Disappointed !

[Gaviao_pt]

The cars handling is precisely one of the main reasons that I'm not disapointed at all with the demo - quite the opposite actually!
It's much more fun than GT5p once you get used to it.

Another interest is that there is a competition going on. And you can rank yourself within your country.
Even if it is just one track / 2 cars, you have a purpose: get the best time!

So IMO no mistake at all from PD to release this.

 

[irnbrutwinturbo]

That's a bit rich coming from somebody with an attitude themselves. You might want to think twice before asking somebody to show a little respect and then proceed to say how stupid they are (sound/are, makes no difference in context).

Are you a moderator? No, so why don't you quit with the attitude and just report the thread/poster instead of acting like you run the place?

The OP has a very valid point - the difficulty level of this time trial is ridiculous, either because they physics are so good that using a pad is a major disadvantage, or maybe, just maybe they messed up. The handling of both cars at slow speeds is woefully unrealistic. So what if this is aimed at those elite few then want to get through to the Academy. The fact is, most people (>99.9999%) will just use this as a demo of GT5 because they know they don't stand a chance against the nerds who put in countless hours of racing and practice. As such, PD and SONY just dropped the ball with this one.

First, I do have an attitude, and i'm happy enough to admit that. I don't and never have claimed to a mod.

Second, do you do realise how much of a pain it is for the mods when you press the report button? From memory, the button ends up firing outs a whole load of emails, for what? Another person who couldn't be bothered to search?

Third, the op gave cheek back to someone who was politely advising him to follow the rules, i would do the same if someone stepped out of place in real life, the forums no different.

Fourth, how stupid something sounds does not directly relate to how stupid they are, i'm sure GTBloke is a perfectly nice person, and i'm also sure that after re-reading his post he probably realised he acted immature.

Fifth, the OP did have a point, if its right or wrong is an opinion, but did it require a new thread at the time? No.

Finally, yes the 'demo' is hard, it's like picking up a completely new game. The physics are different, but anyone who could manage to play GT5P to any average standard would, after a good few laps, be able to handle the cars quite well. It's like any other racing game, it takes a few minutes to get used to it.

 

[TokyoDrift]

Melodramatic...??? Dont make me laugh any more at you then I already have and I dont have to skip past your opinion if I choose not too, this is a forum is it not?.... If youre just going to talk down my attempts to open your eyes to what this demo really is then so be it... But your not my daddy, so dont tell me what to do... And if you want to be picky about it, the MAJORITY of your posts are about how bad this demo is... Your constant attempts to rub peoples faces in your opinion seems more like the actions of a troll waiting for someone to bite... But thats another story, which I will not waste time on now... Maybe you should look into other games which DO interest you instead of coming on here telling people who like the game demo that it sucks...

Yes, it's a forum, so if you don't like my opinion on the game demo, don't go acting like a childish hypocrite. Funny how you see fit to tell me that I'm not your daddy so cannot tell you what to do, yet you feel it's OK to tell me what to do... Grow up.

Picky? No, just correcting your incorrect melodramatics.

Racing games do interest me. Gran Turismo interests me - just not in this guise. If you don't like that, that's your problem.

 

[Blitz187]

Yes, it's a forum, so if you don't like my opinion on the game demo, don't go acting like a childish hypocrite. Funny how you see fit to tell me that I'm not your daddy so cannot tell you what to do, yet you feel it's OK to tell me what to do... Grow up.

Picky? No, just correcting your incorrect melodramatics.

Racing games do interest me. Gran Turismo interests me - just not in this guise. If you don't like that, that's your problem.

Last post to deal with this since its too far off topic, but I dont see where I TOLD you to do something.. I only offered some alternatives to what youre doing now... As you can see I said, "MAYBE you should ..." which is not the same as telling you what to do... Have fun turning around arguements with others, but its not going to fly with me... With that said we'll leave it at the fact that we and others have differing opinions...

