Kim Jong Il is dead
- Thread starter Mike Rotch
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- Hollywood
It's a shame that such good news will make very little difference to the current situation in NK. The country would fall apart if all the lies that Il told were unravelled, as it's all that the population know. I doubt they could handle the relative freedom seen in other countries.
Come in Mr. Robert Mugabe, your time is up. Let's make it a hattrick for 2011 and send you down to hell too!
Come in Mr. Robert Mugabe, your time is up. Let's make it a hattrick for 2011 and send you down to hell too!
- 4,035
- Gothenburg
- Agremont
Sadly it seems that nothing will change.
- 33,155
- Hammerhead Garage
Did anyone expect that it would?
- 4,035
- Gothenburg
- Agremont
Not really. But there's always that feeling of maybe.
- 15,494
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Or that it would change in a space of days?
In honour of our great leaders demise (that is Kim-Jon Ronry not Jordan), I'm going to attach string to my arms and walk about it in a completely plausible manner.
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- BuddhaRock
I would like to hope that Kim Jong Il's death would be the impetus of change that North Korea needs but everything I've read about his son says he is worse than his dad is (assuming the reports about his son are true, of course).
It makes me sick that people are making fun of the North Korean people for crying for Kim Jong Il. I am in no way a sympathizer for him. As stated before I hope this produces change in that country... but these people have been brainwashed all of their lives. They were taught to think of him like a god. Of course they are going to cry. They don't know any better. This whole transition is literally going to be a life altering experience to them. To us, it's just another despot dying but to them, in many cases it might be the most memorable day of their lives. I just hope that they get the chance to see the light someday.
It makes me sick that people are making fun of the North Korean people for crying for Kim Jong Il. I am in no way a sympathizer for him. As stated before I hope this produces change in that country... but these people have been brainwashed all of their lives. They were taught to think of him like a god. Of course they are going to cry. They don't know any better. This whole transition is literally going to be a life altering experience to them. To us, it's just another despot dying but to them, in many cases it might be the most memorable day of their lives. I just hope that they get the chance to see the light someday.
noisiaturismo
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I think they would be better though. Especially Jong-nam. Disneyland North Korea.
Edit: Wikipedia told me Kim Jong-Il is born in the Sovjet Union.
Also, if there might be a war (hopefully not), Kim Il-sung was born on April 15th, 1912, in Japanese Korea (so he's Japanese)
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csmeteora9
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- 155
Yet another luxury Kim Il-sung had over the North Korean citizens. A time-travelling DeLorean.
noisiaturismo
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Yet another luxury Kim Il-sung had over the North Korean citizens. A time-travelling DeLorean.
I have the ability to make mistakes. Thats something everybody would like
csmeteora9
(Banned)
- 155
I was infact rolling my eyes at how a North Korean leader was so easily able to get his hands on a flux capacitor. You're right however, I'd take one anyday.I have the ability to make mistakes. Thats something everybody would like
- 2,439
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- GTP_sneakyboy62
Well from what I've been reading Kim Jong-un has been seen as the heir for a while now and was already being conditioned for that transition.
As for what happens next, like you said, that will be interesting. I have so many scenarios running through my head. Peaceful transition with a fancy funeral and period of mourning, show of force from Jong-un to let his people and the world know that he's no pushover, military leaders not content with serving a 3rd generation of "Kim" who decide to rise up and take control themselves or perhaps the people will see this as an opportunity to challenge the regime. It might not even be any of these scenarios but I just hope that whatever happens is best for North Korea and for the world.
- 754
- Madison, WI
prisonermonkeys seems to be the only person in this thread with a grasp on the realities of North Korea.
To clear some things up:
"Kim Jong-Il and the Kim family are crazy" - Far from it, Jong-Il is reported to be quite intelligent and cunning, and not to be underestimated. If you were essentially the king of the largest prison camp in the world and had no way of gracefully exiting that situation, what would you do to keep your power? Their small military shows of powers over the years are JUST AS MUCH intended to be propaganda for the population (so they're always ready for war) as they are meant to be a deterrent for any military action from the West. They are not a real threat to anyone except South Korea and possibly Japan.
"We should sneak special forces into NK" - WTF for? To start an international crisis? ANY violence or violation of their borders will simply reinforce everything that the citizens are taught from birth. The best thing that can possibly be done is to expose the population to the realities of the outside world, which is currently hidden from them. This has to be a natural process and is not something the West can force.
