2014 Grand Prix du Canada

[otakukid96]

I have no words to describe how I feel after this race. The important thing is that Massa and Perez are okay.

 

[BHRxRacer]

Bad luck, looks like you're putting words in your own mouth there, bad luck dude

He DID set the fastest lap as everyone else who watched the race and timing accepts. Just accept you were wrong before you get asked for a citation to prove that you saw something which nobody else did.

Be careful of fanboyism, it marks you out in this kind of adult discussion as "unreliable".

Do you not understand English or are you that blind? Psychologists have a name for that condition.

Whatever, @niky gets it. I don't have to spoon feed you the alphabets every argument.

The point is, after he missed his braking point and got off the brakes, he took the straightest, fastest line he could across the runoff area, far, far off the track, and had the throttle down the whole way.

So, yes... that was pretty fast.

-

Mind you... this is as an impartial observer. I noted that his move on Lewis early on was entirely fair, given the same logic followed in Lewis' defense against him in Bahrain (you can't expect a driver to give up the outside of a corner exit because the racing line naturally moves that way).

But leaving the track IS illegal under the rules.



A driver leaving the track and gaining a position is expected to return the position. There's no specific guideline for what a driver does if he leaves it in front of another driver and doesn't lose one. How do you give back, exactly, half a second?

Thus there's no specific penalty for that.

Which comes back to a much earlier argument... are you for or against the exploitation of the "gray areas" of the rules? Because, like it or not, however nice the driver's personality may be, that is exactly what happened today.

I acknowledged all of that while the race was going on. Go back and read my post. I mentioned he gained an advantage, but there's no penalty for doing that when you're at the front because it doesn't change the order. In the past they've only given penalties when they felt the driver did it deliberately.

Remember Vettel on Button? He was ahead, he gained only a tenth advantage but it was enough to keep him the position. He was penalized. Why? It was proven through telemetry that he did it on purpose.

It may be a grey area, but it's hard to enforce. As for the sportsmanship discussion, Nico didn't do it on purpose so there's no issues there. If you want to start an argument against him, start it about the first lap thing.

 

[Peasantslayer]

Instead of facing facts you just insult people, he set the fastest lap of the race at the time out of nowhere, deal with it.

 

[Samus]

The way I always look at these things is what would have happened if that was a wall/barrier? Nico would have either hit it or slowed down even further to make sure he didn't. He took the easy way out because it was there.

Perhaps the best idea is a chicane of sleeping policeman, like they have on a few tracks.

 

[dhandeh]

Regarding the chicane I think they really do need to look at making sure anyone taking the easy way out aren't able to drive through at speed. Mistakes happen and people miss their braking points accidentally but it needs to be punished by making the alternative route slower.

I don't understand why they left a small gap there, if it's there then what's the point of having it there because a driver is always going to take the easier route.

Two sets of those sausage kerbs (where there is currently one) and continuing these kerbs all the way and not leaving the gap would prevent the possibility of a driver flooring it and gaining a load of time for a mistake.

 

[mattythedog]

Two sets of those sausage kerbs (where there is currently one) and continuing these kerbs all the way and not leaving the gap would prevent the possibility of a driver flooring it and gaining a load of time for a mistake.

They could employ something similar to the first chicane at Monza and stick up plastic bollard/sign things to make the drivers weave about.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Do you not understand English or are you that blind? Psychologists have a name for that condition.

Thank you, reported because you don't seem to have much of an argument there.

. I mentioned he gained an advantage, but there's no penalty for doing that when you're at the front because it doesn't change the order. In the past they've only given penalties when they felt the driver did it deliberately.

Next you need to revisit the rule that @niky quoted and then the stewards' notes from the event, Rosberg was given a second warning which cumulatively can create a penalty. Hopefully that's not a new system to you (along with the timing)

 

[ThrasherDBS]

I almost fell asleep on the first third of the race, and then the Mercedes guys started duking it out. It got really exciting from that point on. It was also an exciting end, but for the wrong reasons. Good to know Perez and Massa are okay though.