 

[Stotty]

The OP has a very valid point - the difficulty level of this time trial is ridiculous, either because they physics are so good that using a pad is a major disadvantage, or maybe, just maybe they messed up. The handling of both cars at slow speeds is woefully unrealistic. So what if this is aimed at those elite few then want to get through to the Academy. The fact is, most people (>99.9999%) will just use this as a demo of GT5 because they know they don't stand a chance against the nerds who put in countless hours of racing and practice. As such, PD and SONY just dropped the ball with this one.

A wheel and pedal set has always offered a significant performance advantage vs the pad for all but a select few individuals since GT5P came out... it is a driving game afterall, so no surprise that the most realistic control interface offers the best results.

And why exactly do you think the low speed handling is unrealistic?

I spent a couple of hours in the untuned version last night and the handling feels spot on to me... now I'm not sure what you driving experience is, but I've held a full license for 25 years, covered on average 30-35k miles each of those years, driven some pretty serious cars both on road and track and have quite a bit of competitive karting experience, so I feel pretty confident I know what I'm talking about.

Just because YOU can't drive the car does not make it unrealistic.

And what do you expect PD to do... release something that's so dummed down that the average joe can just jump on it with a pad and in 5 minutes set times as quick as the fastest drivers using the most suitable equipment and investing a serious amount of time in to the competition?

I tried it with the pad briefly this morning too, just to see what it's like... I haven't played GT with a pad for 1.5 years and I still got within a second of my wheel time within 20 minutes (my wheel time was 7th in the UK rankings with the untuned car at that moment)... so it's certainly not impossible with the pad.

If you're not fast enough to compete for a spot in the top 20 or not good enough to cope with the physics you need to practice... go download a replay of someone a second or so a lap faster than you... watch how they drive... learn what you're doing wrong and where you're losing time... practice until you can match them... then go down load another replay of some faster still... repeat.

Eventually you'll learn your talent limit.

 

[Solid Lifters]

Just wait for whole game, there will be option for arcade and not professional setting.

True, there will be an easier setting, but it doesn't escape the fact that the controller sucks. The level of input on the controller goes from too less to too much in such a small amount, it's impossible to get the right amount of input to get the proper control of the car.

Then how come I can?

Well, that's good for you. But how are your abilities going to help me control the cars any better? Hey, I bet you can walk without the aid of a wheel chair, too! How special for you. How's that going to get me to walk without one?

I use a DS3, while yes, a wheel would be better,

Good, we agree on something and you recognize what I'm saying. The DS3 is not the best or easiest way of playing the game. I do OK, enough to place 53 overall, but I'm still 5-6 seconds slower that others who I know are using a wheel. Plus, using the controller is VERY frustrating and not very much fun. I play games to have FUN; not to get frustrated or burnt out after playing for just 30 minutes.

...you can't just run the route of blaming the controller, OR the game, it's the driver.

Sure I can. The controller doesn't offer me the kind of control I want or need. That's not my FAULT!

You DO have a way of controlling the cars, But YOU don't know HOW.

That's a very stupid statement. I blame people who can't don't something because they, "don't know HOW." Hey, that guy in that wheel chair can't walk, "'cause he don't know HOW." Hey, that blind guy can't see, "'cause he don't know HOW." See how stupid that sounds?

It comes down to abilities and I, and a whole lot of others, can't use the DS3 controller accurately enough to have fun and get a decent time. We do "OK" but that's not good enough for us. Therefor, the game just isn't that much fun and why play a game if it isn't fun?

 

[NLxAROSA]

Sure I can. The controller doesn't offer me the kind of control I want or need. That's not my FAULT!

PD made the controller more twitchy with the Spec III update from GT5 Prologue. It was solved quite easily by changing the turning angle in the tuning screen. Unfortunately, we don't have that in the demo. But I certainly hope there will be an option to tweak the sensitivity of the controller in the full GT5. Just let people decide for themselves how much sensitivity they want.

 

[a6m5]

What do you mean not at all? You mean people didn't just play a little bit and quit? because that's what I meant.

Isn't this what you are referring to?:

I saw that with GT3.
But I have to say, if someone can't handle GT5P on standard physics, what can you do? Are you seriously suggesting they go the NFS route?

Not at all.