"People in NK are distraught and crying uncontrollably over this? They should be celebrating!" - False, SOME people are legitimately distraught over this. There is growing evidence that many people in NK see through the propaganda* but they have no way of expressing this or spreading this idea. When the threat of your whole family being "disappeared" (or worse) is looming over your head, you'd be surprised how your priorities change. (*There have been several "uprisings" that we have found out about via defectors. One story that sticks in my mind is of ~5000 people at a prison camp that attempted a revolt. They were quickly surrounded and every last one of them slaughtered. Other stories include breaking people out of prison camps and having a getaway car ready, evidence of an organized underground network working against the DPRK government.)
Personally, I don't think Jong-Un is capable of heading the country, not that Jong-Il was either for that matter... I think that publicly they will show Jong-Un as successor so they can project the image of stability and strength but in reality I believe there will be a power struggle between military heads and the Kim family.
To clear some things up:
"Kim Jong-Il and the Kim family are crazy" - Far from it, Jong-Il is reported to be quite intelligent and cunning, and not to be underestimated. If you were essentially the king of the largest prison camp in the world and had no way of gracefully exiting that situation, what would you do to keep your power? Their small military shows of powers over the years are JUST AS MUCH intended to be propaganda for the population (so they're always ready for war) as they are meant to be a deterrent for any military action from the West. They are not a real threat to anyone except South Korea and possibly Japan.
"We should sneak special forces into NK" - WTF for? To start an international crisis? ANY violence or violation of their borders will simply reinforce everything that the citizens are taught from birth. The best thing that can possibly be done is to expose the population to the realities of the outside world, which is currently hidden from them. This has to be a natural process and is not something the West can force.
"People in NK are distraught and crying uncontrollably over this? They should be celebrating!" - False, SOME people are legitimately distraught over this. There is growing evidence that many people in NK see through the propaganda* but they have no way of expressing this or spreading this idea. When the threat of your whole family being "disappeared" (or worse) is looming over your head, you'd be surprised how your priorities change. (*There have been several "uprisings" that we have found out about via defectors. One story that sticks in my mind is of ~5000 people at a prison camp that attempted a revolt. They were quickly surrounded and every last one of them slaughtered. Other stories include breaking people out of prison camps and having a getaway car ready, evidence of an organized underground network working against the DPRK government.)
Personally, I don't think Jong-Un is capable of heading the country, not that Jong-Il was either for that matter... I think that publicly they will show Jong-Un as successor so they can project the image of stability and strength but in reality I believe there will be a power struggle between military heads and the Kim family.
- 10,837
- Belgium
- bramturismo
Let's go easy on Kim Jong-Un for now, shall we? It's a bit extreme to call the man crazy when we actually have little to no information about him at all.
The only thing that is known about him is that he's studied in Switzerland, a country neutral towards the conflict between South- and North-Korea. Besides that Jong-Un is a heavy fan of basketball and the NBA.
I doubt should he take the reign over from his father he'll overthrow the entire country by suddenly shouting "Burgers and naked chicks for everyone!" in his first speech.
The only thing that is known about him is that he's studied in Switzerland, a country neutral towards the conflict between South- and North-Korea. Besides that Jong-Un is a heavy fan of basketball and the NBA.
I doubt should he take the reign over from his father he'll overthrow the entire country by suddenly shouting "Burgers and naked chicks for everyone!" in his first speech.
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- The_Bman24
Regardless if Jong-Un takes over NK not much will change. North Korea will still be cut off from most of the world. If anything major does happen, however, it would be a unification of Korea or the conquest of South Korea (if this happens NATO would cream North Korea, so Jong-Un wouldn't be that dumb).
- 904
- orlando,FL,USA
speaking of Kim Jong il death, I love how the GOP candidates are condemning the man(ron paul being the exception), yet these are the very same people who don't have any problem supporting middle eastern autocrats and dictators who happen to be no different.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...-kim-jong-il/2011/12/19/gIQAbsUf4O_story.html
http://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...-kim-jong-il/2011/12/19/gIQAbsUf4O_story.html
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- driftking18594
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They're not even from the same country.
I've always thought that if you aged Keiichi Tsuchiya by 20 years or so, he'd look like Kim Jong-il. Plus, there's a bit from "Jeremy Clarkson's Motorworld" where Jezza visits Japan, and in that bit it looks like Tsuchiya is wearing glasses like Kim Jong-il's.
That's why I call Kim Jong-il "Evil Keiichi Tsuchiya".
- 13,827
- Down under
That doesn't mean much - Switzerland were also neutral towards Nazi Germany. Western education doesn't automatically mean western ideals will be adopted.
