GTRA | RSeat WSGTC S3 | Round 4 | Nürburgring GP/F | German GT

[Wardez]

Penalties applied

NEPALII .. D/Q breach of car regulations

GV27 .. +25 seconds Avoidable contact resulting in damage

C -Falcon89 .. +10 seconds Avoidable contact

Johnkiller2 .. +10seconds .. Breach of track contact - too severe for a warning

C-Falcon89 .. +10seconds .. Breach of track contact - too severe for a warning

C-Falcon89 .. Warning for aggressive driving

The whole field .. Warning for breach of track contact


Below is a list of the number of times each driver ran wide at turn 2 + turn 4 = total

Moleman : 3+3=6
Johnkiller2 :8+19=27
GTP_Josh-F : 4+3=7
GTP_cicua : 0+4=4
C -Falcon89 : 9+13=22
GV27 : 7+4=11
Jashugan01 : 4+4=8
Paginas : 5+5=10
GTP_twist : 4+3=7
ByGGy : 0+6=6
NEPALII : 0+6=6
Filip_Ovik : 1+6=7

The penalty of 20 seconds seems kinda light for 49 track cuts.At the very minimum the time penalty should equal a trip down pit lane.IF a person was to only gain .5 sec per lap that still is a 3.5 sec total gain in race time with 27 offs.

The NTSC race had one driver that cut the same turn basically every lap and was blocking and the points table shows nothing in regards to a penalty.

People are going to be upset and urge me to send out pm's with my concerns but frankly I dont know who to send them too.PURE is in charge of the complaint department but I have yet to see any comment from them in regards to anything that has happened.

You mean explaining the penalties? We already discussed them this week through PM's with the administration. If you have a concern you PM me. People have been doing it without even thinking about it for the past few weeks. I step in and get things resolved. This is one of them that we can help with but since the results are final I can only offer insight.

 

[Wardez]

That's not what I said, Iforce

A dirty lap remains dirty. But your fastest clean lap should still count.

I think there was just some confusion here on your part. I can't find anywhere someone saying a driver was going to not have their clean 2nd fastest lap counted because they had one dirty. That would obviously be ridiculous. Thanks for bringing it up though.

I think what happened is that when Twist was checking fastest laps, we would find the best lap on the timing screen then check the lap to see if it was clean or not. So he saw that the lap was not clean, then he probably checked the second fastest driver's fast lap when he shouldn't have. He should've kept checking the top drivers laps to make sure his second fastest lap wasn't still faster than the second driver's fastest lap.

If the second fastest lap by the first driver is slower than the second driver's fast lap, then he can move on to the second driver's fastest lap.

Now if the second driver's fastest lap was dirty he'll need to continue with the second driver's race and find his second fastest lap. If his is faster than the first driver's clean second fastest lap then driver two should get the fastest lap point.

You shouldn't have to check every single replay. Just keep going down the podium till you find the fastest clean lap. Unless it of course gets to the point where the podium drivers' fastest three laps were all dirty, then you have to go down the line a little bit more to find out if someone's fastest displayed (Live timing) lap was clean and faster than the first clean lap of the front runners.

Should only take about ten minutes to resolve.

 

[will-i-am]

So when do any penalties apply. At the end. That's not cool for a less time to be taken away than what was gained on track. Like said one guy cut t4 21 times in NTSC GT500. After 2 or 3 in a row it's intentional and 5 sec penalties for each time after that should be added. If the penalties aren't going to do anything then whats stopping them from doing it in any race. Especially when they know the outcome is better then the penalty.

 

[IforceV8]

Wardez-PM sent.

CSL-you got mail.

Since the penalties are already posted then the answers to any questions can be posted right here for all to see.

 

[Andil]

Thanks Wardez, very much appreciate the comments! Long post is long 👍

 

[MONSTAR-1]

So it's race day for the next round and the penalties still haven't been posted. Does anyone gave a clue as to what's going on or has this been forgotten about?.....

 

[Wardez]

We're currently bringing people back to speed and assigning clear-cut roles in penalty and result supervision split across the different divisions.

Announcement to come shortly.

 

[CSLACR]

So it's race day for the next round and the penalties still haven't been posted. Does anyone gave a clue as to what's going on or has this been forgotten about?.....

In my opinion, since the ballast doesn't change with the penalty system anymore, there's no need to have the final results immediately.

This race had a TON of problem areas, and if people drive like hooligans, they should expect a delay in results with lots of penalties.
iforce has sent me the replay now, so I'll have a look asap, but we can't always be playing GT5 all the hours required over the weekend. This seems to have been a very bad week for it, but with 121 track cuts in one single GT300 race, a week long review sounds perfectly fine to me.

Under normal circumstances, I'd be shaking my head at the guys with 7-8 track cuts, down towards 5.
5 track cuts is a lot in my book. I gave someone a friendly warning on running wide after the race, and I only saw them run wide 4-5 times. I had no idea at the time PAL would average 10+ cuts a driver.

 

[IforceV8]

I did?

 

[CSLACR]

I did?