And as for people quitting on last couple of GT games, that is my personal observation.

GT5 / 6 / 7 need to retain an appeal to the general gaming public, and not just in arcade mode.

This has come up in this argument before as well, and my opinion is the same. 👍

Exactly...it's a game foremost, and a driving/racing simulator secondly. All new games take some getting used to, some of you expect — even demand — that you be lightning-quick and inch-perfect out of the box. That's a childish thought and nowhere near reality, since all new things require an period of adjustment. Those fast times you see today will not stand forever with practice.

Damn.... you are alive. It's been awhile, eh?

I see where you are coming from, and I do agree with you. Only thing is, from my standpoint, the game's difficulty is becoming too high for general gamers to enjoy. GT3 is the last game in the series I remember which people still played a heck out of, and there were still room for the enthusiasts to show off their skills. That game was easy, which I'm not going to deny.

Give me a break already! WTH happened to this community, and when did it happen!? I can't believe people are whining about other people's whining and vice versa! How old are you guys, seriously?.

Again, I ask.... you are getting around to complain about this now? I've been here for years, and this is the first thing I noticed when I got here!

It was solved quite easily by changing the turning angle in the tuning screen. Unfortunately, we don't have that in the demo. But I certainly hope there will be an option to tweak the sensitivity of the controller in the full GT5. Just let people decide for themselves how much sensitivity they want.

I saw this in the demo, and I'm afraid that casual crowd will try the demo, see how ridiculously hard it is to race the "stock" 370 in it, they'll decide that the GT5's too hard to play. I'm convinced that GT5 will be a great game, with some practice, like mentioned in this thread before. I don't think regular gamers will show that kind of patience, even if they had bought the game. And IMO, you should have to practice to make a good lap time, not to fight to keep the car on the pavement. That's just me.

 

[Solid Lifters]

PD made the controller more twitchy with the Spec III update from GT5 Prologue. It was solved quite easily by changing the turning angle in the tuning screen. Unfortunately, we don't have that in the demo. But I certainly hope there will be an option to tweak the sensitivity of the controller in the full GT5. Just let people decide for themselves how much sensitivity they want.

Well that sounds like something I can't wait to use. It doesn't sound like a cure, but something that will no doubt will make things easier.

I want my SplitFish controller back. I have a 'tweak' tool that controls and adjusts the level of input and sensitivity of EVERY button. If the X button went from too little sensitivity, to too much too quickly, I can reduce the overall sensitivity and make the X button more smooth and even.

We need something like that for the DS3 in GT5.

 

[juniordee]

People that complain the difficulty is too hard seem to forget they'll be getting standard physics too.

 

[Racer3X]

I will buy GT5 the day it comes out but I don't like the physics in the demo and I am using the controller. I liked the GT5p physics much better,they felt more realictoc to me.

 

[blackninja]

The control, yes is sensitive, but responsive, you need to modulate how much pressure you apply to the steering or the accelerator (I use the controller left/right sticks)
GT5 is by no means, an ON/OFF STOP/ACCELERATE game such as GRID or NFS or Forza3. GT5 is the real thing!!!

Explanation: In racing is impossible to apply brakes while turning, same thing here, you have to work on the brakes before turning, downshifting, controlling. Then in the turn, you can’t apply full acceleration… in racing is not possible, you have to work on the machine, modulate, accelerate, until you are out to the next straight line, I am enjoying so much this simulation, it is amazing how accurate car responds to changes in steering, acceleration, braking, weight transfer. Wow!

Playing with the controller is a bit tougher since you have to know how much pressure you apply and there is no FORCE FEEDBACK, buying a wheel is a VERY good option to improve your skills and get the maximum of this simulation. This is no longer a game.

One lap on the 370 is like music to my ears, controlling, modulating, controlled pressure…. A good suggestion> Learn the track first before you go full swing!

 

[Strittan]

Give me a break already! WTH happened to this community, and when did it happen!? I can't believe people are whining about other people's whining and vice versa! How old are you guys, seriously?

Again, I ask.... you are getting around to complain about this now? I've been here for years, and this is the first thing I noticed when I got here!