Shocking that half the field wound up retiring. That's the highest attrition rate I've seen in a Formula 1 race.

Congrats to Ricciardo for his first GP win!

 

[dhandeh]

Instead of facing facts you just insult people, he set the fastest lap of the race at the time out of nowhere, deal with it.

He is fishing for a nibble. Luckily most of us don't bite.

 

[GTracer98]

Regarding the chicane I think they really do need to look at making sure anyone taking the easy way out aren't able to drive through at speed. Mistakes happen and people miss their braking points accidentally but it needs to be punished by making the alternative route slower.

I almost fell asleep on the first third of the race, and then the Mercedes guys started duking it out. It got really exciting from that point on. It was also an exciting end, but for the wrong reasons. Good to know Perez and Massa are okay though.

Shocking that half the field wound up retiring. That's the highest attrition rate I've seen in a Formula 1 race.

Congrats to Ricciardo for his first GP win!

I think it has been worse.

 

[GTDriver1230]

Even now I'm so gutted that Williams were yet again unable to get a podium despite a strong performance. Heck, at the rate and state that Massa was in, he could have easily won it. Then back at Melbourne Bottas made a huge charge only to have that kiss with the wall which ruined his chances of a podium...

Now whenever is Williams' next good chance for a podium? They surely have to get at least one this year considering how fast they are (well, on a high speed low df track)

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

Instead of facing facts you just insult people, he set the fastest lap of the race at the time out of nowhere, deal with it.

He always does that, it's his fail safe mechanism because he's horrid in debates and doesn't know when to just shut up and walk away. Especially when knee deep in the 🤬 he's produced

 

[CAMikaze]

Damn that was close.

Any closer and not even Mutual of Red Bull wouldn't have saved Vettel!

 

[rickykaka3]

Well done to Ricciardo for winning and for staying in front of Vettel (again)... Mercedes unlucky and not so unbeatable but i'm sure that the next races will return to dominate the Championship. Come on Rosberg!!! Let's hope you win the title. Williams very good and Perez should be penalized next race for the accident he caused... why he moved to the center at the last? hope Massa is ok. Ferrari no comment

 

[86Debris86]

The way I always look at these things is what would have happened if that was a wall/barrier? Nico would have either hit it or slowed down even further to make sure he didn't. He took the easy way out because it was there.

Perhaps the best idea is a chicane of sleeping policeman, like they have on a few tracks.

Hitting one of those at the sort of speeds Nico and Lewis did there could have launched them back on track though, possibly causing a much greater incident. I agree something should be done, but perhaps given the various possible risks attached to the different solutions, the current layout might be the best compromise.

 

[TenEightyOne]

Any closer and not even Mutual of Red Bull wouldn't have saved Vettel!

While it wouldn't upset me to see Vettel out of the race I have no desire to see him crash and am glad he didn't become entangled in that, we could have been looking at a very powerful rollover

 

[GTracer98]

Well done to Ricciardo for winning and for staying in front of Vettel (again)... Mercedes unlucky and not so unbeatable but i'm sure that the next races will return to dominate the Championship. Come on Rosberg!!! Let's hope you win the title. Williams very good and Perez should be penalized next race for the accident he caused... why he moved to the center at the last? hope Massa is ok. Ferrari no comment

Poor Ferrari, I can't watch their performance...

 

[ThrasherDBS]

I think it has been worse.

I know it's been worse by looking at statistics from older races. But of races I've actually seen, it's the worst so far.

 

[BHRxRacer]

I don't understand why they left a small gap there, if it's there then what's the point of having it there because a driver is always going to take the easier route.

It's there to give drivers a way out. They can't go back on the track over the kerbs because it damages the car, and they can't rejoin head-on against traffic coming from the straight. If you're goiig to argue they must be punished then add a gravel trap.

Show me where he said he cut the corner on purpose.

Here:

So you missed Rosberg setting fastest lap by cutting the last corner at full speed?

And confirmation:

Probably because he'd used up a bit more trying to close in or he was told to fuel save, I wonder what trick he'll have up his sleeve next time out...