I assumed.
Hold on... I'll PM Litchi, we do have a reserved space for this already, should be very easy to upload to.

 

[Wardez]

Next time we should really just do away with the track boundaries on Nurb during a race, it's just ridiculously bad every single time we raced it. I remember Senninha in season 1 going wide at T1 EVERY SINGLE TIME...

It just saves this trouble. Very worth it imo.

 

[CSLACR]

Next time we should really just do away with the track boundaries on Nurb during a race, it's just ridiculously bad every single time we raced it. I remember Senninha in season 1 going wide at T1 EVERY SINGLE TIME...

It just saves this trouble. Very worth it imo.

In my opinion, a disregard for track boundaries is never a reason to change them.
I like the challenge of staying inside the line in both 2 and 4, without the boundaries there this track would blow, to be frank.

 

[MONSTAR-1]

In my opinion, since the ballast doesn't change with the penalty system anymore, there's no need to have the final results immediately.

This race had a TON of problem areas, and if people drive like hooligans, they should expect a delay in results with lots of penalties.
iforce has sent me the replay now, so I'll have a look asap, but we can't always be playing GT5 all the hours required over the weekend. This seems to have been a very bad week for it, but with 121 track cuts in one single GT300 race, a week long review sounds perfectly fine to me.

Under normal circumstances, I'd be shaking my head at the guys with 7-8 track cuts, down towards 5.
5 track cuts is a lot in my book. I gave someone a friendly warning on running wide after the race, and I only saw them run wide 4-5 times. I had no idea at the time PAL would average 10+ cuts a driver.

Ok that's cool.

 

[Wardez]

All WSGTC Staff please check your PM boxes for an extremely important announcement as soon as possible.​

 

[redreevos]

In my opinion, a disregard for track boundaries is never a reason to change them.

I couldn't agree more. I think it is appalling the number of track cuts at Nurb. That is blatant cheating and completely unsportsmanlike IMO. If it was just my choice the penalties would be very harsh.

 

[NJ72]

I couldn't agree more. I think it is appalling the number of track cuts at Nurb. That is blatant cheating and completely unsportsmanlike IMO. If it was just my choice the penalties would be very harsh.

I wasn't in this race, so cant comment about the severity of track cuts or the frequency, but looking at the reports from the stewards it's appalling... I think any more than 15 cuts should almost result in a DQ... Mistakes happen, people run wide when they're pushing hard, i get that, but if you are doing it 27 times that's most of the damned race... the penalty should be astronomical. Or perhaps a grid place penalty for the following races or more ballast, I dunno, but it should be real strict.

I'm not a front runner in this championship by any stretch, but I always do my best to drive clean, it shouldn't be any different for anyone else. It doesn't matter if you're at the top and the points make all the difference, you should have a punishment that takes those points (which you gained through cheating (track cutting)) from you...

 

[NEPALII]

I just want to drop by and say the I didn't race this weekend because, no offense to anyone, but the series is being handled terribly. All those complaints from this race(Nurb.) and only a few penalties were given. Can't believe there were so many people running wide and taking others out. And then there was dumb me having the wrong ballast. There were wayyy more penalties to be given and that were forgotten. So much for making things fair...

The series started well, but kept going downhill from the start. So many complications, so many stuff going on. Couldn't this been made simpler? I don't want to hear the whole "the series is big" because it isn't. Look at the turnout. NTSC GT300 has what? 4,5 guys a week? What a joke. Mule's series, for example, aren't big, but they are simple, with fast, respectful drivers and I have enjoyed them a lot. The problem is that there are so many rules, so many things to handle that it just ends up badly. I don't want to talk about the track boundaries of Nurb. as I don't want to start a discussion. You wouldn't like my point on this matter. Same goes to penalties applied.

Not sure if I'll be racing next week. I have been playing GTR Evo now, and I'm enjoying it. Most likely to take a break from GT5. This really needs to get sorted out...

 

[Wardez]

We're working a lot harder than you'd expect behind the scenes. We opened up a whole new channel for discussion. Expect matters to be handled quite deliberately and totally, very soon.

And either you stay on or not, it's up to you to see the series through, but I won't let it fail.

 

[twistedfirework]

I just want to drop by and say the I didn't race this weekend because, no offense to anyone, but the series is being handled terribly. All those complaints from this race(Nurb.) and only a few penalties were given. Can't believe there were so many people running wide and taking others out. And then there was dumb me having the wrong ballast. There were wayyy more penalties to be given and that were forgotten. So much for making things fair...

The series started well, but kept going downhill from the start. So many complications, so many stuff going on. Couldn't this been made simpler? I don't want to hear the whole "the series is big" because it isn't. Look at the turnout. NTSC GT300 has what? 4,5 guys a week? What a joke. Mule's series, for example, aren't big, but they are simple, with fast, respectful drivers and I have enjoyed them a lot. The problem is that there are so many rules, so many things to handle that it just ends up badly. I don't want to talk about the track boundaries of Nurb. as I don't want to start a discussion. You wouldn't like my point on this matter. Same goes to penalties applied.