Yeah, I think it's gotten a lot worse the last 12 months or so. People are whining, starting threads like crazy on topics discussed in numerous threads already, and no one want's to learn from their mistakes.

I've been a cry baby myself, and complained a lot about stuff, but I think I've just now grown up.

 

[dynamho]

Many of the people who think the simulated car is twitchy and that it's not realistic is probably basing it on their real life experience of driving their cars at sub 80mph speeds on public roads. Turning a hairpin at 55mph on a road course almost feels like crawling. On a public road, you'll gets screams, tickets, or bodies. Most stock street cars when propelled to velocities in excess of 100mph will be twitchy once you throw in some turns. Driving at the limit is about finesse and sensitivity. If you mess up the weight transfers, it's very easy to go into an irrecoverable spin at those speeds. If you don't believe me, try it. Or perhaps Need for Speed is a more appropriate title for these folks.

 

[paskowitz]

Nah, I still feel it is a bit twitchy. I have never driven a Z before but from videos and write ups it appears the car is very well mannered and drives smoothly. Again this is only at the limit. Otherwise I have absolutely no trouble with the handling. It seems to handle like what I would expect a Lotus Elise to handle like, and since it is not one, I shutter to think how twitchy that would be. From what I have heard the Z has an approachable and predictable limit. A car like say a Murcielago is very fast but at the limit bites your head off. I think the physics are fundamentally sound they just need a bit of tweaking (a la Spec I-III in GT5p). I think 70% GT5 demo sharpness with 30% GT5p smoothness would be perfect.

 

[dynamho]

I think the physics are fundamentally sound they just need a bit of tweaking

I think you're right about that.

 

[H20HYBRID_GT]

Yeah, I think it's gotten a lot worse the last 12 months or so. People are whining, starting threads like crazy on topics discussed in numerous threads already, and no one want's to learn from their mistakes.

I've been a cry baby myself, and complained a lot about stuff, but I think I've just now grown up.

This is just a random thought, but could it have to do with the fact PD keeps changing the driving physics?
For example I really hate what they did in Prologue( I was ok with SpecII...), but I love the Academy demo physics. For other people seems the exact opposite... what I'm trying to say people will always be mad about something until PD get it right for everyone lol
Which will never happen, if they keep having Standart AND " Professional " physics in one game at least, which's a complete joke in my opinion.
...
Just a thought, dunno if it makes sense

 

[blackninja]

Suggestion: try driving the tuned 370z at low speeds until you learn the track, once you know the track, then speed up, the tuned version have better grip, a tuned suspension and better torque response in low and high RPM. So, less twitchy than the standard 370z.
The standard 370z is equipped with street suspension (no racing) & sport tires, so it is more of challenge to go fast on this one.

 

[cletus 669]

Suggestion: try driving the tuned 370z at low speeds until you learn the track, once you know the track, then speed up, the tuned version have better grip, a tuned suspension and better torque response in low and high RPM. So, less twitchy than the standard 370z.
The standard 370z is equipped with street suspension (no racing) & sport tires, so it is more of challenge to go fast on this one.

I totaly agree, just the exact opisite though. I feel that if you take the time to get as fast as you can with the stock Z that when you switch to the tuned Z it will feel glued to the track. I think that is why GT series always starts you off with slow cars instead of giving the fastest right from the start.

 

[Dave A]

I hate to break this to you, but I know either Mad94D Or Dan would run circles around you with 15 minutes to run, against however many hours you'd like to put in.
They aren't the only ones, don't worry, there's plenty more.

I was chasing Mad94D's ghost (anyone know who that is btw, is it a GTP'er?) around for ages last night. That guy seemed fast as hell, he was off my map before the end of the lap . That was in the tuned car, I'm getting smother though wit practise today and I've started notching down my lap times bit by bit in the stock car so I might go back to chasing Mad94D in the tuned car again soon.

The trick is, to know how a car handles, and how it will react in the first place.

Absolutely, being smooth as well. Modulating your braking, steering and throttle have never been so important in a console game.

