in October though.

As for the rest of the game barely looking better:

 

[64bitmodels]

No.

Forza is PC and Xbox only. GT is Playstation only. Neither can replace either when both are on completely different platforms. Paying 500 dollars to experience Forza or gran turismo is a high barrier of entry- your purchase of platform directly locks you to which ever racer you choose.

Racing games don't have the same pull they had in the 90s or 2000s so its very unlikely they will influence console sales either.

But i'd love to see GT get their butt kicked in if not so they can focus back on good old singleplayer racing rather than the gt cafe junk

 

[jergto]

That hdmi bandwidth limitation is only with when you use 4k 120hz with HDR - it works fine just you don't get the full HDR
and i don't think HDR can fix those x360 models ...

Yea, who needs full HDR when looking at blank interiors that GT7 has for some of their cars.

 

[UKMikey]

Yea, who needs full HDR when looking at blank interiors that GT7 has for some of their cars.

Yup, turnabout is fair play.

 

[Cayit]

I am asking myself is PD getting nervous because of the FM release ...?
They should get nervous because it looks like FM will blow away GT7 in many aspects...