Not sure if I'll be racing next week. I have been playing GTR Evo now, and I'm enjoying it. Most likely to take a break from GT5. This really needs to get sorted out...

A couple of issues;

1. In the rules there are penalties for breach of track contact.
1st offence : warning
2nd offence : + 10 seconds
3rd offence +25 seconds

2. In the rules it says breach of car regulations is a DQ

Simple

 

[Paginas1]

I thought quite a lot of penalties were handed out for that race. Am I missing something?

 

[CSLACR]

I just want to drop by and say the I didn't race this weekend because, no offense to anyone, but the series is being handled terribly. All those complaints from this race(Nurb.) and only a few penalties were given. Can't believe there were so many people running wide and taking others out. And then there was dumb me having the wrong ballast. There were wayyy more penalties to be given and that were forgotten. So much for making things fair...

The series started well, but kept going downhill from the start. So many complications, so many stuff going on. Couldn't this been made simpler? I don't want to hear the whole "the series is big" because it isn't. Look at the turnout. NTSC GT300 has what? 4,5 guys a week? What a joke. Mule's series, for example, aren't big, but they are simple, with fast, respectful drivers and I have enjoyed them a lot. The problem is that there are so many rules, so many things to handle that it just ends up badly. I don't want to talk about the track boundaries of Nurb. as I don't want to start a discussion. You wouldn't like my point on this matter. Same goes to penalties applied.

Not sure if I'll be racing next week. I have been playing GTR Evo now, and I'm enjoying it. Most likely to take a break from GT5. This really needs to get sorted out...

It's the ego complex, where drivers quit series constantly across GT5, if they can't do as well as they want to.

If it's quality, clean fair driving you want, without people blatantly cheating in any way, that NTSC GT300 you like to poke at has proven the best division for that here, hands down. It's also proven to bring many fastest laps and poles over the 5 weeks so far. (between PAL and NTSC)

If it's winning all the time you want, you'll need to pick up your pace, or find another series people don't run as hard as this one.

I certainly don't agree with exactly what penalties are handed out every time, but coming from somebody that breached car specs after being told he was breaching car specs and did it anyway, I'm not sure what you have to complain about fairness.

 

[NEPALII]

It's the ego complex, where drivers quit series constantly across GT5, if they can't do as well as they want to.

If it's quality, clean fair driving you want, without people blatantly cheating in any way, that NTSC GT300 you like to poke at has proven the best division for that here, hands down. It's also proven to bring many fastest laps and poles over the 5 weeks so far. (between PAL and NTSC)

If it's winning all the time you want, you'll need to pick up your pace, or find another series people don't run as hard as this one.

I certainly don't agree with exactly what penalties are handed out every time, but coming from somebody that breached car specs after being told he was breaching car specs and did it anyway, I'm not sure what you have to complain about fairness.

Who said I want to win all the time? Can you please point out where I said that? I haven't won most of the series I was on but I finished them. So your point isnt valid. I breached car regulations as it was a mistake in my part, not because I wanted to get away with it. I admitted it afterwards, so I don't know what you are on about. From what I read on the other threads, Im not the only one complaining.

As for the penalties, only track boundaries penalties were applied and my car regulation breaching penalty. Where are the contact penalties? Im not gonna mention the particular incidents I saw as I don't want to cause more problems. For a series that claim themselves to be "big" and "great" it needs a lot to be desired.

 

[CaptainFalcon89]

To be honest I have to agree. Some of the reports did not result in penalising, it feels like they were being thrown out without being looked at as both my reports where I suffered damage resulted in no penalties being issued and where as I am reported for something I haven't done... (aside from the nurburging)

 

[twistedfirework]

There were two penalties handed out for collisions, 2 for track contact, 1 DQ, 1 warning against future aggressive driving and a warning for track contact for the whole field. If something was missed, did you report it?
All of the above in the pal gt300 race.

 

[CaptainFalcon89]

Earlier in the season Twist, not talking about my penalties from the Nurburgring.

 

[NEPALII]

To be honest I have to agree. Some of the reports did not result in penalising, it feels like they were being thrown out without being looked at as both my reports where I suffered damage resulted in no penalties being issued and where as I am reported for something I haven't done... (aside from the nurburging)

EXACTLY! That's why I am complaining. I saw people getting damaged, punted off and nothing done about it. I'm not complaining specifically about my penalty or someone else's. Im complaining, in general, about the fact that some penalties weren't handed out. That's all I have to say.

 

[Paginas1]

if you see something and you feel it breaches the rules then please report it, don't expect to stewards to know everything that has happens during a hour long race

 

[NEPALII]

It was reported Pag, just not looked at by the Stewards. If it's too much work for them, why create the series in the first place? right?

 

[CaptainFalcon89]

The problem here Paginas is that I did report it but nothing was done about it. I put the incident as black and white as I could and it was still ignored.

Also could be D/Q'd for breaking a rule which is none existent.

 

[Paginas1]

right I have just looked at the report page and I see nothing from either nep or fal during the nurg gp race. So how can the stewards do anything about it when there's no report?