I agree with you about the controller, but only because TCS is not adjustable for it. If I could take mine off, I'd be running about .5 faster, at least.

Again I agree, if you don't have the fingers to control the finer adjustments needed with the pad then there's no shame in using TC or even the arcade physics if that's what it will take for you to get something out of the game. But this demo with it being a traiing tool of sorts for real racing drivers doesn't make any concesions for anyone but the more talented out there and therefore restricts you to the professional physics, TC off in the tuned car with or without the pad and the N3 tyres which you can ofcourse change to stickier ones in thefull game.

I've also noticed that even though TC can be used on the road car, it's not as potent as it is in GT5. Thi may be deliberate on PD's part to keep the game difficult even for thoes using it. But TC on 7 in GT5 would seriously cut your power when wheelspin is knocking on the door, but it's not nearly that strong in this demo.

 

[GordonS]

Point taken, but I believe you got bit wrong. All the proof you need is the (hundreds of ?)millions they spend on the development of this game. If they are focusing just on the likes of the gtplanet crowd, it simply wouldn't make any financial sense. You think game companies lose money on consoles, I think the deficit would be much larger on this software, if that was the case. Reason why I put that "bit" in there is because you may be right about Kaz's rather personal aim with the series.

At the risk of sounding like a fanboy, I would like to see SONY do well with both PS3 console, and the new Gran Turismo game. In my personal opinion, GT4 did well, only because consumers bought the game on the "Gran Turismo" name. Most casual gamers quit, gave up on it pretty early by my observation(for what it's worth). Even if they quit on the game early, sales numbers still looks good, because of the fact that they did purchase it. GT5P, same deal. New console, pretty new "Gran Turismo" game, people bought them, played it for couple of hours, moved on. But I'm thinking that people at SONY look just at the numbers, and they falsely may believe that casual gamers are still very involved with the Gran Turismo game. And while I'm not saying that GT5 is doomed, I think the typical gamers are in the transitional phase of putting GT series in a ignore as we discuss this.

I can appreciate the view of the elite racers, like on gtplanet. But at the same time, retaining the casual crowd very much involved(like racing online) is CRITICAL to the success of both SONY & P.D. IMO.

P.S. Sorry my post is just all over the place. I'm frigging tired, but I didn't want to go to bed without my response, so.....

Hi again a6m5 and sorry for my late reply:
I didn't make my point clear enough. I was talking about the fantastic demo (Sponsored by Nissan I guess) that we have now and not about The Game=GT5.
Cheers
-fbk-

 

[scoobyonline200]

the car drives fine for me... not twitchy, not anything like that... and I've tried it both with the wheel and with the pad.... I don't see what the problem is.

 

[Worst_Driver]

I was chasing Mad94D's ghost (anyone know who that is btw, is it a GTP'er?) around for ages last night. That guy seemed fast as hell, he was off my map before the end of the lap .

He's the EYS Organisator/Administrator and yeah he is fast, I tried to follow his ghost but no success.

 

[a6m5]

Hi again a6m5 and sorry for my late reply:
I didn't make my point clear enough. I was talking about the fantastic demo (Sponsored by Nissan I guess) that we have now and not about The Game=GT5.
Cheers
-fbk-

No sweat on the timing of your reply, not at all.

On the demo, I didn't know it was sponsored by Nissan. That is very cool of them to do that. 👍 However, if we were talking about the demo, I think it most definitely should've been easier, for the sake of the future sales?

I think I've already made this point, but the control of the stock 370 was pretty ridiculous to me. It's set way too difficult for a noobie racer. Demo should make people want to buy the full game, not scare them off. I know many gamers, and I can pretty much guarantee that should that stock 370Z demo be the only GT5 demo available, and if everybody I know tried it, they would either definitely not get it, or VERY strongly consider not getting it.

I of course still believe that GT5 will be a mega seller. Again, I just think that G.T. series is in the process of losing the followers in droves.

 

[Jay]

I was chasing Mad94D's ghost (anyone know who that is btw, is it a GTP'er?)

Yep he is a GTPer.