@dhandeh happy?

 

[TenEightyOne]

@BHRxRacer, where's the citation?

EDIT: Or you can retract your claim that Nico didn't set fastest lap on that cut...?

 

[Spacegoat]

Damn that was close.

Man, that was hell of a lot closer than it seemed on TV.

And Ricciardo, just incredible. 👍 Couldn't be any happier for the guy.

 

[BHRxRacer]

@ Everybody

If you're going to report me I'm reporting all of you for trolling. It's honestly unbelievable that I must repeat myself 100 times, and then you respond with the same thing. At least @LMSCorvetteGT2 had the decency to flat out call me a liar last time.

@BHRxRacer, where's the citation?

For?

 

[dhandeh]

Hitting one of those at the sort of speeds Nico and Lewis did there could have launched them back on track though, possibly causing a much greater incident. I agree something should be done, but perhaps given the various possible risks attached to the different solutions, the current layout might be the best compromise.

Putting them on the perimeter after the corner entry should then force the driver to slow down, not floor it. Just closing that gap up where Rosberg rejoined, would suffice though

 

[niky]

It may be a grey area, but it's hard to enforce. As for the sportsmanship discussion, Nico didn't do it on purpose so there's no issues there. If you want to start an argument against him, start it about the first lap thing.

See, the way you respond to this controversy is that everyone is jumping on Nico because they're pro-Hamilton. Which is not true. We're all pro-Ricciardo.

Few of us are jumping on the first lap incident (and I don't mind it at all), because it is a completely unenforceable action that is not penalized by the rules.

My beef with this one is that the rules state it is illegal, but don't provide a concrete penalty for it or a realistic mechanic for how a driver gives back an advantage when they were ahead in the first place. Which means: Either the rules should be revised or a penalty should be devised for it. A one second penalty to be served in the pits seems about right. Five is too long (and I tweeted that it was good the stewards didn't give him the five second penalty... I wanted this race settled on the track, not in the steward's office). Or they could just fix that damn chicane.

What it all boils down to is this: Nico exploited gray areas in the rules. Twice in a race. Something which has you hot and bothered when his team-mate does it. So why are you not hot and bothered when Nico does it?

That he locked up and had to go on the run-off is evident. That he took the run-off at race pace, instead of doing the sportsmanlike thing and ceding position like a gentleman, or maybe just slowing down to make sure he didn't cause a collision when rejoining (and an unsafe return to track is also worth a penalty) is also evident. So where's the righteous anger at that?

Remember what I said before about being hungry? About doing everything you can to win? Appears that Nico is doing just that, right now.

 

[TenEightyOne]

For?

Sigh... your claim that Nico didn't set fastest lap on that cut. Do keep up dear

EDIT: I think @niky has done a better job of explaining it than you...

 

[sems4arsenal]

Regarding the chicane I think they really do need to look at making sure anyone taking the easy way out aren't able to drive through at speed. Mistakes happen and people miss their braking points accidentally but it needs to be punished by making the alternative route slower.

But how?

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

@ Everybody

If you're going to report me I'm reporting all of you for trolling. It's honestly unbelievable that I must repeat myself 100 times, and then you respond with the same thing. At least @LMSCorvetteGT2 had the decency to flat out call me a liar last time.



For?

You know me I'm not here to sugar coat.

 

[dhandeh]

It's there to give drivers a way out. They can't go back on the track over the kerbs because it damages the car, and they can't rejoin head-on against traffic coming from the straight. If you're goiig to argue they must be punished then add a gravel trap.

Here:

And confirmation:

@dhandeh happy?

Nowhere did he say he done it on purpose. You just interpreted it as that and started your fortnightly crusade.

 

[LMSCorvetteGT2]

But how?

Maybe putting bump strips in the very center or gravel or grass even.

 

[86Debris86]

Putting them on the perimeter after the corner entry should then force the driver to slow down, not floor it. Just closing that gap up where Rosberg rejoined, would suffice though

Indeed. Brake failure there would still be a scary prospect though.