 

[albteman015]

The control, yes is sensitive, but responsive, you need to modulate how much pressure you apply to the steering or the accelerator (I use the controller left/right sticks)
GT5 is by no means, an ON/OFF STOP/ACCELERATE game such as GRID or NFS or Forza3. GT5 is the real thing!!!

Explanation: In racing is impossible to apply brakes while turning, same thing here, you have to work on the brakes before turning, downshifting, controlling. Then in the turn, you can’t apply full acceleration… in racing is not possible, you have to work on the machine, modulate, accelerate, until you are out to the next straight line, I am enjoying so much this simulation, it is amazing how accurate car responds to changes in steering, acceleration, braking, weight transfer. Wow!

Playing with the controller is a bit tougher since you have to know how much pressure you apply and there is no FORCE FEEDBACK, buying a wheel is a VERY good option to improve your skills and get the maximum of this simulation. This is no longer a game.

One lap on the 370 is like music to my ears, controlling, modulating, controlled pressure…. A good suggestion> Learn the track first before you go full swing!

Ok Tires contacting with the road while the weight of the of the object above them is forcing them into the ground creates grip. There is no way to measure how much grip a car has so each car has 100% possible grip.

For example :Let's say that we are heading into a right hand corner which should be taken at around 90 mph. You turn in a bit to late and start going to the outside of a turn. At this point the car is using 97% of its potential grip.You as a driver want to have a tighter apex thus you need to get the car back to the inside. There are two things you could do at this point. get slightly on the breaks to lower you speed so you could get into the inside of the corner. However you risk the chance of going over 100%. The other thing you could do is slightly let off the throttle which would give you somewhat the same result as the braking but without risking going over 100%

You cannot fully come off the throttle because of the effect the sudden change in the weight distribution will have on the car. This also applies for the breaking. As someone else mentioned in the thread you need to be gradual with all your inputs. This is what is meant by smooth driving.

I'm sorry blackninja but you are incorrect. You can apply braking and pretty much anything else as long as you have enough grip and you so it smoothly. The difference between racing driver and everyone else is that they can "feel" these things. That of course is why they are racing drivers in the first place.

P.S. I LOOOOOOOOOOOOOVEEEEEEEEEEEEE the demo

 

[El Drifto]

the car drives fine for me... not twitchy, not anything like that... and I've tried it both with the wheel and with the pad.... I don't see what the problem is.

Same here, minus the wheel.
The tuned 370Z handles like a beauty.

I can even drift, and control it with a DS3.

Mashing the throttle immediately after a corner brings the rear end out, so I just tap it to prevent oversteer.

 

[gtbloke]

If i had known that me posting up my honest opinion on the demo was going to cause so much friction i would not have bothered in the first place :/

Fourth, how stupid something sounds does not directly relate to how stupid they are, i'm sure GTBloke is a perfectly nice person, and i'm also sure that after re-reading his post he probably realised he acted immature

Thanks i am a perfectly nice person 'well i try lol' but im not quite sure how me creating a thread with no abuse towards anyone is classed as immature ??

peace ppl

 

[irnbrutwinturbo]

Thanks i am a perfectly nice person 'well i try lol' but im not quite sure how me creating a thread with no abuse towards anyone is classed as immature ??

peace ppl

My apologies fella but i dont spend every day trawling through forums and just wanted to post my own opinion

The mature thing would have been to follow the same guidelines we all have to, and unfortunately that means trawl the forums and post your opinion in the right places. R1600turbo was only reminding you of this, if it was me, i would have thanked him. 👍
Anyway, as far as i'm concerned, you're new and its no big deal . The line you quoted was in reply to TokyoDrift who must have playing or dreaming of playing Forza 3, his posts recently have been a little off his norm , fingers crossed he calms down, i used to enjoy reading his opinion.

 

[abhinit90]

Same here, minus the wheel.
The tuned 370Z handles like a beauty.

I can even drift, and control it with a DS3.

Mashing the throttle immediately after a corner brings the rear end out, so I just tap it to prevent oversteer.

+1 at first when i played both of them were extremely twitchy but not after many hours have learned throttle control so its easy ........trying to improve my times.....